He's always pulled a result out of the bag when the end has looked nigh. So I'm half expecting a decent win at Goodison on Saturday.
Good post by the way @Jonno
Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)
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He's always pulled a result out of the bag when the end has looked nigh. So I'm half expecting a decent win at Goodison on Saturday.
Good post by the way @Jonno
I think the days of not really being at it tactically as a manager are over. And even if they weren't, Ole doesn't have that character and aura needed in the slightest.
Can't believe there are some people that would endorse moving Ole up to the DoF role.
First of all: The club needs a discernible footballing style, something which he hasn't been able to implement in over 100 games. In theory, you'd likely assume that he wants a high line with attacking wingers, but how have his signings so far fared in terms of properly identifying players suitable for that style? AWB and Maguire were poorly scouted for a team intending to play quick football, a high line and attacking down the wings. That's £130m down the drain in terms of the long-term strategy. Bruno's a good fit, as is Donny, but James was a gamble that didn't pay off at all, since effective counter-attacking doesn't just entail being faster than the opponent, which some people think.
How can we trust Ole to identify the right players for the right long-term strategy when half his signings have been poorly scouted in terms of what he's been trying to do on the pitch?
First of all: The club needs a discernible footballing style, something which he hasn't been able to implement in over 100 games. In theory, you'd likely assume that he wants a high line with attacking wingers, but how have his signings so far fared in terms of properly identifying players suitable for that style? AWB and Maguire were poorly scouted for a team intending to play quick football, a high line and attacking down the wings. That's £130m down the drain in terms of the long-term strategy. Bruno's a good fit, as is Donny, but James was a gamble that didn't pay off at all, since effective counter-attacking doesn't just entail being faster than the opponent, which some people think.
How can we trust Ole to identify the right players for the right long-term strategy when half his signings have been poorly scouted in terms of what he's been trying to do on the pitch?
Id move him to a sporting director role, he clearly loves the club and the targets we go after are a lot better at least, he wants to play good football but I dont think him and his setup are good coaches/ motivators
Do you think a sporting director who wants a high line and attacks down the wings and then goes and spends £130m on Maguire and AWB is someone that should be trusted with even more money?
I love United. I'd go after better targets than we have so far. I'd want to play good football too! Can I be sporting director at United?
There’s no point moving him to a DOF role when the board have already made clear they won’t sign his targets. The board caused the dark cloud around the club after the positive finish to last season, he’s a sitting duck now
I wonder if Ed will give Ole even more time because it's his 3rd attempt and he REALLY wants it to work.
Or if he'll give Ole less patience because he has no goodwill to fall back on (at least with LVG and Jose we could say he's won titles etc. so give it time)
Or if he'll give Ole less patience because he has no goodwill to fall back on (at least with LVG and Jose we could say he's won titles etc. so give it time)
No trust whatsoever.however,once again the players need to take a long hard look at themselves. It seems to be a recurring theme,win a few games then resort back to the usual garbage which has generally been served up more often than not. In my 35 years following United I've never felt so much dislike for a squad than I do for this one. Players who shouldn't be anywhere near us,let alone playing regularly. Ole certainly carries his share of the blame and I want him gone, I only wish he could take 7/8 of the squad with him.
Ed clearly cares most about profit. Once he's fully confident Ole won't get us CL football next year he'll be gone, just like the other three.
There's no reason for a new thread on this, it's being discussed in the main sack or keep Old thread.
That’s football for you. It really is a simple game!
What I don't get is how people say he hasn't been supported by the club when he has.
Look, I never really understood his full-time appointment from the start; the whole thing has been very odd. I get giving him the temporary manager role, but he didn't actually do anything during that time to make us so desperate to sign him on as permanent manager. Beating PSG was good, but in the end, it was a snatch and grab in the last 16 (mainly to do with their defender's mistakes and Lukaku); it wasn't like he did a Di Matteo and won the Champion's League.
When you think about it, would he have ever been given the role had we waited until the end of the season? No, he wouldn't because the end to that season was awful. And that gives you your answer; we jumped in the deep end and tied ourselves to a manager who is way out of his depth. That is a level of support you wouldn't find at any other big club; every other one would wait until the end of the season.
That poor form then continued throughout the first half of the next season (at the time, it was our worst start in Premier League history). Usually, a club would have sacked him for that run; I mean Chelsea didn't hang around with Di Matteo and he won the Champion's League the season before. We had no reason to stick with Solskjaer past that point. It's strange how people don't think he has been supported; he has been given more time than he would get at any other big club (that is the definition of support). In fact, the support he has received has been abnormal for a club of our size.
During that summer we spent £145m, mainly in defence, and we saw no improvement. In fact, we conceded in every game until the end of December. Did the board refuse to back him to despite the poor results when his last signings seemed to so ineffectual? No, they then went and spent £50m on Fernandes in January taking our spending to almost £200m. This again shows the level of support he has received.
We see a temporary improvement in results with Fernandes's arrival which helps Solskjaer to dig us out of the hole he put us in. Honestly, that doesn't get much praise from me as he is the reason we were in that position in the first place; we should have done better that season in terms of performances and results. So the club backed him throughout the season and we manage to capitalise on a weak league.
We then go on and spend another £80m (financial constraints due to covid 19) in the summer, taking spending to £280m. Solskjaer has proceeded to beat his own record of worst start in PL history (last season) with the worst start this season and he is still in the job. If that isn't support, I don't know what is. He has been backed in terms of patience, time, and financial means.
Now, ask yourself this question: with all the time spent, the money spent, and the level of patience you have shown, would you give Solskjaer further backing after all of the above?
Look, I never really understood his full-time appointment from the start; the whole thing has been very odd. I get giving him the temporary manager role, but he didn't actually do anything during that time to make us so desperate to sign him on as permanent manager. Beating PSG was good, but in the end, it was a snatch and grab in the last 16 (mainly to do with their defender's mistakes and Lukaku); it wasn't like he did a Di Matteo and won the Champion's League.
When you think about it, would he have ever been given the role had we waited until the end of the season? No, he wouldn't because the end to that season was awful. And that gives you your answer; we jumped in the deep end and tied ourselves to a manager who is way out of his depth. That is a level of support you wouldn't find at any other big club; every other one would wait until the end of the season.
That poor form then continued throughout the first half of the next season (at the time, it was our worst start in Premier League history). Usually, a club would have sacked him for that run; I mean Chelsea didn't hang around with Di Matteo and he won the Champion's League the season before. We had no reason to stick with Solskjaer past that point. It's strange how people don't think he has been supported; he has been given more time than he would get at any other big club (that is the definition of support). In fact, the support he has received has been abnormal for a club of our size.
During that summer we spent £145m, mainly in defence, and we saw no improvement. In fact, we conceded in every game until the end of December. Did the board refuse to back him to despite the poor results when his last signings seemed to so ineffectual? No, they then went and spent £50m on Fernandes in January taking our spending to almost £200m. This again shows the level of support he has received.
We see a temporary improvement in results with Fernandes's arrival which helps Solskjaer to dig us out of the hole he put us in. Honestly, that doesn't get much praise from me as he is the reason we were in that position in the first place; we should have done better that season in terms of performances and results. So the club backed him throughout the season and we manage to capitalise on a weak league.
We then go on and spend another £80m (financial constraints due to covid 19) in the summer, taking spending to £280m. Solskjaer has proceeded to beat his own record of worst start in PL history (last season) with the worst start this season and he is still in the job. If that isn't support, I don't know what is. He has been backed in terms of patience, time, and financial means.
Now, ask yourself this question: with all the time spent, the money spent, and the level of patience you have shown, would you give Solskjaer further backing after all of the above?
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Not bad enough to get sacked, not good enough to win anything either or improve. We are stuck in the worst case scenario, a long and painful death
What annoys me about Ole is that he just sits in the dugout all game and not even pitch side where the likes of Pep and Klopp shout instructions at their players all game and stand on the sideline.
This really infuriates me and the players are given a free ride every game. This just shows to me Ole has no clue what he's doing.
He has to go. Bruno is starting to come to the level of the other players.
This really infuriates me and the players are given a free ride every game. This just shows to me Ole has no clue what he's doing.
He has to go. Bruno is starting to come to the level of the other players.
He has been more than bad enough to get sacked. No other big club would've persisted this long.
He has nothing to say. Pep and Klopp try to influence the game, because there is something to improve and do better, something you trained on or discussed prior to the game in detail. They have a style and plan.
If your manager tells you to go out and enjoy yourself, what should he say during the game? Come on lads, run more? Shoot? Score goals? We are doing the basics on the ground. Except for some special tactic here or there in the big games, there is nothing to really tell the players that they dont know or that needs to be addressed in detail.
He has been bad enough to be sacked. Problem is they hired a guy that they and the fans are too afraid to embarrass by sacking him
This is how i feel. He's done a great job in some areas and every now and again gets a great performance, but it never feels like it's planned. We lurch from idea to idea and occasionally get a result like a broken clock being right twice a day. He is not learning as he goes. It's been 2 years and we still have the same problems on the pitch.
Not bad enough for United (Ed and the board)standard. We always need longer to sack the manager
Only at United, he isn't bad enough to get sacked.
We are the most predictable team in the PL. Everytime Martial gets the ball he wants to turn and run at people. We don't even create goal scoring chances. Honestly, Everton can have 18 year olds playing CB and you wouldn't realise.
I believe Ole has done some great things within his limits. There's been a noticeable improvement in the quality of players and the overall mood. The current team feels like Manchester United, which it didn't under the previous three managers.
So what's the issue? It can only be that he's not anywhere near the top coaches in the tactical side.
We lack a tactical edge in most matches, seemingly overperforming against the better teams because they leave themselves open to the counter, which suits some players, namely Bruno and Rashford, but we are notoriously bad against teams that sit deep, which, against a big club, are most teams.
Also, Ole seems completely unable to adapt when his initial tactics are outsmarted. To make this issue even worse, his substitutions, ironically, have little to no impact most of the time.
We just lack the consistency to be a powerhouse. That comes with a tactical solidity that Ole and his staff, sadly, seem unable to provide.
We need a top coach to capitalise on what Ole delivered. If he leaves now, he'll be remembered as the first big step towards the rebuild. If not, everything he did right is in jeopardy.
PS. I hate the Glazers but I don't think this is all on them. With the squad we have we could be achieving more.
So what's the issue? It can only be that he's not anywhere near the top coaches in the tactical side.
We lack a tactical edge in most matches, seemingly overperforming against the better teams because they leave themselves open to the counter, which suits some players, namely Bruno and Rashford, but we are notoriously bad against teams that sit deep, which, against a big club, are most teams.
Also, Ole seems completely unable to adapt when his initial tactics are outsmarted. To make this issue even worse, his substitutions, ironically, have little to no impact most of the time.
We just lack the consistency to be a powerhouse. That comes with a tactical solidity that Ole and his staff, sadly, seem unable to provide.
We need a top coach to capitalise on what Ole delivered. If he leaves now, he'll be remembered as the first big step towards the rebuild. If not, everything he did right is in jeopardy.
PS. I hate the Glazers but I don't think this is all on them. With the squad we have we could be achieving more.
To me - winning is what should a managerial success should be rated for a club like United. Not making it deep into the competitions. We aren't Spurs. Even Spurs sacked Poch without him winning anything, yet making it deep and securing league position. That shouldn't never be enough to manage a club with such resources.
The standards are literally non existent for United these days. Can't really explain it myself. You keep shoveling hundreds of millions and you get average shite for how many years now under Ole?
We have made a 14 games run last season without losing and we should worship the guy? Managers like Nuno Santos made a very similar run last year (1 loss in 14 games), without having even 1 / 10th of the resources Ole has, yet we have to somehow praise Ole, considering a run like that should be the standard, not flash in the pan followed by 14 games with 1 win or something..
Crazy really, the similarities between us and Liverpool before Klopp are really striking and we used to mock them with their Hodgson type appointments, now we have to back the manager because "it's the United way"..
This sums up the whole problem, almost everything is about what each individual player will do nothing about the entire team functioning as one unit.
This time the board might be ready to get rid earlier rather than wait for top 4 to be out of sight. If Poch is ready to take over and we still look a mess at the end of this month.
They might've seen enough of Ole's long boom and bust cycles. His whole time here is punctuated with fabulous runs then long collapse. Dec 2018 to March 2019 great run then disaster from March to July 2019. Aug 2019 to Jan 2020 a disaster bottom half of the table for a long time. Feb To June great. We've started this season as bad as last season, will it go on to Jan again? A win at Everton doesn't fix anything, we were one win in five in the first half of last season.
Ole needs to show he can get out of this collapse quicker than Jan I feel.
They might've seen enough of Ole's long boom and bust cycles. His whole time here is punctuated with fabulous runs then long collapse. Dec 2018 to March 2019 great run then disaster from March to July 2019. Aug 2019 to Jan 2020 a disaster bottom half of the table for a long time. Feb To June great. We've started this season as bad as last season, will it go on to Jan again? A win at Everton doesn't fix anything, we were one win in five in the first half of last season.
Ole needs to show he can get out of this collapse quicker than Jan I feel.
I’m sure the thread had been merged now, or I’m going madIf you don’t want to see many threads on the main man of our club on a Manchester United forum, then why are you even here?
I think it has. Can’t remember the name of the old thread now
It's not just that, you don't know his priorities were Maguire & AWB. For me, a sporting Director is someone who identifies a system, I don't think Solskjaer wants WBs providing width, he clearly wanted wingers but we didn't acquire Sancho successfully. We would have had centre backs that are capable of going forward with full backs to tuck in and a sturdy midfield with Matic, Scott & Fred, then with Martial, Rashford, Greenwood & Sancho providing width.
Anyway, my opinion is that it's good to have someone like him on your team, I wouldn't have him in a coaching manner but feel he can add value to us where the majority of our board aren't football people.
You don't appoint a failed manager as DoF to be in charge of the next manager... That's crazy. Has that happened, like ever?
Didn't Dalglish get a similar role when 'moved upstairs' by Liverpool?
Amazing.
Maybe you should all re-read my post. I was saying I think his time here is done. I think he's lost the dressing room, they don't believe anymore and I also don't think he's equipped at elite level.
I'm not however going to deny the fact that he did improve us like some of you like to do. Agenda-driven tinted-glasses maybe? Yes he improved us last season from his own results the season before. But why is it funny that he's improved his own results the following season? Surely you'd look for improvement year on year? Which is exactly why I think Ole's time is up now. He's not improved us on last season and if anything we've gone backwards.
However, feel free to pick out tiny snippets of a long post where I say his time is up, enjoy.
While there are a lot of qualities I admire about Ole, sometimes it takes a change in management to properly elicit a change as we saw with the start of Solskjaer. We are in a good position in CL still (in spite of last night) and the PL is early enough that we can turn around and finish well, coupled with the less than perfect form of the City's and Pool's. If we are going to get a new manager, it needs to be now, not in 4 months, if not now, give him the season.
Love what he has done with the squad but he is definitely not a good enough coach.
Come on, it was pretty a funny feck up from you. Take the joke.
For me, the questions for being Ole in or out are really simple:
Competitive = Challenging for the title
1. Will a team without any systematic approach to attacking (or in general, possession, progressing the ball, pressing) football be competitive in the EPL or ECL?
No.
2. Does OGS seem to have a systematic approach to attacking (or in general, possession, progressing the ball, pressing) football?
No.
3. Will OGS make us competitive in the EPL and ECL short or long term?
Highly unlikely.
I do agree that with the current owners and Woodward/Judge etc that any manager is likely to struggle, but we are not going to be competitive under OGS simply based on his lack of a systematic approach.
Competitive = Challenging for the title
1. Will a team without any systematic approach to attacking (or in general, possession, progressing the ball, pressing) football be competitive in the EPL or ECL?
No.
2. Does OGS seem to have a systematic approach to attacking (or in general, possession, progressing the ball, pressing) football?
No.
3. Will OGS make us competitive in the EPL and ECL short or long term?
Highly unlikely.
I do agree that with the current owners and Woodward/Judge etc that any manager is likely to struggle, but we are not going to be competitive under OGS simply based on his lack of a systematic approach.
But different when there’s threads about different subjects. When one clicks new posts and sees...
Should we keep Ole
Should Ole be sacked
What do you think of Ole
Should Ole stay
I’ve lost patience in Ole
Ole out
that takes the Piss and it’s posters craving attention because they done want their crap opinion ate up in dedicated thread.
threads been merged now anyway so looks likeI did have somewhat of a point, mental!
Samuel Luckhurst
Should be let go regardless of the Everton result.
A lot of journalists have started publucally questioning Ole in recent weeks, so I would imagine some sort of briefing has come from the club, or an agent is leaking info on talks.
Personally I do think the board will hold off until CL is off the table. While they acted early-ish with Jose, I think that was the exception and not the rule.
Woodward also won't want to upset any fans further and sacking a legend will definitely cause more backlash on him. I personally believe he's letting Ole make a rod for his own back before he pulls the trigger.
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