Lukaku playing the role of Aguero is like Jimmy Carr playing the role of Thor. Just doesn't work.
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Lukaku playing the role of Aguero is like Jimmy Carr playing the role of Thor. Just doesn't work.
I'm not sure why this was the response to my post.Let me guess you want him to make the runs behind the defence that in fact non of our midfielders make
Our best passer & pass was shaw today. Pereira made a good cross & martial scored too.
Do you disagree that Martial shows a lack of urgency and doesn't seek to develop his game enough?
I see him being more defensive than ever literally dropping deep as possible to cover shaw which he never used to do until Jose's seasons.
Pressing - no one has done it in the last couple games.
You compare how he pressed when all Lingard, Rashford, Pogba, Herrera were doing it - I see no reason to suddenly ask why he isn't doing it when at max there is only one player who presses if at all anymore.
One day OGS will play him in the false 9/SS position and he'll explode into life. I'm certain of it. Martial is still too much on the periphery of the action. He's still a threat on the left of the diamond even more than pure winger but I think it's time to take the centre stage again. Still recall the way he spinned VVD in his debut season. He may never satisfy enough people that always complains about his style but there's a deadly player waiting to be unleashed- in one or two action he can make the difference.
Martial & Rashford are apparently reaching this unfulfilled potential threshold after not even a half season under ole
I can see why people used to call our fans as glory hunters
Not quite what I said. Though if it comes across as such I’m happy to add a bit more nuance.
I’m not saying they’ll be write offs if they don’t become Ronaldo overnight. They’re both clearly gonna be very good players. If they aren’t already. Merely that if we expect them to become the World Class leaders of our frontline, and hold down their positions for years to come, in a team worthy of challenging on all fronts (which is the dream, is it not?) then they’re going to have to up their consistency pretty soon... in line with the likes of Kane and Sterling, their peers who made these steps at similar ages (Kane was Rashfords age when he had his first 30 goal season, and Sterling is only a year older than Martial)
When do you think it’s reasonable to expect such consistency from them? Both have been at the club for four years now. They don’t neee to settle in. And we’re about to enter a crucial rebuilding period where it’s more than fair to ask whether we can improve our attack, or whether we can rely on what he have.
And don’t do the glory hunter shit mate. Come on now. I’ve been to far flung shit holes at expense to watch us lose dead rubbers with a team of kids. Ive been Water-hosed watching glorified friendlies. I’ve followed England across continents in the dark days of Hodgson & McClaren. Go for the ball, ‘cos the man will take you out sunshine!
When the rest of the team is made to an ability to create chances for our strikers. When that happens we can dump martial & Rashford for not being good enough.
I really can't be bothered to repeat things but Harry Kane at United vs Harry Kane at Spurs - where is he going to be better? The fullbacks, the CM, the attacking midfielders, the wingers, the ball playing CB.
Kane would struggle here so to suddenly expect the like of martial & Rashford becoming consistent & good enough when nobody in the squad is apart from De gea is a bit OTT.
Injured again. Has had a wretched time with them.
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Need to play cohesive creative football for that side of his game to shine.
You see the passes he was making at the start of the game? I can't wait to see those as a deep lying false nine who gets the ball to feet & aims to play balls directly to the wider strikers or takes the defence on himself.
He is a bit too easy to read at LW because his options are usually there for all to see in advance.
Thought he was good today. Passing was nice and crisp and he was asking questions of the defense throughout.
It's that girlfriend of his I'm telling you
Injuries have killed him this season. Playing one week out for two constantly.
This just show your level of bias with Martial. Just because Martial is struggling, doesn't mean a world class striker like Kane would struggle also.
Kane would struggle with this midfield. Any striker will struggle.
Scored, put through shaw who fecked up n east cutback, linked well at times, then didn't touch the ball and Watford dominated.
Good game all things considered.
Good game all things considered.
Right.
So Kane is going to do better here because young & shaw provide better crosses than trippier & Rose or the other fullbacks they have?
Mata is going to create more than Eriksen is he? How about if Eriksen plays at RW
. Let me guess Pogba is better than Eriksen too?What about delle Ali? A support striker who actually plays behind a striker.
What about lamela, son & lucas moura's ability to cross? Not a single player can cross in our team that beats the opponent's foot more than once a match.
If you think Kane & Aguero would do good for us as much as they are for spurs & City without spending a single pound on another player then feel free. I just bamboozled to think how that is the case.
Have you seen the games where teams mark Pogba out & the rest of the team struggle to make a clear cut chance.
Glad to see him score.
When he's on the ball he's good, but he just has no instinct or movement sometimes.
The potential is there, but he needs to add urgency to his play, and learn how to move into better positions in the box.
When he's on the ball he's good, but he just has no instinct or movement sometimes.
The potential is there, but he needs to add urgency to his play, and learn how to move into better positions in the box.
Going by most of our games under Ole, we like to counter. We leave two and sometimes three players up top and then Pogba joins in which makes it four. Unfortunately today our MF was not controlling the ball, especially in that second half, and hence the front two/three had little to work with.
This is a counter attacking side but differs kind of from mourinho in that Shaw would not be bombing forward and martial would be back defending most of the time.
Worrying though our lack of control in MF. Against a top team we would have been destroyed today.
This is a counter attacking side but differs kind of from mourinho in that Shaw would not be bombing forward and martial would be back defending most of the time.
Worrying though our lack of control in MF. Against a top team we would have been destroyed today.
We've been saying it for ages mate, it's not going to happen. I've almost completely lost any hope for Martial. I'd say it's almost 100% certain now that he'll never be a top level player because he's completely stagnated as a player.
We have scored three more goals than Spurs have this season, despite our catastrophic start, and we finished above them last season (and still might this!)
You’re talking as if Kane is playing in some inherently superior cosmic goal scoring powerhouse, based on virtually nothing. Not to mention that when both have played in the same England set up, Kane has managed 22 goals in 37 to Rashfords 6 in 31.
There’s no shame in conceding that Kane is better. He’s older for one, and hasn’t been shifted about positionally as much. But he’s notably a level above Rash at present, and began to show it at this age. And when he did, he did it without the benefit of 4 whole seasons as a first teamer behind him!
I’m not saying Rashford needs to prove himself the second coming of Dennis Law by the end of May, or else. But he also can’t spend another season, let alone two, at the same level he is now, and still expect to be given the same “Yung & Lernin” leeway he currently enjoys.
I want him to be our No10. He’s one of us. But in order to earn that, he needs that big jump to prolific. A jump every truly great striker makes. This isn’t remotely controversial.
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Kane and Aguero might not as good as in their teams now, but I doubt they would 'struggle' as you said before. Again, just because Martial is struggling, it doesn't mean the like of Kane and Aguero would struggle. Just because Martial isn't as good as those two.Right.
So Kane is going to do better here because young & shaw provide better crosses than trippier & Rose or the other fullbacks they have?
Mata is going to create more than Eriksen is he? How about if Eriksen plays at RW
What about delle Ali? A support striker who actually plays behind a striker.
What about lamela, son & lucas moura's ability to cross? Not a single player can cross in our team that beats the opponent's foot more than once a match.
If you think Kane & Aguero would do good for us as much as they are for spurs & City without spending a single pound on another player then feel free. I just bamboozled to think how that is the case.
Have you seen the games where teams mark Pogba out & the rest of the team struggle to make a clear cut chance.
I never said that Kane wasn't better than Rashford. No one would say such a thing.
I said that Rashford & Martial can't be compared to their maximum ability at United when there is no one creating enough chances for them when spurs have a better defence, have better wingers & some good players playing in the middle as well.
That's why they are above us ultimately because they have had a game plan with players that can execute it. We have hardly had any consistency coming from the managers, the players or the tactics - so ultimately giving up on Rashford or Martial at this moment of time does not make sense to me.
When we have good creators centrally at midfield & defense - at that point if Rashford & Martial fail then I'd be glad to see them leave. But complaining about the players who should be the icing on the cake when the cake is half cooked doesn't make sense to me.
Is it confirmed he's injured again?
Yes. Ole said he's unlikely to make it on Tuesday.
Why are people comparing Martial to Kane and Aguero when the former plays as a winger while the latter two play as strikers.
Such an odd season from him. So many injuries this season which has stopped him pickin up any momentum since Ole arrived.
Journos are saying he's been having problems since before Ole was here but kept playing through injuries.
His dribbling has taken a nose dive lately.
He can't get past players at all.
He can't get past players at all.
He's definitely had them since pre-season I think. His knee maybe? Not sure exactly but I remember reading that he's been just playing through injuries but constantly getting knocks. Still having a relatively productive season anyway mind you. I know a lot of people are getting impatient, but he's justifying his spot in the side regardless of if he makes this step up or not, but even so, I reckon next season he'll really push on. First full season with Ole and an attacking side and more importantly, as the status of being an important player, but also a rest this summer to fix up his injury problem. You look at his situation since Mourinho arrived. Instantly was treated pretty poorly by Mourinho, always struggled to get a run of games, was still relatively consistent in terms of his end product (though with inconsistent game time came inconsistent performances as you'd expect). That lasted literally 2.5 seasons as nothing changed with Mourinho. Ole's been here 3 months, Martial has been mostly good but again has had injury problems so can't get a consistent run of games, but for different reasons this time.
People are being way too harsh with all of our younger players. We had fecking Mourinho in charge. I'm willing to completely write off the last year or 2 for players' development simply because it was Mourinho in charge. From the start of Ole's time and moving forward, I'd expect them to push on, and to be fair to them, they all have been pretty much.
Yeah he was having problems even during Mourinho time. I remember toward the end of Jose's time he was already missing games through injuries and knocks.
Yet have somehow scored less goals?
They’re barely above us, and it’s very fair to assume they likely wouldn’t be were it not for our disastrous half season under Jose. We could very easily still finish above them... and with more goals! Yet you’re still talking about them as if they’re miles above us! Why!?
I don’t know why you’re conflating “they need to step up a level next season” with “I’ve given up on them and want to see them leave”?
That’s a complete bastardisation of my point! I want to see them make it... I’m simply making the entirely uncontroversial point that after 4 years of potential, at a juncture when we need to reshape our side for the future, they’re gonna need to prove a little more than they are...
I wasn’t aware this was in anyway some kind of crazy outlier fantasy!
But he's 21. He literally is "Yung & lernin". He played majority of his career on the wings and his stats reflect that. If anything they're very good for a young winger. Of course he should be given another season or two of leeway. There's not a developmental curve that every single player follows. Every single players develops differently.
Does that mean he should be our only option for a starting striker? Obviously no. That's why we brought in another more experienced striker whose main feature is being prolific and why we probably should add another ready made forward (not necessarily striker, logically a RW) in the summer.
I find it encouraging for Tony to score a scrappy goal right in front of the keeper. He needs to add more of those, which Ole has mentioned before in constructive criticism of Martial.
Martial is approaching Lingard status. Where he'll still be young despite being in his mid twenties. He has played 256 games in his career so far, he is not inexperienced anymore. At some point you have to accept that this is the player he is. The comparisons to Henry are common, yet by the time Henry had played 250 games he was Arsenal's best player.
Not a slight on Martial. He's a good player that I want to feature regularly. But, its unlikely he'll be a world beater for us.
Not a slight on Martial. He's a good player that I want to feature regularly. But, its unlikely he'll be a world beater for us.
Pedantic I know, but he’s actually 23.
Wasn't he talking about Rashford?
Its been very stop start. Not conducive towards putting any kind of momentum together.
Yeah, have to say one thing that really bugs me about him is he always tends to loiter about on the outskirts of the 18 yarder instead of getting in the box and hitting the front or back post. He just seems to hang back but I swear if he just made a few more runs in there he’d easily pick up another 10 goals a season. Even today there were two other occasions outwith his goal where if he made the run he is getting a shot on target. Actually at one point he tried to play Rashford back in where if it was me I’m taking the shot on my left hard and low across the keeper and hopefullly taking him by surprise.
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