If the Glazers are super patient and Jim is old, does this minority deal make any sense for him?
Club Sale | It’s done!
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) and Jamie (@Vault Dweller) are here to talk about United's dreadful home defeat at the hands of Big Ange's Tottenham Hotspur. Should this have been the end of Ten Hag? How long does he actually have left? And does Nik finally want ETH out?!
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The only way it makes sense for him is signing a deal for minority stake now whilst guaranteeing he buys the rest off of them in a few years or something. There is no point in buying a minority stake and then he might buy more from them in the future if the Glazers want to sell, he'd be stupid to do that with a bunch of rats like the Glazers.
I’ve been thinking about that as well. If this is a passion project for him as has often been said is his reasoning, then surely the appeal of it is getting it now so he can get some joy out of it in the now. He’s already 70+ (I think) and there’s no telling what can happen in a few years, so I can’t see how finally being able to be the owner in a few years would really appeal to him.
I think he's just trying to save face at this point.
2 years ago fans would be wetting themselves at the prospect of Ratcliffe getting hold of 25% of the club with a view to eventually owning the whole lot. But now that the prospect of cheat code oil money had been dangled in front of them he is suddenly the enemy. I don't even mind which of the bids gets the club as long as one of them does. We just cannot go on as we are. Something has to change.
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Part of his 'i tried' routine, like with Chelsea?
He already knew there's fan objection to part ownership with his earlier bid, makes no sense to inflame the fans more by leaking this worser deal.
The blase 'not ideal' should be our primary focus and the epicentre of all dissent. There are no guarantees with state ownership except state ownership.
In short, human rights (including those of others) are not of less importance than the trials and tribulations of an entitled football franchise and its fanbase, however vulnerable. If this is unacceptable then 'state ownership' is very much ideal, indeed.
In my opinion, Radcliffe has come to the conclusion/realisation that Glazers have zero intention of a full sale. (Well, Joel & Avram anyway)
Id say thats why he adjusted his bid to 50%, it doesnt make any sense to go from an aim of a 100% purchase, to 50% ... unless he knew for sure now a 100% bid was a waste of time. But then theres the whole thing about if the two last parasites stayed, they would still hold sway on control over the board/club decisions. If this was the case he shouldnt touch the deal, the whole thing would be pointless and just giving them more money.
These new reports thats he's planning on possibly going for a minority share, it just doesnt make sense to me. Glazers would essentially still be in complete control. It seems like Radcliffe just wants a piece of the pie at this stage. Because if he does that aiming to take full control at some point, he could be in for a shock in trying to move them on/ buy them out. God knows how long they would stay. Especially with the reports of what they think the club will be worth in 10 years.
I said at the first announcement, Ill believe them leaving when its official. They will drag everyone along for a ride with no outcome. They are simply just too greedy. Only thing thing that matters to them is £££
Id say thats why he adjusted his bid to 50%, it doesnt make any sense to go from an aim of a 100% purchase, to 50% ... unless he knew for sure now a 100% bid was a waste of time. But then theres the whole thing about if the two last parasites stayed, they would still hold sway on control over the board/club decisions. If this was the case he shouldnt touch the deal, the whole thing would be pointless and just giving them more money.
These new reports thats he's planning on possibly going for a minority share, it just doesnt make sense to me. Glazers would essentially still be in complete control. It seems like Radcliffe just wants a piece of the pie at this stage. Because if he does that aiming to take full control at some point, he could be in for a shock in trying to move them on/ buy them out. God knows how long they would stay. Especially with the reports of what they think the club will be worth in 10 years.
I said at the first announcement, Ill believe them leaving when its official. They will drag everyone along for a ride with no outcome. They are simply just too greedy. Only thing thing that matters to them is £££
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The poster is incorrect, the sky report clearly states ratcliffe's latest offer is for 25% of entire club and he intends to buy chunks of both glazer and listed shares to make up that 25% for a total cost of 1.5 bn. Which would value their shares at 70% of it not the 6bn for just their 69%.
Complete nonsense.
2 years ago we had 2 years more to sort the mess, City didn't have a treble and look like winning the league in at least 3 out 5 seasons if nothing crazy happens (that's optimistic) and Newcastle weren't Saudi owned.
We're quickly sinking down the pecking order in the PL and could easily be mid-table if the current trajectory continues.
This pathetic mentality in the UK that if you're meeting some minimum existence is pervasive in United and the country as a whole. If we can get the necessary injection of capital, ambition and most importantly competence in the club, why would we forego that for the ego-driven agenda of a Brexit Boomer who will be gone in 15 years tops, by which time City might already have more PL titles than us and be getting close to our league total.
Its game over and we will be stuck with the double Glazers backed by Jim'll Brexit.
The media is now doubling down on that the fans are deluded and entitled and we are to be laughed at for hoping the Qataris would save us.
Looking forward to seeing where the Qataris now move their interests too.
The media is now doubling down on that the fans are deluded and entitled and we are to be laughed at for hoping the Qataris would save us.
Looking forward to seeing where the Qataris now move their interests too.
So because City have won the treble we have no choice but to pray that we get our own injection of oil money? Personally I couldn't care less what City win because its completely false. It might as well be West Brom winning the CL. The idea that Qatari money will solve all our problems is mad considering the mess they've made of PSG. And even with Qatar we would still have to catch up with City, Chelsea and Newcastle who have even more money and a head start.
Liverpool have managed to push City for years with modest spending. Our problem isn't money its ineptitude. I just want competent owners who will run the club well. Whether that's Ratcliffe or Jassim I don't know.
Keegan about to go live and take questions
I would luv it if we beat them luv it
The Sheikh has to up his offer. I think it has to exceed £6b to get this over the line.
Yes but 1 billion dollar question, would you take that $1 billion now, knowing the club is in crisis or would you wait for Knight in shining armour (Jimmy Ratcliffe) to bail you out and hopefully make United great again, his recent track record at other clubs probably doesn’t fill Bryan, Kevin, Edward and Darcy with that much confidence?)
One thing that I keep thinking about is how the line of “he doesn’t want to overpay” gets thrown out for Jassim. I get that but he’s at the point now where surely he’s just come too far to get embarrassed by losing the deal over a relatively small amount for a state.
I think surely he just pays and gets it done.
I think surely he just pays and gets it done.
If Jim was to actually go through with this and the Glazers accepted, would Jim and INEOS actually be able legally get them to invest the money into the club? Or could the Glazers say they're just selling their own shares, so they have no obligation to spend or invest the money into the club? Could Jim actually, legally, force them to invest that £1.5bn against their will?
How does it do that?
It just means the uncertainty continues for a few more years, at least.
Keegan confirmed the current Qatar bid is 5.5 Billion
Thats my feeling too, if this genuinely was his final offer and he knows the Glazers won't accept, then he wouldn't be sticking around.
He's withdraw on his terms rather than be rejected by the Glazers, plus history has shown that when Jim ups his bid, SJ does the same in return. Didn't he submit his final take it or leave it offer then up it a short while later anyway?
????????????????
Has he said anything about whether that was is final bid, in the grand scheme of things, losing out on United for the sake of £500m seems a bit stupid to be fair doesn't it?
The problem he has is the bid cannot be caught being a state actor, or it being an outright state bid.
So, if he increases his offer there's an opportunity Ineos increase their minority investment stake and Qatar have to raise it again, whilst concealing their true identity. They have to be coy in order to evade the proper scrutiny.
I think they'll raise the bid, alright, but not by any gargantuan amount.
They’ll need to reach the 6 Billion mark to see this through imo, otherwise the Glazers will take the rats minority offer, pocket the money and it’s business as usual for them and the club continues to go down the toilet.
I can’t listen anymore I’m afraid but it’s being recorded so you’ll be able to go back and listen.
Keegan knows jack shit about the actual details of the deal I doubt any of the Journalists know that .
He’s always had a good line on Qatar.
With debt or without? With infrastructure spending included? Just for the Glazer owned shares or the entire club?
Your right in your assumption that INEOS are valuing the club now higher than SJ at 25% of £6bn at £1.5bn, however it also states that his bid would only be obliged to buy the same 25% of the Class A shares as well which at most is 12.5 million at maybe £300-350m. If and none actually knows he has offered a substantially less enterprise offer per share than SJ/92 foundation there will be legal battles to the Glazers and INEOS by the Major Hedgefunds in the US court.
This is why SJ/92 foundation are currently not moving, they believe that this has forced the Glazers hands, so let’s assume the Raine Group announce that INEoS are there preferred option with a 25% minority and the process starts, two weeks further in that timeline, both the Glazers and INEOS are served by the US judicial court that they are both being sued buy some pretty big heavyweights like Lindsell Train LTD, Ariel investments, eminence capital etc.
Why would these minorities agree to only 1/4 of their shares being sold at 30-40% less than all 100% being sold at an optimum of $36-38. There is a reason right now the share price is under $19, if SJ provides a 6th bid even if it’s only £250m more so let’s say £5.5/5.6 billion the share price will shoot up to $26-27.
Now would it surprise me INEOS actually wining?
No it would not but that initial victory would not necessarily mean they won the war, pretty sure that at the eleventh hour SJ would bid again and in all honesty that’s what Raine and the Glazers actually want.
It doesn’t , it’s a desperate last play from a man that knows he’s losing !
My take
Ratcliffe is being used as a pawn to force a much improved bid from Qatar
Ratcliffe is being used as a pawn to force a much improved bid from Qatar
To be fair he hasn’t an iota what the bid is.
You say much improved but it’s only like £500 million. Relatively small amount to a nation state.
How I see it pan out:
- Ratcliffe minority stake. Allows Glazers to get by for another 5 years minimum if there is no on field success, to a maximum of 10 years if some form of success comes through or even genuine potential.
- Eventually, Glazers get fed up primarily due to them not being able to sustain the club without further private equity funding, the situation we have now.
- Leads to Ratcliffe full takeover.
You are looking at a timeline of between 5-10 years for this.
- Ratcliffe minority stake. Allows Glazers to get by for another 5 years minimum if there is no on field success, to a maximum of 10 years if some form of success comes through or even genuine potential.
- Eventually, Glazers get fed up primarily due to them not being able to sustain the club without further private equity funding, the situation we have now.
- Leads to Ratcliffe full takeover.
You are looking at a timeline of between 5-10 years for this.
Don’t know what’s worse. This news about Jim ready to become a Glazer yes man puppet or our performances on the pitch.
What a mess of a club
Let's just say both together is a shitshow,maybe this will mean a few of Ratcliffe's supporters on here will see the light
But the report said they'd look to buy out within the next 3 years, potentially 2026.
Still, this would likely tie the Glazers down to a fixed price in the future would it not, which might mean INEOS get the club at a bargain? I really don't know
This is an entirely new take too.
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