Adnan Januzaj

[Lawman]

Jesus, not this again. I don't know where you got it into your head that I'm an Anderson fan, but I'm not. I remember you kept randomly referring to me defending him this summer when I'd never posted anything of the sort. Maybe you're thinking of someone else?

Either way, come back with an actual quote or piss off.

Nov 25, 2012

Lawman said:
As I have stated I like Anderson but too many people defend him blindly. Yes, he could be great but he has failed to do it in 5 years off being here. Injuries, form, selection issues whatever these are the facts. To suggest he will now be great and answer our problems in midfield is optimistic. Will he produce levels off consistency and stay fit given his track record? I think the manager might give him a try but think its more likely we will buy someone else. I say might because i'm not even sure Fergie hasn't already got other plans already.

Brightonian said:

1. This is the flaw at the core of your argument. You say over and over again that he's failed to do it in five years here, so he probably won't do it now. But you ignore the perfectly valid reasons we've given you why those five years are not necessarily indicative of his future.

2. This is a valid concern. If he continues to get injuries over the next five years the way he has over the last five, then he'll probably never contribute much more to United than he does now. If he manages to shake off the injury problems, however, I don't think consistently good football is something to worry about. During the last two seasons, his good games have far outweighed his average ones. And the good ones have been really, really good. His ratio of good to bad/average is no worse than Welbeck's or Hernandez'.

 

[Lawman]

Jesus, not this again. I don't know where you got it into your head that I'm an Anderson fan, but I'm not. I remember you kept randomly referring to me defending him this summer when I'd never posted anything of the sort. Maybe you're thinking of someone else?

Either way, come back with an actual quote or piss off.

Lawman said: ↑
Think this means he is our best now to be fair. I'm a big Carrick fan but I do wish at times we had two mobile midfielders with a bit steel and class like Keane and Scholes of old. Would love nothing better if Anderson and Cleverley stepped up though. Just think the possibilities of Anderson doing it is less likely than him actually doing it, but i'd love nothing more than to be wrong on it as its great to see him in full flight.

Brightonian said:
He can be our most important midfielder and not be our best. He's the only fit midfielder who can fill the DM/quasi-DM role, so he's important. But for me, Cleverley is narrowly the better player at the moment.


Lawman said:

Another quote from you stating that Cleverley is better than Carrick when that just looks stupid now! We all say things that look silly as time goes bye just no need to be smug about it

 

[Brightonian]

You seem to take someone disagreeing with your views pretty personally.

I'm not actually talking about myself. Genius was the one really expecting Januzaj to get lots of starts, and a lot of people were ripping the shit out of him. Whereas now it looks like he might well end up being right.

Sorry you guys seem to have been upset by me bringing it up. Thankfully Sarni, who was the one actually quoted, took it as it was meant: light-heartedly.

 

[JustAFan]

I'm reasonably confident he won't. I just can't believe the club would be so mind-numbingly stupid as to let him go. Not being willing to splash out £40mil on a top midfielder in the summer is one thing, but being unwilling to offer Januzaj an enticing enough contract to keep him would be utterly beyond belief given how stupidly rich this club is getting.

Well I am confident the club does not want to let him go, but not so confident that his agent will not take the opportunity to let the contract run out and sign with the highest bidder.

 

[Brightonian]

Lawman, the Anderson related quotes there feature me saying that a) you couldn't know for sure that because his first five seasons didn't go well, the following ones wouldn't and b) that injuries are what have really screwed him over, and that the actual games he'd managed to play had included bad ones, good ones and very good ones. Are those opinions that look stupid now? Not really, I don't think.

Again, I never said that you couldn't find things I've said that look stupid. Obviously you can. I'd think that's true of anyone who's posted a lot on here. I just don't understand where you got this idea that I'm a big Anderson supporter, because I never really have been. I've spent the last three years oscillating between dim hope and indifference. So it's a bit mystifying. The fact that those were the most emphatic quotes you could find sums up my attitude to Anderson.

Anyway, it doesn't actually matter. I only mention it because you brought it up out of nowhere again. We're sort of derailing the thread here.

 

[Sir A1ex]

Well I am confident the club does not want to let him go, but not so confident that his agent will not take the opportunity to let the contract run out and sign with the highest bidder.

So we need to put in a proper contract offer that is up around what he'd get in that situation. With the bonus of stability etc that makes it a no-brainer.

 

[JustAFan]

So we need to put in a proper contract offer that is up around what he'd get in that situation. With the bonus of stability etc that makes it a no-brainer.

Well I think what we have to realize is that what we want as fans or what we imagine a player would want and see about Manchester United is not what a player actually wants or sees. "Up around" might not be enough, if we can not match or beat what other clubs put on the table then we run the risk of losing him.

The point being regardless of what the cub intends or wants or what we the fans want, the player and his agent might have a different way of looking at things.

 

[Sir A1ex]

Well I think what we have to realize is that what we want as fans or what we imagine a player would want and see about Manchester United is not what a player actually wants or sees. "Up around" might not be enough, if we can not match or beat what other clubs put on the table then we run the risk of losing him.

That's why we need to do it now, and not wait until other clubs can put their offers on the table. If he's got a general bias towards staying, but suspects our offer is well under what he could get, then he waits. If he's happy that it's around what he'd get anyway, it's a much easier decision to sign.

 

[Genius Me!]

If they are really only asking for £20k and a £100k signing on bonus, then I really don't see why we haven't wrapped this up already.

But I feel a lot more confident than I did with Pogba. Although I'm sure I was confident Pogba would have stayed as well, but I must surely feel more confident with Januzaj.

 

[pocco]

I thought, perhaps naively, that this would get wrapped up during the international break.

 

[gooDevil]

I thought his father was his 'adviser', and he also had an agent as well? I remember reading that the agent stated he's the only one involved and is communicating directly with Adnan's family.

True. Dirk De Vriese is his agent.

Thanks guys, thought I read otherwise.

Any word on this agent, are his players always changing teams?

 

[JustAFan]

That's why we need to do it now, and not wait until other clubs can put their offers on the table. If he's got a general bias towards staying, but suspects our offer is well under what he could get, then he waits. If he's happy that it's around what he'd get anyway, it's a much easier decision to sign.

Well as I said before it cold be that his agent and him might want to wait until they can see what other clubs are willing to offer. Afterall, you do realize that we can not force him to sign a contract and his agent might actually want to make sure he gets the best deal for Adnan, afterall that is his job.

My point being, getting him signed to a new contract requires an agreement between BOTH parties not just United walking into the room and saying "Here sign this" So we can go all out trying to sign him to what we think will be a great offer, but his agent might want to wait.

Unfortunately we do not hold all the cards in this game, the player and his agent have a bit of say in what goes on also.

 

[Dracula]

It would make no sense whatsoever to sign a contract with us before January. We have until then to prove we have him in our plans

 

[Hellboy]

I hoped we would hear some news during the international break.

 

[pocco]

It would make no sense whatsoever to sign a contract with us before January. We have until then to prove we have him in our plans

If it gets to January and he hasn't signed, then he is off.

 

[Salfordlad70]

If it gets to January and he hasn't signed, then he is off.

I think if he hasn't signed by January we'll be super brickin it but the lad has time on his side.This will be his first big contract and he wants to make the right choice and I think he will choose us and I think his decision will be out of loyalty and respect and because he must know he's at the right club and is playing in the first team and looks set to continue doing so.I would be shocked if he decided to leave.It would make little sense so I am remaining positive.

I hope he does sign before January.We can all settle then and the sooner he does the sooner he can focus fully on his football.It might help him to resolve his nationality issue also.I expect him to be made to feel unreal when he walks out on Saturday, assuming he starts of course which I think he will.The support from the fans will help seal this deal.

 

[The Mitcher]

If it gets to January and he hasn't signed, then he is off.

If Moyes got Nani to sign that contract, then he can Januzaj.

 

[KiD MoYeS]

It's naive to expect anything to be signed before January.

 

[Sarni]

If they are really only asking for £20k and a £100k signing on bonus, then I really don't see why we haven't wrapped this up already.

But I feel a lot more confident than I did with Pogba. Although I'm sure I was confident Pogba would have stayed as well, but I must surely feel more confident with Januzaj.

That's because it'd set a bad precedent and we'd find ourselves in a position where more of our youngsters demand hefty wages. If he leaves because we don't cave in to his demands then so be it, no one is bigger than the club and he he has to earn it etc.

Like they said with Pogba.

 

[RedRonaldo]

That's because it'd set a bad precedent and we'd find ourselves in a position where more of our youngsters demand hefty wages. If he leaves because we don't cave in to his demands then so be it, no one is bigger than the club and he he has to earn it etc.

Like they said with Pogba.

This is always the biggest dilemma here isn't it. On one hand we don't want to set a bad precedent, on the other hand we are putting ourself at risk of lossing some of our best young players too, who may worth 10-20 times more in few years time. No easy way to deal with.

 

[Sarni]

This is always the biggest dilemma here isn't it. On one hand we don't want to set a bad precedent, on the other hand we are putting ourself at risk of lossing some of our best young players too, who may worth 10-20 times more in few years time. No easy way to deal with.

Nah, it's easy. If you want to produce good players you need to be prepared to reward them accordingly in line with their talent. If we don't want to 'set a bad precedent' by giving a talented youngster a decent contract we may as well give up.

We'll offer him a good deal.

 

[Robbie Boy]

I dreamt last night that he signed a new deal with us and it was announced just before the Southampton match. I'm taking this as a premonition.

 

[Bestie07]

This is always the biggest dilemma here isn't it. On one hand we don't want to set a bad precedent, on the other hand we are putting ourself at risk of lossing some of our best young players too, who may worth 10-20 times more in few years time. No easy way to deal with.

It's not a bad precedent. If any youngster wants as good a contract as Januzaj may potentially get, then just tell them to be as good as him. In fact it's a better precedent than seeing another talented youngster leave the club and do well elsewhere while earning more in the process. I'd rather the first option than the second.

 

[pocco]

It's naive to expect anything to be signed before January.

If he wants to stay then it shouldn't be. He should be aware that other teams will probably offer him more money, that doesn't mean we will. If he does want to wait and see see what those offers are then we're definitely losing him.

 

[elmo]

That's because it'd set a bad precedent and we'd find ourselves in a position where more of our youngsters demand hefty wages. If he leaves because we don't cave in to his demands then so be it, no one is bigger than the club and he he has to earn it etc.

Like they said with Pogba.

20k/week and a 100k signing fee is a joke, the likes of Macheda are probably on higher contract...

 

[LR7]

Not setting a bad precedent and upholding our principles is all well and good in theory but in reality if it's going to cost us good (potentially great) players who can significantly improve the team, then what is the point? We have other teams to compete with and we won't be awarded any trophies for winning the moral victory. I'm not saying we should give young players what they want every time but I think 'rules' can be bent in exceptional circumstances and we have a real talent on our hands here. I know the figures are probably tabloid bollocks but if it takes £20k a week and £100k to the agent or lose the player then we should pay it imo.

For some reason I don't see this as just being about money which is the easy line for journos to churn out. Adnan and his Dad seem to really take time to make the right choices for the lad and I genuinely think that he will stay here.

 

[Brwned]

Nah, it's easy. If you want to produce good players you need to be prepared to reward them accordingly in line with their talent. If we don't want to 'set a bad precedent' by giving a talented youngster a decent contract we may as well give up.

We'll offer him a good deal.

No-one's saying we won't offer him a good deal, it's whether other clubs go the extra mile and offer him a silly deal to swing it in their favour - are we willing to go above what we deem a reasonable wage to prevent losing another one of our best talents?

 

[Adebesi]

Nah, it's easy. If you want to produce good players you need to be prepared to reward them accordingly in line with their talent. If we don't want to 'set a bad precedent' by giving a talented youngster a decent contract we may as well give up.

We'll offer him a good deal.

I think so. Times they are a-changin, power has ebbed towards the younger players and I think we will have learned something from the Pogba experience. When the facts change the strategy has to change with it. If we are going to focus our attention on attracting and developing young talent, rather than competing with City and Madrid for the galacticos, we have to ensure we are competitive in that market. If we let Januzaj go the Pogba situation becomes the precedent, rather than a one-off. For me, that would be a far more damaging precedent than accepting we have to pay market value for younger players. In that scenario we are losing out at both ends of the market and our position at the summit of English football will surely be eroded fairly quickly.

We will bargain hard to get the best deal we can but I am confident we will hold onto him. The alternative is too damaging, not just in the loss of one very promising player, but in the message it sends out to other aspiring youngsters. Dealing with the fallout with other kids wanting more money is the lesser of two evils.

 

[MoneyMay]

Might see Adnan at Eid prayer today. Will tell him to sign a new contract, don't worry lads.

 

[jojojo]

We paid Ronaldo a £1m signing on fee and 20k/week to come to us - he'd been on 2k Euros/month at Sporting. Ten years ago. Sometimes you pay what it takes.

If what it takes with Januzaj is £100k + £20k/week - the only precedent involved is that we're paying something like the going rate, which is surely exactly the precedent that our young talent need to see. Be good enough, work hard enough and United is a good employer.

Mind you I doubt those figures, they're far too simple and contracts aren't. Real contracts at the "going rate" in Europe often include bonus payments, and yes, even release clauses. This one will have an image rights element as well, because he's got the looks and the on-field wow factor to make those significant.

If we haven't done a deal by January I'll refer you back to something SAF said a few years ago: when both sides want a deal, you can make a deal. So, I'll be assuming we're negotiating right up until the moment when I see the photos of him signing a contract.

 

[LR7]

Some Belgian journo/blogger with an unfortunate name being retweeted onto my timeline, saying that he thinks Januzaj renewed his contract with us yesterday but that it's still unconfirmed.
He doesn't have many followers.

 

[Adebesi]

Some Belgian journo/blogger with an unfortunate name being retweeted onto my timeline, saying that he thinks Januzaj renewed his contract with us yesterday but that it's still unconfirmed.
He doesn't have many followers.

Nor do I, but I am still one of the most fascinating people on the internet.

 

[LR7]

He doesn't seem @agentITK007 esque

Tweet is here for those who are interested:

Spoiler

 

[pocco]

Are we trusting a guy with a name like that?

 

[LR7]

Take it as you will. I expressed my caution a couple of posts above.

 

[Jimy_Hills_Chin]

Are we all not Bjorn De Cock?

It would be better PR for the club to announce this on Friday rather than let it get buried in the England coverage.

 

[LR7]

Another Belgian Journo off twitter who apparently spoke to Adnan's agent yesterday.
Seems reasonable enough but I can't vouch for his credibility so don't open the spoiler if you're looking for something verified

Spoiler

 

[King_Eric]

Thanks guys, thought I read otherwise.

Any word on this agent, are his players always changing teams?

I have no idea. He's not exactly a big shot in the agent world I think. He's an ex-football player and doesn't seem to work for many high profile players (or even at the Belgian level). I know he worked with two players that came from Caracas to Belgium. Ronald Vargas (Club Brugge, moved to rival Anderlecht after 3 years) and Roberto Rosales (started in Gent, moved to Twente after three years and is still there in his third season). But other than that, I don't know of any other football players he worked with at that level. And apparently, he's not on the official FIFA agent list for Belgium.

 

[Swaters16]

I have no idea. He's not exactly a big shot in the agent world I think. He's an ex-football player and doesn't seem to work for many high profile players (or even at the Belgian level). I know he worked with two players that came from Caracas to Belgium. Ronald Vargas (Club Brugge, moved to rival Anderlecht after 3 years) and Roberto Rosales (started in Gent, moved to Twente after three years and is still there in his third season). But other than that, I don't know of any other football players he worked with at that level. And apparently, he's not on the official FIFA agent list for Belgium.

Well, it sounds like he just helps players move between clubs and is in the interest of the player. Let's hope he is just mediating for Adnan and not one of the money hungry agents out there.

 

[King_Eric]

Never heard of Bjorn De Cock, nor the website he apparently founded. Wouldn't pay much attention to his tweets.

Now this Jens Cuypers works for Gazet Van Antwerpen apparently, which is a decent newspaper. But even then I wouldn't get my hopes up too much.