Hes given 2 final bids and Ben Jacobs reckons he would go up if he has to. Its never take it or leave it really.
Club Sale | It’s done!
- Thread starter JB08
- Start date
-
In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
- Status
I don’t agree. There are genuine issues, particularly regarding infrastructure, that the review was seeking to address.
He likely will go up higher if needed i imagine. I can't see him giving up easily, and the fact he's silent at the moment speaks volumes. He has no reason address anything because, i imagine, in his mind, there is nothing of concern
Yes there are huge issues. The Glazers don't really give a shit about addressing them though.
Was written under the context that INEOS become minority owners. I think people that think there’s going to be some long term plan to buy the club are very naive. I didn’t see it when Ratcliffe went from full buyout of the Glazers shares to keeping the Glazers in, but I could somewhat understand those that believed it.
But now with him only wanting minority ownership and people still deluding themselves into thinking it’s part of a master plan to buy the club in the future the only thing that will snap those people into the reality of INEOS is when they see our players driving INEOS Grenadier’s. (The rip off the G Wagon) and see other INEOS stuff and logos plastered all over OT and our social media
Could one of you wizzos please explain the following: This all started with the much needed infrastructure re-build expenditure, particularly the OT revamp, which estimates suggested could be well over GBP 1bn. Money that neither the club nor the Glazers have . Then there was the absurdly inflated Chelsea deal which gave the Glazers the idea that if Chelsea could go for GBP2.5bn, what would Utd be worth in the current market? They arrived at a figure (in their estimation) of another inflated figure of GBP6bn. As with Chelsea they expected an auction whereby they got their figure if not more. As we know this didn't materialise and the two bids fell below their wild estimate. Anyhow, they still believe the club's value will increase exponentially over the short to medium term due mainly to TV revenues. Therefore, why sell now unless the offer is one of those "can't refuse" kinds? However, if they don't sell or accept the Ratcliffe minority stake offer, where is the money coming from for the infrastructure spend as well as the burgeoning debt issue? As far as I know only the Sheikh has offered to spend that kind of money on top of buying out the Glazers. I don't think Ratcliffe has said anything about infrastructure spend or paying down the debt. So how would it work?
Give us all one good reason why Jim and Ineos and would settle for only 25% of the club?
Desperation
I just have.
Desperate for what? To be a silent owner indefinitely?
You think Ineos want to put money in to this club, without guarantees they can get control? Tell me the benefit of doing that?
Last ditch attempt to sway the Glazers?
You think Jim is putting in 1.5bil just so the players can drive INEOS Grenadier’s?
How old are you, 12?
Flip it the other way. Why would the Glazers agree to a derivatives contract or a put and call option for a specific price if they expect the value of the club to increase? They would be stupid to do that.
Unless something drastic changes I think it’s no sale sadly. For at least the next year or two.
Thats the thing, if it was a no sale, why is SJ still hanging around? If the Glazers were intent on no sale, why would Raine even bother continuing discussions with both parties? Why wouldn't SJ and Jim just withdraw if the Glazers were absolutely adamant there was to be no sale? Surely SJ at the very least would want to withdraw with his dignity still intact rather than be rejected by the Glazers? Jim on the other hand, who knows
Like Ratcliffes mate said, possible fishing expedition.
Can’t see Ratcliffe getting any deal through that doesn’t buy all the Glazers B shares because he needs the approval of all 6 Glazers to buy shares from any of the and also to structure the purchase in such a way to protect the voting rights of the shares.
If they are completely split then he’s finished.
Qatar also has no reason to up their offer as they are not really bidding against Ratcliffe.
Hence the current deadlock
Fishing expedition for what? Two parties who have been here from the very beginning? What would they possibly be discussing, if we don't sell now, would you be interested in the future? It wouldn't take weeks or months to ask that question would it?
What would they be fishing for, and why would the Glazers continue to pay them for what they already know? All points to something happening behind the scenes that we don't know about in my opinion.
Yes I do. A car that few have heard about will suddenly get huge global exposure.
I also think he’s putting 1.5b into the club to promote all aspects of INEOS. From other sporting teams, to other products they may have. I think you’re pretty naive if you don’t realise the ripple affects it will have in his entire business.
I’ll explain it to you as if you’re 12. If Jim currently gets £1 in sponsorship for his racing team. Being associated with Man Utd could easily increase it to £3. The constant interaction between the brands and Man Utd will increase awareness of INEOS other sports and drive traffic.
Nothing showed up for me, thought I was missing some breaking news like Glazers had been called back to their own planet or something. Disappointing
Sway them do to what? 25% is useless without a pathway to future control.
My theory is that this is a way to avoid legal challengers that may be brought by minority owners of Class A shares....
https://www.express.co.uk/sport/foo...takeover-Sir-Jim-Ratcliffe-Sheikh-Jassim-news
The original article from Sky says...
That offer would entail making an offer at the same price for both sets of shares, with one suggestion on Monday evening being that Sir Jim could seek a roughly 25% stake in the club as part of his latest proposal.
Remember, Glazers only own 69% of the club. The rest is owned by institutional investors or on the NYSE.
If Jim buys some Glazers stock for a set price equal to the Qatar bid, then buys the stock owned by the institutional investors that were threatening legal acton, it opens the pathway for him to buy more Glazer class B stock - likely those owned by the 4 siblings who want out.
It is understood that if you buy the class B stock, you have to offord the offer to the class A shareholders. Jim may only need to buy one class B share to trigger this offer.
You already know the answer. They probably wanted to see how much they could get. They all have different ideas about what we’re currently worth.
Its quite clever not to leak and stay silent. This way you will see who blinks.
This is kind of dumb mate.
1.5bil doesnt give you sponsorship rights.
If you want that, you become the shirt sponsor for 60mil a year, like Snapdragon just did.
It could be a good sign though. It sort of smacks of desperation, which could mean the sales rumours to Qatar in November have some credence behind them.
Class A shares seem to be the stumbling block. They can’t buy off one or two big names because the law protects them all. I’m guessing he’s willing to buy some class A shares now because he can’t get 25 percent out of Glazers alone.
For me it looks as if he has given up and is buying stock for either an investment now or to give himself some kind of footing when the club is in the market again in 5/10 years. All this master plan bullshit when he had already had 3 bids rejected because they were either shit or actually not lawful is simply nonsense
So he'd essentially be buying 12.5% of the Glazers Class B shares and 12.5% of the Class A shares. The Class B Glazer shares at an equal amount across the 6 siblings (according to reports), meaning that each sibling would likely sell 2.08% of their shares... not really much when you think of it, and not exactly providing those who want out with any serious amount of cash. Makes no sense to them to sell at all really does it?
Plus then he'd have to offer the same price as SJ to the Class A shareholders too... and i imagine he'll only be buying from the larger shareholders, or even the Glazers Class A shares themselves, leaving the minority shareholderts at a disadvantage. It's all a bit messy if you ask me.
But what would be the point in leaving the current bidders in limbo? Raine, on behalf of the Glazers could say offer £6bn and it's yours. We're not accepting your offer, you can leave it there as long as you like, it's not going to be accepted. At that point, SJ and Jim would either need to re-evaluate their bids or pull out. Jim seems to have gone public to a degree with what he plans on doing, quite possibly to judge the reaction of such a move perhaps?
SJ has stayed silent throughout, we don't know anything from their side and when asked all they say in the bid is on the table. That seems to be the company line at the moment. It'd be foolish to think that theres not something going on in the background
Ratcliffe has a number of issues to overcome to be fair. Think you’re about right though. Although I don’t believe it will take 5 years. The Glazers I don’t think can hang on without investment for that long.
Sir Jim, buying the club on the knock. £5 a week for X weeks.
The impetus isn’t on the Glazers here though. They set an asking price and nobody has met it.
Where does is say he is buying 12.5% of each share class?
For all we know, he could buy a tiny number of class B, thus triggering the offer of class A shares.
Lets say he matches the Qatar offer of on a per share basis for a big chunk of the class A shares. He then goes back and makes a lesser offer for the class B shares owned by the 4 Glazers that want out. Why a lesser offer? Because that is the condition he wants to leave the other 2 Glazers are shareholders. The Jassim bid is stuck because they will only settle for 100%.
That happened by itself. Honest.
It was a bit tongue in cheek but I wouldn't be surprised if we don't qualify for the CL again during that timeframe
I find this interesting. Keegan claimed that Jassim was now at 5.5 billion which is an increase on the last “known” bid. It’s in with what this Lowesfest guy was saying a few days ago on Twitter
The global car industry is worth 2.86 trillion $
The global chemical industry is worth 5.7 trillion $
INEOS are also in Cycling, Sailing, Formula 1
$1.2b = $60m per year over 20 years, but the benefits doesn’t end after 20 years. They can sell their shares for a profit, break even, or loss at anytime. But unlike Snapdragon it’s very unlikely that their investment is gone.
When you think with a business brain. What makes more financial sense.
Arguably because the asking price is too high?
And investment to buy shares in the club is completely separate to sponsorship.
You think the club will forgo future sponsorship revenue, just because Jim happens to own a stake?
Look at all the investors in United that are not named Glazer...
| Lindsell Train Ltd. | 20.85% | 11,018,676 |
| Ariel Investments LLC | 16.00% | 8,454,466 |
| Massachusetts Financial Services ... | 6.49% | 3,428,274 |
| Marathon Asset Management Ltd. | 4.47% | 2,362,700 |
| Millennium Management LLC | 2.85% | 1,505,762 |
| Harvey Partners LLC | 2.66% | 1,405,000 |
| Antara Capital LP | 2.41% | 1,276,000 |
| Alyeska Investment Group LP | 2.35% | 1,244,157 |
| Senvest Management LLC | 2.25% | 1,186,663 |
| Pinnacle Associates Ltd. | 2.11% | 1,114,129 |
Do we see any of their names listed as our official sponsorship partners?
That’s their prerogative though. They’re obviously not all that keen to sell.
Feck me. You’re out here calling people dumb and 12 year old etc and you’re not aware of the difference between class a and class b shares or can’t even figure that if your own research painted the full picture it would mean the Glazers didn’t own United!
Last edited:
- Status