It was a dull, tumescent final, in all honesty. No one who isn't Spanish will be watching that back in toto again.
WWC23 | England v Spain - Spain win the World Cup - and Rubiales gets sacked
- Thread starter jojojo
- Start date
Congratulations Spain! I was a Japan supporter (after a fairly tumescent Irish showing). Them’s the breaks…
On the penalty that Earps saved:
She did win the golden glove award.
One thing that made me smile about that one is that it's the Adidas award. Mary complained before the tournament that Nike weren't releasing goalkeeper shirts for any of their sponsored teams (including Mary's England shirt). She even asked if she could pay for a small batch of them to be produced (the way they do for photoshoots and for "match shirt" sales etc) and they turned her down flat
She did win the golden glove award.
One thing that made me smile about that one is that it's the Adidas award. Mary complained before the tournament that Nike weren't releasing goalkeeper shirts for any of their sponsored teams (including Mary's England shirt). She even asked if she could pay for a small batch of them to be produced (the way they do for photoshoots and for "match shirt" sales etc) and they turned her down flat
Hesistant to say it but I don't think she is fit enough, Adama Traore of the womens game, a couple of bursts and she is walking for the next 15 mins.
I'll be watching the final tonight, gloating for that shithousery you're talking about.
I've enjoyed the World Cup, and the style, although completely different from men's football, is very entertaining.
It reminds me a bit of children football, which I also like.
At least in Spain, where I think Madrid's emergence helped, the fans already know the names of the players and have a critical opinion as with the football and basketball sections.
It would be nice to have a women's version of the super league and more free-to-air games to create a fan base.
I'm happy for Vilda ,the coach, being able to win without the mutinies.
As has been said, the basis of the team is Barcelona, just like in 2010. If they become independent we will never win anything again
I've enjoyed the World Cup, and the style, although completely different from men's football, is very entertaining.
It reminds me a bit of children football, which I also like.
At least in Spain, where I think Madrid's emergence helped, the fans already know the names of the players and have a critical opinion as with the football and basketball sections.
It would be nice to have a women's version of the super league and more free-to-air games to create a fan base.
I'm happy for Vilda ,the coach, being able to win without the mutinies.
As has been said, the basis of the team is Barcelona, just like in 2010. If they become independent we will never win anything again
Watching today it looked like England weren’t fit enough as a whole
Removed. (Somehow activated 'post', despite having second thoughts.)
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Without the mutineers, you mean. Whatever the 'mutiny' that occurred stands for hasn't been erased.
I dunno I’ve always thought that the keeper is pretty fit
If the women want to be treated as equals they have to take the banter as well as the men do.
I'm happy for Ona - though I wish we had been able to keep her and it was hard being reminded of what we're losing.
Bonmati (unsurprisingly) won the Golden Ball for the tournament and really has to win the Balloon D'Or this year - she's just an exceptional player and so consistent for Barca and now again for Spain.
Paralluelo won the young player award - again no surprise. She's won everything this year with Barca and with Spain she's now won WWCs at the U17, U19 and first team level. A real talent.
That said - I hate that Vilda and the RFEF have anything to celebrate.
Bonmati (unsurprisingly) won the Golden Ball for the tournament and really has to win the Balloon D'Or this year - she's just an exceptional player and so consistent for Barca and now again for Spain.
Paralluelo won the young player award - again no surprise. She's won everything this year with Barca and with Spain she's now won WWCs at the U17, U19 and first team level. A real talent.
That said - I hate that Vilda and the RFEF have anything to celebrate.
So I've been reading into this and I feel like I must be missing something somewhere along the way.
From what I can tell the Spanish players were unhappy with his level of coaching and the general organisation/backing of RFEF. There was also some stuff about not treating players in the best way (hotel rooms not being allowed to be locked - which is weird but not sure it classes as anything more then just a strict manager?) but - unless I've missed something which I may well have done - he hasn't done anything too egregious.
Now the fact that they've won this tournament and I saw one of their players commending the federation and celebrating with Vilda - it would seem to be they've set things right?
So yeah, would be good to be educated on this because lots of people - especially on Twitter - seem very angry that a) he's won and b) Spanish players celebrated with him
Sad news
What awful news for her, especially after how well she had played to go from the heights of absolute joy to the depths of despair like that. Sad sad news
Sad that they lost but don’t think they played to their potential. Whether that was nerves, or Spanish play not allowing it? I thought Bronze had a poor game for most of it, Stanway too. Had we got a goal instead of the cross bar early on it may have settled the nerves and made the team play like in the semis.
Pleased we at least had a penalty save to cheer.
Hopefully this will further promote women’s/girls football. I think the lack of English dignitaries at the match was bad. For me the main difference between the men’s and women’s team is money. The game will be different between male and female but the effort put in, and the passion just the same.
A few players looked a bit nervy or overcooked, like Bronze, Stanway, Kelly and Russo. Toone didn’t really get into the game. Spain won first and foremost for me because of their aggressive and cohesive pressing, and their pass-and-move quality. Nothing new under the sun, that is. They also have some brilliant players (Bonmati, Hermosa, Caldentey, Batlle, Paralluelo, Carmona). For England, I’ve been most impressed by Mary Earps and Lauren Hemp. Had Hemp’s crossbar hit gone a little lower, we might have had another game, but then again, when Earps pulls a penalty save and a couple more stunners and it still isnmt enough, it reflects that Spain simply was better on the day and won deservedly. Still think England has had a very well tournament. Two straight finals, that is really something, shows it isn’t a matter of coincidences.
Up until a couple of years ago, the women's hotel bedroom doors had to be left open at night until the manager or his assistant completed a kind of "lights out" inspection that they were in bed and alone had been completed and the doors could be locked.
That rule changed but the condescending mentality behind it didn't.
Vilde survived the row - essentially because he's a lifetime employee of RFEF and so is his dad. That said, the women didn't ask for him to be sacked - they asked for training camp and pre-match arrangements to be done more professionally.
A few months after the letters from players dropping out of the team Vilde agreed to run a series of sessions (held at the Barcelona training ground I think) on their grievances and what needed to change.
As a result, a number of changes were made. Personnel things like an agreement to have a qualified physio on site during training, team Doctor to travel with team to training camps , new fitness and tactical coaches etc. Organisational things like better travel arrangements.
Some of the women decided that they'd done enough and returned to the team.
Some of the team do everything they can to avoid him, even when celebrating. Some just ignore him as much as possible. Some obviously have a better relationship with him and act as the go-betweens between him and the other players.
That doesn't stop me thinking that he's a patronising bully, who's only in a job due to nepotism and who thinks wins are down to him and defeats are down to the players. But that's just how I see him - he probably thinks he's great.
That's really sad. A cruel way to end what must have felt like a perfect day for her.
As the media at your post is disabled, I guess it was that situation - absolute awkward weirdo ugh how someone like that can be at his position is mind-boggling.
Thanks, I dunno, all seems a bit much to me... People saying he can't claim any credit for the win, or Spanish players that celebrate with him are a disgrace... I don't know, he seems like a bit of a knob, but yeah, not exactly the worst guy in the world.
The head of the federation seems far worse... Just for that kiss alone.
He is there purely out of nepotism but as I recall neither in their resignation letter nor later did they properly explain what the problem was.
The only thing that came to light was the issue of unlocked rooms.
Explaining the lack of professionalism of the federation, the physio issue, etc., which you mention and which I did not know about, would not be something controversial to expose publicly.
If there have been improvements, why haven't they all come back, like Mapi León. They came back because of the improvements or because they didn't want to miss a World Cup after all?.
Arguably the results up until this win didn't justify him being the coach. "If he was the men's coach, he wouldn't have a guaranteed job" it was said, but on the other hand the federation could not allow blackmail of that kind either.
Moreover, some of the signatories of the letter had already done the same with the Barcelona coach in 2021, after winning the treble and got his resignation.
We don't know the details of the complaints - like whether some of the complaints criticized particular staff members or behaviour etc. We know a bit more about the discussions that took place earlier this year that ended with some players returning to the team - which were mostly about practical things.
As for some deciding to return. At a guess - they decided that those discussions were all they were going to get. Two choices then - go to a World Cup and try and ignore the manager or stay home. It's hard to miss a World Cup. On the face of it, the ones expected to start matches went back, the ones likely to be squad options didn't. Whether they got offered other incentives I don't know - the dream of playing in the finals might have been enough.
Wow that’s awful. The best day of her life is now also the worsts day of her life. That’s brutal. So sad.
I wonder where the next WWC will end up being held?
4 bidders I think
Brazil
South Africa
USA/Mexico
Netherlands/Belgium/Germany
I have no particular favourite.
4 bidders I think
Brazil
South Africa
USA/Mexico
Netherlands/Belgium/Germany
I have no particular favourite.
Be surprised if the US/Mex bid got it. US have had it twice in the last 25 years (albeit the 2nd was a last minute replacement due to SARS as it was due to be in China). Ger/Bel/Ned possibly the favourites
That news about the goal scorer’s father is terrible
Why exactly is it ok to laugh at men crying after losing, but not women?
Men don't suffer?
It sounds like he had been battling a long term illness and died before the final. The family decided to keep the news from her and her mother and others from the family flew to watch her play. Wish he had been able to see her score that goal.
Strange that the broadcast media's coverage isn't letting the fact England lost change the narrative. I get that reaching a major final is a great achievement, but if you lose then shouldn't there be some analysis of that?
That’s tough on Carmona.
On the final: It was gripping. Some great skill and some drama to boot. All in all very good.
Congrats to Spain.
On the final: It was gripping. Some great skill and some drama to boot. All in all very good.
Congrats to Spain.
Yuk, how out of touch is this cnut. I'm going to kiss this woman I don't know on the lips live on national television, this is a great idea, she must be so honoured to be kissed by me.
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Rubiales is the Spanish Infantino. Weird, strange man; completely and utterly out of touch too. In 2023, doing that to one of your 'employees' is utterly unacceptable. In many countries it would cost him his job but being Spain he'll just keep on cruising along.
I'm not sure how much football "analysis" actually gets done during the aftermath of England losing a tournament.
In terms of how most regular watchers of the women's game will see it, including the pundits and the press - Spain were a better team than England. We didn't get the luck or the flashes of brilliance to overcome that and Spain didn't make many mistakes - we kept it at 1-0 and could have freaked an equaliser but didn't.
We lost the midfield - Spain exposed our weaknesses there. It was our weakness at the Euros as well, we don't have obvious players on the bench or in the WSL to fix it. We didn't have the precision or the invention on the day to score goals despite that.
In terms of finding a national scapegoat - there wasn't one. Several players were poorer than normal (or made to look worse by Spain) including key players like Walsh and Bronze. Only a couple of England players played well.
In terms of improving the situation. A lot of it is about expanding the talent pool and developing the youth team and talent scouting structures - particularly for kids living in inner cities and for ethnic minorities. Oddly enough that's an issue that's been magnified by the big clubs taking over a lot of the youth system and moving it to out of town training bases. Spain are U17 and U20 champions - once their pro clubs got interested they improved fast at every level.
The Rubiales thing is just plain weird. Yes, everyone's emotional after a big match like that but it was pretty obvious that was neither welcome nor done with permission. I know Hermosa released a statement afterwards saying that she didn't mind, but that just sounded like someone trying not to spoil the party rather than someone who was happy about how he chose to celebrate.
Your boss's boss shouldn't do that to you. Do I think that he's capable of judging criticism of FA culture or coaching team behaviour made by women players?
As Mary Earps would say
Africa and Latin America have never had one so I think either Brazil our South Africa would be a good choice for the overall growth of the game.
I don’t follow women’s football that extensively in-between major international tournaments and big club games.
But from what I’ve seen, it has appeared to me that during the past few years Spain have comfortably had the best array of talent in women’s football bar none, and clearly ahead of the USA, England, Australia, the Netherlands, Germany, Brazil etc.
But of course they’ve also had to contend with a huge amount of ‘political tension’ and in-fighting behind the scenes, notably with so many players despising Jorge Vilda and the RFEF, and the resulting boycotts and absences.
I thought they were pretty unlucky to lose against England in their Euro quarter-final last year, and that was on the back of Putellas and Hermoso both being ruled out by injury before the tournament started.
But from what I’ve seen, it has appeared to me that during the past few years Spain have comfortably had the best array of talent in women’s football bar none, and clearly ahead of the USA, England, Australia, the Netherlands, Germany, Brazil etc.
But of course they’ve also had to contend with a huge amount of ‘political tension’ and in-fighting behind the scenes, notably with so many players despising Jorge Vilda and the RFEF, and the resulting boycotts and absences.
I thought they were pretty unlucky to lose against England in their Euro quarter-final last year, and that was on the back of Putellas and Hermoso both being ruled out by injury before the tournament started.
I don't follow the womens game too much either, but just looking at their results at the youth level indicated they're doing something right over there. They're defending world champions at both U17 and U20 level.
You would think that with their internal tensions and eternal civil war by proxy that is football over there would make such results impossible, but they seem to be able to make it work.
I think the conclusion is that most forms of banter are stupid
There's a video doing the rounds from Spain's dressing room after the game where (I think?) one of her teammates asked her about it and her response in that moment was that she says she didn't like it.