Yaya Touré: "I want to destroy the Pep myth" (France Football interview)

spiriticon said:
Very few racists make that distinction though. If you hate a very specific subset of people within a race, its less to do with general racism and more likely that there is a very personal or familial bad history there.
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Well that isn't true.
Black Africans have suffered quite a lot of racism directed specifically towards them, its actually a serious issue. Not all of the perpetrators are white too.

Similarly ask a Polish person living in London if they experience racism differently from a white English person.
 
Random Task said:
Not sure exactly what you are implying here. Are implying that Barca, specifically the owners, are racists?
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:D

Heh, there's around, what, 150/200,000 owners? Some of them probably are racist
 
Cassidy said:
Well that isn't true.
Black Africans have suffered quite a lot of racism directed specifically towards them, its actually a serious issue. Not all of the perpetrators are white too.

Similarly ask a Polish person living in London if they experience racism differently from a white English person.
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I think we've got to be very careful with race and country here. We can't just generalise all sorts of discrimination under racism. It's a far too common word to be bandied about these days.
 
A few people have mentioned they're surprised people laughing this off.
We do await the "proof" Toure will bring, but he has made himself a bit of a farce with his sheer mercenary ways and the nonsense with the cake.
Doesn't mean he hasn't been subject to something, but hard to believe that.

Has Pep had any allegations before?
Toure has been finished at the top level for ages, so it's not like he's the 5-6 years ago version being left out.
 
spiriticon said:
I think we've got to be very careful with race and country here. We can't just generalise all sorts of discrimination under racism. It's a far too common word to be bandied about these days.
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Like I said there are many races within black, anyway getting away from the point.
As for it being far too common a word, thats probably because racism is very common.
 
spiriticon said:
I think we've got to be very careful with race and country here. We can't just generalise all sorts of discrimination under racism. It's a far too common word to be bandied about these days.
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Very much agreed. So evident on this forum too.
 
Cassidy said:
Like I said there are many races within black
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There are also many different countries, even cities in Africa that someone might have a dislike for. When hatred gets that specific, I personally feel uncomfortable with the use of the word 'racism'.

Anyways, we've kinda gone a little off topic =/
 
Kind of wish this was from someone with a bit more credibility than Yaya Toure. You could see this coming a long way off given that Toure moans and basically throws the race/agenda card at anyone who doesn't make him the centre of attention.

He just isn't a Pep type of player, even when he was at his best. Doesn't work hard enough throughout a game and needs a rest every time he sprints for more than 3 seconds. He'd stick out like a sore thumb in a Pep team and probably hinder them a lot.
 
There's posts in this thread that wouldn't have looked out of place in the RAWK thread attacking Evra. Rivalry, perception and assumption turns people into cretins it seems. I got 3 pages in and thought "Feck this..."

Whatever happened to "Let's wait and see what comes out of this"? Everybody so quick to discount it and take the micky....

That's all I wanted to say, don't quote me as I probably won't reply until there's something to actually comment on.
 
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spiriticon said:
I think we've got to be very careful with race and country here. We can't just generalise all sorts of discrimination under racism. It's a far too common word to be bandied about these days.
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Racism is more complicated than just prejudice against people on the basis of colour. Belonging to a race isn't a natural thing, it is a social thing - a category that you are put in by people. Those racial categories are variable and change over time. Sometimes they correspond to national boundaries, sometimes not. If racial categories can't correspond to national boundaries then how could you account for the history of anti-Irish racism?
 
Yaya's not exactly been the most reliable voice in recent years and has often seemed like he's on the verge of losing it, but obviously shouldn't ridicule such accusations either until they're investigated/discussed thoroughly. I suspect most of Toure's issues with Pep are just personal though.
 
witchtrials said:
Racism is more complicated than just prejudice against people on the basis of colour. Belonging to a race isn't a natural thing, it is a social thing - a category that you are put in by people. Those racial categories are variable and change over time. Sometimes they correspond to national boundaries, sometimes not. If racial categories can't correspond to national boundaries then how could you account for the history of anti-Irish racism?
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Very true. Sometimes racist might not always be the correct word in the tradition sense in that xenophobic or another term may apply better, but when someone uses the word racist I think we all have a general idea as to the broad scope it can entail, and discussing the minute details as to whether it should apply or not seems a bit beside the point.

Plus racism/xenophobia is inherently a weird/illogical thing anyway, and so discussions as to why Pep would hate Africans but not English-born players with a foreign backwards again also seems a bit beside the point. Even though I'm sceptical as to the claims myself.
 
witchtrials said:
I don't understand what weird point you're trying to make here so let me try and get it straight: that it's not possible to be have stereotypes about black Africans because white people also live in Africa?
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It's always possible to.. People will always do it in whatever way it suits their agenda.
If a person says African is should mean African, not black people.
 
afrocentricity said:
There's posts in this thread that wouldn't have looked out of place in the RAWK thread attacking Evra. Rivalry, perception and assumption turns people into cretins it seems. I got 3 pages in and thought "Feck this..."

Whatever happened to "Let's wait and see what comes out of this"? Everybody so quick to discount it and take the micky....

That's all I wanted to say, don't quote me as I probably won't reply until there's something to actually comment on.
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Well said, these threads drive me mad.
 
witchtrials said:
Racism is more complicated than just prejudice against people on the basis of colour. Belonging to a race isn't a natural thing, it is a a social thing - a category that you are put in by people. Those racial categories are variable and change over time. Sometimes they correspond to national boundaries, sometimes not. If racial categories can't correspond to national boundaries then how could you account for the history of anti-Irish racism?
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Sure I agree. And that's the dangerous part since when you're accusing someone of it, it's the generalised connotation of it that's damaging to a person's integrity.

When someone says: 'That man's a racist!", you don't immediately think 'Which region and country? Where are the boundaries of his racism?' You assume he hates all of the race.

So again, when we accuse someone of racism against blacks, we have to be sure he doesn't just hate a few black people from a city in Africa.

Anyway, last word on this =/
 
spiriticon said:
Sure I agree. And that's the dangerous part since when you're accusing someone of it, it's the generalised connotation of it that's damaging to a person's integrity.

When someone says: 'That man's a racist!", you don't immediately think 'Which region and country? Where are the boundaries of his racism?' You assume he hates all of the race.

So again, when we accuse someone of racism against blacks, we have to be sure he just doesn't hate a few black people from a city in Africa.

Anyway, last word on this =/
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He accused him of racism (or having an issue) against Africans, in fact i think he was specific to say non naturalised africans.

Also all of the race isn't all black people as I have already pointed out.
 
RedRover said:
Why is he smug?

Like all top managers I suspect he just doesn’t suffer fools who either won’t, or can’t fit into his system. Those he doesn’t need are discarded. Nothing wrong with that.
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So eto, ibra and yaya are fools? I mean yaya and his agent say foolish things but hes still a beast on the pitch, and has won city many points this year despite his limited appearances, and contributed to citys record beating season. Fergie would have found a way to deal with those egos.
 
Is Yaya saying Pep doesn't like black people ? Or is he saying Pep doesn't like people from the African continent. One is a location the other is a race. Pep signs black players all the time and speaks nothing of praise for the likes of sterling. So there's no preference for players due to race

If it's that pep doesn't like Toure because he was born in Africa then that hasn't anything to do with race. Its like calling someone racists because they don't like North American players. Having preference or lack thereof for a player because of the country or region they are from is nothing new and not racist.
 
Fluctuation0161 said:
Players can learn and adapt to new styles. Irrespective of where they developed as children.

But taking your concept further- if people think that way outside of football too then it highlights a greater prejudice.
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One would expect players to adapt to new styles but that's in theory.. A top manager like Pep is more focused on delivering results than seeing an individual as a project.
 
KikiDaKats said:
One would expect players to adapt to new styles but that's in theory.. A top manager like Pep is more focused on delivering results than seeing an individual as a project.
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That doesn't sound like the story Pep fans push, isn't developing talents supposed to be one of his strong points.
 
It reminds me of the Eto'o story. Just for that, it's hard for me to even think of respecting Pep... still think it's not institutional but targeted to specific players.
 
ChaddyP said:
Is Yaya saying Pep doesn't like black people ? Or is he saying Pep doesn't like people from the African continent.
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You only have to read his comments to answer this question - he is wondering aloud whether Guardiola has a problem with black Africans.

ChaddyP said:
One is a location the other is a race. Pep signs black players all the time and speaks nothing of praise for the likes of sterling. So there's no preference for players due to race

If it's that pep doesn't like Toure because he was born in Africa then that hasn't anything to do with race.
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Not really, it's perfectly possible for someone for someone to be less racist against black people who they see as naturalised, and more racist towards black people who are from Africa. Which in fact is the very thing that Toure says about Guardiola. Rightly or wrongly.
 
Vialli_92 said:
This is going to be interesting
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Not as interesting as Yaya saying the reason he fell out with Pep was because he refused to do a line of bugle off of Messi’s arse, now that would be a ripping yarn.
 
mu4c_20le said:
So eto, ibra and yaya are fools? I mean yaya and his agent say foolish things but hes still a beast on the pitch, and has won city many points this year despite his limited appearances, and contributed to citys record beating season. Fergie would have found a way to deal with those egos.
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Yeah he would have sold them.
 
Is this the second or third player to come our accusing Pep of racism? But let's all keep defending King Pep. I am wondering how many more are too scared to speak.
 
Can’t blame people if they are apprehensive about what comes out of Yaya’s mouth. He created his own baggage, which is unfortunate as there could actually be an issue here.
 
"Do you really think he could've been like that with Iniesta?"
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Well, Yaya, Iniesta isn't a dick and is arguably the greatest midfielder ever. You, on the other hand, are a dick, and a fat, lazy, drink-driving, scumbag too.

Zlatan got bombed out too. Meanwhile guys like Fernandinho, Walker and Jesus are all crucial players for Pep. Pathetic once again from this clown.
 
Seen some quotes. Basically the whole racist angle is something Touré suspects might be the reason for cnut's behaviour towards him, but there's nothing substantial that points to it. In fact Yaya mentions how cnut is smart enough that he'd never get caught being a racist even if he is
 
witchtrials said:
You only have to read his comments to answer this question - he is wondering aloud whether Guardiola has a problem with black Africans.
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So Toure thinks he has no problem with black jamaicans like sterling or black frenchmen like mendy but he has a racial bias towards black africans like him? . That sounds to me less like racism and more like a culture issue as thats the only difference between Toure and sterling they both are the exact same race but different cultures. If its right to give prefrence to someone over where they were born or their culture is a different debate but its not racism as your culture has nothing to do with your race.


witchtrials said:
Not really, it's perfectly possible for someone for someone to be less racist against black people who they see as naturalised, and more racist towards black people who are from Africa. Which in fact is the very thing that Toure says about Guardiola. Rightly or wrongly.
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i guess i just dont follow this logic. If i dont like people from Canada, but like sweeds , dutch , russians and *insert predominantly white country here* people am i just less racist againt whites that arent canadian? As far as i remember Race has to do with race. no matter where you are from. Maybe racism is just not the word that should be used.


EDIT: this is assumeing Toure is right and Pep doesnt like africans and has nothing to do with the fact that hes just shite
 
I know we're eating this up here in the CAF cause it makes Chity look bad, but racism is a serious accusation. Yaya is an bit of a thick bellend with colossal sense of entitlement so I take what he says with a grain of salt. And I dislike Guardiola. Guardiola benched him because he could no longer perform at the highest level. That's it. And Guardiola is not going to play with 5 African players anytime soon, because the current generation of African players is not as good as previous generations (including Toure's) and with his petrobudget he can buy whoever he bloody well wants.
 
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