This is just my personal observation, but I think the pertinant question is did he give 100% back to the club when injured? Part of the reason we signed him was for his experience, Im not sure we fully saw that because he wasnt in the country.
Bastian Schweinsteiger | Exit Speculation
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) and Imran (@Annihilate Now!) are here to discuss Amad saving our blushes in a win against Southampton as well as our now annual loss at home to Brighton. They discuss Amorim's post-match comments, revisit how mid-table we may or may not be, and discuss some transfer news.
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This is just my personal observation, but I think the pertinant question is did he give 100% back to the club when injured? Part of the reason we signed him was for his experience, Im not sure we fully saw that because he wasnt in the country.
Why? Maybe he wants to stay and fight for a place with the club he holds in high regard.
However, it seems that he is definetly gone.
(Who can't see it: His brother tweets simply two words: "no respect"
(Who can't see it: His brother tweets simply two words: "no respect"
Yes, but then the manager is within his rights to ask him to practice with U21's. If he wants to stay and fight, he would fight it out with U21's. I'm not defending it, I'm just saying this could have happened.
Amen. How fecking hard is to grasp? Why is everyone so terrified of starting new threads?
Anyway. Schweinsteiger is off. Seems a reasonable decision. He was phoning it in last season. I've no time for professional athletes who are visibly overweight. That's just taking the piss.
The manager is within his right to do a lot of things. Doesn't mean he has to treat him like that when you have the likes of Rojo/Jones still training in the first team. Do you think he'll show the same ruthlessness with Rooney if he continues not to perform? I don't.
house keeping is not an issue for me. I'm simply wondering why all other mids got a chance to impress Jose and he did not. Jose being paid to make hard decisions is irrelevant to me questioning something.
Classless from the club.
FWIW, I agree re:Rooney
And why not? Jesus christ. This place. It's like some kind of mass hysteria. Rooney is an evil genius, who bends managers to his will leaving them incapable of thinking for themselves. He's clearly wasted on football. Should be hell-bent on world domination instead.
Probably because none of the other mids spent last season visibly overweight and pissing off out of the country to swan round Europe on vacation every time they picked up a knock.
Bastian is a fan of the game as much as a player. In his munich time, he was often attending amateur or youth matches in his spare time. That guy has a penthouse, more money than he can spend, probably a barn full of Ferraris and a trophy model GF and *doesn't* spend a nice sunday afternoon jetting to Venice for a cup of coffee. He could have gone the easy way and sat out his career in munich, yet he was still adventurous enough, and enough of a schoolboy in the stands, to risk a dent in his career by signing for a club which is one of the biggest clubs in the sport, but as club he didn't know in a league he didn't know. This is taking a risk, the risk to get a dent in his career. I could name several that didn't have the guts. He did have them because he fancied the idea United wanted him and it was sort of a boyhod dream of his, and that i respect him for. He is long enough in the business to know that united didn't sign a legend but expected performance, and i'm sure he is gutted he couldn't return more than he did.
His times of playing 38/90min were over after the WC final, many suspected. United signed him anyway.
His times of playing 38/90min were over after the WC final, many suspected. United signed him anyway.
Carrick and Schweinsteiger are too similar. Both sitting CM's who want to dictate the play from deep. We don't need 2 holders like that especially when the majority of opponents we face put 10 men behind the ball. Putting 2 CM's who sit and Pogba ahead of them would have Pogba as a 10. Terrible idea and no shock to see Mourinho is ditching Schweinsteiger.
I didn't say it should stop you or anyone from questioning the decision but just that it was a tough call that he had to make and he is standing by it. As to why he was targeted, he probably earns what Schneiderlin and Fellaini combined earn whilst he has played the least minutes on the pitch due to his injuries. To create room for a major signing a big earner was always going to leave.
I don't think Rooney is an evil genius, or is in any way manipulating managers. I'm just bamboozled as to how Rooney can last in the starting XI with mediocre performances ahead of others in the squad.
And to answer the why not bit, its clear Jose values him highly before evaluating him close up. Which again, is mind boggling, especially when we'll be flooded with players to rival his position this year.
I've no problem with him leaving as he's been, as predicted, horrendous here, but I do wish we could've parted on good terms. Despite seemingly getting unfair priveldges last season from van Gaal, and spending what seemed to be multiple weeks every so often with his girlfriend/wife in a different county when he was supposed to be getting back to full fitness, which was annoying, he seems like a nice guy.
Nope.
Van Gaal wanted him. Jose doesn't. He's past it and injury prone and has been here only 1 year.
Have absolutely zero problem with Jose not wanting him and he's well within his right to shape the team he wants and Schweinsteiger isn't in his plans
Thats no reason to have him train with the u23s
He's apparently demoted him to train with U21s, which is a lack of respect & historically something done to punish players. Jose has barely given Schweinstiger the chance to fight for a spot and prove himself in training.
Can't argue with that to be fair. Perhaps something else has happened behind the scenes we are not aware of. I do get the feeling however he doesn't care about the club half as much as he indicated at the beginning and that is the main issue here. If it is true he turned up after his holiday being unfit, then I can see why Mourinho did what he did and banished him to the reserves as this would further confirm the fact he simply doesn't really care about United. Unfit before the Euros, fit for the Euros and unfit again after when he returns to us. If that is the case, then I am fully behind the decision. There is a lot of if's though. The fact that he is at the end of his career and injury prone may just be the nail in the coffin; based on the assumption that what has been said about his motivation regarding United, is true.
I am of the opinion that if he has been treated as harshly as reported, then surely the above must have more truth to it than not. At the end of the day, lets say Mourinho heard the same thing from several players, and then he himself saw BFS report back for training in an unfit state; then it would make complete sense for him to be banished to the reserves.
I don't know what it is, but I never truly felt that BFS was one of us, something that I couldn't imagine 10 months ago.
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Maybe because of the career Rooney has had for us for over a decade? That surely earns him one more chance to fight for his career, the place Bastien had those privileges was Munich but even they chose to dump him on us.
We willingly bought him. Showing a class football career should be irrespective of the shirt you wear. If you're talented, you should have a chance to fight for a place.
I'm not out here to suggest Schweinstiger should command the same place as Rooney, cementing a place in the first XI in his respective position. I'm just confused as to why he's been demoted away from the first team. He basically has no chance to prove his worth and change Mourinho's mind.
It's the same crap with every manager. Utter bemusement that they might actually rate him. Isn't it obvious by now that football managers see something in Rooney that a lot of people on here evidently don't?
Which is not to say he wasn't shit for most of last season or that it's not possible he's in some sort of terminal decline. Whatever, the redcafe meme that Rooney picks our team is getting really tedious.
Perhaps he believes he didn't deserve a chance? If it is true he reported back for training completely out of shape then why bother with him. I think it is more about belief in the mans commitment to the team than belief in his ability, which is gradually waning on top of the fact he is injury prone.
This is a man that fecked off to Germany at every opportunity throughout a season in which the team were struggling psychologically and physically, was barely fit throughout the season, and out of nowhere got in to top shape for the Euros. And now it appears he came back out of shape, again. Doesn't sound like much of a leader; for United anyway. And that is the whole problem.
Rooney as much as I don't like him and think he should be dropped; is evidently commited to the team, more so than most players in the dressing room and is rightly our captain. He would fight through thick and thin for this team, despite his declining talent. And I just don't feel the same can be said for BFS, especially if the reports we have been hearing about his attitude are true. We can hate on Rooney as much as we like but the fact is he is 100% motivated and committed to the team and this has probably been his saving grace in recent years. That and his ability to pop up with important goals every now and then. Again, I dislike him as a player, but as a character I very much respect the man. He is a true professional.
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I'm with you on this. Fair enough if mourinho doesn't want him, but give a world cup / euro / cl winning captain a decent United send off ffs. He tried his best but his injuries gave way, not his will.
We did and sadly it hasn't worked so a decision has been made which the manager is sticking by. Banishing him to the reserves is not what I would wish on anyone but without any facts as to what actually happened it difficult to judge whether Mourinho is justified in being this ruthless with him.
Is that really a good barometer to judge him by when the last two managers we've had have been sacked (and the most recent one largely thanks to issues in attack that - at the very least - were exasperated by his faith in Rooney)? The last good manager we've had spent his last few days in the job manipulating public opinion so that his replacement could sell him without backlash.
When a player is ostracised for no apparent reason something must have gone on behind closed doors. Him not being fit and seemingly being on holiday a lot might be the reason.
Giggs was asked during his punditry stint about Schweinsteiger. Obviously Giggs doesn't give much away but he did say something like "we didn't see too much of him."
Yes, Moyes and LVG. As @NinjaFletch said, that is not a very good barometer. Its fair to assume Rooney would have been packing had SAF stayed on, but putting that to one side, its very odd for Mourinho to class Wayne as being important to the team without evaluating him in training off the back of 2 declining seasons.
This would make a lot more sense, but I think if true would have more smoke around it by other journos.
Never really bought into this idea that Fergie set Rooney up to be immediately sold by his predecessor. Having hand-picked Moyes, he must have failed to pass on that particular memo.
EDIT. Wrong thread for this. I'll shut up now.
Now begins the re-writing of Wayne's performances 
Sooner we get shot of him the better. Injured, fat, not interested. Go
It isn't a classless move. He is visibly overweight and was for the entirety of last season and allegedly spend most of the season over in Germany. He may be a nice guy and a football hero but he has never shown anything in a united shirt to suggest he is a decent player and players shouldn't be in the squad based on reputation alone. I like him on a personal level but if you are one of the oldest and most respected players at a club (his due to reputation deservedly gained elsewhere) you have to set the right example by giving 100% in training and keeping yourself in shape, I have no doubt ibra, rooney, de gea, smalling, young, carrick and other senior players are offering that and if he can't which he clearly can't he should be gone.
The fact that Schweinsteiger wasn't even given a chance would assume Mourinho had already made up his mind about the German when taking over as our manager. Perhaps Schweinsteiger was the only one he was sure about letting go.
Now, I would've kept him, but consider that Mourinho wants a small group, with two players at each position, and given Schweinsteiger's injury record and age, I can see the manager's point in selling him.
Does it give Mourinho the right to treat the player like this? I don't know. I don't know the whole story, but it would have been more respectful to let him be with the rest of the group. He wouldn't have to participate in all the tactic game plans. He could've just been there like an extra player you've put in from the u23.
I would assume the reports are untrue, but the tweet from his brother says to me that it's not.
Now, I would've kept him, but consider that Mourinho wants a small group, with two players at each position, and given Schweinsteiger's injury record and age, I can see the manager's point in selling him.
Does it give Mourinho the right to treat the player like this? I don't know. I don't know the whole story, but it would have been more respectful to let him be with the rest of the group. He wouldn't have to participate in all the tactic game plans. He could've just been there like an extra player you've put in from the u23.
I would assume the reports are untrue, but the tweet from his brother says to me that it's not.
Obviously, there is something that Bastian did/has done in regards to his attitude for him to be treated in such a way. The fact every other midfielder was given a chance further confirms this suspicion IMO.
Doesn't matter about his weight, if he was a pacey striker then perhaps but he is a playmaker. Very similar to Scholes.
I am really beginning to dislike every decision we make
I am really beginning to dislike every decision we make
I think he went public with news Rooney had submitted a transfer request (and Rooney denies that he ever did) to allow for the possibility he would leave.
If the summer had gone how it did (Rooney flirting with Chelsea and rejecting bids) without Ferguson having done so it would have been looked at as a sign of weakness and crafted as a narrative that Rooney was unhappy with Moyes' appointment and wanted to leave because of it.
As it was, he painted Rooney as the bad guy and gave Moyes the possibility to sell him. After that I think he then largely, and regretfully, left Moyes to his own devices and he decided to go the other way with it. But I don't think its in any doubt that Ferguson no longer saw him as a key part of his team, had he stayed, we'd almost certainly have started the new season with Kagawa behind RVP imo (although thinking about it, wasn't that the summer Madrid sold Özil? So maybe he'd have rekindled his interest in him).
Of course it matters about his weight. What a mad thing to say.
On the rare occasions he managed to get out on the pitch last season he looked blatantly unfit and was a letdown.
The thing is players are like kids, when things go wrong you only hear their side of the story, how they have been treated badly etc. We don't know how Mourinho came to this decision because he's been on a charm offensive with every other player bar him. We don't have the full picture but I think Mourinho will talk about it in his next presser because journos will surely ask him about BFS.
This. I have my issues with Rooney as a player but I don't understand how people can't see his full and unquestioned commitment to the team. There is a reason he has stayed as captain throughout the reign of 3 managers and that clearly isn't down to his playing ability alone. As for BFS, all signs point to him not being committed to the team at all throughout the course of last season. Fecking off to Germany for most of the season collecting our wages when he should have been here helping to motivate the team.It is also laughable the shape he was in for the euros when he couldn't stay fit for over 2 games for us. I really fail to understand why people are getting their panties into such a twist.
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