Football fans are ridiculous sometimes, it's fine to join United for money but you are a pussy if you decide to not come because you like where you are. That's a little bit easy.
Antoine Griezmann
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Football fans are ridiculous sometimes, it's fine to join United for money but you are a pussy if you decide to not come because you like where you are. That's a little bit easy.
Yeah people think Griezmann will compete for more with United omg
In my view football is about winning trophies, as a top player your career moves should be based on that and nothing else, as Roy Keane said the other stuff will still be there when you're done at 35, nothing else should factor in IMO, if he thinks otherwise then ok, we'll have to look elsewhere.
Not a pussy but not wanting to leave his comfort zone is a strike against him imo.
Fair play to him but it hurt the likes of Shearer's legacy and place in history. That's the choice they make.
Yeah totally agree
It's not, we're shite, we're a long way off competing with the best teams. Still need to sign a few world class players, the Barca game from a few days ago shows how far we are.
Edit: Oops quoted wrong post my bad.
The problem is that we are not the club or the team we think we are. I understand why he would be reluctant to join United today but I wouldn't if SAF was still here. I love United but I have no idea about where we are going to be in 3 or 4 years.
This. People need to realise we just don't have the pull we use to. These past few years have tarnished our rep, players could assume we're taking the Liverpool route. We are just lucky we are stocked with cash tbh.
Yeah but let's been honest Roy Keane is a weird kinda guy, probably the last guy in the world I'd turn to for personal advice.
If there was a nuclear holocaust and the survivors were me, Keane and a goat. I'd ask the goat for advice before I asked Keane. He is a man of strange beliefs and many fixations. He rarely looks happy.
Anyhow, if Grizzi doesn't come Mou and Woody will get someone else. I trust them to solve our goal scoring problem one way or another.
(If the above did not make any sense, it's because I'm drunk)
But it's a brighter future than a Simeone less, cash stapped Atletico.
Saying all that, the reasons thats put forward aren't success based, they're weather and country based. That's the problem i have with it.
Hes not moving because he's comfortable. And its not as if United are the only club in for him
I think you both are seriously too negative
I still think this team will win Europa
I think you both are seriously too negative
I still think this team will win Europa
It's not negativity, it's a fact mate. No sane player, not matter how tinted his glasses will look on our performances over the last 4 years and be excited to join. We've been dire, to put it lightly. Things are looking up with Jose etc. but we are still a far way off. The gap with us and Atleti isn't as big as of a few seasons ago but they're still a better team.
I understand we are a "project" or whatever the term that keeps getting thrown around is, but we've been saying that shite for years. We need to start finishing up this project and start winning again because our rep has been tarnished.
Also, the Europa is shite.
I cant see him coming as what do we offer him he couldnt get going to any of the top performing clubs. Real Bayern PSG Juve maybe even Barca would be in for him if he was put up for sale. If he stays where he is even hes guaranteed Champions League every season. We cant guarantee that at this present time, nor could we say its guaranteed in the next 3-4 years. Hes also said the weather puts him off coming to England. The only 3 things that might make him think is his brother, Pogba and his favourite player was Beckham growing up.
Our biggest and highest ever profile signings have arguably come in the last 4 years.
As I've already said $$$$. No-one wanted to pay the money for Pogba, Falcao was on a free and on ridiculous wages, ADM was kicked out of Madrid and wanted PSG in the first place. Zlatan on ridiculous wages and most people thought he was finished, PSG didn't even renew his contract.
All money.
And thats the crux of the matter, how far off the creme of Europe we are.I think you both are seriously too negative
I still think this team will win Europa
But not our best players
I think you both are seriously too negative
I still think this team will win Europa
I'm not negative, I just say that our current situation can and will create doubts in the big players minds, Mourinho could call him and convince him that it's the best place for him but if he is just watching from the outside the picture is fairly bleak.
What are you talking about? Is this meant for me? If so, then - What are you talking about?
How are we shite? We've won 2 major trophies in the past year and on course to win 2 more in the next few months.
What has that Barca game showed you, because to me, it's was pretty average quality football game with a lot of drama. Seriously people like to piss on us from great height, but Real Madrid went through a phase where they did largely feck all for 10 years.. 2002-2012. Did it make them suddenly a club that wasn't guaranteed success in a grand scheme of things? Bayern did the same thing as did Barca. Barca were down as far as 17th in the league one time and got put out of UEFA Cup by Celtic that year.
PSG wanted to renew Zlatan but he wanted to leave.
Are we supposed to sign these players on frees? The players are coming no matter how you try to line it up with your insecurities.
Except for all those big name players we sign.. .We can't attract the big players...
Baillys dream was to play for us for example, even with Barca looking at him.
The Atalanta player whos tearing up Serie A has said he would turn down Juve's bid to join us. PSG impressive rb wants to join as well as Fukir (sp) from Lyon.
That's just three players who would improve us thats even made their wishes public.
Its not as if Griezmann is saying we're not good enough or turning us down for a rival. He enjoys Spain and wants to stay there.
It's that simple
Attracting the big players and using them correctly are two different thing
Bailly was relatively unknown, also the rest of the players you mentioned are fans of the club, all players are not fans of United. I'm not saying we should be signing players for free, simply that given how shite we've been over the past few years there wouldn't be much more of an initiative for the world's best players to join us if we didn't possess it.
We aren't even sure where our club will be in a few years as no matter how much money we spend we seem to be stuck between 4th and 7th for the past 4 years, let alone players outside of the club who don't pay as much attention to United as we do.
Genuinely, some of our fans think we're some second rate club who can only offer great wages. It's a fecking joke. Did you not see all that Russian support we've had in Rostov. Or the time we were in Australia and our team got mobbed on Bondi beach? You move to United you're guaranteed to be known worldwide. Do we have an amazing team at the minute no? Are we absolutely enormous club, with far reaching global support? Undoubtedly.
That's cool, not like there are teams around the world that can offer that while actually being good at football too. Ala Madrid, Barcelona, Juventus, Bayern etc.
Edit: Also, I'm not saying we are a second rate team. We are a huge club that has been pretty shite at football for a while. That's all.
Yeah Juventus? As great a club as it is is nowhere near as popular as United. United is behemoth, in a league of its own. If you're unsure just look at this photo in U.S from a couple of years back.
Marca had to photoshop it. To make it seem like there were more Madrid fans.
Bailly was known to Barca, that's the point.
Those players want to join us, that's my next point. Not every player in world football has to want to play for us, just players that can improve us.
You can't if and but every signing or potential signing to prove a point. All you're doing is giving reasons why they're joining, not that we can't attract them.
Also Madrid can put out a front 4 tomorrow that cost over 300m euro. Big sides pay big money for players they want.
Mkhi left a title chasing Dortmund and turned down Arsenal to join us.
3 of our 4 signings cost what? 50m between them?
Pogba isn't the norm.
Can you provide proof there was concrete interest from Barca and a bid was made? Speculation is hardly worth discussing, otherwise. When did I say that players wouldn't want to join us? You're arguing a completely different discussion than what I'm claiming. Simply put, those players you mentioned all came out and admitted they were fans of the club. We can offer prestige and money, but so can a lot of other teams, whilst actually being good at football, competing for the Champions League and their respective leagues. We can't even guarantee top 4 as we've only made it once in the past 4 years.
Also I'm not even talking about the ilk of players you're mentioning, I'm talking about the world's best and how we can't offer them anything that other clubs can't, apart from money. Hence if a player isn't driven by money I don't see them picking us over a Real or a Barca for example who are light years ahead of us atm.
Thinking logically rather than having your opinion skewed by your love for the club, actually pay attention to our predictament. We lost our greatest ever manager, hired two donkeys to replace him and qualified for the CL once in the past 4 years despite spending an incredile amount of money.
We are heading in the right direction as I've already said, but not all players not involved with United give a feck about us enough to see that, nor are some of the world's best players who are already established interested in projects, they want to win things.
Not saying we can't sign them, simply that if they aren't motivated by money, or assuming they aren't a fan of the club, our rep has been damaged a bit imo. Hence we don't have some divine right to sign players.
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Not all players consider Utd, especially latin players from S America and Southern Europe as Real and Barca are the big draw. Even Bale turned us down to go there. I cant remember many WC or top players in their prime signing for us. Cantona Veron Di Maria and Pogba apart, although some of his performances have been meh. We either signed them young and they developed here Ronaldo, Rooney, class of 92 and Keane. Not well known players who developed here Schmeichel Vidic Evra Kanchelskis, or heading towards the finishing line, RVP, Ibra for example.
We could sign plenty of South American players. You don't think Jose gets phone calls about players wanting to move to United? I'm talking about high profile players too. You just don't hear about. Just cause it's not in the media, it doesn't mean there isn't anything happening. We always signed players with a certain profile until recently, so that why we rarely went for superstars. I'm not saying every single player would always pick to play for United, of course they wouldn't. What I'm saying is that Man Utd have a lot of pull for a whole host of reasons, be it money or the profile of the club. The point is, some people don't give us credit. I see some United fans saying 'oh why would such and such leave Dortmund (for example) for us'? Which is laughable!
If Griezmann doesn't want to come I don't want him.
But it's a big year ahead. We'll either sign a stopgap who's heading towards the finish line, ie. Mertens, or we'll take a punt on a ready-made star who either will or won't fit.
As much as I would like young and developed here, or not well known developed here, I don't think Jose will go that route.
We need someone quick and with plenty of great goals in them. I'm not sure Dybala suits us because he never played as spearhead more in Mata's position. I'd love it to be Mbappe but I think Mertens or Lacazette is more likely.
But it's a big year ahead. We'll either sign a stopgap who's heading towards the finish line, ie. Mertens, or we'll take a punt on a ready-made star who either will or won't fit.
As much as I would like young and developed here, or not well known developed here, I don't think Jose will go that route.
We need someone quick and with plenty of great goals in them. I'm not sure Dybala suits us because he never played as spearhead more in Mata's position. I'd love it to be Mbappe but I think Mertens or Lacazette is more likely.
Again Madrid are the biggest club in the world and they could put out a front 4 tomorrow that cost 300m. They held the record transfer fee for over 15 years, hell they broke the world record twice in a week.
Were those players motivated by money? Suarez cost as much as Di Maria and if we take away actual broken laws its reported Neymar cost more than Pogba. Their front 3 have or will sign new contracts that will put them top 4/5 earners in world football. Their entire wage budget is focused on those 3 players.
Big clubs do not sign big players cheaply. Big clubs spend money.
In your world you want us to sign players cheaper due to our success. That would mean turning down other successful clubs across Europe when we approach them.
You'd then probably just call them a fan of ours and we're back to square one.
We were league winners and lost out on Hazard due to not paying top dollar. Pogba left us when we were head to head with Barca for the title of top side in Europe for a rebuilding Juve. Benzema went to a struggling Madrid during that period as well. Ribery said no and went to Bayern. Rooney nearly jumped ship to City unless he got paid.
Lost out on Robben to Chelsea, Mikel as well.
The lesson is if we want to sign players against other European sides we have to overpay. Win lose or draw.
This isn't a revelation that's suddenly appeared over the last 4 years. We've lost out on massive talents when we were dominating.
Everybody is motivated by money. Thats why they have agents.
I get this is a forum and all but some of you guys need to relax.
There's 2 sides to a coin - yes we have to overpay & make the best players an undoubtedly wonderful offer but we also cannot buy every player that is shining. It is just not possible.
What is important is we have shown signs ever since Moyes left that this club is moving away from SAF's shadow relatively unscathed.
The right players will come & the success we follow. Very few players are able to say No to moving to our club & actually make it look like a good decision.
There's 2 sides to a coin - yes we have to overpay & make the best players an undoubtedly wonderful offer but we also cannot buy every player that is shining. It is just not possible.
What is important is we have shown signs ever since Moyes left that this club is moving away from SAF's shadow relatively unscathed.
The right players will come & the success we follow. Very few players are able to say No to moving to our club & actually make it look like a good decision.
You're failing to understand what I'm posting. If we were to compete for the world's best players, a player that the other teams who could match us for prestige and money were also chasing, unless they had some sort of attachment to the club we would lose out more often than not. It's really that simple. We are a project in work and if a player was given the option of a project that hasn't been a competitive force for nearly half a decade now and a team that matched the terms and was competing for multiple honours, there'd only be one winner.
That's not even taking into consideration the better living conditions etc. those teams could offer.
We are on a Utd forum, so the majority on here love the club, and we have a few who come on here for whatever reason and support other clubs. A lot of people speak with their heart, and think if we go calling to the world, most of the players will trip over themselves to come here. in the late 90s and 2000's this would of been more likely than now. If you take the 'average' WC footballer, they are already at a top team who probably win things on a regular basis, do not originate from these shores, English is probably not their first language either. The only thing attractive here, (unless the player has an affinity to us, usually to how we used to play, or for a specific player who played for us e.g. Griezmann) is the money first, the club second, the manager third. At the likes of Chelsea City etc its probably money, manager, then club. This is proven as City & Chelsea won nothing for years before their rich sugar daddies took over. To get the top stars in we need to overpay. If we can get back to winning like we did under Fergie it will be a lot easier.
In a last month there were definitely more hints that he will stay in Atletico. It's also clear that we have shown some interest in the player.
Now, just maybe, we also cooled that interest recent just because of the things that everybody mentioned already in the thread.
He is definitely not our priority looking from a tactical point of view. Pogba struggles in a 2 midfield but on the other hand even if he didn't struggle Mhki great form in a last 2-3 months suggest that he is capable to play that role behind the striker. Not just capable but even been able to play it on a similar level to Griezmann.
With that in mind, it's possible that we are looking at other option. Of course, there is also a possibility that he decided to stay and I have no problem with that. Atletico is a great club and there are cases in the past where other players have refused us. But this transfer was always questionable, even more now when Mhki has hit the form.
Now, just maybe, we also cooled that interest recent just because of the things that everybody mentioned already in the thread.
He is definitely not our priority looking from a tactical point of view. Pogba struggles in a 2 midfield but on the other hand even if he didn't struggle Mhki great form in a last 2-3 months suggest that he is capable to play that role behind the striker. Not just capable but even been able to play it on a similar level to Griezmann.
With that in mind, it's possible that we are looking at other option. Of course, there is also a possibility that he decided to stay and I have no problem with that. Atletico is a great club and there are cases in the past where other players have refused us. But this transfer was always questionable, even more now when Mhki has hit the form.
So what if he won't come. We'll get someone else.
Hate to see all the hate for EL here..
Hate to see all the hate for EL here..
Definitely and we don't even know what he is going to decide, he just said several times that moving from Atletico wasn't a straightforward decision which is perfectly understandable.
Although unrealistic, I'd much rather see Sanchez in a united shirt
Every since this thing broke, I think he's wanted to distance himself from it. It's mid season it's not good for him, his club or United. I don't think we can read much into anything. Naturally we'll want to quality for the CL and then take it from there.
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