A serious look at Mauricio Pochettino

Mastadon said:
Yeah after spending 435 mil net or 5 Paul Pogba's more than them over the last 5 sesaons you would sort of expect to be ahead of them. And its not over yet with them 4 points behind. Plus they finished ahead of you for the last 2 seasons.
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Barking about the net spend again and again. Mourinho inherited a United team in a disarray, with lots of misfit transfers and despite that here we are ahead of Spurs once more. I'm sure if Pochettino would need to buy a proven striker in the mould of Kane/Lukaku that net spend trophy you are barking about would go down by 100m pounds. Or maybe he has someone like Ibrahimovic that would come and play for him despite not being in the CL?
Fair fecks he kept faith in youth, in a no pressure surrounding and we can on hail him as some genius or the "second best manager" in the league. Except other have done the same and won stuff, he won feck all.



Mastadon said:
Nowhere near the improvement of the Spurs boys mentioned dont you agree? Making a donkey of Arsenal this season is a given we are in full donkey mode.
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You are ready to throw your own team under the bus just to downplay a very good performance. I didn't see any of Liverpool's MFs making donkeys of Arsenal players, didn't you beat Spurs 2:0 also? Chelsea in the league cup?



Mastadon said:
Unlike Wenger and Poch he has had almost unlimited budgets. Unlike Wenger and Poch he was also sacked just above the relegation zone after a classic meltdown and losing the dressing room as manager of the existing champions, something even Moyes didnt manage to do. As bad as Wenger has been he has never ever lost the dressing room or suffered a meltdown like Mourinho does.

There is also the fact that Arsenal hates Mourinho so it would never happen.
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Before Mourinho had unlimited budgets he won a CL with Porto. Your beloved Arsenal didn't manage to do that in their entire history. Find me a club that has won a CL from lesser odds despite the age or whatever you might come to downplay it. Yeah he was sacked aafter a meltdown, after he WON THE FECKING LEAGUE. The other two you mentioned haven't come close to that. Wenger lost entire fan base, and if he was working under a trigger fast owner like Roman, he would have been sacked 10 years ago. Pochettino the same.


Mastadon said:
I'm not saying Poch is a proven elite manager. Fergie is the greatest of all time and Mourinho will go down as one of the greatest for all he has won. What I am saying is that based on his last 4 years at Spurs I rate him as the 2nd best manger in the league and he deserves a chance at a bigger club. Which is likely to be your club unfortunately as I would have loved him at Arsenal.

It does count but his team has hardly been performing well despite the huge amount of resources available to them. There are plenty of threads full of ppl complaining about his style of play and performances in bad games.

Spurs are only 4 points behind and again you simply cannot ignore the gulf in resources in the teams. Spurs only ended up with Lucas because Utd got Sanchez. They cannot compete financially with any of the other top 5 teams yet they are up there with the rest (Arsenal aside ffs).



Arsenal haven't played beautiful football in a while its a rare occasion these days with mostly disjointed performances. Spurs as I have said are at such a huge financial disadvantage (half a billion) that you wouldnt expect them to win much.

If you want to pick on someone then go for someone your own size. Go pick on City you have spent about as much as them yet their performances are on another planet. Leave Pochettino out of it till he gets a big team. In the meantime compare yourself to City under Pep and hope that Spurs who have spent half a billion less than you dont overtake you this season.
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City is the only stick with which you ABUs can beat Mourinho and United. :lol:
Ok we'll leave your beloved Pochettino out of it don't worry. Have a good night now, it's time for CL.
 
prath92 said:
For a player maybe not since a player has 10 other teammates in his team who he does not select. Whereas it’s a fair call for manager since the managers control who plays in the team and how all players play
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Yes. You are right but again if a striker is missing sitters, if the midfielders are miss passing, if defenders are out injured when you need them the most. I think considering all the factors, pochettino can be counted among the creamy layer of managers out there.
 
breakout67 said:
Net spend is virtually irrelevant because they have a £150m player from their academy, along with a fantastic scouting network that has got them good players for cheap.

If anything, Spurs are quite suspect when it comes to splashing the cash, they bought Sissoko for £30m and Sanchez for £42m. Whether that has to do with the board or Pochettino I don't know.

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/premier-league/startseite/wettbewerb/GB1

Spurs have the third highest squad value in the league and are only 5% behind United in that aspect. That is because they have players that are very good and would fetch a pretty penny on the market. Levy and Pochettino have built a lot of value for the club, to the point that they have world class players.
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These are good points however you have to wonder whether these players could have developed like this at other teams. Poch teams seem to improve players and perform above their financial means. He has to take credit for developing talent too. But yeah player wise they probably have just as good as us really.
 
Pochettino: “We’re not going to buy trophies, we’re going to deserve trophies. The players are so happy. The worst thing in life is to compare [yourself] with others. We need to compare with ourselves. The players, they feel [and should be] proud about all they’re doing.”

Source - BenPearceSpurs on Twitter
 
Angry Virginian said:
Pochettino: “We’re not going to buy trophies, we’re going to deserve trophies. The players are so happy. The worst thing in life is to compare [yourself] with others. We need to compare with ourselves. The players, they feel [and should be] proud about all they’re doing.”

Source - BenPearceSpurs on Twitter
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Such a Spursy thing to say.
In other words, we are not here for the trophies, we just want to have fun and enjoy ourselves.
 
Giggs86 said:
Such a Spursy thing to say.
In other words, we are not here for the trophies, we just want to have fun and enjoy ourselves.
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Your "in other words" is not a translation of what Pochettino said, it's just your desired projection.
 
Adisa said:
Every team buy players. The feck is he on about?
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Pretty obviously he's talking about the clubs that spend vast amounts of money on players - in terms of net-spending on transfers and in terms of wages - especially the sugar-daddy clubs.
 
Adisa said:
Every team buy players. The feck is he on about?
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It's pretty clear what he's on about tbf.

Giggs86 said:
Such a Spursy thing to say.
In other words, we are not here for the trophies, we just want to have fun and enjoy ourselves.
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Why? We can't buy players on the level other clubs can, when Spurs win a trophy it's not going to be because they spent the most to do so. Personally I respect that view I also don't really mind richer clubs winning everything that's the way the business is at the moment. What does piss me off is some clubs supporters either are in denial or are simply thick and don't see the massive gap in resources.
 
GlastonSpur said:
Pretty obviously he's talking about the clubs that spend vast amounts of money on players - in terms of net-spending on transfers and in terms of wages - especially the sugar-daddy clubs.
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He would also spend millions on players if he were able to. That's a silly argument which he only comes up with because his club is not in position to compete with richer clubs.
 
Sarni said:
He would also spend millions on players if he were able to. That's a silly argument which he only comes up with because his club is not in position to compete with richer clubs.
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Spurs have been more than competitive at various times in the league across the last 3 years compared to several richer clubs. This has included at various times Liverpool, United, City, Chelsea and Arsenal.
 
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GlastonSpur said:
Spurs have been more than competitive at various times in the league across the last 3 years compared to several richer clubs. This has included Liverpool, United, City, Chelsea and Arsenal.
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Competitive yes but falling short at the final hurdle too.

I’m not sure finances had anything to do with losing out on the PL to Leicester or last year’s FA Cup semi to Chelsea
 
InLevyITrust said:
Define compete?
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GlastonSpur said:
Spurs have been more than competitive at various times in the league across the last 3 years compared to several richer clubs. This has included at various times Liverpool, United, City, Chelsea and Arsenal.
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Compete in the market for the expensive players is what I meant. On the field the team is competitive enough and have made a significant step up since he joined.
 
Sarni said:
Compete in the market for the expensive players is what I meant. On the field the team is competitive enough and have made a significant step up since he joined.
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We haven't generally needed to compete in the market for expensive players ... because we've often been able to sign very good players for bargain prices.

Once we start generating more spare income from the new stadium, from next season onwards, I expect the lion's share of that will go on improved contracts for some of the players we already have rather than on trying to compete for expensive transfers. The latter is a fool's game in the face of sugar-daddy clubs in particular.
 
GlastonSpur said:
We haven't generally needed to compete in the market for expensive players ... because we've often been able to sign very good players for bargain prices.

Once we start generating more spare income from the new stadium, from next season onwards, I expect the lion's share of that will go on improved contracts for some of the players we already have rather than on trying to compete for expensive transfers. The latter is a fool's game in the face of sugar-daddy clubs in particular.
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Il get shot here but Poch wouldn't sign a superstar player unless he fitted the criteria he looks for. You cant listen to the guy and not believe what he says. I think a prime example is Son, I think after his first season he was quite close to leaving because he didn't seem to fit the Poch player. He choose to stay and work harder and is reading the rewards.
 
I think Poch has done an amazing job at Spurs and deserves to go onto something bigger. He's clearly improved a side, and has them punching well above their wages - something very, very few managers can consistently do.

In fact, having read the joyous 'Soccernomics' the last manager to consistently outperform the 'spend expectations' was...David Moyes at Everton.

Point being: outperforming relatively low expectations is an entirely different beast from meeting outrageously high expectations. And, more importantly, the only way to be considered as one of the best is to actually be one of the best. That's not doing 'relatively' well, it's doing absolutely well. Win the league. Win the CL. Then you get to talk. And obviously, that probably means moving club.

Until he has trophies, in my opinion he's just the new 'outperformer who needs a step up'. I hope he chooses us as that step, and is hugely successful.
 
Beachryan said:
I think Poch has done an amazing job at Spurs and deserves to go onto something bigger. He's clearly improved a side, and has them punching well above their wages - something very, very few managers can consistently do.

In fact, having read the joyous 'Soccernomics' the last manager to consistently outperform the 'spend expectations' was...David Moyes at Everton.

Point being: outperforming relatively low expectations is an entirely different beast from meeting outrageously high expectations. And, more importantly, the only way to be considered as one of the best is to actually be one of the best. That's not doing 'relatively' well, it's doing absolutely well. Win the league. Win the CL. Then you get to talk. And obviously, that probably means moving club.

Until he has trophies, in my opinion he's just the new 'outperformer who needs a step up'. I hope he chooses us as that step, and is hugely successful.
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Spurs aim to become one of the globally elite clubs (that's why we have/are putting in the needed foundation stones of new stadium and new training centre).

It never seems to occur to some on here that Pochettino might be committed to this project and all the rising expectations that come with it ... just as it never seems to occur to some on here that in a year or two the number of clubs that would be considered a clear step-up from Spurs might be counted on not much more than the fingers of one hand.
 
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GlastonSpur said:
Spurs aim to become one of globally elite clubs (that's why we have/are putting in the needed foundation stones of new stadium and new training centre).

It never seems to occur to some on here that Pochettino might be committed to this project and all the rising expectations that come with it ... just as it never seems to occur to some on here that in a year or two the number of clubs that would be considered a clear step-up from Spurs might be counted on not much more than the fingers of one hand.
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So, I've not had the privilege of going to Wembley when Spurs are playing - how does the koolaid taste then?
 
GlastonSpur said:
Spurs aim to become one of the globally elite clubs (that's why we have/are putting in the needed foundation stones of new stadium and new training centre).

It never seems to occur to some on here that Pochettino might be committed to this project and all the rising expectations that come with it ... just as it never seems to occur to some on here that in a year or two the number of clubs that would be considered a clear step-up from Spurs might be counted on not much more than the fingers of one hand.
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And do you really believe in his commitment in case Barca/Madrid would be interested in him? Both will be looking for new managers in the next 1-2 years, and Pochettino would definitely be on the radar. Same goes for Kane.
 
Beachryan said:
In fact, having read the joyous 'Soccernomics' the last manager to consistently outperform the 'spend expectations' was...David Moyes at Everton.
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(Whispers) That is why I was actually one of the very few in favor of Moyes being named Manchester United manager.
 
Giggs86 said:
And do you really believe in his commitment in case Barca/Madrid would be interested in him? Both will be looking for new managers in the next 1-2 years, and Pochettino would definitely be on the radar. Same goes for Kane.
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He has already ruled out ever managing Barca. As for RM - who knows. But at least 2 things would have to fall into place: 1) That RM actually want Pochettino in the next 1 -2 years ahead of any other manager; and 2) that Pochettino would want at this stage in his career to abandon the stability and undeniably growing potential at Spurs in order to join the RM circus/managerial merry go-round.

He's still young (46) and so has plenty of time later on to think about a club like RM. So if he was offered the job but turned it down, it's not like it'd be now or never.
 
Personally don't see anything wrong with what he said. IMO, he just means that he can't compete with the richer clubs in the transfer market and if they do win trophies, it's because his team worked hard to get to where they are now, not because he just goes out to buy the best players in the world ala PSG/City. His statement doesn't sound arrogant or sour to me.

Let's admit this at least, Spurs are not exactly filled with world class players and yet Poch is having them punching above their weight consistently while playing attractive football. Wonder how far Poch can go with a big budget. Would love it if Poch manages us one day.
 
GlastonSpur said:
He has already ruled out ever managing Barca. As for RM - who knows. But at least 2 things would have to fall into place: 1) That RM actually want Pochettino in the next 1 -2 years ahead of any other manager; and 2) that Pochettino would want at this stage in his career to abandon the stability and undeniably growing potential at Spurs in order to join the RM circus/managerial merry go-round.

He's still young (46) and so has plenty of time later on to think about a club like RM. So if he was offered the job but turned it down, it's not like it'd be now or never.
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Its all well and good to imagine scenarios but changes and uncertainty is the new norm in football these days. If Kane moves to RM or anywhere else the entire balance of this Spurs team will be disrupted. it will be interesting to see how they perform now that he is injured. I am in no way saying Spurs are a one player team (deja vu?) but things change and If that happens it will be interesting to see how Poch and spurs react. One bad season and this flavor of the day will end up being a sour taste in the mouth.
 
Micky Targaryen said:
Personally don't see anything wrong with what he said. IMO, he just means that he can't compete with the richer clubs in the transfer market and if they do win trophies, it's because his team worked hard to get to where they are now, not because he just goes out to buy the best players in the world ala PSG/City. His statement doesn't sound arrogant or sour to me.

Let's admit this at least, Spurs are not exactly filled with world class players and yet Poch is having them punching above their weight consistently while playing attractive football. Wonder how far Poch can go with a big budget. Would love it if Poch manages us one day.
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Your second paragraph had been discussed to death at this point I believe, so please bother to read before wondering.

The problem is with what Poch said is as if spending money is a sin. And spending money is guarantee to win. Sure the ability to able to add quality into the team help, but it still requires management skill. You can have all the raw talent but if the manager can't sell his way to the player and them not performing to required standard, it can still be a failure. Top players usually have bigger ego, so it's not easy to manage. Poch basically said like teams who spends money and the team win it doesn't work hard to win it. It's not necessarily the case. Top players nowadays are expected to work hard too as the gap in quality is close and other competitor also work hard to gain any small advantage. Poch is a bit naive to say so if your interpretation is correct.
 
GlastonSpur said:
We haven't generally needed to compete in the market for expensive players ... because we've often been able to sign very good players for bargain prices.

Once we start generating more spare income from the new stadium, from next season onwards, I expect the lion's share of that will go on improved contracts for some of the players we already have rather than on trying to compete for expensive transfers. The latter is a fool's game in the face of sugar-daddy clubs in particular.
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You have indeed been able to find very good players for not so huge fees but I don't for a second believe that Poch would still be shopping for £30m players only if his budget allowed him to once in a while go and buy a superstar for £70m or more. If he had the option to improve his team chances of winning silverware by buying a very expensive players he'd jump at it instead of lecturing people how he doesn't want to buy trophies, it's my point.

The club has been managed extremely well for the last 4-5 years so the lack of huge budget does not hinder it as much as it could but if the funds were there, they'd be utilized. It's the case for every single club out there bar maybe United under Fergie as Fergie was simply tight with the money (and it wasn't good for us).
 
ti vu said:
Your second paragraph had been discussed to death at this point I believe, so please bother to read before wondering.

The problem is with what Poch said is as if spending money is a sin. And spending money is guarantee to win. Sure the ability to able to add quality into the team help, but it still requires management skill. You can have all the raw talent but if the manager can't sell his way to the player and them not performing to required standard, it can still be a failure. Top players usually have bigger ego, so it's not easy to manage. Poch basically said like teams who spends money and the team win it doesn't work hard to win it. It's not necessarily the case. Top players nowadays are expected to work hard too as the gap in quality is close and other competitor also work hard to gain any small advantage. Poch is a bit naive to say so if your interpretation is correct.
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Basically what I'm trying to convey is this; If Pochettino is in charge of our current squad and Mourinho is in charge of the current Spurs squad, what position will we be on the table now?

Yes, you're right about man management and top players with big egos. But how would we know whether Poch can or cannot manage big egos? As far as I know, he's managed Espanyol, Southampton and Spurs and I don't see any big stars in those teams. Everyone has to start somewhere so who's to say Poch doesn't have it in him to manage big egos? We wouldn't know because he doesn't have the opportunity to do so yet. With that being said, and with all the uncertainties, even though it's been 'discussed to death', I'm certainly going to keep wondering whether Poch can make it in a big club because I would love to see that happen.

About the spending money part, we will have to agree to disagree on that because I certainly did not interpret it the same way you did. :)
 
Sarni said:
You have indeed been able to find very good players for not so huge fees but I don't for a second believe that Poch would still be shopping for £30m players only if his budget allowed him to once in a while go and buy a superstar for £70m or more. If he had the option to improve his team chances of winning silverware by buying a very expensive players he'd jump at it instead of lecturing people how he doesn't want to buy trophies, it's my point.

The club has been managed extremely well for the last 4-5 years so the lack of huge budget does not hinder it as much as it could but if the funds were there, they'd be utilized. It's the case for every single club out there bar maybe United under Fergie as Fergie was simply tight with the money (and it wasn't good for us).
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I fear you miss the target and intention of his words, which I see as intended to make the squad feel valued and unique and to enhance their cohesive identity: "hey look guys, the others are a collection of high-priced prima donnas and egos, but we are a real team"
 
He's one of the candidates to manage Bayern, according to Didi Hamann on Sky Sports Germany.

https://sport.sky.de/fussball/artik...m-coach-pochettino-kontaktiert/11290746/34130

Google translate:

Although allegedly everything speaks for Thomas Tuchel, I somehow do not believe in this commitment. I know that Bayern contacted Mauricio Pochettino and he was an option - and possibly still is. That Bayern coach should speak German, may be an important criterion, but certainly not the crucial. Pep could not be perfect either. They will try to get the best possible coach. For me that would be the coach of Tottenham.
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Phil Osophy said:
He's one of the candidates to manage Bayern, according to Didi Hamann on Sky Sports Germany.

https://sport.sky.de/fussball/artik...m-coach-pochettino-kontaktiert/11290746/34130

Google translate:
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I don't read that as anything other than Hamann's opinion as to who the best possible coach is. Basically the reasoning being that the Bayern Head Coach should speak german blah blah blah, but even more important, it should be the best possible coach and for HIM (Hamann) that is Pochettino. It doesn`t seem like it`s a name he has been given from anyone inside Bayern.

That said, of course Pochettino is on the short list of pretty much all of the larger than Tottenham clubs in the world If and when they change their manager. That doesn`t mean he is a candidate for all of them.
I would be nervous if Real, PSG, Utd & Bayern came knocking this summer though. Not sure any honest Spurs fan wouldn`t be, although I`m sure we pretty much all tell ourselves that he surely wouldn`t leave us in the next 2-3 years.
 
CapitalismSucks said:
I don't read that as anything other than Hamann's opinion as to who the best possible coach is. Basically the reasoning being that the Bayern Head Coach should speak german blah blah blah, but even more important, it should be the best possible coach and for HIM (Hamann) that is Pochettino. It doesn`t seem like it`s a name he has been given from anyone inside Bayern.
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He says that he's been considered for the job and even contacted. That's more than a simple opinion. Another matter is if Hamann has any credibility or not, but I wouldn't be surprised if Bayern were taking a look at Pochettino as one of the candidates.

He's been linked recently to Real, PSG and now Bayern, all of them looking for a new manager. "Candidate", "being on the shortlist", call it as you want, but he's being considered for bigger jobs is clear as water. If he stays for next season you'll be fortunate, and if he remains another one then it would be a miracle in my opinion. But time will tell.
 
Phil Osophy said:
He says that he's been considered for the job and even contacted. That's more than a simple opinion. Another matter is if Hamann has any credibility or not, but I wouldn't be surprised if Bayern were taking a look at Pochettino as one of the candidates.

He's been linked recently to Real, PSG and now Bayern, all of them looking for a new manager. "Candidate", "being on the shortlist", call it as you want, but he's being considered for bigger jobs is clear as water. If he stays for next season you'll be fortunate, and if he remains another one then it would be a miracle in my opinion. But time will tell.
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Sorry. He does actually say that. Given the headline of the article thats a big miss! ^^
Though, I did agree to him being a candidate regardsless.
As I also said, I think all bigger clubs than Spurs would have him on his shortlist. Anything else would be ridiculous given the quality and style of our play the last few years.
And also again , I (and most Spurs fans I feel, bar maybe Glaston) will be nervous if those 3 clubs you mention (plus even Utd if it comes to that) come knocking this summer.

I do feel the odds are he would stay regardless.
The timing would be strange given the upwards trajectory under his reign, plus of course the chance to become a legend by winning the league or CL next year playing in our new home. I think he has worked too hard building this team with peanuts (relatively) to leave now without giving it atleast one more season in our new home that will probably be rocking next season. If he were to succeed winning one of the big 2 titles at a club like ours under the financial handicap we are competing under he would become legend, and I imagine the challenge of achieving that to be more tempting to him than most other options.
I think he has shown enough in the last few years that the chance to move on to one of those clubs you mentioned will be there in the next few years a well, so I don`t think he is in a rush to move on.
Of course if Levy sells Kane, Alli or Eriksen without Poch`s approval he would be gone faster than you could say (pick your word).
 
CapitalismSucks said:
Sorry. He does actually say that. Given the headline of the article thats a big miss! ^^
Though, I did agree to him being a candidate regardsless.
As I also said, I think all bigger clubs than Spurs would have him on his shortlist. Anything else would be ridiculous given the quality and style of our play the last few years.
And also again , I (and most Spurs fans I feel, bar maybe Glaston) will be nervous if those 3 clubs you mention (plus even Utd if it comes to that) come knocking this summer.

I do feel the odds are he would stay regardless.
The timing would be strange given the upwards trajectory under his reign, plus of course the chance to become a legend by winning the league or CL next year playing in our new home. I think he has worked too hard building this team with peanuts (relatively) to leave now without giving it atleast one more season in our new home that will probably be rocking next season. If he were to succeed winning one of the big 2 titles at a club like ours under the financial handicap we are competing under he would become legend, and I imagine the challenge of achieving that to be more tempting to him than most other options.
I think he has shown enough in the last few years that the chance to move on to one of those clubs you mentioned will be there in the next few years a well, so I don`t think he is in a rush to move on.
Of course if Levy sells Kane, Alli or Eriksen without Poch`s approval he would be gone faster than you could say (pick your word).
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I feel the odds are heading in the opposite direction to that which you suggest. Should the option of managing Real or Bayern become a genuine possibiility, you can all but guarantee that Poch will leave for either of them without a moments hesitation. There is simply no logical reason for Poch to remain at Spurs if presented with a significanlty more appealing option, which the aforementioned clubs provide in spades.

We're talking about 2 absolute giants of the game, the apex of football, the primary destination for any and all players/managers whom harbour that insatiable ambition for success. History taught us this fact a long ago.
 
Random Task said:
I feel the odds are heading in the opposite direction to that which you suggest. Should the option of managing Real or Bayern become a genuine possibiility, you can all but guarantee that Poch will leave for either of them without a moments hesitation. There is simply no logical reason for Poch to remain at Spurs if presented with a significanlty more appealing option, which the aforementioned clubs provide in spades.

We're talking about 2 absolute giants of the game, the apex of football, the primary destination for any and all players/managers whom harbour that insatiable ambition for success. History taught us this fact a long ago.
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He hasn't won anything, why would anyone want him? Poch is young, to go to a big club with no silverware is an incredible risk. Poch will be at Spurs next season, I have no doubt in my mind.
 
InLevyITrust said:
He hasn't won anything, why would anyone want him? Poch is young, to go to a big club with no silverware is an incredible risk. Poch will be at Spurs next season, I have no doubt in my mind.
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I agree with you, I was simply saying that given the opportunity to manage Real or Bayern he'd jump at the chance.

Discounting the fact that you are a Spurs fan, wouldn't you do the same? I know I would.
 
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