Cheers lads! How many books are there in this series apart from the 5 written and 2 coming out? Like the Targaryan and Dunk and Egg novellas? Any other side quest novels that are as popular as the big 5 so far?
Books A Song of Ice and Fire (Books) | TV show? What TV show?
- Thread starter Massive Spanner
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In the show, does anyone else think Tyrion might try to convince Dany to let Jaime take the Black? It might be a hard argument considering Jaime backstabbed her father.
Dunk and Egg (A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms) have quite a big fanbase. I already listed all ASOIAF content above aside from The World of Ice and Fire, which is a sort of encyclopedia of the universe, quite useful if you want to know more about locations listed/mentioned fleetingly in the main books and their lores.
I've borrowed A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms from Library today 
Are you just referring the Ice and Fire wiki or you have actually read the books? I'm genuinely curious there is just no way you will continue to argue about some of the finer points if you have read all the books about the ASOIAF universe.
The Late Lord FishI've borrowed A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms from Library today
I have read everything in ASOIAF (5 books + reread the first three, 3 Dunk and Egg novellas, two other Targ novellas and a very quick read of World of Ice and Fire). For what points you are exactly talking?
Succession related questions and some of the weird decisions in the show. Each his own I guess.
I think a few posters in the show thread have seen the spoilers of dialogues/plot outlines for next week but subtly posting as if they are guessing next week's episode
Well, they may be actually guessing it, but chances are remote. As far as today's episode, felt like the calm before the storm yet had so many advances in the plot line. If the leaks are real, next week will be epic. I've stopped making sense of timelines and character progressions. Just enjoy the spectacle by itself.
Succession related questions and some of the weird decisions in the show. Each his own I guess.
I think a few posters in the show thread have seen the spoilers of dialogues/plot outlines for next week but subtly posting as if they are guessing next week's episode
As far as today's episode, felt like the calm before the storm yet had so many advances in the plot line. If the leaks are real, next week will be epic. I've stopped making sense of timelines and character progressions. Just enjoy the spectacle by itself.
This
Just 8 episodes left in the series.
Ah... so she knew they were dead, just not that it was Theon who was responsible for their death. Makes sense then that she doesn't have him on her list.
Cheers for that.
Yeah we thought as much, digging the exact passage out was hard though. My Ebook collection has ADwD as stand alone and the first 4 books bundled together, a nightmare to find anything in ACoK and ASoS.
Until recently I had the epub, mobi and pdf, version of all 5 books. Would have searched for it myself but I deleted the mobi and pdf version.
We have debated this to death. And a lot of things I said were exclusively for the show (like Jaime defeating Tyrells, which in the books would have been totally impossible, but in the show made sense).
A slower episode but quite enjoyable. Not sure why Tarly did what he did, and Dickon was pure stupid on following him.
The show has annulled Rhaegar's marriage to Lyanna and made Jon legitimate which gives him succession claim over Dany.
Assuming this is how it goes down in the books as well and that Aegon is not fake who then takes the throne? From what I read in the Dance of Dragon novellas it seems that Aegon would still be the king despite the annulment of the marriage.
Also coming to Annulments, is it so easy to annul them? I don't think I have ever come across a divorce from a consumated marriage in ASOIAF.
Edit: Instead of annuling the marriage they should have just mentioned that Rhaegar married Lyanna after he learned about the death of Ella (not sure about the name) and before Jon was actually born.
Assuming this is how it goes down in the books as well and that Aegon is not fake who then takes the throne? From what I read in the Dance of Dragon novellas it seems that Aegon would still be the king despite the annulment of the marriage.
Also coming to Annulments, is it so easy to annul them? I don't think I have ever come across a divorce from a consumated marriage in ASOIAF.
Edit: Instead of annuling the marriage they should have just mentioned that Rhaegar married Lyanna after he learned about the death of Ella (not sure about the name) and before Jon was actually born.
The Annulment is nonsense because Targs practice polygamy. They stopped to appease the Faith in exchange for the latter keeping mum about their incest, but it was never officially banned. That wont be in the book. Also, I don't think divorce is a thing in Westeros. The only mention of annulment of a marriage is in Tyrion/Sansa case, and you need a council of Faith or the High Septon himself to do it, provided the marriage were never consummated.
If Aegon isn't fake then he is the true heir. Annulment doesn't make trueborn children bastards or strip away their rights.
It's just something Dumb and Dumber came up with to give Samwell something to do.
If Aegon isn't fake then he is the true heir. Annulment doesn't make trueborn children bastards or strip away their rights.
It's just something Dumb and Dumber came up with to give Samwell something to do.
Aegon is obviously the first in the line of succession (assuming that he ain't fake), regardless if the marriage was annulled or not. To be fair, it had no reason for the marriage to be annulled considering that Targs practice polygamy.
Err.. first in line of succession is the one true king, Stannis Baratheon.
Not if you count Baratheons as usurpers though. The entire kingdom was created by Targaryans, and there are still 2 (if not 3) Targs alive.
The Baratheon claim is as legit as the Tagaryen's though. Right of conquest.
Of course, there's all that crap about Robert's grandmother being a Targaryen, but no one had any doubt who's king after the Trident.
The talk of who has the strongest claim should be scrutinised in the context of each dynasty.
Edit: Also, even though the Targaryen line Dany and Jon descended from was the 'true' one, the throne strictly speaking was briefly usurped during the Dance. Aegon III was Rhaenyera's son but Aegon II went against Viserys I's expressed will.
Slightly different to Aegon's original conquest. Back then, there were seven kingdoms, he conquered 6 of them and made a single kingdom (later Dorne was added by marriage), while in Robert's case, he essentially made a rebellion to overthrow the rightful king. Obviously, no one cared, cause the most important thing is who is the strongest.
And as of this moment, Daenerys is the strongest regardless of her heritage.
...
I think that Danny and Jon are making a mistake by going all politics and shit as that. Danny should go full Rand Al-Thor and give the option to all the other lords and kings and queens and whatever, join me or be totally annihilated. Worst possible case is to go in a war against the others, with people (Cersei) who would want to backstab you from behind.
One of the things I just realized is how many show watchers can not differentiate between the things they know because they get to see every scene of the show and what the characters know from their viewpoint within the story. It's really weird.
I think the idea of Jaime taking the black as LC seems sort-of plausible, in the grand scheme of this episode. *Please don't confirm or deny this because you read leaked scripts in your spare time*
Operation capture an other/wight seems really silly. I don't think smart plans are team Daenerys' forte.
Operation capture an other/wight seems really silly. I don't think smart plans are team Daenerys' forte.
They need better comprehension of dramatic Irony
It is really ridiculous. Time consuming and most likely doesn't solve much, while she can finish the war once and for all within a day. Also,
Episode 4: Enough with the clever plans
Episode 5: Hear, hear.
Jaime as LC would be nice, but think that he's gonna die saving mad king's daughter. There is a lot of parallelism in ASOIAF, and this would be as awesome as ironic.
Not only this, but do they really believe Cersei will have a sudden change of heart and join forces? If it does happen, it'll be a complete u-turn on her character motivations. She's said so many times in the past few seasons that all she gives a feck about is herself and Jaime... Having everyone join forces like this feels a bit too 'The beacons are lit!' and I've never really had ASOIAF pegged down for something like that.
There is no way that Cersei joins the others. This is not Lord of the Rings or The Wheel of Time. She would love the others to get annihilated in the North if that means that her stay as queen would continue for another bit. Heck, she would sacrifice the entire mankind just to sit on that chair for another day.
Not only this, but do they really believe Cersei will have a sudden change of heart and join forces? If it does happen, it'll be a complete u-turn on her character motivations. She's said so many times in the past few seasons that all she gives a feck about is herself and Jaime... Having everyone join forces like this feels a bit too 'The beacons are lit!' and I've never really had ASOIAF pegged down for something like that.
I hope that at least this act of stupidity by the trio of idiots, will somehow convince the fourth idiot (that would be Jaime) to join them, otherwise it would be all for nothing. And if in some ironical way of fate, Jaime somehow saves Daenerys or Jon (like I have hoped it will happen for a long time) this would pay off, but otherwise, it is a colossal idiotic plan that won't solve anything and can potentially endanger everything.
Yeah, but isn't that similar to you telling people to ignore Jaime drowning down to 'dramatic scenes showing symbolism like other fantasy movies and not to try and look for logic about the difference in knee high water where a horse can run and a trench 12 inches to the left' and the next week telling people there is logic after all on why Daenarys doesn't look for Jaime Lannister because she doesn't know him as there are objects blocking her line of sight and you can discover objects on freezing panes?
It is what it is. Leave logic aside and try to see if the show will provide conclusions with the foreshadowing neatly tied up.
Why have you not read the plot spoilers for Episode 6 and 7? I thought you'd go for it if information is available?
I have read them back then in October or so, but don't remember anything. And more importantly, I guess that the 'game of thrones' will continue in the eighth season too, while that season should have been all about 'A song of ice and fire', with 'the game of thrones' being essentially finished.
I mean, where is exactly the logic on Daenerys to go for an alliance for the final battle, and then to settle the throne after it, when in all likelihood she would be considerably weaker (if she survives at all), and how on Earth the war can be lead by three different kings/queens. Now she is by far the strongest and can finish the war immediately. After the war, her army might be finished, her dragons might be dead, and Cersei (even assuming that she joins) can backstab her during the end of the war.
Wouldn't it make sense, to offer to Jaime/Cersei Casterly Rock and Warden of the West, otherwise burning them. Then offer to Jon to fight with him with the full strength of her army if he bends the knee (or better, an union with a marriage proposal). Then go all in in the last battle without worrying for the smaller things.
I read the ones back in October, but there are specific leaks in Reddit with Spanish videos and text translations. Are they the same? Could have sworn the new reddit links had more details and address some of the questions about Cersei's motives.
As for why she doesn't kill/make alliance with cersei before the war with the others is conjencture now but she may think that war at this point may swell the ranks of the dead
As for why she doesn't kill/make alliance with cersei before the war with the others is conjencture now but she may think that war at this point may swell the ranks of the dead
Or she got Snow fever
Or she got Snow fever
That was probably bullshit though. Surely? Come on, she's the mother of dragons
The more I think about it, the more I get convinced that the execution of Tarlys don't make sense for any of the characters.
Randyll: I would have appreciated more if it was an acceptance that he had done wrong by choosing the wrong side and betraying everything he believed on in order to become Warden of the South, and so causing so many deaths which result in nothing for him. A bit like the last moments of Ser Allistar Thorn. But here, he looked like he was in love with Queen Cersei, which makes no sense in whatever direction you look at. And even there, when he saw Dickon joining him, it made sense to change his mind. After all, Eddard Stark betrayed his honor to save Sansa, and Eddard was 10 times the man Randyll is.
Dickon: why, just why? Sure, his dad might have made the wrong choice and decided to live (and die) with it, but Dickon why?
Daenerys: she didn't even try to make him change his mind. She didn't even play the loyalty card (Tarly was a Targaryan loyalist during the war). And with Baratheon brothers, Tywin and Ned dead, he is the best general in Westeros. Considering that Daenerys is on desperate need of a general (Daario was superb but she left him in Essos), she could have moved heaven and earth to convince Tarly to join her. It is easy in the battle for the Iron Throne, but in a war between equals (at best), she needs all the assets she can get.
Tyrion: at least he tried, but probably could have tried harder.
Writers: at this stage, only the warriors matter, so I do not get why they killed Tarly (and the actor seemed to be doing a very good job). It is time to chop of the likes of Littlefinger, Varys and other politicians, not the likes of Tarly.
It was a lose-lose situation for everyone, and they still went for it. Is the Night King the only rational person in the show?
Randyll: I would have appreciated more if it was an acceptance that he had done wrong by choosing the wrong side and betraying everything he believed on in order to become Warden of the South, and so causing so many deaths which result in nothing for him. A bit like the last moments of Ser Allistar Thorn. But here, he looked like he was in love with Queen Cersei, which makes no sense in whatever direction you look at. And even there, when he saw Dickon joining him, it made sense to change his mind. After all, Eddard Stark betrayed his honor to save Sansa, and Eddard was 10 times the man Randyll is.
Dickon: why, just why? Sure, his dad might have made the wrong choice and decided to live (and die) with it, but Dickon why?
Daenerys: she didn't even try to make him change his mind. She didn't even play the loyalty card (Tarly was a Targaryan loyalist during the war). And with Baratheon brothers, Tywin and Ned dead, he is the best general in Westeros. Considering that Daenerys is on desperate need of a general (Daario was superb but she left him in Essos), she could have moved heaven and earth to convince Tarly to join her. It is easy in the battle for the Iron Throne, but in a war between equals (at best), she needs all the assets she can get.
Tyrion: at least he tried, but probably could have tried harder.
Writers: at this stage, only the warriors matter, so I do not get why they killed Tarly (and the actor seemed to be doing a very good job). It is time to chop of the likes of Littlefinger, Varys and other politicians, not the likes of Tarly.
It was a lose-lose situation for everyone, and they still went for it. Is the Night King the only rational person in the show?
Haven't looked at the Spanish ones, but read somewhere that they are the same but much more detailed (like back in October there was like a couple of paragraphs for episode, while in the Spanish ones there is a description scene by scene and the guy talks for an hour). I didn't even know that there are translation of them.
If they just burn the dead, then it is fine.As for why she doesn't kill/make alliance with cersei before the war with the others is conjencture now but she may think that war at this point may swell the ranks of the dead
Probably explains why Eddard changed his mind and Tarly didn't.
The other bolded bit made me laugh.