Frenkie de Jong | The last muppeting lap

Frenkie to United?

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golden_blunder said:
IF the holdup is the money owed why do you think Barca aren’t paying it? Or does he really not want to go?
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I don't think he wants to go but I do think he will if Barca pays him the money. Even if he is well liked in Barcelona it will be tough to stay since he will be aware of that he is blocking the way for a financially easier rebuild of the team. My best guess is that Barca aren't paying it because they need every penny and I think they are hoping that United is desperate for some kind of talisman signing and that United will pay the whole or a part of the money they owe. However I do think it is very very likely De Jong leaves and if United doesn't act in time it could be to another club.

The reason for why I don't think Frenkie wants to leave is that Barca will have a great starting eleven this year and Barcas only problem is lack of depth in midfield and somewhat in the defense line. The attacking line is off the charts with Lewandowski, Dembélé, Ansu Fati, Ferran Torres, Raphinha, Aubameyang and Depay. It is crazy having Aubemeyang and Depay risking being the sixth and seventh alternative for a starting place but that is how good the offense looks like. De Jong knows he could play a vital role in a team that can compete for every title and it is clear that it will be a blow for Barca if he leaves, but we are in a position were we have to gamble with the squad depth. Since I'm a huge Bielsa/Guardiola-fan I'm sure Tenhag is going to do wonders with United this year but the squad isn't good enough (yet) and De Jong surely sees that United can't compete for the title this year and playing in Europa League is not a plus either I suppose
 
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Summit said:
They aren't paying it imo because they don't owe it. When frankie signed a new contract with what he'd earn over the 4 years he fecked himself. Now his wage hits high notes and they want to sell, but frankie is obviously like hold on, I did this for you when I didn't have to and have lost out on x amount of euros. Barca being the fecks they are simply just probably saying you signed the contract.
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This to me is the one scenario that I can’t imagine is possible. For it to happen it would mean that no-one negotiating the contract said at any point ‘what if you get sold?’. Given that surely 90% of transfers involve a fee, (and thus by definition that the player moving was under contract), how do you envisage a scenario where the people negotiating such an enormous deal simply omitted to plan for that incredibly common outcome?

Not saying I know what the issue is but, the idea that a £50m contract would be renegotiated without an incredibly obvious and frequent scenario being thoroughly covered, just seems too unlikely to be true.
 
Plant0x84 said:
I know, but them putting pressure on us doesn’t make them want to pay any more. They need to pressure FDJ.
“If you don’t sign for Utd we’ll sell you to Chelsea instead” :D
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I think they are putting pressure on us. We upped the guaranteed money in the offer on the understanding they would use it to pay Frenkie but it looks like they plan to pocket it instead and then we offered to pay him ourselves but reduce the transfer fee and the next thing we heard was that was a non starter due to taxes and/or UEFA regulations. Their end game seems to be they want the full fee we agreed on and they want us to find another 17M down the back of Arnold's sofa to pay Frenkie for them and so to apply pressure they leak stories about Chelsea hoping we will panic as we can all see Boehly is running around Europe throwing money around and being gazumped on a number of his targets so clearly he has cash to burn.
 
why the fuk is life so hard for us to sign a top target when Munich can go start a talk and within a few days sort out a fee with Juve for deLigt?? 67m for him is a decent fee considering his age and experience

meanwhile we continue to age page after page of the same rhetoric....blah blah blah
 
Romano did tweet earlier that Barcelona and Chelsea are in direct contact today about Azpilicueta.

Sounds like it did 2 weeks ago, throw in De Jong for clicks.
 
NicolaSacco said:
This to me is the one scenario that I can’t imagine is possible. For it to happen it would mean that no-one negotiating the contract said at any point ‘what if you get sold?’. Given that surely 90% of transfers involve a fee, (and thus by definition that the player moving was under contract), how do you envisage a scenario where the people negotiating such an enormous deal simply omitted to plan for that incredibly common outcome?

Not saying I know what the issue is but, the idea that a £50m contract would be renegotiated without an incredibly obvious and frequent scenario being thoroughly covered, just seems too unlikely to be true.
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I hope it isn't the case at all, but in frankies mind when renegotiating he is at his dream club and he doesn't get sold unless he agrees. So by that he sees out his contract and gets his money, which is pretty much gonna happen reading between the lines
 
Can we offer Barca 100m, then pay up 50m first and tell them the other 50m will be deferred to the next transfer signing we buy from them?
 
Has there been anything else about this supposed Chelsea bid yet? I mean if it was real surely others would have gotten word of it? Romero and Romano for sure would have reported it by now.

Seems to me like it's another Barca scare tactic
 
bosskeano said:
why the fuk is life so hard for us to sign a top target when Munich can go start a talk and within a few days sort out a fee with Juve for deLigt?? 67m for him is a decent fee considering his age and experience

meanwhile we continue to age page after page of the same rhetoric....blah blah blah
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Im sure if United agreed to pay what he’s owed it would be done, but we can’t for tax and regulatory reasons. So, Barca and him are in a game of who blinks first
 
golden_blunder said:
Im sure if United agreed to pay what he’s owed it would be done, but we can’t for tax and regulatory reasons. So, Barca and him are in a game of who blinks first
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Also this forum would erupt if news comes out that we helped pay the salary of a player from another club and in turn "over paying" for another transfer.
 
bosskeano said:
why the fuk is life so hard for us to sign a top target when Munich can go start a talk and within a few days sort out a fee with Juve for deLigt?? 67m for him is a decent fee considering his age and experience

meanwhile we continue to age page after page of the same rhetoric....blah blah blah
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Because we're not winning prizes. We start winning prizes again and the best players will be flocking to us.
 
golden_blunder said:
Im sure if United agreed to pay what he’s owed it would be done, but we can’t for tax and regulatory reasons. So, Barca and him are in a game of who blinks first
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I imagine even including it in the transfer fee, so paying an extra £17m would be very risky as Barca would be under no obligation to pay it to de Jong. What would be stopping them pocketing the money and saying we value him at this price therefor that's how much we're taking.
 
golden_blunder said:
Im sure if United agreed to pay what he’s owed it would be done, but we can’t for tax and regulatory reasons. So, Barca and him are in a game of who blinks first
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true....probably right on that one.

They have enough finance guys though to figure out a way to make it beneficial for all parties. Don't know if this is possible but why not drop his price the money owed in back pay and have United pay it as a signing bonus? so if original agreement with 75m, pay Barca 58m and a signing bonus of 17m to Frenkie?
 
peridigm said:
Because we're not winning prizes. We start winning prizes again and the best players will be flocking to us.
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i get that and typically, even when struggling a bit, we can still lure guys due to the ability to make it worthwhile in wages but this certainly isn't the case with Frenkie
 
bosskeano said:
why the fuk is life so hard for us to sign a top target when Munich can go start a talk and within a few days sort out a fee with Juve for deLigt?? 67m for him is a decent fee considering his age and experience

meanwhile we continue to age page after page of the same rhetoric....blah blah blah
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You can't compare the way Juve are run with the way Barca are run. Night and day.

The problem is Barcelona. As big a critic as I am of the board, I really can't blame them for this.
 
bosskeano said:
i get that and typically, even when struggling a bit, we can still lure guys due to the ability to make it worthwhile in wages but this certainly isn't the case with Frenkie
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I imagine when the wage issue is sorted there will be no problem with personal terms.

That's why i take this Relevo piece with a handful of salt... they say de Jong doesn't want to move to Manchester, for both personal and Sporting reasons, but he's never said that. He said he'd prefer to stay st Barca but that's it.

Seems like they're just putting stuff out for the fun of it now and everything is anti United. It's almost like they're trying to make United look like twats for chasing de Jong, even though Barca want to sell
 
marcus agrippa said:
You can't compare the way Juve are run with the way Barca are run. Night and day.

The problem is Barcelona. As big a critic as I am of the board, I really can't blame them for this.
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i think some of the stubbornness with our board has got to be ETH has said this is his absolute #1 target and they HAVE to get him
 
Brownie85 said:
I imagine when the wage issue is sorted there will be no problem with personal terms.

That's why i take this Relevo piece with a handful of salt... they say de Jong doesn't want to move to Manchester, for both personal and Sporting reasons, but he's never said that. He said he'd prefer to stay st Barca but that's it.

Seems like they're just putting stuff out for the fun of it now and everything is anti United. It's almost like they're trying to make United look like twats for chasing de Jong, even though Barca want to sell
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LaPorta is absolutely trying to make United look like prats in the media with his talking out of both sides of his arse....I'm sure Frenkie and his agents must be itching like fuk to say something publicly
 
bosskeano said:
i think some of the stubbornness with our board has got to be ETH has said this is his absolute #1 target and they HAVE to get him
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Yep, looks like ten Hag's top target. We've agreed a fee with Barcelona - I don't really see what else we can do.

We're just waiting around now for Barca and De Jong to resolve the deferred wages problem. That probably won't happen until late in the window.
 
Spanish source mentioning Chelsea but not a single British source even hinted at that.
 
I really don't believe the money owned theory.
Messi still has to take cash from them, but that didnt stop either of the parties to pack his things to Paris.
I cant believe EtH is acting like a donkey - just forget him already and consider someone else... He doesn't want to be at United. Period.
 
bosskeano said:
i think some of the stubbornness with our board has got to be ETH has said this is his absolute #1 target and they HAVE to get him
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Arnold pretty much said as much during that pub incident with the fans: they only go for whom the manager wants. Time will tell, but I'll trust ETH on this. Lines up with what Fergie used to say: he'd only sign players he feels are better than what he has. Evidently ETH sees the game in a very specific way that he only trusts FdJ to deliver it.
 
pratyush_utd said:
Spanish source mentioning Chelsea but not a single British source even hinted at that.
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Same thing happened the last time our name was thrown in. Gerard Romero mentioned Chelsea but no English sources.

Unless Ornstein or Matt Law say something you can basically discount it. They’re the first to know anything Chelsea related.
 
bosskeano said:
true....probably right on that one.

They have enough finance guys though to figure out a way to make it beneficial for all parties. Don't know if this is possible but why not drop his price the money owed in back pay and have United pay it as a signing bonus? so if original agreement with 75m, pay Barca 58m and a signing bonus of 17m to Frenkie?
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Apparently we’re not allowed to do that either
 
bosskeano said:
i get that and typically, even when struggling a bit, we can still lure guys due to the ability to make it worthwhile in wages but this certainly isn't the case with Frenkie
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The issue with FDJ is that Barca have fecked him and several other players with their deferred wages plan. This goes back to Messi even. Despite him loving that club, he held them to ransom over his wages. Granted, he won them a shit ton of trophies but he didn't do them any favors when it came to their wage structure. They still owe him money as well as Pique and probably others we've not heard about. FDJ just wants the wages that were promised to him in his contract. No harm in that. If it causes this deal to break down it's not our fault at all. That is between him and Barca. But, I get what you're saying. Our transfers do seem to have some form of stigma.

What other club have deferred player wages like Barca have and have sold players without paying those deferred wages prior to them leaving? How many clubs have forced players in their prime that they want to keep to renegotiate their contracts for a lower wage?
Barca are financially fecked right now. Despite all of their levers and selling their sole to the media giants, they are just kicking the can down the road. Didn't they also sell the naming rights to the stadium recently?

Besides all of that, what other players have we really struggled to sign? The Sancho deal took two years. Covid had a lot to do with this. Maguire went to the end of the window only because we were trying to get him for less. Can you blame the owners and board over trying to save a few million? Think about our other big name transfers over the past decade. Pogba was signed pretty quickly without much fuss. Varane was signed without much fuss. Even that prick ADM signed without much fuss. The bottom line is that this is a huge business and clicks equal money. Don't ask me how but it does. I'm sure the board are loving this situation right now. I think FDJ will leave Barca this window. My worry is whether another club will gazump us last minute. Not sure who that could be but I hope the relationship between ETH and FDJ is stronger than that and we get him.
 
bosskeano said:
why the fuk is life so hard for us to sign a top target when Munich can go start a talk and within a few days sort out a fee with Juve for deLigt?? 67m for him is a decent fee considering his age and experience

meanwhile we continue to age page after page of the same rhetoric....blah blah blah
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Don’t think it helps that we always look desperate… when someone looks desperate and are putting all there eggs in 1 basket then the other team can negotiate as much as they want no matter how much they need the money. This is where we’re going wrong we need to send out some reports linking us with other players to show Barca we have got other options but at the minute there’s nothing. I know it’s not the case at the minute though because they’ve accepted our offer, just them not paying de Jong that’s holding it up but we could of got him cheaper if we didn’t seem desperate.
 
Orc said:
Same thing happened the last time our name was thrown in. Gerard Romero mentioned Chelsea but no English sources.

Unless Ornstein or Matt Law say something you can basically discount it. They’re the first to know anything Chelsea related.
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It's the same re Ornstein for United related also. Stone is just a mouthpiece who seems to hate his job.

It's so hard to follow transfer sagas involving one of the two big clubs in Spain. Their journos are so far up their arses that they blatantly post whatever the club likes mixed in with some fan fiction paint their club in the best light possible (ex "Barca is the best", he only wants Barca" etc.) which makes it extremely hard to deduct what's reliable or not.
 
The Chelsea journo's have been reporting heavily on Kounde, nothing on De Jong yet...
 
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