Alexis Sanchez | Signed for Arsenal

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Cina said:
Spurs and Everton finished ahead of us too, does that mean they've better squads than us as well? You really can't use that as a basis, last year was horrible from a Utd perspective, clearly. The idea that we can possibly have another season even close to that is ridiculous.

Our squad definitely had it's problems, I'll never deny that and I said it time and time again last season, but Moyes could've easily remedied lots of those problems last summer himself, he didn't, hence now we're spending the money we didn't last year.

Your last paragraph is hilarious btw, and sort of sums up the whole Arsenal ideology I guess. I mean, why bother spending lots of money on players if you have the money at your disposal and want to make your squad better than it is? What's the point of doing that anyway? Trying to improve something? No, you're right, keep it as it is. You improved by a good few points last season so I suppose it's best not to buy players, mission accomplished and all that. Well, until you lose in your first game or two of the season miserably and go into panic mode, that is.
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My last paragraph referred to the hole in your argument where you blame Moyes for the vast majority of the problems. You're now going to finally sign the two CMs you need, the left back you need, the CB, the winger. These have been needed for at least a season.

When you do these things and they perform on the pitch, then you can say United have gazumped Arsenal again. Until that point, you're speculating based on a history of United entwined with Ferguson that no longer exists.
 
alastair said:
My last paragraph referred to the hole in your argument where you blame Moyes for the vast majority of the problems. You're now going to finally sign the two CMs you need, the left back you need, the CB, the winger. These have been needed for at least a season.

When you do these things and they perform on the pitch, then you can say United have gazumped Arsenal again. Until that point, you're speculating based on a history of United entwined with Ferguson that no longer exists.
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Who signs the players?

Or, more importantly, who completely fecked up last summer and didn't sign those players, instead spending £27m on a midfielder who should be nowhere near a team like Utd?

But yes, let's see what happens next season.
 
alastair said:
I don't understand where Arsenal's transfer policy of 2013 comes into this. Despite that transfer window, we still finished miles ahead of you and in the CL.

Ferguson was instrumental in you winning the league but he left Moyes a squad decaying in serious areas. That's completely undeniable. United are clearly now trying to fix it.

If Moyes was deemed by the club and players to be the main problem, it seems rather odd that United are going down the road of spending huge amounts of money to buy new players. Surely by appointing LVG, they've fixed the problem already?
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Chelsea (central midfield, forwards), Liverpool (keeper, whole defense, midfield, wings) and Arsenal (keeper, full backs, defensive midfield, striker) had plenty of problem areas last year too and all reached the top 4. A top manager makes the most of his team, and it's very rare that teams are incredibly strong across the board.

United have areas to improve, but in it's current state it's no weaker than Arsenal or Liverpool at present/last season.

I'm still interested to see whether you stand by your 'no other top team wanted them' argument or whether it was just a troll. It's ridiculous (Fernandinho, Toure, Fabregas, Matic - arguably the 4 best central midfielders in the league), especially since every transfer Arsenal have made for a long time has had no other top competition.
 
Alock1 said:
Chelsea (central midfield, forwards), Liverpool (keeper, whole defense, midfield, wings) and Arsenal (keeper, full backs, defensive midfield, striker) had plenty of problem areas last year too and all reached the top 4. A top manager makes the most of his team, and it's very rare that teams are incredibly strong across the board.

United have areas to improve, but in it's current state it's no weaker than Arsenal or Liverpool at present/last season.

I'm still interested to see whether you stand by your 'no other top team wanted them' argument or whether it was just a troll. It's ridiculous (Fernandinho, Toure, Fabregas, Matic - arguably the 4 best central midfielders in the league), especially since every transfer Arsenal have made for a long time has had no other top competition.
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I'm merely saying that Herrera is coming up to 25 and the most natural move for him would be elsewhere in Spain, plucked by a bigger club. It's just not happened for him and he hasn't got a Spanish cap either (although difficult to get).

He might be amazing, but the signs suggest he's a step down from the top tier.
 
alastair said:
I'm merely saying that Herrera is coming up to 25 and the most natural move for him would be elsewhere in Spain, plucked by a bigger club. It's just not happened for him and he hasn't got a Spanish cap either (although difficult to get).

He might be amazing, but the signs suggest he's a step down from the top tier.
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Nobody is really suggesting he's in the top tier though, so why are you trying to bring that up? He is however a big improvement on what we currently have in our midfield and therefore he's going to improve our first XI big time. Likewise Shaw is already a better player than Evra is nowadays. You're making it sound like we're spending big money without improving our team, which is bollocks.
 
Cina said:
Nobody is really suggesting he's in the top tier though, so why are you trying to bring that up? He is however a big improvement on what we currently have in our midfield and therefore he's going to improve our first XI big time. Likewise Shaw is already a better player than Evra is nowadays. You're making it sound like we're spending big money without improving our team, which is bollocks.
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You're improving your side, definitely.

Whether you're improving it enough is another question. As I say, you're not done yet for the summer. These two might just be your supplementary signings with the big ones to come.
 
alastair said:
You're improving your side, definitely.

Whether you're improving it enough is another question. As I say, you're not done yet for the summer. These two might just be your supplementary signings with the big ones to come.
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I'm not convinced we actually need 'big' signings though, it'd be great to land a Vidal but it's not essential. This summer for me was always about making our first XI strong again and being less reliant on the brilliance of RvP or Mata. I think we have the world class attack at our disposal and what's important to do now is build a solid midfield and defense behind it. That doesn't necessarily mean buying the best midfielder and young CB in the world, as nice as it'd be.

you yourself should know the importance of having a balanced team without needing world class everywhere. It's something Arsenal have done well in the last few years, keep a reasonably balanced side.
 
alastair said:
I'm merely saying that Herrera is coming up to 25 and the most natural move for him would be elsewhere in Spain, plucked by a bigger club. It's just not happened for him and he hasn't got a Spanish cap either (although difficult to get).

He might be amazing, but the signs suggest he's a step down from the top tier.
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He might be but that doesn't mean he can't be a better buy than someone from the top tier. Matic and in particular Fernandinho showed that last season. Although I agree he's not there, I don't see why it's important.

If someone has some genuine ability/quality and is able to do a job and has the right characteristics they can easily be as good, often better than some of the bigger name signings that happen. He's combative and is more than competent at everything in midfield without being the flashiest player.

Why didn't Barcelona or Real Madrid want him? Real Madrid generally buy from other countries when you look at their midfield options until Iarramendi last year (Modric, Khedira, Xabi Alonso, Sahin, Essien, Diarra, Altintop) and Barcelona had 4 quality players in that position, with eyes on young kids with huge talent (Koke, Torres) and cheaper options (Song, Rakitic) since Bilbao are known to not negotiate their release clauses. Are those players who Madrid/Barcelona bought all top-tier then? They really aren't. What about the players who Barcelona/Madrid let go - does that mean they weren't top tier either (Robben, Sneijder, Tiago, Fabregas, Toure?). It's really flawed that people use these two teams and their interest in players as a way to qualify a player.

Talking of Spanish players.. David Silva was 24 when he got picked up by Manchester City. David Villa was 28 when Barcelona bought him. Cazorla was 27 when Arsenal grabbed him.

I don't think he's going to be the best player in the league or anything, but he's very good and I think his characteristics mean he could easily be the most important signing we make this summer. Fernandinho made a world of difference to City last season without being a big name signing, I'm hoping for a similar story here.
 
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Berbaclass said:
I reckon we should look at closer to £30 million for that pair. Hernandez is being touted at £18 Million and Nani is worth £12 million surely
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No one is going to pay that kind of money for two out of favour players. Nani has been out of form for two years as well. I think we will get £10m for Hernandez and £7m for Nani.
 
NK86 said:
Really? Griezmann has always been pretty okish when I have seen him. Certainly not a massive upgrade on our current options.
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Well, there's Nani, if he was italian his name would be Nani Inconsisto, then there's Ashley Young, who just doesn't produce anything but 2 great goals per season, also very inconsistent and then there's Valencia, who just seems to have lost all his freshness. So at current state, IMO they're all not United quality. So, he's better than all our wingers I'd say, but he's not in the bracket of Sanchez, like someone said before, more like a tier below, Shaqiri or Valbuena.

Griezmann doesn't really play as a traditional winger at Sociedad, at least not the last 1-2 seasons. He's often switching to the middle and playing as a striker, similar to Ronaldo at Real actually. He plays as winger for France though, didn't look that shabby so far, not a Ribery replacement of course.
 
Spielmacher said:
Well, there's Nani, if he was italian his name would be Nani Inconsisto, then there's Ashley Young, who just doesn't produce anything but 2 great goals per season, also very inconsistent and then there's Valencia, who just seems to have lost all his freshness. So at current state, IMO they're all not United quality. So, he's better than all our wingers I'd say, but he's not in the bracket of Sanchez, like someone said before, more like a tier below, Shaqiri or Valbuena.

Griezmann doesn't really play as a traditional winger at Sociedad, at least not the last 1-2 seasons. He's often switching to the middle and playing as a striker, similar to Ronaldo at Real actually. He plays as winger for France though, didn't look that shabby so far, not a Ribery replacement of course.
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I would be an improvement on our current options. But Griezmann has been an average whenever I have seen him. So we will be replacing one set of average wingers with another.
 
NK86 said:
I would be an improvement on our current options. But Griezmann has been an average whenever I have seen him. So we will be replacing one set of average wingers with another.
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He's not average at all IMO and still way younger than our current options.
 
alastair said:
I'm merely saying that Herrera is coming up to 25 and the most natural move for him would be elsewhere in Spain, plucked by a bigger club. It's just not happened for him and he hasn't got a Spanish cap either (although difficult to get).

He might be amazing, but the signs suggest he's a step down from the top tier.
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So basically you have not seen him play but are basing your thoughts on the "signs" that he was not bought by Real/Barca and has no cap for the Spanish team?
 
Sarni said:
No one is going to pay that kind of money for two out of favour players. Nani has been out of form for two years as well. I think we will get £10m for Hernandez and £7m for Nani.
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Can easily get double than that. Both players are already having approaches from top teams or close-to-top kind of teams and we can easily ask for more. Any random players get sold for 7m nowadays. Better not to sell Nani than sell for 7m.

12-15m for Nani and15-18m for Chicha is not at all unrealistic amount to ask for.
 
The Man Himself said:
Can easily get double than that. Both players are already having approaches from top teams or close-to-top kind of teams and we can easily ask for more. Any random players get sold for 7m nowadays. Better not to sell Nani than sell for 7m.

12-15m for Nani and15-18m for Chicha is not at all unrealistic amount to ask for.
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Not going to happen. Nani has been out of form for two years as I've said, no one's going to pay a significant fee to land him. He might go to Galatasaray for a knockdown price and that's it.

I won't discuss Hernandez. I was called names a while ago for suggesting he wasn't worth 30 million+. Now I don't think he's even worth around 20 given his lack of playing time and the fact he's not even a regular for Mexico anymore. I'm not having this discussion again.
 

Zubizarreta confirmed there are offers for Alexis and that Pedro is definitely staying.
 
Sarni said:
Not going to happen. Nani has been out of form for two years as I've said, no one's going to pay a significant fee to land him. He might go to Galatasaray for a knockdown price and that's it.

I won't discuss Hernandez. I was called names a while ago for suggesting he wasn't worth 30 million+. Now I don't think he's even worth around 20 given his lack of playing time and the fact he's not even a regular for Mexico anymore. I'm not having this discussion again.
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If random players like Ross McCormack can go for 10m then we can easily get 15m for Nani. Just need to find clubs who need player like him. Same for Hernandez.
 
I am not convinced we are interested. Looks like he'll end up in the prem though so I'd rather he end up at Pool as that would mean Suarez is definitely gone.
 
I don't want him anywhere near Liverpool and I think we're interested, he's the sort of player van Gaal is bound to like. Mata, Sanchez, Rooney and van Persie as our front 4 would be mind blowing.
 
Sarni said:
I don't want him anywhere near Liverpool and I think we're interested, he's the sort of player van Gaal is bound to like. Mata, Sanchez, Rooney and van Persie as our front 4 would be mind blowing.
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Rooney on the wing though? That just doesn't sound like a good idea to me.
 
Orc said:
Rooney on the wing though? That just doesn't sound like a good idea to me.
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Mata drifting from the left side, Sanchez from the right, Rooney in the centre interchanging with Mata and Sanchez. Very fluid line.
 
Sarni said:
Mata drifting from the left side, Sanchez from the right, Rooney in the centre interchanging with Mata and Sanchez. Very fluid line.
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I'd rather just play people in their natural positions to get the best out of them. Mata is at his best behind the striker as a pure #10 so to me he shouldn't be anywhere else.

I'd rather just play Adnan on the left than Rooney. Both Mata and Rooney want to cut inside and play closer to the box so having the both out there may not provide us with much width whereas Januzaj would.
RedSky said:
I'm intrigued to see what LvG does with Rooney.
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Wish we could offload him somewhere to be honest. If he's not going to be played where he's most effective then we may as well sell him for a player we can better utilize. He's best as a #9 or a #10 but we have better players in both of those positions. Don't want to just shoehorn him in.
 
cesc's_mullet said:
Who do you prefer out of the two?
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I think the cantera route is 90% the right path but this time I'd go with Alexis. Tougher to acknowledge since he's been a favorite player of mine since his debut with Rijkaard but he too can become a better player with more freedom someplace else
 
Orc said:
I'd rather just play people in their natural positions to get the best out of them. Mata is at his best behind the striker as a pure #10 so to me he shouldn't be anywhere else.

I'd rather just play Adnan on the left than Rooney. Both Mata and Rooney want to cut inside and play closer to the box so having the both out there may not provide us with much width whereas Januzaj would.
Wish we could offload him somewhere to be honest. If he's not going to be played where he's most effective then we may as well sell him for a player we can better utilize. He's best as a #9 or a #10 but we have better players in both of those positions. Don't want to just shoehorn him in.
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I know what you mean, but we can't really afford to offload a 20 goal player in this transfer window. I'm not Rooneys biggest fan (I'm more of the same opinion of Paul Scholes), but he's still a useful/important United player. For all we know LvG might reignite his football. I think it's probably in the best interest of the club to keep him for another Season then look at Summer 2015 if we want to sell him.
 
FCBarca said:
I think the cantera route is 90% the right path but this time I'd go with Alexis. Tougher to acknowledge since he's been a favorite player of mine since his debut with Rijkaard but he too can become a better player with more freedom someplace else
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Do you think he could get involved in a player+cash deal for Suarez? Also, would you want that maniac in your team? Getting Messi to take rabies shot before that gopher joins won't be the worst idea :p
 
Sarni said:
I don't want him anywhere near Liverpool and I think we're interested, he's the sort of player van Gaal is bound to like. Mata, Sanchez, Rooney and van Persie as our front 4 would be mind blowing.
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With Januzaj always ready to come in if any them slackens.
 
The Man Himself said:
If random players like Ross McCormack can go for 10m then we can easily get 15m for Nani. Just need to find clubs who need player like him. Same for Hernandez.
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Problem will be Nani's wages. Not too many teams would be able/willing to pay him that after paying a hefty transfer fees.
 
NK86 said:
Do you think he could get involved in a player+cash deal for Suarez? Also, would you want that maniac in your team? Getting Messi to take rabies shot before that gopher joins won't be the worst idea :p
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The only credible rumour atm is that Zubi confirmed there are offers for Alexis and did not designate him as someone not for sale. From there, whether it would be linked to a potential deal for Suarez or not is anyone's guess

As for the welfare of any future teammates of Suarez, I suppose the fact that he's never punctured the skin it's more nibbling than biting that is at risk. Fortunately, you don't need to be immunized for rabies from a nibble
 
FCBarca said:
The only credible rumour atm is that Zubi confirmed there are offers for Alexis and did not designate him as someone not for sale. From there, whether it would be linked to a potential deal for Suarez or not is anyone's guess

As for the welfare of any future teammates of Suarez, I suppose the fact that he's never punctured the skin it's more nibbling than biting that is at risk. Fortunately, you don't need to be immunized for rabies from a nibble
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Give it a season or two :)
 
alastair said:
You're improving your side, definitely.

Whether you're improving it enough is another question. As I say, you're not done yet for the summer. These two might just be your supplementary signings with the big ones to come.
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Yes because building a great team involves signing the very best players...

Judge Louis van Gaal not on the individual players he signs but the collective performance of his team. You are the kind of person who would be critical of Louis signing Strootman on the basis he isn't in the top tier yet Louis van Gaal has spoken of how what he brings to a team is incredibly important, he refers to players like him as 'key' to building a powerful team.
 
Empire said:
Yes because building a great team involves signing the very best players...

Judge Louis van Gaal not on the individual players he signs but the collective performance of his team. You are the kind of person who would be critical of Louis signing Strootman on the basis he isn't in the top tier yet Louis van Gaal has spoken of how what he brings to a team is incredibly important, he refers to players like him as 'key' to building a powerful team.
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Ignore him. How many 'top tier' players has Wenger ever brought in? That's not what building a great team is about and I'm sure he knows that. Anyone who has watched Fergie dominate in the Premier League should know that.
 
More chance of signing Vidal and the probability of that happening is low. Would be fantastic to shift out Nani and young and bring Sanchez in
 
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