The 3 pies were served to Roose Bolton at Ramsay's wedding wasn't it? But Manderley calling for a song about the Rat Cook was probably one of the best moments in ADoD.
Books A Song of Ice and Fire (Books) | TV show? What TV show?
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A character I liked and am waiting to return is Benjen Stark. I think he is the Wight on the elk that guides Bran. Do you think it's likely that Bran wouldn't know his own uncle?
Depends on how much his appearance changed.
Don't think it's Benjen, considering Coldhands was "killed long ago". A couple of years doesn't sound that long.
Yeah fair point. I have a feeling he's someone we have been introduced to though.
That's the other thing is cold hands a wight? Or some weird hybrid or just an old lad with bad circulation?
Why do you like him? We hardly know anything about him.
Sometimes you just know when you've met the right one. You'll figure it out someday.
The thing about Benjen is we do not even know why he joined the Nightwatch do we? Okay fine he was never going to be the Lord of Winterfell, but if you look at most of the other Brothers of the Watch, they joined because they were running away from something or forced to. In some ways in the books he seems to exist solely as an excuse for Jon Snow to join the watch.
Literally all Benjen has done is go "OK Ned... Well I'm off back to the wall. Bye."
He's mysterious!!
Some join it just for the sake of it, because they believe that the nightwatch really defends the kingdom. Lord Commander Mormont for example, he was the lord of that small island but he decided to gave it up and go on nightwatch. Not everyone there is a thief.
That's what I thought all the time of it that Benjen, coming from a noble house in the north, with a strong sense of duty joined the Night's Watch because he thought it was a noble cause and the right thing to do to protect the north from the wildlings.
I don't think it's that simple. He may have been sent to protect someone. He tried to discourage John from taking the black too.
Who? And by whom? He never got mentioned in any way, shape or form so I doubt it's of any relevance for the story why he is there. George R.R. Martin always drops hints if something is of importance and the fact that he never really mentioned anything about Benjen being involved in any of the affairs that went on before the books started or ever mentioned him again after he left Winterfell I think pretty much says it all. He has no relevance to the story.
I think JustAFan hit the nail on the head when he said that he only seems to exist to give Jon a reason to join the Night's Watch.
I think Benjen might be Coldhands.
Possibly, but he could just have easily done that by giving him an argument with Catelyn or something. I'm also surprised that they'd bother to cast him if he was completely unimportant.
Possibly but an arguement could have just sent him off with Eddard just as effectively. I mean in reality she never treated Jon Snow well at all, so it is not like having a fight with her would have been some game changer for him. Certainly though her treatment of him does play a part in his decision as he never really had a spot completely as part of the family so he was looking for a place to be at home in. it is the fact that his uncle is a Ranger in the Nightswatch that ultimately tips the balance for him to make that decision.
They cast lots of smaller roles in TV shows and movies. Heck this show is full of them.....
I think he was a good opportunity to set up Jon for his arrival on the wall. He saw his uncle as an honorable man, someone he looked up to and thought that most men who belonged to the Night's Watch were like his uncle. He was naive in that way like all the Stark kids seem to start out as naive children, which they all essentially are at least in the books.
Benjen served to build up the strong contrast to how the Night's Watch really is and served to set up Jon's first big conflict with having to deal with the real world so in that regard he is a fairly important character if only for a short time.
Actually, yeah. This was quite important. Jon went there thinking everyone was going to be noble, brave, capable warriors, and he ended up being largely surrounded by a bunch of cowardly criminals that could barely swing a sword. It meant that him swearing his oath became a big thing, because for a while he still had the option to nope the fuck out of there and go back to Winterfell, or at least somewhere that wasn't The Wall. Jon's oath has been a big part of his character. The series began with Ned lopping off someone's head for being an oathbreaker, and Jon models himself very much on Ned, or at least he used to. He already has the bastard thing hanging over him, so he doesn't want the double hit of being an oathbreaker too.
I think Benjen is dead personally.
Him joining the Watch ended up being a reason why Jon wanted to do the same and him dying/disappearing meant Jon had to find his own way around the watch once he actually got there. It also allowed Tyrion to build a friendship of sorts with Jon which could be important come the end.
Him joining the Watch ended up being a reason why Jon wanted to do the same and him dying/disappearing meant Jon had to find his own way around the watch once he actually got there. It also allowed Tyrion to build a friendship of sorts with Jon which could be important come the end.
Yeah he's probably dead, and I expect the whole thing will go unresolved. I think GRRM has just left it open to tease fans into believing he may be alive, but then giving us nothing to confirm he probably is dead.
I am not ruling out him in some way showing up again either as a wight or still being alive with some group of wildings, you never know in these books.
But it is interesting how the different our initial understanding of the Nightwatch is, with the reality that soon sets in.
I think Benjen still has a part to play yet. He's been gone for far too long (and mentioned too many times) to turn up as a wight or simply never be seen again. As Alex99 said, I've wondered if he could be coldhands, but that probably wouldn't make much sense.
Even if he does come back, I don't think he's a particularly important character.
It's also possible that Benjen joined the Night's Watch to ensure the Starks had someone there. Ned was planning to populate the gift and I suppose that might have gone easier having someone inside the Watch.
Many Starks had joined the NightWatch during the all times. In fact, one of the Starks build the wall as a member (possibly founder) of the nightwatch. While the other houses on recent times weren't that much interested for the Nightwatch, Starks still contributed on it.
On another topic I have recently read the two excerpts of "The Winds of Winter" and now I totally can't wait for the next book to come out. God damn you George hurry the feck up.
I wonder if you have to have a Stark at the Watch. The Starks appear to have magic in their blood especially this generation.
Yeah, I don't see a lot of it happening.
Whitewalkers being the saviors. Hopefully not. From the beginning I have thought that they are the main antagonists and everything else (like the game of thrones) is just a distraction. If it turns that they are the good guys while Aegon and Daeneris especially the baddies, meh, it doesn't make sense.
Well my predictions:
- At the first half of next book:
- Aegon will get many lords behind him, including the entire Dorme.
- Stannis will defeat and kill the Boltons
- Princess Myrcella gets executed on Dorne
- King Tommen gets killed by Tyrells
- Jaime gets executed by Catelyn, or possibly join her and the brotherhood without banner
- Cersei become almost insignificant and goes to Casterly Rock
- At the second half of next book:
- Daenerys rides the dragons and attacks immediately Kingslanding.
- She defeats the Tyrells
- After some negotiations, she and Aegon join forces and prepare to get the entire Seven Kingdoms
- Stannis is reconsidering his position
- At the ending of the next book
- The Others finally march and destroy the wall, the North is completely unprepared because a few of nightwalkers had came there from the sea, so the North is between them.
- Jon Snow is reborn as Azar Ahai. He is also confirmed as Rhaegar's son.
At the final book:
- Stannis dies fighting the Others/after the war Stannis becomes the Lord of Baratheans
- Tyrion/Jaime kills Cersei
- Snow, Daenerys and Aegon rides the dragons and lead the humans against the Others (possibly after they get convinced to join forces from Tyrion/Arya).
- Bran helps them ... somehow
- Only Aegon survives the final battle. Daenerys and Snow are already lovers but they die in the battle.
- Aegon marry Sansa and they together become king and queen
- Rickon Stark becomes Lord of Winterfell
- Tyrion becomes Lord of Casterly Rock
- Aegon will get many lords behind him, including the entire Dorme.
- Stannis will defeat and kill the Boltons
- Princess Myrcella gets executed on Dorne
- King Tommen gets killed by Tyrells
- Jaime gets executed by Catelyn, or possibly join her and the brotherhood without banner
- Cersei become almost insignificant and goes to Casterly Rock
- At the second half of next book:
- Daenerys rides the dragons and attacks immediately Kingslanding.
- She defeats the Tyrells
- After some negotiations, she and Aegon join forces and prepare to get the entire Seven Kingdoms
- Stannis is reconsidering his position
- At the ending of the next book
- The Others finally march and destroy the wall, the North is completely unprepared because a few of nightwalkers had came there from the sea, so the North is between them.
- Jon Snow is reborn as Azar Ahai. He is also confirmed as Rhaegar's son.
At the final book:
- Stannis dies fighting the Others/after the war Stannis becomes the Lord of Baratheans
- Tyrion/Jaime kills Cersei
- Snow, Daenerys and Aegon rides the dragons and lead the humans against the Others (possibly after they get convinced to join forces from Tyrion/Arya).
- Bran helps them ... somehow
- Only Aegon survives the final battle. Daenerys and Snow are already lovers but they die in the battle.
- Aegon marry Sansa and they together become king and queen
- Rickon Stark becomes Lord of Winterfell
- Tyrion becomes Lord of Casterly Rock
I wonder how many of my predictions will turn out to be true.
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Why will the Tyrells kill Tommen?
And I am not too sure there will be many people who buy Jon's parentage not until he rides a dragon anyway. So the reveal itself, while significant to Jon himself, might not be all that important.
And I am not too sure there will be many people who buy Jon's parentage not until he rides a dragon anyway. So the reveal itself, while significant to Jon himself, might not be all that important.
I think that he has to die. Maybe not from Tyrells but I would be surprised if him or Myrcella survives the next book.
It will be significant to Jon. The realms probably won't even know it though. And heck, Jon and Aegon being brothers, Jon being twice bastard it is fun.
@Revan no way are the tyrells killing tommen. Thats their only claim to the kingship.
Also, think tyrion will ride on the dragons.
Also, think tyrion will ride on the dragons.
If Myrcella is dead, who is next in line for the throne after Tommen? Stannis is a traitor so he would be discounted, wouldn't it essentially become a toss up between the Lannisters who are weaker than ever before and Tyrells.
Oh I think he'll die but the Tyrells killing him doesn't make sense since all the power they havederive is on the back of Tommem being king. If they kill him, Margaery is no longer queen and heir is in Dorne.
Well the actual order is Myrcella, Stannis, Shireen. Beyond that you would have to dig deeper into the family, perhaps too deep. And since Robert did not base his rule on conquest maybe even Dany has a claim.
Like I said Stannis is a traitor and so he and Shireen would get ruled out straight away. Imagine Dany would also get pushed out for that very reason. I had never thought about the Tyrells killing Tommen for the very reason that they rely on him for power in KL but then they could always form a populist coup if that was to happen.
It won't matter at all the claim for kingship. Already a Targaryan would be on Westeros who has a much better claim for kingship than Tommen and a part of the kingdom will be with him. The North will be ruled by Stannis. The Riverrun will again be ruled by Tullis (after whatever happens with Jaime). It will be a total war IMO, and what claim you have for kingship won't matter. The Tyrells have already the army near the Kingslanding (Tarly had immediately marched there when he heard that Margaery was imprisoned) and I can see them doing something drastic.
I don't think that Tyrion will actually ride them, but I can see him being the negotiator which will make Daeneris and Jon join forces. He already has 'good' relations with Jon and in the next book he will meet Daeneris. He isn't a warrior, but he is a smart man.