All-Time Fantasy Draft

[Fortitude]

Prefer Baresi. Much better with the ball and his organisational skills are better than anyone that I know.

Both true, of course, as I said previously: who surrounds him is pretty important.

Just that Nesta is very probably the best one-on-one defender there's ever been and I don't think there's a forward in the draft he couldn't contain, by himself.

Horses for courses, I guess.

 

[paceme]

I agree with that. The way I'm planning on setting up suits Baresi more though.

 

[Fortitude]

I agree with that. The way I'm planning on setting up suits Baresi more though.

Fair play.

Looking forward to seeing your creation!

 

[Theon]

Thoughts on Passarella?

 

[paceme]

Thoughts on Passarella?

Get some good crossers!

 

[Fortitude]

Thoughts on Passarella?

Curious to see how he will be played and where he will be played, tbh.

He's a proper throwback for the fact he is so short despite his magnificent leaping ability, so the debates about how he'd stack up against certain types of modern striker (I'm thinking of one in particular who will probably be picked very late in the draft) should be a good read.

Terrific player in his own right, but a bit of a cnut with those he didn't like.. combining him with volatile sorts isn't going to work. He's an interesting conundrum!

 

[paceme]

Come on nm.

 

[Moby]

It's MJJ's turn though. But yeah, come on nm!

 

[paceme]

 

[Fergus' son]

Falcao and Keane in the same midfield is a challenge and a half for the other midfields in the draft!

Beckenbauer and Didi should give them a good game!

 

[Moby]

Beckenbauer and Didi should give them a good game!

Clearly the better midfield but will they get enough votes?

 

[Fergus' son]

Prefer Baresi. Much better with the ball and his organisational skills are better than anyone that I know.

I think you picked the right combination.

Thoughts on Passarella?

Amazing defender, always a great pick.

Clearly the better midfield but will they get enough votes?

There is that but I think people are quite aware of how good they are, certainly a lot of the participants in this draft know a great deal about them. It was Brwned that actually first made me aware of just how good Didi is anyway!

 

[Fortitude]

Clearly the better midfield but will they get enough votes?

Didi is not going to chase those two on the defensive end for 90 minutes.

As a two. Beckenbauer & Didi don't work so well as that's clearly a midfield best suited to a '3' with Didi having play-making duty.

2 on 2, Falcao & Keane would be extremely hard to beat.

Course, let's see how these midfields look when they're completed!

 

[Moby]

The problem is that even though he was the heart of that Brazilian team, he is not as popular as other members of that same team. We saw what happened in the same draft in the newbies, I think I was the one who won against the team with Didi, Di Stefano and someone with Robson in my team, which really shows that he is underrated.

And we can never rule out someone mistaking him for the German with that nickname.

 

[Isotope]

What's Didi like to recent midfielders? or even to the 80's - 2000's players.

 

[Theon]

Curious to see how he will be played and where he will be played, tbh.

He's a proper throwback for the fact he is so short despite his magnificent leaping ability, so the debates about how he'd stack up against certain types of modern striker (I'm thinking of one in particular who will probably be picked very late in the draft) should be a good read.

Terrific player in his own right, but a bit of a cnut with those he didn't like.. combining him with volatile sorts isn't going to work. He's an interesting conundrum!

As a centre back with a sweeper/covering type next to him. Nesta would have been perfect.

His height isn't an issue, he was immense in the air. It wasn't just his leap either because winning headers isn't a case of matching up each players height + leap and seeing who's is higher. But his reading of the game and positioning for getting up ahead of the striker was first class. Hard as nails as well and an inspirational leader, obviously World cup winning captain, maybe a bit cnutish at times though like you say!

The only defenders I think are above him are Baresi, Scirea and Beckenbauer.

 

[Brwned]

Didi's a hero but I wouldn't call him a centre mid at all. You'd have to have another holding midfielder in there and stick him in a midfield 3. Otherwise he'll be playing in the same position as Di Stéfano although going about it in a different way. Falcão's a proper centre mid who can do it all in midfield whereas Didi's all about the playmaking.

Both were the brains of Brazil's two best attacking sides in history, IMO. If you're building your team around one of them then Didi's your man but Falcão's so much more versatile. Whereas Didi would elegantly stroll about with the ball patiently probing, Falcão would be the one injecting pace into the game with selfless running and fantastic one-touch and two-touch football - and then he'd get back and help out in defence.

Most teams are struggling to outrun the duo never mind everything else.

As a centre back with a sweeper/covering type next to him.

Passarella was a sweeper himself so why would you want a sweeper alongside him?!

 

[paceme]

I could use someone with good knowledge of serie A to confer with over my next picks. Anyone willing to help?

 

[Moby]

What's Didi like to recent midfielders? or even to the 80's - 2000's players.

Bit tough to say with the different formations used back then. Bit of a shot in the dark but maybe you can equate him with Xavi.

 

[Theon]

Passarella was a sweeper himself so why would you want a sweeper alongside him?!

When he carries the ball forward, sweeper isnt the right term, covering was better.

Point is not someone like Vidic who closes down. More Ferdinand.

 

[Brwned]

You see I'd be inclined to pair him with someone like Vidic to compensate for the lack of height and to create the classic sweeper-stopper combination. Pretty much all of Vidic's weaknesses are Passarella's strengths, and vice-versa.

I'd say Didi's more Valerón than Xavi.

 

[Moby]

The only defenders I think are above him are Baresi, Scirea and Beckenbauer.

I'd put Figueroa comfortable ahead of the Argentine and Nesta can be argued to be at least as good as him.

 

[Fortitude]

What's Didi like to recent midfielders? or even to the 80's - 2000's players.

Zidane and Valderrama mixed together with a hint of Xavi and Iniesta, if that helps!

 

[Theon]

You see I'd be inclined to pair him with someone like Vidic to compensate for the lack of height and to create the classic sweeper-stopper combination. Pretty much all of Vidic's weaknesses are Passarella's strengths, and vice-versa.

I'd say Didi's more Valerón than Xavi.

Im putting my lad to sleep atm but I'll carry this on in a bit, could be interesting discussion.

I see the ideal combo as coverer/stopper instead. Whilst a sweeper is often a coverer Passarella wasn't but was more aggressive than someone like Scirea.

 

[Theon]

I'd put Figueroa comfortable ahead of the Argentine.

I'e barely seen Figueroa but it's obviously not comfortable at all, considering Passarella is often cited as the best South American defender of all time.

 

[KM]

Okay if everyone's rating each other picks, then somebody rate my picks too.

 

[Moby]

I'e barely seen Figueroa but it's obviously not comfortable at all, considering Passarella is often cited as the best South American defender of all time.

Strange, as that is what I've heard for the Chilean plenty of times. Beckenbauer calling himself the European Figueroa was just underlining his greatness.

 

[Moby]

Okay if everyone's rating each other picks, then somebody rate my picks too.

No one can question Messi and Scirea. With the Magyar in the middle you have a great spine. Might find some trouble in telling the voters about him though.

 

[paceme]

I'e barely seen Figueroa but it's obviously not comfortable at all, considering Passarella is often cited as the best South American defender of all time.

Figueroa is considered that also.

 

[Theon]

Strange, as that is what I've heard for the Chilean plenty of times. Beckenbauer calling himself the European Figueroa was just underlining his greatness.

It's surely not strange, is it? Different pundits, writers, bloggers will have different opinions.

Some people say Baresi is the best Italian defender of all time, others Scirea, others Maldini. It's not strange, but to be expected.

 

[Theon]

Figueroa is considered that also.

I know man, I am not trying to knock him. Like I said at the time it was a great pick.

I've just said it wasn't a comfortable decision like Aldo is implying. Some say Figueroa, others Passarella.

 

[paceme]

Two different players really anyway. Figueroa is the ball player of the two where as you have the elbow in your face beast.

 

[Gio]

Okay if everyone's rating each other picks, then somebody rate my picks too.

Very good. Messi's probably the biggest vote-winner on the Caf, many Italians consider Scirea as better than Baresi, while any player integral to Hungary's golden team is a sell with me.

 

[Moby]

I don't think I have ever heard that for Passerella, that is why I found it strange. In any case, both are legends of that continent however it has to be said that had Figueroa won a World Cup he might have been rated more than Beckenbauer himself. Not saying that Passerella is the Cannavaro of yester years, but the WC does tend to add a lot of reputation, to anyone.

If you ask me to compare them based on what I've seen in footage, Figueroa just looks class apart. Always ahead of his opponent, much like Scirea and I just tend to rate such players ahead of the ones who put their bodies on the line, to good effect, but still I'm a bigger fan of defenders who can sense a danger 5 seconds before.

 

[Moby]

Very good. Messi's probably the biggest vote-winner on the Caf, many Italians consider Scirea as better than Baresi, while any player integral to Hungary's golden team is a sell with me.

I do as well. As amazing as Baresi was, Scirea had that extra ordinary level of intelligence that made him a great player, that kind of genius that comes once in a generation. Also, when both were put to their toughest test, that is facing Maradona, Scirea did do a lot better than Baresi as Maradone needed a special free kuck to beat Juve 1-0 if my memory serves me right while Scirea had him covered throughout the game and intercepted many of his passes. Baresi on the other hand was bit of a car crash against Diego, the offside trap that was supposed to be organized by him failed miserably and Diego just steamrolled past him once the ball was put in the space behind him.

 

[paceme]

I do as well. As amazing as Baresi was, Scirea had that extra ordinary level of intelligence that made him a great player, that kind of genius that comes once in a generation. Also, when both were put to their toughest test, that is facing Maradona, Scirea did do a lot better than Baresi as Maradone needed a special free kuck to beat Juve 1-0 if my memory serves me right while Scirea had him covered throughout the game and intercepted many of his passes. Baresi on the other hand was bit of a car crash against Diego, the offside trap that was supposed to be organized by him failed miserably and Diego just steamrolled past him once the ball was put in the space behind him.

There was an International match that ended 1-1 with Maradona and Scirea in about 1984 where Maradona had the best of him by far. The goal came from Maradona confusing him.

Sticking up for my man!

 

[Theon]

I don't think I have ever heard that for Passerella, that is why I found it strange. In any case, both are legends of that continent.

I find that pretty surprising, it's a commonly held view. Anyway, remembered it being discussed fairly recently so found this comment.

Although I've always liked Ayala, I think most South Americans would have Elías Figueroa as their 2nd best centre-back ever (after Passarella).

But Anto provides the balanced view, which is what I was saying in response to you acting like it was clear cut. Some will think Passarella, others Figueroa. Personally I'd pick Passarella no question because I prefer that style of defender, with that mentality. Plus I have seen him much more, never seen Figueroa bar the odd highlights.

Argies will tell you Passarella was South America's best ever defender, Brazilians that it was Da Guia, Chileans that it was Figueroa and Uruguayans that it was Nasazzi. Santamaria is the only one of the set who was also hugely successful in Europe and in Spain they would likely say he was better than any of the other four.

As far as South American CBs goes don't look beyond them, complete waste of time.

 

[Moby]

I remember reading that thread as well, and Anto's comment isn't entirely relevant here. What that tells us is that there is not much between them. True, there isn't much between Baresi and Scirea either but what I said was that for me it is crystal clear that who out of both those comparisons will fare better against a variety of players in a variety of different scenarios.

 

[Gio]

I do as well. As amazing as Baresi was, Scirea had that extra ordinary level of intelligence that made him a great player, that kind of genius that comes once in a generation. Also, when both were put to their toughest test, that is facing Maradona, Scirea did do a lot better than Baresi as Maradone needed a special free kuck to beat Juve 1-0 if my memory serves me right while Scirea had him covered throughout the game and intercepted many of his passes. Baresi on the other hand was bit of a car crash against Diego, the offside trap that was supposed to be organized by him failed miserably and Diego just steamrolled past him once the ball was put in the space behind him.

Yeah agree with the thrust of this. That 4-1(?) Napoli - Milan game was extraordinary for how a normally bulletproof Milan crumbled. Equally however the body of Baresi's work is impressive and during his excellent World Cup in 1990 I don't recall him having significant problems in the Naples semi-final against Argentina (although Diego always oozed danger).

 

[Theon]

I remember reading that thread as well, and Anto's comment isn't entirely relevant here. What that tells us is that there is not much between them.

That is exactly what I was saying though mate! There isn't much in it. I was responding to you saying this,

I'd put Figueroa comfortable ahead of the Argentine and Nesta can be argued to be at least as good as him.

I don't think it's comfortable either way, could understand if you think Figueroa is better etc, but it's not a real mismatch or anything.