The United Kingdom is slightly trickier because of Wales, england etc.
But the US is definitely a nation.
Anyway i'm off, you seem to have some bizarre views about countries/nation/state/race etc.
4 X 100 Relay USA
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But the US is definitely a nation.
Anyway i'm off, you seem to have some bizarre views about countries/nation/state/race etc.
All I'm trying to say, and it's in the other direction is that I have no more of a connection to a black althete from Crewe than I do to a black althete from Jamaca or California. Like I said, it come down to supporting people on the passport that they hold. Wasn't there a girl that used to compete for the UK in these games, a long jumper she was, but she maried an Italian and then started to represent Italy? Did those back in ol' blighty stll want her to win? I doubt it. This is where it is stupid to the extreme.
I actually agree with that. I wouldn't feel any affinity with someone who isn't actually from my country.
If that's what your point has been, then you've gone a very roundabout way of telling us.
The US is a state of 50 states. It is not a nation, because not even a decent percentage of the population have the same nationality.
Nationality is a subset of ethnicity (or as some people call it - race, even though that is wrong). The English are Anglo-Saxons, they no longer exist. The Irish are Celts, they no longer exist, same for the Welsh and the Scotsh (who are Irish in any case). Non of these nationalities were actually indigenous to the British Isles in the first place, every one took the place by force. So, what are you supporting here?
I'm 1/2 English, 1/4 Irish, 1/8 Welsh, 1/8 Scottish. I'm British. The problem is, that none of those descriptions of nationalities are valid.
As I said, why should I support a white bloke from Durham over a black bloke from Cuenca?
Dear lord - can not believe I read 4 pages of this. You been on the Sangria again Waste?
Weaste, the thing is that if there are no similarities to draw from between us and those competing, then what stake do we have in the Olympics? None I suppose would be the answer. Well personally, if I don't have a stake in something, be it emotional or ethical or absolutely anything else, then why the feck would I give a shit?
Sorry but I don't buy your whole nationalities argument for a second. Maybe the athletes don't care at all about the fact that they're representing America in that given moment when their energy is being poured into their event, but when they speak and how the act would suggest otherwise.
Also, as for your comment about how Americans don't exist, it's an argument with no right answer. If Americans don't exist, then British don't exist, or Russians or Norwegians etc... and we would all just be descendants of evolving central African apes and what not. But central African apes don't compete in the Olympics, and in the societal norms we live in, Americans do, and that's something I have a stake in because I was born and raised in this country.
Trying to defy the notions of nationalities and that there are in fact no similarities between the citizens of a given country (or at least no more than the citizens of other countries) is actually quite bold and either Utopian or Distopian, not sure which... but it doesn't matter. Because we live in the year 2008, I'm American, you're well... whatever you are, and that's how the world views us.
I may have completely missed your point but that's okay because I'm American, and that's what we do best.
Sorry but I don't buy your whole nationalities argument for a second. Maybe the athletes don't care at all about the fact that they're representing America in that given moment when their energy is being poured into their event, but when they speak and how the act would suggest otherwise.
Also, as for your comment about how Americans don't exist, it's an argument with no right answer. If Americans don't exist, then British don't exist, or Russians or Norwegians etc... and we would all just be descendants of evolving central African apes and what not. But central African apes don't compete in the Olympics, and in the societal norms we live in, Americans do, and that's something I have a stake in because I was born and raised in this country.
Trying to defy the notions of nationalities and that there are in fact no similarities between the citizens of a given country (or at least no more than the citizens of other countries) is actually quite bold and either Utopian or Distopian, not sure which... but it doesn't matter. Because we live in the year 2008, I'm American, you're well... whatever you are, and that's how the world views us.
I may have completely missed your point but that's okay because I'm American, and that's what we do best.
Well, I thought that I was trying to say all along, and it was quite clear, that supporting someone on the passport they hold is a little odd because there is no reason to do so apart from holding the same passport or "citizenship". And that is what the USA is, a huge collection of people of different nationalities with the same passport.
But your really have to stop thinking that it is stupid or silly, because if you have that line of thinking, you will go insane!
An obvious example is, you support Alan Smith when he wears the United Jersey but when he was with Leeds, you hate him with a passion. Isn't that also a silly thing using your line of thinking???
People support whoever, but they relate themselves to a group. A group that share their common interest. If the athlete wears a shirt with a logo same as your passport, you can support them and feel proud. But no one will hold it against you if you do not support them or feel proud and go on to support a black athlete wearing a Korean Yin Yan logo!
Well, surely you would give a shit if you were interested in the pinicle of raw sport?
Are you saying that you would not bother watching the 100m final if there was not a man/woman there from your country? It's worth watching because of what it is, even if it was 8 men from Laos running 8.43 seconds.
The entire point of watching it is surely that you are watching the fastest 8 men/women on the planet going head to head (the pinicle of raw sport). The same goes for the marathon.
As I said, the Olympic ideal is about the individual and excellence.
This is what I feel is very disturbing as a thought process. I lived for all of my life within two miles of Old Trafford, to even compare a mass social entity that is association football to a pool full of a few swimmers or a track full of a few runners is way off the mark. If you cannot understand that, then you have a problem.
No, but see, I still have something vested in that scenario as they maybe from a country I respect, have heard of the athlete, anything. It's not either they're American or nothing.
The idea that the purpose of an event (the Olympics) was created as an individual test and then was fixed in that mold forever is very conservative. Think big Weaste! It's purpose can change, and indeed has changed.
The idea that the purpose of an event (the Olympics) was created as an individual test and then was fixed in that mold forever is very conservative. Think big Weaste! It's purpose can change, and indeed has changed.
Weaste is clearly winning here. His interpreting of US of A was clearly brilliant, dunno why many cement heads living over there have overlooked Weasties points completely.
I am the referee.
I am the referee.
You have totally misunderstood the whole idea/concept of an Olympic Games in your thinking process! And it really is your problem, not ours!
Iam the referee!
The Olympic games is not about representing a state, country, or nationality.
FFS! I'm fed up of tying to explain this to you. It's not a big world cup for multiple sports, that's not the idea.
Don't, it's a personal choice. If you can't come to terms with the fact that the way in which we interpret who we are has changed.
In all of mankind's history we have constantly reinvented our origins. In the strictest sense, of course you're correct, of course we all come the same place, but our paths have diverged and society has created different names and categories for the directions in which we have gone.
The current modern standard for these categories is the country that we are from.
The fact of the matter is, his thinking process evolve around the supporting aspect. Whether he is right or not about the nation and country thing is irrelevant! He has a problem supporting a black athlete because he is from a difference race, and the fact that he is wearing the GB logo troubles him (in terms of supporting him in the Games because he does not support the the idea of Passport association)
Ah yes, but the media wouldn't have it that way. Much less interesting you see...
Wait a minute, I have no problem supporting a black athlete at all, clean your mouth out. I'm just saying that a black athlete from Paris is no different to a black athlete from London. I have no reason to support one over the other. The only difference would be the language they speak at home (which may not be English in either case) and the passport they hold.
So what? So none of us belong to any country?
Again it's your problem! You DON'T HAVE TO support anything! That doesn't mean our world must change around you!
Now that is well said.
I never said you couldn't support what you want to support, just that it's a little bit retarded supporting people that have the same passport as you do.
You may not. But theere are others, for whom their country is a part of their identity. It is a bit like you cheering on random people from around the world, when they play for United. You assosiate yourself with Manchester United, others do it with their country as well.
So what if we only support the passport? So what if we only support the logo? That person performs in the highest level (credit to them for the hard training!!) and if he/she said he/she wants to represent me (my passport logo) I am more than pleased to give him/her my full support and yell at my highest pitch when watching him/her compete!!!!!
Given that Weste doesn't understand the USA, what's your expertise in the area? Or are just another ignorant "referee" in the manner of the bozos who are scoring the boxing at the Olympics?
It may very well be but the passport which we hold is how we most commonly interpret where were from. If someone else holds that passport then they're from the same place. And in the world that revolves around the idea of borders and countries, being "from" the same place is something people appreciate.
Like I said, in terms of how the Olympics has changed, this may simply be media fueled, but it has caught fire none the less.
I cannot even believe in 2008 I am having this conversation. Why do you need to belong to anything? You belong to where you are because of your citizenship. That does not mean that you have to be of the same nationality as the majority of people that are in that political state. If I went to live tomorrow in Japan with my mistress from Blackburn, and we had children there, and then lived out the rest of our happy days there, would those Children be Japanese? OF feckING COURSE NOT! THEY WOULD BE LANCASTRIANS, BECAUSE THAT WOULD BE WHAT THEY ARE, EVEN IF THEY WERE CITIZENS OF JAPAN. THEY WOULD NOT BE JAPAESE.
I'm slightly pissed off trying to talk with halfwits.
People can say the same thing about you supporting United because you live a few miles around OT. But you would tell those people to F*uck off. Same principle. The person is wearing the logo of my passport, I support him/her, that's no silliness in it!!!! If the Chinese Athletes change their shirt into my logo tomorrow, I would give them a two thumbs up and support them totally so the medal counts on my country is top!
People can say the same thing about you supporting United because you live a few miles around OT. But you would tell those people to F*uck off. Same principle. The person is wearing the logo of my passport, I support him/her, that's no silliness in it!!!! If the Chinese Athletes change their shirt into my logo tomorrow, I would give them a two thumbs up and support them totally so the medal counts on my country is top!
Wot?????????
Where are you from? I've never ever before on this forum taken offence to an OOTer, but you are talking shit. If you really think what you have written here, then I can understand you, but it does put you into perspective.
Are you an OOTer? If so, I wouldn't talk about United in the way you are trying to.
I saw some blatant bias officiating for a chinese boxer today was so fustrating.
But to be expected.
Ok Yankies, tell us your nationality approx. I've already stated mine.
If someone has the same passport as I, womeone has just commmited a crime involving identity theft. On the other hand, if that person has a passport issued by the same national government, we do have something in common--a way for me to identify with a given athlete in a given event. Whether I get excited or want to overturn police cars and attack ethnic restaurants when that person does well (or bomb out completely) is a different issue. However, when one knows no one in the competition, but finds the event intriguing, backing the person who votes int he same elections and supporting the guy from the homeland makes at least as much sense as any of the other reasons people have come up with for supporting teams or individuals in sports.
You could have had a boxer with Chinese nationality but with USA citizenship boxing for you. Then he's an American is he?
I've worked there for some time..should be more than sufficient
I reckon Weaste should grasp something two or three pages down the line
Any way I am the referee.
You are a cretin with nothing to say (nothing new), so nobody is paying any attention.
why did you quote me then feckwit?