Actually I did not say the Lannisters killed Jon, I said he was killed because he found out the secret.
Books A Song of Ice and Fire (Books) | TV show? What TV show?
- Thread starter Massive Spanner
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Actually I did not say the Lannisters killed Jon, I said he was killed because he found out the secret.
I can completely see where they're coming from. Almost anything we say can be a spoiler in some way, even if we don't mean it.
ffs
I mistook you for a non-book reader.
Yeah, I learned a long time ago that it's completely pointless to debate with them in there, and I stopped. Imagine if you hadn't read the books and someone who had was debating 4-5 paragraph long posts with you? I would definitely get pissed off, even if it wasn't spoiling anything on me.
It's okay, I did mention it as a reason the Lannisters wanted to kill Ned, so I can see how it would seem that I was also suggesting a role for them in Jon Arryn's death.
I get them getting annoyed by plot points, but I don't understand why they fly off the handle just as much when someone makes a comment about a character that they couldn't remember the name of.
It's not a problem if people infer from what you wrote that the Lannisters killed him, I think that's what most show watchers assume, I was just worried that Gandalf might hint that it wasn't the case when defending Jaime.
Nope. Tyrion is 'the littel brother' IMO.
the bad thing right now is that out of the people currently having the debate in the thread, more have read the books than have not. I'm telling you, you'll get shat on by the mods if you keep at shit like this. Stop.
I am going to stay here. I almost made a huge blunder in the TV show thread, but luckily was able to delete my post before anyone read it.
As I mentioned I have read the books but my wife and daughter have not. They are watching the show now and I have to be careful with them about what I say. They are on season three and my wife keeps commenting on why don't certain characters just take a certain action. I have to do my best not to give away that in fact that action is going to happen.
@Gandalf Greyhame STOP
It's really interesting, I think I'll take my chances. Unless it's in the rules, of course.
You almost made me go "But Lysa killed Jon!". Let's keep OUR debate here, FFS.
Huh? Seriously, stop posting in there, you'll get banned.
In that case then, okay. I'm done there.
What exactly did you post?
It was a couple of months ago, something I meant to post here but posted in the TV show thread instead.
Even inferring that the Lannisters killed Jon might be wrong, don't you think?
Why are you assuming that Cersei's death will be dramatic or symbolic, at the hand of one of her brothers?
Ned was killed by Ilyn Payne, not Jaime.
Robb was killed by Frey, not Joffrey.
Joffrey was killed by Littlefinger, not Tyrion.
Tywin was killed by Tyrion, not Stannis.
Stannis was killed by Ramsay, not Tywin. (At least, we suspect)
Gregor was killed by TV, not The Lightning Lord.
My point is, none of the characters that died have died at the hands of the one we (or I, in the above examples) expected them to. While we were looking for dramatic/redeeming/appropriate/classic endings, GRRM just landed a sucker punch. Why should Cersei be any different? She might be backstabbed by Varys r Littlefinger's men, for all we know. Anyone but Jaime or Tyrion, I'd say.
I think it's what the show has lead people to believe. Ned thought the lannisters did it and we've no reason to doubt him yet.
Because there is a prophecy that says that Cersei will be killed by her little brother. Cersei being paranoid for that (IMO) will make the prophecy become true because she was always bad with Tyrion.
I fully expect all prophecies to be fullfilled (Azor Ahai = Jon Snow, the prince who was promised = Daeneris, the mummer prophecy = Aegon, and the little brother prophecy = Tyrion).
Arya to kill Cersei in disguise as Tyrion
Yeah, but if they realize he's a book poster (like if they see his name in the poster list for this thread, or with the last post), they're going to immediately assume it was the Lannisters that did it, and be mad at him for "confirming" it. That's why it's never a good idea to post in that thread no matter how much you try to play by the rules, anything you say can be taken to mean something, whether it did or not.
Come again?
I've been re-readng the books these last few weeks and books are even better when you read them 2nd time round. The only chapters I felt like skipping were the Danny chapters in DwD. The reek chapters in that book are superb, every one of them.
I am really interested to see what happens to Rickon in the next book and how that plot is played out.
I am really interested to see what happens to Rickon in the next book and how that plot is played out.
Yo Grand Maester Revan, when do you expect Winds of Winter to be released? Also I heard about a 'Encyclopaedia of Ice and Fire' or something similar, which will write about pretty much everything within the books e.g. houses, creatures, lands (even Sothoris (??), which is way south and is almost completely undocumented in the books). That would be awesome if they put a lot of detail and effort into it, I love reading about events and the world the books are set in on Wiki of Ice and Fire.
Apparently (don't quote me on this), one of the British publishers tweeted that the next book was 'years away' before deleting her tweet
Could mean nothing but given GRRM's history it wouldn't surprise me.
Could mean nothing but given GRRM's history it wouldn't surprise me.Who knows? I hope it will come next year but I doubt that anyone (including GRRM) knows.
I spend a lot of time reading Westerosi forums (though never signed up) and is a great place. They have found everything there is to be found, including links with 'The Hedge Knight' novellas.
An enciclopedia would be brilliant and a must buy. I also wonder does GRRM has a plan for Sothoris or he just put it on map because of the analogy Europe-Asia-Africa (Westeros, Esos, Sothoris).
You're saying that as if that's some kind of grand revelation. There are lots of much subtler things in the series than that.
True, but we've had no proof yet, and the jury is still out on how Arryn was murdered, if you're following the TV series. Stating it as a fact would mean you're eliminating the other possibilities, and the blokes on the other thread could beat you with that stick if they wanted to.
I read a rumour a few months ago on the ASOIAF reddit where the OP was positive it was going to be released this summer
to be fair it wasn't just blind optimism, there were some hints from publishers/friends etc, can't find it now. Surely the publishers need a certain amount of time to start promoting it. But I'm fairly pessimistic and can't see it released before the end of next year.Yeah the idea of having more information about Sothoris, Esos and the Lands of Always Winter would be amazing, really looking forward to that.
I thought he was killed by the lady head of the Tyrell family. I must've misread that one.
I didn't suspect that. I just thought it was a standoff and winter is coming so I was hoping for white walkers to get to both Stannis and Ramsay.
Wasn't he just given to Cersei as a night of the Queensguard? That mad attempted septon saved him in some way.
Actually isn't the prophecy that "the valonqar" will kill her, does that mean it is HER little brother or just somebody's little brother? Only time and the mind of GRRM will tell.
The old 'Reek', the monster who helps Theon take Winterfell, and then takes it from him. His name was Ramsay Bolton, no? He sent a letter to the Wall in the last book (addressed to 'Bastard') telling Jon that Stannis was dead.
I thought Stannis would be killed long ago by Tywin.
Ah. To be frank, I think GRRM will do a bitch and come up with a development/plotline so huge, it will leave everything else tottering in its wake, and all insignificant things like prophecies and character arcs will end up twisted and open-ended. Something like the dragons destroying half of the kingdom, or the White Walkers taking over the north.
Like what Brandon Sanderson did in Mistborn, destroying the whole world entirely in the last book.
Mind listing out a few? I want to know what I may have missed.
According to Littlefinger, Lady Olena killed Joffrey and it makes sense I suppose.
When did Stannis die?!?
Nah, Oberyn killed him with that spear and they sent Gregor head to Dorne. God knows what Qyburn was up to in the dungeon.
Didn't Littlefinger, while talking to Sansa, hint at how she was on his side, and that it was all by his design? I may have to read that part again, I guess.
Ffs, why would you spoil that. Thanks.
we actually have two confessions. Lysa's is very strong and not denied by Littlefinger. But there is also the conversation overheard by Arya underneath the castle, the conversation between two men was are to believe to be Varys and Illyrio Mopatis, they seem to indicate some role in the killing the previous Hand.
Plots within plots, people willing to take advantage of situations as they arise, even spreading misinformation, etc. While Lysa and Littlefinger are the most likely suspects, it is possible that Littlefinger is playing more of his elaborate games. The same could be said of Varys also.
I do believe there is ample evidence she was involved, but Littlefinger most likely had his hands in that plot also.
I'd need a list or something to do that, I don't actually remember most stuff.
Oh, yeah, that. I never actually thought he was actually dead, though.