2020 US Elections | Biden certified as President | Dems control Congress

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It was always going to depend on Dem base showing up and Rep base staying home for this to go for Beto. It can still happen on the day though. We will see.
 
Raoul said:
I don't know anyone who actually likes Harris other than establishment media types. She comes across as a female version of Booker to me.
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I know an old white male in charge of a hospital who is a fan of Harris, thinks she might make a good candidate in 2020.
 
Red Dreams said:


Just listen to this man.

No one else has the experience, the focus and drive of wanting to change American lives for the better.

It would be a privilege to vote for Bernie Sanders in 2020.
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This is why I think polling at the moment is a bit pointless(Although somewhat interesting)when the primaries come along Bernie will be leading the discussion and everyone will be playing catch up. In a similar way to how the both labour leadership contest went, but possibly even more so more as Bernie is by far a better communicator than Corbyn(Although policy wise Corbyn and the labour party are far better)
 
Bernie should be a VP candidate for someone - not sure who that someone is, but that gives people who call him a socialist an option to look at him as someone who's authority can be overridden by the president.
It also gives him a bit of power to influence a lot of the policies and sort of be an alternate power center around the president.
 
Sweet Square said:
This is why I think polling at the moment is a bit pointless(Although somewhat interesting)when the primaries come along Bernie will be leading the discussion and everyone will be playing catch up. In a similar way to how the both labour leadership contest went, but possibly even more so more as Bernie is by far a better communicator than Corbyn(Although policy wise Corbyn and the labour party are far better)
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What do you prefer about Corbyn's policies?
 
Red Dreams said:


Just listen to this man.

No one else has the experience, the focus and drive of wanting to change American lives for the better.

It would be a privilege to vote for Bernie Sanders in 2020.
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It was a privilege to vote for him in 2016!
 
Charlie Foley said:
What do you prefer about Corbyn's policies?
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Just off the top of my head

.Labour alternative models of ownership/Preston model

.Nationalisations and democratisation of national utilities.

.Corbyn view on foreign policy

.Corbyn team view on British state(They tend not to trust it)

And potentially

.Basic Income

.Worker Democracy

.Shorter Working Week

Basically Corbyn polices offer more of fundamental change and are just more socialist.
 
Raoul said:
I see Bernie promoting the public funding of elections from time to time. Are there any other prominent candidates who support that ?
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Honestly I have not heard any other prominent politician say that. Or I don't know of others.

Several of course have mentioned not taking PAC money.

Citizen United is the problem.

It was interesting to hear Bernie not really answer the question about increasing Supreme Court seats as a solution to addressing gerrymandering and other injustices continued by a Right wing court.
 
Red Dreams said:
Honestly I have not heard any other prominent politician say that. Or I don't know of others.

Several of course have mentioned not taking PAC money.

Citizen United is the problem.

It was interesting to hear Bernie not really answer the question about increasing Supreme Court seats as a solution to addressing gerrymandering and other injustices continued by a Right wing court.
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That's what I thought. The public funding of elections is a very socialist policy to promote which is why ordinary Dems wouldn't be interested, and certainly all the GOP would rebel. If someone like Warren would promote it then it would have a bit more credibility.
 
Raoul said:
That's what I thought. The public funding of elections is a very socialist policy to promote which is why ordinary Dems wouldn't be interested, and certainly all the GOP would rebel. If someone like Warren would promote it then it would have a bit more credibility.
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Socialism is no longer a dirty word.
Capitalism is though.
The point is to do what is right for the vast majority.
What people want is a representative that represents their interests, not that of corporations.

There is a huge vacuum that is available to be filled by the Democrats.

They need to simply have the courage and will to run on policies that benefit people.

EDIT:

You implement policies that benefit the majority by gaining power.
 
Red Dreams said:
Socialism is no longer a dirty word.
Capitalism is though.
The point is to do what is right for the vast majority.
What people want is a representative that represents their interests, not that of corporations.

There is a huge vacuum that is available to be filled by the Democrats.

They need to simply have the courage and will to run on policies that benefit people.
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They're both dirty words depending one which side of the fence your politics falls. People generally don't debate the quality of ideas, they instead vote for people they like or against people they dislike.
 
Raoul said:
They're both dirty words depending one which side of the fence your politics falls. People generally don't debate the quality of ideas, they instead vote for people they like or against people they dislike.
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The point is far more people especially younger people consider Capitalism as harmful.
People gravitate to people based on ideas and policies.

Everything Bernie supports benefits the majority.

Everything Republicans support harms the majority. But people are misled by plain lies.
 
Red Dreams said:
The point is far more people especially younger people consider Capitalism as harmful.
People gravitate to people based on ideas and policies.

Everything Bernie supports benefits the majority.

Everything Republicans support harms the majority. But people are misled by plain lies.
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The Capitalism v Socilaism debate is a bit of a red herring that each side use to attempt to vilify the other. Even Sanders is a capitalist to the extent that he is pro market driven economics that are regulated to protect against imbalances that favor only the wealthy. That is still a version of capitalism. Most Republicans are also not dumb enough to do away with social security and Medicare, which would mean they are amenable to various social safety net policies that the public rely on. So at the end of the day it’s not a simplistic debate about the words capitalism or socialism, but rather the extent to which both concepts are appropriately balanced to create a healthier society.
 
Raoul said:
The Capitalism v Socilaism debate is a bit of a red herring that each side use to attempt to vilify the other. Even Sanders is a capitalist to the extent that he is pro market driven economics that are regulated to protect against imbalances that favor only the wealthy. That is still a version of capitalism. Most Republicans are also not dumb enough to do away with social security and Medicare, which would mean they are amenable to various social safety net policies that the public rely on. So at the end of the day it’s not about the capitalism v socialism, but rather the extend to which both concepts are balanced to create a healthier society
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Socialists are not Communists.

That is a fact. They believe in regulations that benefit the vast majority.

Republicans Do want to do away with Social Security and Medicare. They are just dishonest about what they want to do.

Bernie himself said it on the Senate floor. The Republicans will use the phrase "To save Social Security" then they will put forward policies that actually cuts Social Security. Republicans are brain dead libertarians.
You judge people by what they do, not by what they say.

So which party has put forward policies that would help 'create a healthier society?'

The Democrats of course need to walk the talk. Social Security, health Care, Education, Housing can all be solved by simply reallocating resources. We don't need to blow up the national debt, which the Republicans have done to great harm to the least protected.
 
Sanders is the only candidate that is worthy of being President in 2020.

For him to govern effectively the Dems this November need to win and hold every Republican who enabled the criminal and traitor accountable in what he has done.

This will soften the ground for a full sweep in 2020 for the Democrats.
 
Red Dreams said:
Socialists are not Communists.

That is a fact. They believe in regulations that benefit the vast majority.

Republicans Do want to do away with Social Security and Medicare. They are just dishonest about what they want to do.

Bernie himself said it on the Senate floor. The Republicans will use the phrase "To save Social Security" then they will put forward policies that actually cuts Social Security. Republicans are brain dead libertarians.
You judge people by what they do, not by what they say.

So which party has put forward policies that would help 'create a healthier society?'

The Democrats of course need to walk the talk. Social Security, health Care, Education, Housing can all be solved by simply reallocating resources. We don't need to blow up the national debt, which the Republicans have done to great harm to the least protected.
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The point is that a vast majority of people throwing around both terms don't understand what they mean. We are talking about introducing limited social democratic concepts into a market driven, capitalist economy. Sanders is smart enough to know that he would be laughed all the way to Pyongyang if he proposed removing all facets of capitalism in favor of across the board state control.
 
Raoul said:
The point is that a vast majority of people throwing around both terms don't understand what they mean. We are talking about introducing limited social democratic concepts into a market driven, capitalist economy. Sanders is smart enough to know that he would be laughed all the way to Pyongyang if he proposed removing all facets of capitalism in favor of across the board state control.
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He is not proposing getting rid of anything. He is simply advocating serious reformation of existing programs. And he has not proposed any nationalizing of anything.

If there was any question he is running in 2 years....




Direct attacks on Trump.
 
Red Dreams said:
His emphasis on Climate Change is not just political talk.

He is speaking with great belief and urgency.

People should listen and act now.
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Most Dem candidates would take action on climate change, in fact the Paris withdrawal is set to take place days after the new POTUS takes office so any Dem can undo it.
 
Eboue said:
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Corporate Dems.

Socialist Dems all the way. The USA is already a 4 party country, it just only recognises two plus the independents when in fact you have your Republicans, Independents your centrist Democrats and your left wing socialist Dems.

Do you think if the voting lines were redrawn fairly and gerrymandering was stopped AND the electoral college issues were fixed, that then you would see the Dems split and other parties being formed?

I think the two main parties often are at complete opposites within their own parties at times and the only reason they don't split is because of fear of losing elections for decades until the new parties gained enough support.
 
langster said:
Do you think if the voting lines were redrawn fairly and gerrymandering was stopped AND the electoral college issues were fixed, that then you would see the Dems split and other parties being formed?
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Its the winner takes it all thing that causes the two parties. Change the electoral system from majorz to proporz and you get a whole different party spectrum and as a result a whole different decision making process.
 
It's just so like the democratic party if they can't agree on a path after a full 4 years after 2016 with the unity tour between Perez and Ellison etc just to face 2020 with the Sanders wing blaming Clinton and the corporate wing and the establishment idiots blaming Trump,Russia and everyone else.
 
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