Ander Herrera is a Manchester United Player!

[Fergie's Man]

Everybody spins. Everybody. United do. Bilbao do. Players agents do. And football journalists make up shit. All the time.
I just want to know why the version of events that makes certain posters the most annoyed is the gospel? Why is the story that the player offered a pay cut taken as gospel?
Why is the fact that United and Bilbao did not agree on a price the worst thing that has ever happened? Such things have happened zillions of times and the world did not end.

Nobody is expecting the world to end. The timings of this nonsense and the sheer Hollywood of the three imposters is beyond a joke. Anybody with a modicum of common sense will know that the lad was used for a purpose. We may have wanted him, but clearly not enough to pay the release clause, that we would definitely have known was the Bilbao way.

We kept him on a shoestring until Fellaini was secured. Now the lad has to face his club and fans.

It is a shocking end to a shocking transfer window.

 

[#07]

12 hours later and I still haven't accepted how much we messed this one up. Do.Not.Understand.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Except in the other thread where we wasted money needlessly on Fellaini?

I don't think people have an issue with paying above a players true value ( whatever that is), but in fellaini's case we could have forced Everton into accepting a lower fee than we eventually paid which is silly really. I don't see why people keep comparing it to the Herrera case.

 

[NotoriousISSY]

Just want to hear Herrera's side on this. Think that will be the most level-headed view.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

And again. This idea that the release clause was a flat fee for United, no taxes to be paid. Jesus.

This deal was only ever going to happen at this stage if United and Bilbao did a deal. They didn't. Life goes on. Somehow.

We were going to negotiate taxes with Bilbao?

You haven't told me who called Herrera the new Iniesta yet.

 

[#07]

Nobody is expecting the world to end. The timings of this nonsense and the sheer Hollywood of the three imposters is beyond a joke. Anybody with a modicum of common sense will know that the lad was used for a purpose. We may have wanted him, but clearly not enough to pay the release clause, that we would definitely have known was the Bilbao way.

We kept him on a shoestring until Fellaini was secured. Now the lad has to face his club and fans.

It is a shocking end to a shocking transfer window.

He has to face the fans of a club btw that only accepts players that are born in the Basque country. This isn't even like Barcelona with Catalans because Barcelona buy foreign players. Bilbao only buy Basque. Bilbao is like the Basque national team. Herrera will be treated as if he betrayed the Basque nation. We've properly done him over.

 

[Sir A1ex]

I wonder when, if ever, we'll get the full details of what the feck happened. I'd at elast like confirmation of who exactly the three stooges were... somebody must know!

 

[Fergie's Man]

I don't think people have an issue with paying above a players true value ( whatever that is), but in fellaini's case we could have forced Everton into accepting a lower fee than we eventually paid which is silly really. I don't see why people keep comparing it to the Herrera case.

I would suggest that on Transfer Day, a player is worth what a club is prepared to pay for him. Last night, that was clearly correlated to progress in the Fellaini transfer. This is what I am mightily pissed off about. Shitting on a player who now has to regain the affections of the Bilbao fans is not what I would call ethical.

 

[#07]

I wonder when, if ever, we'll get the full details of what the feck happened. I'd at elast like confirmation of who exactly the three stooges were... somebody must know!

According to AS they were the three lawyers who worked on getting Martinez out of Bilbao to Bayern and were brought in as intermediaries by United to make the deal happen.

 

[moses]

I don't think people have an issue with paying above a players true value ( whatever that is), but in fellaini's case we could have forced Everton into accepting a lower fee than we eventually paid which is silly really. I don't see why people keep comparing it to the Herrera case.

I'm not comparing anything, as like you and everyone else, I have no facts. What I do know is we have people with polar opposite and contradictory gripes about the club in two threads. One calling us stupid for overpaying and the post above I quoted calls us preoccupied with penny pinching. Both can't be right.

 

[Fergie's Man]

He has to face the fans of a club btw that only accepts players that are born in the Basque country. This isn't even like Barcelona with Catalans because Barcelona buy foreign players. Bilbao only buy Basque. Bilbao is like the Basque national team. Herrera will be treated as if he betrayed the Basque nation. We've properly done him over.

For sure.

I am sure many in here are not aware of how tribal Bilbao is.

 

[Stretch]

And again. This idea that the release clause was a flat fee for United, no taxes to be paid. Jesus.

This deal was only ever going to happen at this stage if United and Bilbao did a deal. They didn't. Life goes on. Somehow.

What don't you get, United didn't have to agree a deal with Bilbao!!! Who said anything about taxes that didn't have to be paid? Jesus.

 

[charleysurf]

Nobody is expecting the world to end. The timings of this nonsense and the sheer Hollywood of the three imposters is beyond a joke. Anybody with a modicum of common sense will know that the lad was used for a purpose. We may have wanted him, but clearly not enough to pay the release clause, that we would definitely have known was the Bilbao way.

We kept him on a shoestring until Fellaini was secured. Now the lad has to face his club and fans.

It is a shocking end to a shocking transfer window.

Waiting until the last minute is a gamble. It puts pressure on the buyer. But it puts pressure on the seller to take the money on offer as well.
It did not work out. And ultimately you feel it would have been better to not even bother. But there we are. Herrera is not a United player. Lets see what happens in January. But again, United are not a sugar daddy club who can pay over the odds for a player, even uncapped Spanish players. I don't think this should be a new realisation for anyone. This is the way it's going to always be. Arguing over every million. If people are "embarrassed" by that and want the more clean cut City approach of "name your price" then they need to do some thinking.

 

[KanieKaned]

your right we ought to be ashamed of how we dealt with this. If we were using this as leverage for the fellaini deal then Woodward and Co. truly are cretins.

I hope someone rips him a new arsehole today with the way things have been handled of late. I dont care how many fecking sponsors your bringing in, whats important is how we portray ourselves to other clubs and ensuring we continue to act in the right way after all the changes during the summer.

 

[Fergie's Man]

According to AS they were the three lawyers who worked on getting Martinez out of Bilbao to Bayern and were brought in as intermediaries by United to make the deal happen.

Common sense dictates that they were on the payroll.

 

[BD]

I wonder when, if ever, we'll get the full details of what the feck happened. I'd at elast like confirmation of who exactly the three stooges were... somebody must know!

Apparently they were the lads that Bayern used to close the Martinez deal. The middle men of the transfer who we allegedly hired but then claimed we knew nothing about when it went tits up.

 

[Name Changed]

Regardless of the reason why we pulled this deal (I don't believe this imposters story for one second), we have totally messed up this lad's career. He obviously wanted to join the club and was seemingly taking a pay cut to sign for us. He is not going to be welcome at Bilbao based on previous behaviour. He'll be sitting on the bench/reserves until he can get a move, and he'll be hated by all the fans. If I were him, I would tell United to go feck themselves if they came back in January willing to meet the clause. There is absolutely no reason I would pay my own tax anyway.

And we won't go in for him in January either. If we weren't willing to pay the price now, we won't then. The only scenario I could see would be United going back on the 30th of January at the last second with a lower bid trying to get him on the cheap.

One other point, everyone is saying Moyes has no blame in this. He does. Some blame has to be attached to him also. It's up to him to tell Woodward what he wants and make sure he gets it done. That shit would not have happened under Ferguson. If it did, people would pay for it after.

 

[Fergie's Man]

Waiting until the last minute is a gamble. It puts pressure on the buyer. But it puts pressure on the seller to take the money on offer as well.
It did not work out. And ultimately you feel it would have been better to not even bother. But there we are. Herrera is not a United player. Lets see what happens in January. But again, United are not a sugar daddy club who can pay over the odds for a player, even uncapped Spanish players. I don't think this should be a new realisation for anyone. This is the way it's going to always be. Arguing over every million.

You make valid points, but I think you are missing many.

 

[iAm20Legend]

12 hours later and I still haven't accepted how much we messed this one up. Do.Not.Understand.

Yeah, it's going to take a while to get over this one. We'll always look back on the summer of 2013 with much bitterness.
My only hope and plea is that this not be repeated. If you don't want to sign anyone, don't sign anyone, bring the youth players through, ok. But not this madness.

 

[Fergie's Man]

Regardless of the reason why we pulled this deal (I don't believe this imposters story for one second), we have totally messed up this lad's career. He obviously wanted to join the club and was seemingly taking a pay cut to sign for us. He is not going to be welcome at Bilbao based on previous behaviour. He'll be sitting on the bench/reserves until he can get a move, and he'll be hated by all the fans. If I were him, I would tell United to go feck themselves if they came back in January willing to meet the clause. There is absolutely no reason I would pay my own tax anyway.

And we won't go in for him in January either. If we weren't willing to pay the price now, we won't then. The only scenario I could see would be United going back on the 30th of January at the last second with a lower bid trying to get him on the cheap.

One other point, everyone is saying Moyes has no blame in this. He does. Some blame has to be attached to him also. It's up to him to tell Woodward what he wants and make sure he gets it done. That shit would not have happened under Ferguson. If it did, people would pay for it after.

We won't go back for him, he was simply used as a failsafe. Utter shite way to operate in my opinion.

 

[charleysurf]

He has to face the fans of a club btw that only accepts players that are born in the Basque country. This isn't even like Barcelona with Catalans because Barcelona buy foreign players. Bilbao only buy Basque. Bilbao is like the Basque national team. Herrera will be treated as if he betrayed the Basque nation. We've properly done him over.

Love it!

It's only if people believe this image of him as a lovestruck teenager who "offered a paycut!" to join United that he might have an issue. Otherwise he has done nothing to be a ashamed about. Two clubs did not do a deal. Happens all the time.

 

[Stretch]

Waiting until the last minute is a gamble. It puts pressure on the buyer. But it puts pressure on the seller to take the money on offer as well.
It did not work out. And ultimately you feel it would have been better to not even bother. But there we are. Herrera is not a United player. Lets see what happens in January. But again, United are not a sugar daddy club who can pay over the odds for a player, even uncapped Spanish players. I don't think this should be a new realisation for anyone. This is the way it's going to always be. Arguing over every million. If people are "embarrassed" by that and want the more clean cut City approach of "name your price" then they need to do some thinking.

See our newest player, he's called Fellaini. He had a buyout clause of 23.5m and we paid 27.5m which has been widely reported. Err yeah, we don't overpay. Also see the likes of Young. And this after our CEO and manager bragged about how much dosh we have.

 

[Sir A1ex]

I hope someone rips him a new arsehole today with the way things have been handled of late.

Not going to happen. He's the Glazer's man, and everything he's been doing will have been in accordance with their wishes. You think they've just sat in Florida all summer having no interest in transfers?

 

[charleysurf]

See our newest player, he's called Fellaini. He had a buyout clause of 23.5m and we paid 27.5m which has been widely reported. Err yeah, we don't overpay. Also see the likes of Young. And this after our CEO and manager bragged about how much dosh we have.

How much are we paying upfront for Fellaini?

 

[Sir A1ex]

See our newest player, he's called Fellaini. He had a buyout clause of 23.5m and we paid 27.5m which has been widely reported.

That's not really over-paying in the way that the like os City and PSG do though. They just pile straight i with a silly load of cash and wall away with their man. We spend so long trying to penny pinch and umming and ah-ing over deals that we end up getting screwed over.

 

[NotoriousISSY]

How much are we paying upfront for Fellaini?

Does it matter? In any structured deal we're still paying £4m more than what we would've done if we'd done the deal 4 weeks ago. That's 16.66666% more than the original release fee.

No logic behind this at all.

 

[BD]

Bilbao will most likely freeze him out now. As unfortunate as that is, hopefully it makes a January move more possible. Thats the only good side to this, which is barely a good side.

 

[charleysurf]

Does it matter? In any structured deal we're still paying £4m more than what we would've done if we'd done the deal 4 weeks ago. That's 16.66666% more than the original release fee.

No logic behind this at all.

It matters a lot if the buyout clause was all up front in cash, but this deal can be staggered.

 

[charleysurf]

Bilbao will most likely freeze him out now. As unfortunate as that is, hopefully it makes a January move more possible. Thats the only good side to this, which is barely a good side.

He'll play in their next game if fit. Why wouldn't he?

I doubt Bilbao will reduce their valuation so I see little chance of a United move.

 

[jojojo]

I wonder when, if ever, we'll get the full details of what the feck happened. I'd at elast like confirmation of who exactly the three stooges were... somebody must know!

Three lawyers from Bilbao: Guillermo Gutiérrez, Álvaro Reig and Rodrigo García (of Laffer abogados).
What we don't know is who, if anyone, hired them, and who, if anyone, sent them to Liga HQ last night.
They were involved in Martinez's transfer to Bayern.

 

[Fergie's Man]

That's not really over-paying in the way that the like os City and PSG do though. They just pile straight i with a silly load of cash and wall away with their man. We spend so long trying to penny pinch and umming and ah-ing over deals that we end up getting screwed over.

It is not really about the overspend, we should have popped his release clause, had him for a bit of pre-season with us and playing. Transfer day would have been much more civilised and structured.

 

[Stretch]

It matters a lot if the buyout clause was all up front in cash, but this deal can be staggered.

Why in the feck does it matter when you have a CEO and a manager saying we've endless budget and we're a club breaking all kinds of record year after year for revenue? You really telling me paying the pennies over a year or two makes any difference? Really. I'm done.

 

[moses]

He has to face the fans of a club btw that only accepts players that are born in the Basque country. This isn't even like Barcelona with Catalans because Barcelona buy foreign players. Bilbao only buy Basque. Bilbao is like the Basque national team. Herrera will be treated as if he betrayed the Basque nation. We've properly done him over.

Jesus Christ. Ramp it up lads. United, trampling roughshod over the small nations of the world, phone the UN.

No he won't. They accept players will move. They would just rather it wasn't to Real.

For sure.

I am sure many in here are not aware of how tribal Bilbao is.

I am. It's nationalism, and more defined within Iberia. Martinez to Bayerm was ok, if he had gone to Real there would have been a few more pissed of Basques.

 

[BD]

He'll play in their next game if fit. Why wouldn't he?

I doubt Bilbao will reduce their valuation so I see little chance of a United move.

They dont take it well when a player tries to get a move.

 

[Stretch]

That's not really over-paying in the way that the like os City and PSG do though. They just pile straight i with a silly load of cash and wall away with their man. We spend so long trying to penny pinch and umming and ah-ing over deals that we end up getting screwed over.

I didn't say it was. charleysurf said we don't overpay. But we do though. That's my point.

 

[Fergie's Man]

It matters a lot if the buyout clause was all up front in cash, but this deal can be staggered.

Do we really need to stagger £27m, are we that hard up? feck a duck!!

 

[Stretch]

Do we really need to stagger £27m, are we that hard up? feck a duck!!

Exactly

 

[charleysurf]

They dont take it well when a player tries to get a move.

Its business. Bilbao would have done a deal if United offered more. I'd like to see some examples of mad Basques hanging players who were caught in transfer tugs. They seem to have a funny image on here.

 

[Name Changed]

It matters a lot if the buyout clause was all up front in cash, but this deal can be staggered.

It doesn't really matter when we pay it if we still have to pay it.

The fact that he was available a month ago at 4m lower than what we paid shows how poorly the club acted in the transfer market this summer. Fellaini should have been signed on July 1st and he would have had pre-season with us, he would have played in two matches that we have already dropped points in, and we would have saved 4m.

 

[NotoriousISSY]

It matters a lot if the buyout clause was all up front in cash, but this deal can be staggered.

As has been said in this thread. If we ran away from Herrera over €6m and we're paying Everton and extra £4m for Fellaini there is no defending anything. You can make up all the little scenarios and try to defend the club all you like but sometimes logic is more important than sentiment.