Are Bruno and Rashford a problem?

[Pickle85]

Bruno is 90th + percentile in expected assists, shot creating actions, and progressive passes. Oh and he manages to do that while also being almost 90th percentile at pressing and defensive actions.

There literally isn't a player of his caliber in the world with this combination of creation and pressing. So you all are deranged if you think he isn't our best player.

Only argument i'd have is he needs to be more clinical in finishing chances. And also we now finally have strikers and wingers (not named Rashford) to finish the chances he creates.

Thank you! I've felt like I'm the mad one here. You'll soon be told that these stats aren't reliable, though, and that you're not watching games. I'm bowing out at this point as folks are utterly unwilling to see what's plain as day.

 

[Footyislife]

Thank you! I've felt like I'm the mad one here. You'll soon be told that these stats aren't reliable, though, and that you're not watching games. I'm bowing out at this point as folks are utterly unwilling to see what's plain as day.

I swear half these posters have to be paid City fans by ABU media. Only rational reason why there is so much hate and negativity towards our players who are actually decent.

This thread should just be Rashford is the problem.

 

[BluesJr]

I love Bruno, but he has an awful habit of ruining game winning moments that are maybe not really reflected in the stats. Yesterday for example, easy pass to Zirkzee but he over hit it, and ok it goes to Garnacho but then it leads to an offside goal. A lot of incidents like this occur with him on the pitch, a bad pass that should be made at 1-1 or a counter when we’re leading he messes up when we are looking to kill the game and then the opposition come back to draw etc.

 

[MrBrightside1989]

To answer the post question, yes they are a problem. Rashford is much more of a problem. But to be honest all of the players are a problem, perhaps with the exception of Martinez.

As problems go Bruno probably isn't in the top 10 of them at Man Utd

 

[Lentwood]

The manager put the team in position to close out the game by half time

Also to take the lead in the second half.

Not really a player issue yesterday either we made 2 defensive mistakes and got punished. Its not lost though that the players who made those mistakes are ones we largely want to replace (Maguire, Casemiro, McTominay) whilst personally for me Dalot should be a bench option

Saying that their attacking players and also depth are clearly better than ours and thats why we were worried as well as past results.

I really don't buy that their attacking players are better than ours. Football is a game of opinions so I'm not going to get into a back and forth about it but I will say that much-derided players like Rashford and Anthony would be talked up too if they played for low-pressure, low-scrutiny teams teams like Brighton.

We can talk about mistakes but every team makes them. What I don't see from every team is lack of structure and no patterns of play or ideas in attack

 

[Quinze]

But assists aren't the only metric where he excels. It's also in big chance creation. Now feel free to explain why that's also a useless metric, as well as the two combined.

You're actually agreeing with my point that assists aren't the main thing for playmakers.
The post I was responding to claimed Elanga and Pereira (the very man who botched an easy 2v1 against us last week) were better players because they got more assists last season.

 

[Chelsea Dubbing]

Bruno can be a problem but not as much as Rashford, who has been the main problem for a few years. He's not good enough, hasn't improved and epitomises what's been wrong at United since Fergie retired.

No one's had the balls to drop him because he gives sandwiches to kids and is seen as the poster boy. I have more respect for Southgate for having the balls to drop him from the Euros than I do the United management.

Until he's dropped to a squad option/bench, rather than a starter, we aren't going anywhere.

 

[RedRocket9908]

Marcus Rashford's head is clearly not in the right place and can see from his body language and the way he is playing that he no longer enjoys playing so I think someone from the club (probably not Erik or any of his team) should sit down and have a proper conversation with him to try to find out whats wrong with him and what Man Utd as a club to do to help him put it right and get back to enjoying the game and playing well.

 

[Kingofwinners]

Bruno is not a problem he is the problem. Not saying he’s a bad player but his style does not suit where we are as a team. If he was gone it would force us to address many other issues and start playing a more structured style of football.

It’s no reflection on him, he’s talented gives 100% creates chances when no one else does but we are still playing similar mediocre stuff as 5 years ago with lots of other changes and I don’t see that changing this year with him in midfield. He needs to be in an outstanding side where others will look after possession and his creativity is the extra spark or a bad side that needs an outlet. He just doesn’t work for a team like us fighting to be 3rd to 7th in the table.

 

[gajender]

It's too much of a guess to build on Rashford's form, but I think I agree. The thing with Bruno, for me, is that he is not just the best player on the team, but that he is treated as such to too much of a degree. It's not horrible to have a talisman, but it's different if he's THE talisman, and that's what he is. It's been better since he became more of a playmaker, but that's what seemed to always hold Atletico back with Griezmann pre-Barcelona. Yes he was great often, but it's a problem if one player's form is basically the whole team's form. And that's the case with Bruno for me, too.

ETH does kind of like these kind of no bullexcrement (or ALL bullexcrement) leaders, like how he had Tadic before at Ajax. Another player who had the skills for a great 10... but also a liability as your main playmaker. And it wasn't a surprise that they were usually best with him as a false 9 or a winger, or at 10 but with someone like Ziyech on the wings adding a playmaker/midfielder in another way (plus players with more control and -consistent- playmaker attributes like Frenkie and Lasse Schone behind him, or even Gravenberch and Berghuis (and Lisandro, Blind, Mazraoui further back taking on a lot of the playmaking duties, as well).

In that sense it's good that Mainoo is breaking through, that Casemiro can pass better than expected, and that Eriksen and Mount are options - and that Bruno is played more Tadic-like when possible, on the wing or as a false 9. But the problem - or risk - is that Mainoo is inexperienced, so his consistency is likely not perfect, and he's still building up the capability to play 90 minutes, and do that multiple games in a row, let alone multiple times a week. Casemiro showed last season his consistency is an issue, too, while the one before in which he was more consistent, the red cards also showed that the complete reliability there was, well, re: liability. Eriksen can't keep up well enough, Mount is a liability further back.

Bruno could still stay, and maybe once the team gets into more of a rhythm, especially with the new players (and returning?), as it's already more structured in play than it was last season. But it also says more than enough that the Brighton game maybe deserved more, perhaps a win even, but that it also was not that unexpected. Losing 2-1, allegedly against the run of play, is better than losing 4-0 with the run of play, but both give you 0 points and you need to do more than just improve the goal difference - slightly.

It could help (could) if Amad develops into more of a playmaking winger, or if Mount (or Bruno himself) would take that role. Because I honestly think that's the only way to build on Bruno (as a 10) without relying on one player too much. He is no Messi, and even at Barcelona the decline was still there once Xavi, Iniesta, and such moved on and even more reliance was placed unto Messi. Part of the reason the start of Bruno was so good, is because he was new, a new weapon, he could give great through passes, he could appear in the box and score in various ways. But he was A weapon, and treated as such. So besides defenders not being prepared as much yet, he could appear as more of a surprise and focus on his skills, which also makes the surprise and luck factor he's going for more of a benefit rather than a crossed-fingers or prayer situation. He could still be the main weapon, but if he's the only tool and the rest just tries to be a nice toolbox for him, carving out a Bruno shape into that foampillow... you're f'ed if you forgot your batteries, or if this tool cannot get small/big enough to turn this particular gear at work today.

Maybe the entry of Mainoo will do a lot, maybe Casemiro will be more consistent this year, maybe Ugarte will get in and settle well and swiftly. Maybe. I don't think Bruno can be a reliable main weapon if he's the only weapon. Hopefully Mount, Zirkzee, ~Ugarte~, Amad, Mainoo, Mazraoui, etc adapt and grow further, but otherwise Bruno will just be a bit more reliable Pogba, where it's just waiting for the perfect balance to appear, hopefully someday.

And that's why someone like Rashford (or now Garnacho) works a bit better as a main weapon (now). As the whole team doesn't necessarily fall apart if one of them does. You may not score the goals you want and they can be marked out of the match, turning you into more of a toothless beast, but since they would not suddenly become the main playmaker, you don't tame the entire beast by taking out the teeth. A reliance on Rashford gets you hoping for a 1-0, 2-1 win, a reliance on Bruno gets you hoping for a 3-2, 4-3 win. Overly simplified, clearly, but that makes Bruno more risky to me. Doesn't mean he has to go, but that it's a bigger puzzle to figure that out. If you replace Rashford you get to hope the next player is more efficient in assists or goals, maybe a bit of hold-up and in blocking their right back or some midfielder. Want to replace Bruno? Well, you better figure out a new gameplan.

Before I thought the solution would definitely be to let him/them go, but I think that's only the case if the setup will never grow beyond "give it to Bruno and pray for the best". But if we get to the point where him having a bad game just means more edge of the seat moments (and frustration) in creating and scoring chances, then he could stay an amazing asset for quite a while still. There's a reason Tadic felt overrated, but Ajax reached the semifinals, and kept winning in the CL group and its domestic games, with Tadic being the MVP in goals+assists in the Eredivisie for like 4 seasons in a row(?), while not being a consistently reliable playmaker. But if not enough out of Amad, Mount, Mainoo, Casemiro/Ugarte, Mazraoui, Lisandro, Shaw, and possibly even Zirkzee, take on more of the playmaking duties (and grow the necessary skills), Bruno being the leader of this team is closer to a weekly coin toss.

But, again, I do think this season so far (and perhaps the end of the last) shows that the chance is bigger than I thought it could be last season (and beyond). So now I'm curious to see whether I'll be disproven or not, as it obviously comes with many dependencies and the future being unknown (at least to me, right now).

Brilliant post but I just believe if we have any notion of regaining our status as regular title chasers sooner we end this Experiment with Bruno earlier we can be on road to recovery .

 

[Pickle85]

You're actually agreeing with my point that assists aren't the main thing for playmakers.
The post I was responding to claimed Elanga and Pereira (the very man who botched an easy 2v1 against us last week) were better players because they got more assists last season.

Ah ok, apologies!

 

[MancunianAngels]

If our defenders could defend and Zirkzee was an inch shorter, we win that game 2-0 and this thread stays on hiatus for a bit longer.

 

[lost7]

If our defenders could defend and Zirkzee was an inch shorter, we win that game 2-0 and this thread stays on hiatus for a bit longer.

Or maybe Rashford should actually do something for a change? You look at liverpool, arsenal, chelsea, tottenham and their attack is so much better than ours. And I bet none of them pay their players as much as Bruno or Rashford

 

[Cassidy]

I really don't buy that their attacking players are better than ours. Football is a game of opinions so I'm not going to get into a back and forth about it but I will say that much-derided players like Rashford and Anthony would be talked up too if they played for low-pressure, low-scrutiny teams teams like Brighton.

We can talk about mistakes but every team makes them. What I don't see from every team is lack of structure and no patterns of play or ideas in attack

They are clearly better. Adringa who was on the bench starts ahead of Amad at international level and Mitoma is a better player than an out of form Rashford (who was out of form before the manager arrived). Joao Pedro is a top talent CF and thats before you count Ferguson and all the attacking players they signed this summer.

The at a minimum had more attacking depth which in the end when we tired is what won them the game. That and silly defending of course.

Our backup CF hasnt even scored more than 12 goals in all comps in a top 5 league whilst theirs (Joao Pedro, probably not even considered backup now hit 20, last season more than Hojlund)

People will point to Rashfords 30 goal season but in reality that season is an anomoly, he averages around 15 goals a season and has only broken 20 twice in around 10 seasons.

 

[Musclehead]

I swear half these posters have to be paid City fans by ABU media. Only rational reason why there is so much hate and negativity towards our players who are actually decent.

This thread should just be Rashford is the problem.

Forget the stats, watch the games. The guy is totally over rated. Enough said.

 

[POF]

It's the eternal United question with Bruno though. Does he create all these chances to the detriment of our team being able to control games. Would the team be better with 3 midfielders who are capable of keeping possession better or instead funneling everything through Bruno. I get both sides with him. He doesn't seem to have an off switch despite being an older player. When we are penned in and he gets the ball and can release Rashford/Garnacho he's amazing. When we need to take control of a game or pen a team in he's too risky with the ball. He is constantly trying to create something which is both good and bad.

I still believe if you want to play with a No 10 who has complete freedom he is perfect, however I don't think the trade off for having a No 10 is good enough to justify that position.

Alternatively if you want a functioning midfield that can control possession he is too much of a risky player to play there.

It goes back to in my eyes Ragnick's assessment of the squad and the problems we as a club face. You have the two biggest stars in Bruno and Rashford who are perfect for a counter attacking/transition team. But to be a top team you need to be able to dominate possession and have a good counter press. How can you change the team to do that when the two biggest players in the squad are not really suited to it.

The easiest way to control games is to be ahead on the scoreboard. Goals completely change the dynamic of games and you can hold possession all you want but, if you're behind, the opposition is perfectly comfortable out of possession.

When Bruno was off the field against Brighton the game completely changed because there didn't seem to be any chance United would score. That gave Brighton momentum and, with United's defence, that was only going to lead to one result

Bruno is #1 in chance creation in the entire league 2 years in a row in a bang average team completely devoid of attacking quality. You can see how players like De Bruyne talk about him.

You don't get those sort of stats only playing on the counter attack. He is extremely adept at breaking down a low block, whether that's making late runs, playing through or shooting from distance.

Creating chances is the hardest thing to do in football. You can find plenty of players who can keep possession and play simple. Players who create that level of chances are extremely rare and it's really unbelievable how he's taken for granted by United fans.

If he were to get injured and be out for any extended period of time, I shudder to think where United would end up.

Rashford on the other hand produces absolutely nothing and is a huge liability out of possession. If he wasn't in the starting lineup it would make very little difference.

 

[POF]

I love Bruno, but he has an awful habit of ruining game winning moments that are maybe not really reflected in the stats. Yesterday for example, easy pass to Zirkzee but he over hit it, and ok it goes to Garnacho but then it leads to an offside goal. A lot of incidents like this occur with him on the pitch, a bad pass that should be made at 1-1 or a counter when we’re leading he messes up when we are looking to kill the game and then the opposition come back to draw etc.

Are you serious? He picked out Garnacho who tapped it in.

Before that, he played the ball wide to Amad from deep and made a lung bursting overlap to create the extra man which created the chance.

There wasn't much on when he picked the ball up near halfway and he was the sole reason there was a chance at all.

 

[Hammondo]

The easiest way to control games is to be ahead on the scoreboard. Goals completely change the dynamic of games and you can hold possession all you want but, if you're behind, the opposition is perfectly comfortable out of possession.

When Bruno was off the field against Brighton the game completely changed because there didn't seem to be any chance United would score. That gave Brighton momentum and, with United's defence, that was only going to lead to one result

Bruno is #1 in chance creation in the entire league 2 years in a row in a bang average team completely devoid of attacking quality. You can see how players like De Bruyne talk about him.

You don't get those sort of stats only playing on the counter attack. He is extremely adept at breaking down a low block, whether that's making late runs, playing through or shooting from distance.

Creating chances is the hardest thing to do in football. You can find plenty of players who can keep possession and play simple. Players who create that level of chances are extremely rare and it's really unbelievable how he's taken for granted by United fans.

If he were to get injured and be out for any extended period of time, I shudder to think where United would end up.

Rashford on the other hand produces absolutely nothing and is a huge liability out of possession. If he wasn't in the starting lineup it would make very little difference.

Yes he creates the most chances yet our biggest problem is always controlling games, odd that.

 

[Pickle85]

Forget the stats, watch the games. The guy is totally over rated. Enough said.

It's ok guys, @Musclehead has solved it by watching the games (not something I've ever thought to do!) Discussion over!

 

[Musclehead]

It's ok guys, @Musclehead has solved it by watching the games (not something I've ever thought to do!) Discussion over!

Really though, do you watch Fernandes play? How many times have you see that mysterious pass or cross to no one?? 5, 6, 7 times a game? Even his stats are not that great comparatively. Yet some would say he is the next Messi. De Bruyne had more assists in 18 games last yr than Fernandes did in 35. So what is Fernandes there for? Reality is the guy is not as good as some make him out to be. The guy is not a leader, rarely physical, passing % was below 80% and on and on. So let's make him captain? I am still waiting for Fernandes to lift off the ground with all the flapping the guy does every time he is touched. Obviously you have not followed this team for very long or you would see how they have diminished over the years in a downward spiral. Scholes and Giggs told Ronaldo when he first came in if he didn't stop rolling on the ground they would start cleaning their boots on him and they actually did. Those are leaders and this team who has had so many good ones over the years is now clearly lacking.

 

[Footyislife]

Forget the stats, watch the games. The guy is totally over rated. Enough said.

Bruno or Rashford? Bruno is well rated, Rashford definitely shouldn't be starting any games period.

 

[ifightdragons]

If he were to get injured and be out for any extended period of time, I shudder to think where United would end up.

Look at our average league position and goals scored before he arrived in the post-SAF era. It's pretty much the exact same as it has been after we bought him.

 

[Musclehead]

Bruno or Rashford? Bruno is well rated, Rashford definitely shouldn't be starting any games period.

Both, neither of these guys are good enough to start for Manchester United. What is Bruno well rated on? I have looked at his stats and can give examples. The key stat, assists and pass completion %, which really a mid should be counting on, he had less than De Bruyne in assists in half the games last year and a worse pass completion below 80%. (PS I am not looking at City because I like them, in fact not at all) Look at the stats Bruno has, they are pretty mid of the pack. He doesn't hit the top 12 in the EPL for most of them. It seems some have downgraded the expectation level based on the last decade. The expectation level is to win every game every year. As a coach, that was my expectation. If you don't you need to figure out why. Players? Systems? Coaching? You need to make changes and progress yr over yr. If not changes need to be made. I would say that both Rashford and Bruno are more problems than solutions. Rashford is clearly not good enough to start little alone hold a first team spot on the bench. Ineos is bringing in no excuses system. ETH dodged a bullet, probably because Ineos had no alternative and bought some of what he said. This will not go on for long though. Look at Boehly, he has a team sitting out every week. It is a change from the player holds leverage. If you don't play at the highest level every week, meet the expectations, then you don't play. The Pogba situation with Mourinho, Pogba should have been sold as soon as there was friction, in fact should have never been brought back. Instead, Jose was sent walking. Once players know they have that leverage, it is the beginning of a bad culture. Both Rashford and Bruno were part of that bad culture. It seeps in and is hard to remove unless you make a clean sweep.
Look at Slot after Klopp, we will see if there is a negative distinction between the 2 or if Slot will carry on what was a successful tenure.

 

[Pickle85]

Really though, do you watch Fernandes play? How many times have you see that mysterious pass or cross to no one?? 5, 6, 7 times a game? Even his stats are not that great comparatively. Yet some would say he is the next Messi. De Bruyne had more assists in 18 games last yr than Fernandes did in 35. So what is Fernandes there for? Reality is the guy is not as good as some make him out to be. The guy is not a leader, rarely physical, passing % was below 80% and on and on. So let's make him captain? I am still waiting for Fernandes to lift off the ground with all the flapping the guy does every time he is touched. Obviously you have not followed this team for very long or you would see how they have diminished over over the years in a downward spiral. Scholes and Giggs told Ronaldo when he first came in if he didn't stop rolling on the ground they would start cleaning their boots on him and they actually did. Those are leaders and this team who has had so many good ones over the years is now clearly lacking.

Can we stop with this 'do you watch united' nonsense when someone has a different opinion? It's dumb and not constructive.

Who says he's the next Messi? I've literally not seen that anywhere. Any quotes?

His stats are excellent - we've been over this - and his melodrama doesn't make him a worse player. It just makes you like him less. Again, he's consistently among the most prolific creators in Europe and he's not nearly as wayward with his passing as some would have you believe. As for him not being a leader, I think that's rubbish. There's more than one way to lead - not every leader is a Roy Keane - and Bruno's work rate, unwillingness to give up and let his head drop, and courage is an example to follow.

 

[Resonance]

Bruno? No, he is our best player.

Rashford? Probably.

 

[BelfastRed2021]

Sorry but how the heck is Bruno being scapegoated yet again. Mainoo had a very poor game he got caught in possession several times and could have been subbed but the biggest issue on Saturday was Casemiro losing his legs completely in the second half with him and Mainoo both gassed and as soon as Bruno came off we not only lost any semblence of control we basically handed complete control over to Brighton. I really struggle to fathom how Bruno is always to blame the blame should go on on our forwards who where constantly offside when it mattered with two disallowed goals and the absolute shocking defending that cost us two shocking goals.

 

[Grande]

Bruno? No, he is our best player.

Rashford? Probably.

It’s funny this should come up now. I thought it was a so-so performance from Bruno basednon his own (high) standards, yet he was our most creative player, moat key pases, one of the most involved in our opportunities and with most defensive pressures. Rashford was unlucky/unskillful when he was not very offside for his pretty lucky goal, but apart from that he was one of the involved in our press, far behind Amad and Garnacho, and was the only player in the team (goal-keeper included) without a single role to play in any of our small or big opportunities (given that his ‘goal opportunity’ was not part of play).

In short, Bruno is again very useful even on a sub-par day, while Rashford is really struggling making his play count.

The x factor with Rashford is of course that his talent is of a kind that, if he first gets flowing, it is match winning type of talent. But atm stats confirm the eye test deep analysis, and it is what you say.

 

[Leftback99]

Our 6 highest paid (Rashford, Bruno, Casemiro, Sancho, Mount, Antony) are all a problem in one way or another. And that's after recently getting rid of Varane, Martial and De Gea's ridiculous contracts.

 

[Poborsky's hair]

Bruno? No, he is our best player.

Rashford? Probably.

BRUNO: How can be a player who only has 30% of good games and I am being generous our best player?? Hes defo our flashiest but all of the times he fecks up and loses the ball, hes putting so much pressure on us. In ideal word hes an impact bench player. Hes costing us all the control and his moaning all the time is just so pain to see as he doesnt deserve to be our captain. Without other leaders in the team its hard to chose though. Also him being captain make him even more undroppable so he always plays all games without being subbed off which is again 2/3 games easily.


Rashford: hes past it and we should move him on. hes like our Sterling. COuld be good as impact sub, but in ideal world we sell him and reinvest in more motivated and switched on player with both grit and talent. For his own sake he should also kickstart career elsewhere

 

[lex talionis]

Bruno and Rashford should never be in the same sentence when discussing problems with our attack.

 

[ifightdragons]

Bruno and Rashford should never be in the same sentence when discussing problems with our attack.

They definitely should, and they rightfully are.

 

[Glorio]

I genuinely don't think Bruno is a "problem", he plays a controlled game with his national team and would do a lot better with more ball players around him.
His hyper-emotional personality doesn't help at times. He loses his head a fair bit when things go wrong and starts forcing things. When that happens, the team tends to lose it's collective wits as it's currently too reliant on him. Unfortunately there are not many other senior players to pull him out of it when he starts spiralling (e.g. sitting on the floor moaning at the ref while we had a chance to attack at Brighton).

One would have thought a player like Real's version of Casemiro would produce a balancing effect on him and the team, but he's just come and caught the same kamikaze bug! This is where I wonder if there's something in the instructions with the whole "real United players take risks" spiel.

 

[Idxomer]

They are clearly better. Adringa who was on the bench starts ahead of Amad at international level and Mitoma is a better player than an out of form Rashford (who was out of form before the manager arrived). Joao Pedro is a top talent CF and thats before you count Ferguson and all the attacking players they signed this summer.

The at a minimum had more attacking depth which in the end when we tired is what won them the game. That and silly defending of course.

Our backup CF hasnt even scored more than 12 goals in all comps in a top 5 league whilst theirs (Joao Pedro, probably not even considered backup now hit 20, last season more than Hojlund)

People will point to Rashfords 30 goal season but in reality that season is an anomoly, he averages around 15 goals a season and has only broken 20 twice in around 10 seasons.

Joao Pedro offers a lot in general play but he scored 5 goals from open play in the PL last season. He wasn't prolific in the championship either, with fewer goals than Amad when both were there.

 

[Ali Dia]

This is like when people lumped Fred in with McT.

Bruno is twice the player and competitor that Rashford is or ever will be.

 

[swooshboy]

Rashford should not be starting games for us.

Bruno shouldn't either. People will point to his stats about how many chances he creates...but then bemoan us for a style of play that is dependent on moments of magic to score goals. We don't score many goals through consistent attacking pressure, where we create lots of chances and eventually one goes in. We score from isolated highlights.

Bruno loses possession so often – not from trying speculative, incisive passes...but from simple passes that he either misplaces completely, or passes back so inaccurately that the next pass is almost doomed to fail. He also passes backwards far too often – typically when he is passed the ball from a defender, he will pass it straight back to them. Kobbie will often try and turn and go forwards. Bruno rarely does this. I really wish players like Mata were given more chances to play as a 10 when they were heere. Instead, he get's brough on and played on the right wing so Bruno can stay in the middle.

So starting Rashford is silly, because we can play someone better.

Starting Bruno is criminal, because he prevents us having a style of play.

 

[Cassidy]

Joao Pedro offers a lot in general play but he scored 5 goals from open play in the PL last season. He wasn't prolific in the championship either, with fewer goals than Amad when both were there.

Who called him prolific? He outscored both our CFs last season and hes not their top talent CF was the point

 

[tentan]

Both should've left in the summer.

Wait, there is still time.

 

[dan1509]

Yes, both are absolutely the problem.

Rashford has always been an average player. Even back when many on here thought he was good. He is a winger with zero technical ability and skill who only relies on pace in a counterattacking style of play. If you ever put on a City or Madrid match, you will see how Doku, Savinho, and Vini Jr cause havoc with their dribbling. Rashford has never ever been able to do that. His dribbling relies primarily on outpacing defenders, which is useless when playing against low block teams.

Bruno is a luxury style player that can only shine in midtable teams where he can be given the liccense to do anything he wants as their star player. I do not believe it is possible for any team featuring him to have a cohesive functioning midfield, and throughout his 10+ year career he has never once been apart of one. Many on here made excuses that his teammates here are poor and how on Portugal with better teammates he looks great. Then at the Euro when he finally played against real teams, he looked terrible. Once again though his fanboys changed the narrative, now claiming his Portugal teammates are crap too. Its amazing how unlucky this guy is, his teammates are apparently always "crap" for some reason. Even at Sporting he was apparently carrying them, yet they never made a legitimate title challenge while he was there. You would think that since he was carrying Sporting they surely musta done terrible after he left right.....well no they won the league the very next season

 

[POF]

Yes he creates the most chances yet our biggest problem is always controlling games, odd that.

Not at all. It only works if you have players who can finish those chances. That doesn't mean the team should stop creating them.

Look at our average league position and goals scored before he arrived in the post-SAF era. It's pretty much the exact same as it has been after we bought him.

Look at the quality of the strikers in those eras.

It's gone from RVP, Rooney, Chicharito, Welbeck and Falcao to Hojlund and Zirkzee.

 

[Musclehead]

Look at our average league position and goals scored before he arrived in the post-SAF era. It's pretty much the exact same as it has been after we bought him.

Go figure! Now there is a stat that matters.

Can we stop with this 'do you watch united' nonsense when someone has a different opinion? It's dumb and not constructive.

Who says he's the next Messi? I've literally not seen that anywhere. Any quotes?

His stats are excellent - we've been over this - and his melodrama doesn't make him a worse player. It just makes you like him less. Again, he's consistently among the most prolific creators in Europe and he's not nearly as wayward with his passing as some would have you believe. As for him not being a leader, I think that's rubbish. There's more than one way to lead - not every leader is a Roy Keane - and Bruno's work rate, unwillingness to give up and let his head drop, and courage is an example to follow.

Its not opinion, its reality. As I mentioned earlier even using stats he doesn't show at the top level, not sure what your cherry picking from. You can accept mediocrity at Brighton, West Ham, Everton and the list goes on, however this is Manchester United. Bruno Fernandes is mediocrity. Whether you think that or not is irrelevant. Talk to anyone who has played at a high level and they will tell you the exact same thing. Looking at it through rose coloured glasses doesn't change the reality. The funniest comment is "there is more than one way to lead". Well compared to Keane, who pretty much won it all and played for a championship team, I think I would take that way over the "Bruno" way. Unwillingness to drop his head and give up, really? The guy makes lazy plays. Whatever, I cannot believe I am even responding to this drivel.