erm, Hodgson is now the manager of WBA and was talking about them in that article.
You know that, right?
A Tribute to Roy Hodgson - his LFC legacy in quotes
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erm, Hodgson is now the manager of WBA and was talking about them in that article.
You know that, right?
Not to mention Rafa inherited a treble winning squad....
I think we are all aware of that tbh.
Now... do you remember the OP(s)? and the long-running theme from which they stem?
He said similar at Liverpool and was crucified for it.
And rightly so. You talk your players up in the public domain, not down.
Listen to the manager of Utd or Arsenal some time. Or any top manager for that matter.
To be honest, I was one of those who thought Hodgson was an inspired choice by the Liverpool board and could not think of many others who were realistic targets. (I think Dalglish will soon be exposed as another Keegan - ie a has been messiah who is now short in the tooth and out of touch).
However, the evidence posted in the OP along with what we all witnessed can only indicate that this appointment was an unmitigated disaster and Liverpool's board should be congratulated for acting so quickly on its mistake and trying to correct it.
Would have been very hard for Liverpool fans at the time; on the one hand you have to back your new man, but what do you do when it very quickly becomes apparent that he is just not up to the job. Just like SAF did with the likes of Taibi, you need to ship them out as soon as you realize that they do not perform as well as they say so on the tin.
Hodgson is clearly not suited for big time premiership football. His 'level' is making average teams look good and he should have stuck at that instead of exposing himself. In doing so, unfortunately he was well and truly found out and his reputation has suffered as a result.
However, the evidence posted in the OP along with what we all witnessed can only indicate that this appointment was an unmitigated disaster and Liverpool's board should be congratulated for acting so quickly on its mistake and trying to correct it.
Would have been very hard for Liverpool fans at the time; on the one hand you have to back your new man, but what do you do when it very quickly becomes apparent that he is just not up to the job. Just like SAF did with the likes of Taibi, you need to ship them out as soon as you realize that they do not perform as well as they say so on the tin.
Hodgson is clearly not suited for big time premiership football. His 'level' is making average teams look good and he should have stuck at that instead of exposing himself. In doing so, unfortunately he was well and truly found out and his reputation has suffered as a result.
There's a big difference to saying that you need money to improve the squad in order to challenge for honours (Benitez), than implying the players you've inherited are basically shit & it's going to take significant investment to put things right (Hodgson).
But when Benitez went on and on about needing six or seven new players etc and how he could not be expected to challenge without more money, he was talking his players up was he?
Unbelievable. Benitez spent more time denigrating his squad than any manager I've ever heard.
Similar, in terms of criticising the squad, to those of Rafa, it was suggested.
Not really.
Rafa was much more vocal in moaning about the quality of the squad and needing new players. His moaning was actually less warranted due to the fact it was the squad he built, spending more money than anyone bar Chelsea in the process.
Roy carried on the theme. Difference being Roy was crucified whereas Rafa was praised for making a stand. That's why I'm always bemused when I see these page long critiques of Roy and his quotes. Rafa was saying much the same shit for years, without reproach. It's even happening right now!
So?
Managers shouldn't be criticising their squad in public. In my humble opinion of course.
I don't understand the relevance of Benitez here.
So - because Hodgson spells out the conclusion that Rafa merely implies it's that much worse is it?
Perhaps you are working on the basis that Liverpool's players are so thick that they could not work out that Rafa needing new players meant that the one's he had (and for heaven's sake he had enough in terms of quantity) were not good enough? Could be right about them being that stupid I guess.
See above.
Manager shouldn't criticise their players publicly.
Again, what is the relevance of Benitez to this thread? They are Hodgson quotes during his time as Liverpool manager.
...and the point being made to you is that you criticise Hodgson for the same thing for which you praised the FSW - double standards.
eh? You're making it up, I'm afraid.
If Benitez criticised his players in public, I wouldn't have praised him for it.
Have you actually bothered to read through Hodgson's comments on the OP ?. If so, you'll have noticed how he started off upbeat & confident. After that it's just a mess of negativity, contradiction, & back-tracking. Show me a like for like comparison with Benitez to back up your claim of double standards.
Plenty did though, and we're highlighting the double standards.
Even in this thread redman is trying to defend Rafa for criticising the squad, and pretending that Rafa's moaning was different.
Really - so you weren't one of those who felt he was right when he was publically in dispute with the owners about needing new players?
Rafa was pretty happy when his inherited team did ok - once the team (he had built) started struggling he started needing more players (because the current ones aren't good enough).
Hodgson came in not realising how bad the situation was and how resistant the players and fans would be (otherwise he'd have been well advised to steer clear) - once reality dawned he made statements accordingly. What annoyed you all so much was that he did go as far as telling the truth about how crap you were - instead of merely implying it a la Benitez.
Having said that, I don't think Hodgson's media performances were very good - but for 'poo fans it was just they'd been seduced by Rafa's jingoistic claptrap for too long (and have unrealistic expectations of their team).
If Benitez criticised his players publicly, I didn't praise him for it.
You can always contradict me with evidence backing up your claim of course.
Good luck with that.
I repeat my question about your attitude to him campaigning (publically and to the detriment of club stability) for new players. You know what you said - surely you can enlighten us.
Go to the Rafa press conference/meltdown thread.
It's a goldmine for bizarre Benitez interviews and press conferences.
The relevance is you are slating Hodgson for something Benitez did consistently for several years and got nothing but praise for it.
And he had even less reason to moan.
Roy is a tit. Benitez was a bit of a tit as well. I don't mind managers being tits as long as they are succesful. I am sure United fans can sympathise with this view.
Benitez had a lot more leeway to be a tit because of his results. And even then, I found his public tirades unnecessary and sometimes counterproductive.
There is a big difference between the moaning of Roy and Rafa though. Rafa moaned with a winner's mentality. He wanted to get places and he would rant at anything that got in his way. The owners, Parry, etc. Roy moans to excuse himself and disavow his responsibility. For all his criqitique of the owners and lacking funds, Rafa stuck his neck out and said 4th was the minimum acceptable and he would guarantee it. That's taking responsibility. He failed, lost his job. Fair dos.
Roy comes in, claims he can do better and instead goes on a campaign of lowering expectations and level of ambition to try and pass himself off as acceptable, even going as low as saying 'whoever comes in will be doing a similar job to me', trying to con us into believing he was doing the best possible job.
In a way, I would have loved for Roy to be succesful. I can live just fine with the boring football, did so under Houllier and I can live with him being a tit if he is a succesful tit. It would have been fun times to get 3 points in the bag and then go straight to cracking up as Roy goes off on yet another ether-induced rant at the press conference. I love a good mindfeck like that. A bit like having Ranieri as manager (when he was good) I suppose, except that Roy seems to take himself awfully seriously.
But Roy was failing abysmally resultswise. And his utterances were so bad, it didn't just look your your average periphery 'managers being managers' twattery. It began to look like it was actively contributing to the poor form of the team.
Benitez had a lot more leeway to be a tit because of his results. And even then, I found his public tirades unnecessary and sometimes counterproductive.
There is a big difference between the moaning of Roy and Rafa though. Rafa moaned with a winner's mentality. He wanted to get places and he would rant at anything that got in his way. The owners, Parry, etc. Roy moans to excuse himself and disavow his responsibility. For all his criqitique of the owners and lacking funds, Rafa stuck his neck out and said 4th was the minimum acceptable and he would guarantee it. That's taking responsibility. He failed, lost his job. Fair dos.
Roy comes in, claims he can do better and instead goes on a campaign of lowering expectations and level of ambition to try and pass himself off as acceptable, even going as low as saying 'whoever comes in will be doing a similar job to me', trying to con us into believing he was doing the best possible job.
In a way, I would have loved for Roy to be succesful. I can live just fine with the boring football, did so under Houllier and I can live with him being a tit if he is a succesful tit. It would have been fun times to get 3 points in the bag and then go straight to cracking up as Roy goes off on yet another ether-induced rant at the press conference. I love a good mindfeck like that. A bit like having Ranieri as manager (when he was good) I suppose, except that Roy seems to take himself awfully seriously.
But Roy was failing abysmally resultswise. And his utterances were so bad, it didn't just look your your average periphery 'managers being managers' twattery. It began to look like it was actively contributing to the poor form of the team.
Do you think that Kenny is going to change everything though? Honestly...
Tbh, I find the 'what about Rafa, ya hypocrite' arguments tiresome. He was a clearly superior manager and I don't really care to answer for RAWK's deification of him. When he was bad, I critisised him. I posted this on RAWK in November 2009 when things were starting to go bad in a thread called 'Re: Are there any intelligent reds who want Rafa out? (some hindsight comments added in cursive brackets):
In the end, he didn't finish 4th. I was not opposed to his sacking. Too bad we ended up with such an inferior replacement though.
In the end, he didn't finish 4th. I was not opposed to his sacking. Too bad we ended up with such an inferior replacement though.
Compared to Roy? Yes. Change enough to get us back in the top 4? Remains to be seen. If he keeps up our recent form, assuming the first couple of games were beginner's wobbles, he certainly deserves a shot at it next season. He's revitalised this club not just from Roy's shenanigans but also from some of the shadows still from Rafa's tenure. Almost overnight, Liverpool has become a club with purpose, goals and identity again.
Accentuating the positive, white lies at worst. He has a basic idea if he has watched them play this season. Don't tell me managers can only assess how good players are in training.
What planet did you just descend from? He's been bullshitting about his players since the day he landed in England. I recall Lampard telling how, early in his reign, he was in the shower and Jose came in, told him he was the best midfielder in the world and he wanted him to start playing like it. Obviously bullshit and certainly so at the time, but Frank felt ten feet tall when he heard it.
Same way he immedately claimed Zlatan was the bestest ever when he joined Inter. And now Ronaldo is the bestest ever even if he scored no goals at all.
Mourinho could write a book on the science of bullshit. I'd buy it too.
Are you for real? You think watching their first 11 play very few times is enough basis for him to access the status of their entire squad? What. You think he spent all his time at Liverpool watching West Brom games?
I'm a human from Earth. I'm certainly curious as to which one you hail from
I thought your quoted piece was very sensible & reasonable.
Fair enough.
Enough to give an indepth assessment of the squad? No. Enough to spin a positive angle on it for his first press conference? yes. Even from only having watched them a few times, he should know enough to be able to say that with the right management they are good enough to stay up. Because everyone knows this is true (although the same applies to most of the relegation teams).
That's a difficult question to answer. But we always felt, that in the short-term at least, Kenny could steady the ship after what's been a turbulent 2 or 3 years at Anfield.
There are advantages to keeping him on full time. He's a proven winner, both as a player, & as a manger. The fans & the players trust him completely. That's not something we've been able to say about any manager since the days of....err, Kenny Dalglish. The thing I admire most about the guy. Is that just like Fergie, or any other great mangager. You get the feeling that when the players go out onto the pitch. They want to play just as much for the manager, as they do for the club. If you've got that at the club, then you've got a great chance of progression because everyone is pulling in the same direction.
His time out of the game is an obvious disadvantage. Whilst the principles & concept of football is generally the same: Good managers = good teams = success - We're now talking of top class squads as opposed to just top class teams. Kenny built 2 title winning sides at Liverpool & Blackburn, when give or take an occasional change here & there because of injuries & suspensions etc, it was basically send out your strongest 11. In today's game, the manager has had to develop new skills in dealing with player's ego's & inflated ambitions. Torres is an ideal case in point. Not only that, a manger now has to keep 18 or 19 players happy, rather than the 12 or 13 he was used to back in his days at Anfield & Ewood Park.
The footballing world isn't awash with top managers who could guarantee success. There is also the fact that some top managers may not want to come to Anfield. So in many respects, we may be left with no alternative but to give Kenny another go.
Haha, love these quotes.
I'm a Liverpool fan, and Hodgson should never have got the job in the first place. He stock was ridiculously high based on one good Europa League run. It's similar to when you see clubs signing players off the back of a decent World Cup.
Liverpool finished 7th last season, so there was no reason to accept languishing 15th under Hodgson. We lost Mascherano, that's all. There was no reason that we should have been so severely poorer than last year- which was pretty poor itself.
I'm unsure if Dalglish is the long term answer but he's as good as anyone else available for liverpool right now. It's actually nice to have a manager who praises the players once in a while too.
It'll be a long time until we challenge for the league again but things are at least looking better that they were earlier in the season. I hope Hodgson keeps WBA up (not least because I actually like them) but it's shown that a manager who does well with a small club wont automatically do well with a bigger club.
While I'm here.....What a goal by Rooney, by the way. Unbeleivable.
I'm a Liverpool fan, and Hodgson should never have got the job in the first place. He stock was ridiculously high based on one good Europa League run. It's similar to when you see clubs signing players off the back of a decent World Cup.
Liverpool finished 7th last season, so there was no reason to accept languishing 15th under Hodgson. We lost Mascherano, that's all. There was no reason that we should have been so severely poorer than last year- which was pretty poor itself.
I'm unsure if Dalglish is the long term answer but he's as good as anyone else available for liverpool right now. It's actually nice to have a manager who praises the players once in a while too.
It'll be a long time until we challenge for the league again but things are at least looking better that they were earlier in the season. I hope Hodgson keeps WBA up (not least because I actually like them) but it's shown that a manager who does well with a small club wont automatically do well with a bigger club.
While I'm here.....What a goal by Rooney, by the way. Unbeleivable.
Hey, you're back. You left right after I asked you about Fulham. You completely disappeared.
Feel free to go back to the last page, reread the posts leading up to my question and answer it.