Antony | On loan to Real Betis

flameinthesun said:
It's less him not being able to handle the pressure, if anything he seems like he has the mentality to handle the pressure. Its just a simple fact that the league is quicker and more physical than other leagues and he could not make that step. Technically he still kept his good touch and control of the ball in tight spaces. He just didn't have that extra bit of physicality needed as well as not really being a creative, unpick the lock type of player. La liga seems well suited for him. Not every player who moves to the premier league fails because of mentality.
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That's a good point. Not everything has to do with handling pressure or being mental monsters or whatever. Some players just aren't good enough for that level. It's a different thing if he'd moved to Arsenal and then started lighting up the league.
 
flameinthesun said:
It's less him not being able to handle the pressure, if anything he seems like he has the mentality to handle the pressure. Its just a simple fact that the league is quicker and more physical than other leagues and he could not make that step. Technically he still kept his good touch and control of the ball in tight spaces. He just didn't have that extra bit of physicality needed as well as not really being a creative, unpick the lock type of player. La liga seems well suited for him. Not every player who moves to the premier league fails because of mentality.
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I would agree with your post in regards to his first season. He was decent enough, but just didn't have the ability or physicality to do more than that.

Second season he declined massively and that seemed to be more a mental issue. His confidence or belief seemed shot. How much of that was his off-the-field problems and how much was the 'pressure of playing for Man Utd', we don't really know. Purely at a guess, I suspect the former may have started it but then the latter exacerbated it to the point he couldn't pull himself out of the spiral.
 
MadDogg said:
I would agree with your post in regards to his first season. He was decent enough, but just didn't have the ability or physicality to do more than that.

Second season he declined massively and that seemed to be more a mental issue. His confidence or belief seemed shot. How much of that was his off-the-field problems and how much was the 'pressure of playing for Man Utd', we don't really know. Purely at a guess, I suspect the former may have started it but then the latter exacerbated it to the point he couldn't pull himself out of the spiral.
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Your later point probably played a factor as well. Although I'd also say its a bit of second season syndrome where the league figured out he won't be able to beat his fullback physically and doesn't really have a high enough level of dribbling or creative passing, so just stick to him and he likely isn't going to do much.
 
There's so many examples of players leaving the PL and hitting their peak or getting back to their best form. For a myriad of reasons. We all know he has that finish in his locker and will score if you give him that angle a few times a game but he wasn't getting games under Amorim and he looked shot under ETH since that Barca goal and them the problems the following summer. It's not that we aren't signing decent players who have no chance of success here. It's just when it's clearly stopped working we just hold on for too long or initially give them too much wages so the only option we have is to loan them and hope they get started up again somewhere. If we can get a McT type fee for him in the summer or even a bit more that would be a result. This team needed and needs more than another shooter who would happily track back but even that was an improvement on Rashford the last 1.5 years. Im suprised we didn't try him more under this new manager in different positions but I assume the player wanted a fresh start either way. Can't blame him for that.
 
flameinthesun said:
It's less him not being able to handle the pressure, if anything he seems like he has the mentality to handle the pressure. Its just a simple fact that the league is quicker and more physical than other leagues and he could not make that step. Technically he still kept his good touch and control of the ball in tight spaces. He just didn't have that extra bit of physicality needed as well as not really being a creative, unpick the lock type of player. La liga seems well suited for him. Not every player who moves to the premier league fails because of mentality.
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Mata was one of the least physical players I've ever seen in this league and he was world class compared to Antony for us.

Regards Antony. It's either he couldn't handle the pressure or just wasn't good enough. Maybe a combination of the two.
 
His cameos at wingback were pretty good Id say, then I am sure he said to Amorim, he didnt want to play that position, otherwise I dont see a reason why he would leave with so many limited options in attack we have had at the time.
 
Poborsky's hair said:
His cameos at wingback were pretty good Id say, then I am sure he said to Amorim, he didnt want to play that position, otherwise I dont see a reason why he would leave with so many limited options in attack we have had at the time.
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All for supporting the new manager, but wow.
 
erikcred said:
All for supporting the new manager, but wow.
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It is a reach, but I wonder how much of a reach it actually is given his reaction to being asked to play full back by the manager he pushed to join here.

Either way, I did like him at wing back.
 
GMoore23 said:
Mata was one of the least physical players I've ever seen in this league and he was world class compared to Antony for us.

Regards Antony. It's either he couldn't handle the pressure or just wasn't good enough. Maybe a combination of the two.
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I think he realized he wasn't good enough and then it knocked his confidence.

It was a silly signing. He wasn't even that great in the Dutch league.

It was a panic purchase.

We should've bided our time and scouted for someone better. Olise for example.
 
GMoore23 said:
Mata was one of the least physical players I've ever seen in this league and he was world class compared to Antony for us.

Regards Antony. It's either he couldn't handle the pressure or just wasn't good enough. Maybe a combination of the two.
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Him not being good enough for the premier league....is exactly what was said...
 
He is not doing anything different at Betis. For us, teams had figured him out and stopped giving him that space to shoot.

Give it time, once teams learn he has one trick in his book and cut it off, he will go back to being toothless.
 
Some players just suited to certain League. Forlan is a good example. Working class at United, world class at Villareal & Atletico M.
 
Nogbadthebad said:
I always think of Gary Birtles when this comes up, he scored 6 goals in 9 games for forest in the 81 season, moved to us, didn't score a single goal in the league, 25 games and no goals. Just wasn't a player that could cope with it all.
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That was painful to watch, we were willing him on to score but he ended up trying to hard, it jsut wasn't happening for him
 
next_number_seven said:
I think he was in a state of panic after losing first two games to smaller teams.

Antony would've been a fine purchase if he was 30m max.

I bet Fergie would've never signed him though.
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No he wouldn't, if he can't do the job required of him he's not worth 30p to us
 
Rasmus_9 said:
I’m not totally convinced by those that think Antony wasn’t able to cope physically with the league. Amad has similar speed and slighter frame yet is excelling in the league.
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Absolutely not. Amad has far better acceleration and agility. He can actually burst past players thanks to his first step and turning speed.

Beyond that he's also just a smarter, better player overall
fergiewherearethou said:
It is very hard to comprehend how a supposedly top manager cannot make the difference between the Eredivisie and the PL.
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Man failing at something he's never done before is not hard to comprehend actually
MadDogg said:
I would agree with your post in regards to his first season. He was decent enough, but just didn't have the ability or physicality to do more than that.

Second season he declined massively and that seemed to be more a mental issue. His confidence or belief seemed shot. How much of that was his off-the-field problems and how much was the 'pressure of playing for Man Utd', we don't really know. Purely at a guess, I suspect the former may have started it but then the latter exacerbated it to the point he couldn't pull himself out of the spiral.
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This
 
giorno said:
Absolutely not. Amad has far better acceleration and agility. He can actually burst past players thanks to his first step and turning speed.
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The difference between the two is Antony's a one trick pony. All he does is feint his body to the right, move the ball left and try to curve the ball in from outside the box. Once defenders figured this out and closed out his left side, he was useless going outside and hence stopped scoring goals. Amad is far more unpredictable and actually has two legs.
 
bringbackbebe said:
The difference between the two is Antony's a one trick pony. All he does is feint his body to the right, move the ball left and try to curve the ball in from outside the box. Once defenders figured this out and closed out his left side, he was useless going outside and hence stopped scoring goals. Amad is far more unpredictable and actually has two legs.
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The difference is how fast they move. Antony doesn't move fast enough to get any separation from the defender, Amad does(in the PL)

Mind you, the biggest difference is Antony relies on his dribbling a lot more than Amad. If he can't threaten the defender 1vs1 he doesn't have the short touch pass&move and off ball movement to make up for it
 
Just scored a cracking volley and won a pen earlier in the game as well.
 
Good on him! Can we recall him due to injury crisis ? He probably wouldn’t want to return. I probably don’t really want him back. Christ I’m miserable.
 
Still think we should have tried him out properly as a wing back.
 
This is too much. You’ve got Rashford beating a man and pressing. You’ve got Antony scoring bangers. Then you’ve got Amad getting his foot stuck in the grass and doing his ligaments.

Burn the training ground down and start again.
 
Fantastic goal.

And regardless of how he's doing at Betis, it was madness to send both Rashford and Antony out on loan. Of course there would be injuries.
 
The opposition is down to 10 men so he is being afforded more space and time. I know he can only beat what he is up against, but just a bit on extra info.
 
Dve said:
Fantastic goal.

And regardless of how he's doing at Betis, it was madness to send both Rashford and Antony out on loan. Of course there would be injuries.
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Short term pain for the long term gain of increasing their value and marketability.

This seasons a write off except for the cups.
 


Good to see him doing well. We might get a decent fee for him if he can continue to play well.
 
Has an assist now as well (albeit a bit of a Sancho one where he passed it sideways 25 yards out from goal and the other player smashed it into the net).

Genuinely glad to see him doing well, and can't say that of some of our other loanees.
 
Good stuff. Hopefully him and Rashford get us the funds for a top striker.
 
That could be 3 assists and 3 goals in 4 matches. If you count the rebound and penalty won.
 
next_number_seven said:
Short term pain for the long term gain of increasing their value and marketability.

This seasons a write off except for the cups.
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Yes, perhaps, but shot term pain could turn into a long term pain if we don't win any of the cups. We can still qualify of the CL, mind.
 
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