Keane and Scholes have both pointed the finger at Woodworm. Van Gaal won't put up with this for long and if Woodward fecks up this summer, Van Gaal won't be slow in letting everyone know whose fault it is. The second coming of Kenyon is what this is.
Woodward (old thread)
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Keane and Scholes have both pointed the finger at Woodworm. Van Gaal won't put up with this for long and if Woodward fecks up this summer, Van Gaal won't be slow in letting everyone know whose fault it is. The second coming of Kenyon is what this is.
Too soon for the "what now for ed Woodward" me thinks.
Not that anyone would give a flying feck.
heh
When Keane and scholes start pointing fingers at him, you know the guy is not doing his job right
Ed's been a busy boy; the club have just recently amended the dollar loan from last year to exclude amortization payments, the upshot being that the club gets to retain an additional 5 to 10m a year for the duration of the amended loan (5 yrs). Every little helps. The club even gets to recoup the loan payment it made in June.
If Woodward can't provide any of LvG's targets then he is to blame. But if it's LvG who is waiting to give his final go because he thinks certain current or youth players can step up then fair enough (and if he can't get us into top 4 then LvG is to blame because of his misjudgement).
But some posters won't give Woodward credit for any signing. I have already read stuff like:
Mata - We paid huge money and Chelsea wanted to get rid
Herrera - Buy out clause, so Woodward didn't do any wonders
Shaw - We overpaid for a kid
Well this way, if you want, you can blame him for everything. I am sure some ppl would continue like this:
Vidal - Huge money for a player who is already 27 and has a bad knee, so no credit to Woodward
Di Maria - Huge money and we only got him because PSG didn't want him enough in the end
But you could do this with lots of signings:
Özil - RM tried everything to get rid and Arsenal somehow still managed to give them 42 mil £
Costa - Release clause, so no credit to the Chelsea negotiation team
Fabregas - Barca have been trying to get rid for ages and even Arsenal didn't want him, leaving Chelsea the only team to be in for him
P. Luis - too much money for an old full-back and no other team was in for him.
As you can see this can be done for almost every big signing. So while correctly blaming Woodward for talking too much but not delivering accordingly, please don't insist on devaluing the signings of quality players which he has delivered.
Because if we had not landed Mata/Herrera/Shaw then wecall know that he would have been blamed non-stop, too!
But some posters won't give Woodward credit for any signing. I have already read stuff like:
Mata - We paid huge money and Chelsea wanted to get rid
Herrera - Buy out clause, so Woodward didn't do any wonders
Shaw - We overpaid for a kid
Well this way, if you want, you can blame him for everything. I am sure some ppl would continue like this:
Vidal - Huge money for a player who is already 27 and has a bad knee, so no credit to Woodward
Di Maria - Huge money and we only got him because PSG didn't want him enough in the end
But you could do this with lots of signings:
Özil - RM tried everything to get rid and Arsenal somehow still managed to give them 42 mil £
Costa - Release clause, so no credit to the Chelsea negotiation team
Fabregas - Barca have been trying to get rid for ages and even Arsenal didn't want him, leaving Chelsea the only team to be in for him
P. Luis - too much money for an old full-back and no other team was in for him.
As you can see this can be done for almost every big signing. So while correctly blaming Woodward for talking too much but not delivering accordingly, please don't insist on devaluing the signings of quality players which he has delivered.
Because if we had not landed Mata/Herrera/Shaw then wecall know that he would have been blamed non-stop, too!
He has not done the bare minimum to deserve any credit.
Mata was a panic buy as being out of the top 4 became a real possibility. Herrera was signed a year late. What ever 'credit' you think Ed deserves, he still presided over the transfer fiasco of last year which means United are still playing catch up.
This is where we are
LVG has sat in the press conference today and said that he's giving it two weeks to evaluate players that he hasn't worked with in the US and if need be - it takes 24 hours to sign players.
It's basic business (not just football) - LVG will have already identified (to Woodward) the people he would like should he decide to make a move in the transfer market.
You can be sure that at this stage of the transfer window MUFC will be speaking to clubs and agents and already know fine well who is possible and who isn't.
If LVG decides to bring players in then I think we will have already done the groundwork - if he decides to stick with what we have - we will just be left with the crap that the press put out about our failings in the transfer market.
I still think January or next summer will be more important for us given our situation.
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If Van Gaal was really keen on Vermalaen, and the player himself wanted the move, I think it's fair to say Woodward's not done too well so far this season.
Dog knows
If Barca are in the frame Woodward's job wasn't straightforward on that one.
Some feckers are never pleased.
Imagine if we signed Di Maria - yes, but Real wanted to get rid, Woodward just payed the price. Or if Vidal asks to leave and we sign him - yes, but he asked to leave, Woodward couldn't convince Juve, doesn't deserve any credit.
If somebody said we would sign Mata 1 year ago, we all would have said that he was crazy. Some say that he was a panic buy or we just played the price, but at the end of the day we done what was needed to sign him. If we wouldn't have bought him, another team would have for slightly less and we would be still cursing Woodward to this day.
Nobody can say if they are worth their pricetag or not until they've played in the system of their new team. I think you can only judge the value of a player in hindsight. All of your examples could turn into flukes, bargains or anything in between. All this money vs. stats comparison is a bit footballmanageresque for me.
It would be fair to say that. With all the ifs, we can't do that.
Transfers take 3 to tango. Buying club, player, selling club. Clearly one element was never keen of this transfer happening to us.
LVG - "We have to wait and see, because you can buy a player in 24 hours, believe me. That’s not a problem.”
That tells me that all the 'monitoring a player' stories are actually true and if/when LvG gives the green signal, Woody will make the moves.
But while we're "monitoring" another club jumps in and buys.
Aye. Seems like a risky game to play with 2 weeks left of the window and the season starting today.
That would be the best outcome, sacking him isn't an option.
What can Woodward do about that? I think this is the case, then surely the issue that frustrates muppets lies with Van Gaal?
LLO
And what if a player fails his medical... Then he doesn't sign but you're out of time for an alternative.
We saw how well that strategy worked for Herrera and Contrao last summer....
We saw how well that strategy worked for Herrera and Contrao last summer....
Yes. Not Woody's fault though.
I dont belive that Van Gaal hasnt made his mind about the squad, transfer yet.
Fair enough, that's your choice. I do believe he was sincere when he said, what he said.
1. Van Gaal said he wanted to target 1st place.
2. Van Gaal said the squad lacks balance.
3. Van Gaal said the squad is below top quality.
4. We already missed out on Varelman, we know we are after Rojo.
5. Woodie said they were working on transfers, he said that mid July...just days after Van Gaal took over.
Sorry something doesnt add up here.
We know for sure we were interested in Vermaelen and that story first emerged ages ago. How does that happen if he hadn't made any decisions by that point?
The notion that LvG has only just decided where he needs new players is nonsense. All he has to do is be able to count to three to know we need cover at CB ffs...
Eh? Its clear he has taken cognizance of the CB situation, hence why the moves for CBs. I'm on about the other positions, where we're yet to see any moves.
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Only 1 player we wanted has moved to another club. Vermaelen was never on once Barca became interested, Arsenal were always selling to them.
No doubt Vermaelen will say "oh I always wanted Barca", but that's just the way it is once the move is complete.
How do you know this?
Out of all the main linked players Vidal / Rojo / Hummels / Di Maria / Blind / Vermaelen etc only 1 of those has joined another club, and 1 has stayed. The rest are still up in the air. Sure it's annoying that we haven't bought anybody else yet, but if we get 2/3 of those target's things will look much rosier.
We're going into the first match of the season playing most likely Tyler Blackett, Reece James and one of Fletcher or Cleverly in the heart of our team. The guy has had months to rectify our squad issues. Van Gaal gave him an A, B an C list. He must have got past Z by now.
You're right, you "forgot" to mention:
6. Van Gaal said he wants to work with the squad before he decides to bring in new players
7. Van Gaal said he wants more time with the WC returners before he decides about new players
8. Van Gaal said a new signing can be sorted within a day
9. Van Gaal is a proven winner with a trackrecord of success at numerous clubs
There are people who think LVG hasn't made up his mind on who he wants? I'm sure he has told the club the players he wants, and the "assessing the squad part" is just to be sure who he needs to move on. That we have not done any significant business is down to the club and doesn't surprise me much, whenever it comes to signing top players which I'm sure LVG has requested, we find it very difficult. There's no manager of repute that likes to wait until the last few days of the window to get transfer business done.
And the biggest club in the world seemed to be fully prepared to go into the season with these options
6. Van Gaal has had most of the squad to work with for a month now. How much time does he need to decide that 3 defenders is too few?
7. None of the defenders nor midfileders were involved in latter stages of WC. Withe exception of Fellaini but hes as as gone. Lack of numbers in defense and lack of quality in midfiled has been a well reported issuse. So waht are you on about?
8. That bollocks and you kniw that.
9. Irrelevant.
Slightly off-topic, but I was just talking to my mate about this and didnt want to make a new thread:
Should we have done more to sign Fabregas? I think so.
a) He is versatile, can play happily further forward than Mata (in my opinion). A interchangable front three of Rooney, RVP and Fabregas could have worked wonders.
b) The signing of Fabregas seems to have completed Chelsea's squad, more so than Costa, Matic and Courtois (end of loan deal) alone.
c) Even if it forced Kagawa out on a cut price deal, he'd likely not end up with one of our rivals. Unlike Fabregas who ended up at Chelsea.
d) The money wouldn't have directly funded a rival, unlike the signing of Mata. Although Barca did give a few quid to Liverpool.
e) The best 4 clubs in the world at the moment, Barcelona, Madrid, Chelsea and Bayern, are happy to sell very good players to improve their squads with expensive purchases. Mata, Ozil, Sanchez, Luiz, Lukaku, Higuain, Fabregas, Valdes, Kroos, Gomes probably Di Maria nearly Xavi. Whilst we are "stagnant" with players who havent improved in many years.
I'm not sure thats enough to sign a 27 year old who plays in a position we already have several players for, but to get up their with the best at the moment, it's the type of purchase you need to do.
Should we have done more to sign Fabregas? I think so.
a) He is versatile, can play happily further forward than Mata (in my opinion). A interchangable front three of Rooney, RVP and Fabregas could have worked wonders.
b) The signing of Fabregas seems to have completed Chelsea's squad, more so than Costa, Matic and Courtois (end of loan deal) alone.
c) Even if it forced Kagawa out on a cut price deal, he'd likely not end up with one of our rivals. Unlike Fabregas who ended up at Chelsea.
d) The money wouldn't have directly funded a rival, unlike the signing of Mata. Although Barca did give a few quid to Liverpool.
e) The best 4 clubs in the world at the moment, Barcelona, Madrid, Chelsea and Bayern, are happy to sell very good players to improve their squads with expensive purchases. Mata, Ozil, Sanchez, Luiz, Lukaku, Higuain, Fabregas, Valdes, Kroos, Gomes probably Di Maria nearly Xavi. Whilst we are "stagnant" with players who havent improved in many years.
I'm not sure thats enough to sign a 27 year old who plays in a position we already have several players for, but to get up their with the best at the moment, it's the type of purchase you need to do.
10.
11. Ok10.
Sorry mate, I really can't agree with you. Your points are right, but they're very one-sided.
I think you'd be right to question somebody like DM, but we've moved on. We have a manager that isn't just trying a new approach. He's repeating an approach that he's been successful with at different clubs.
LvG always puts the team and the system before individuals. On top of that he doesn't just look at the players' usual position, he's talented at finding alternative, maybe even better positions for players even if they've never played there before. That's why we don't just have 3 defenders in his book. Just for LB he was asked if Shaw missing was a problem, but he said he has good backup in James and Young.
And as far as transfers go, I don't think he'll be bullshitting us. If he doesn't get somebody he wants, we'll hear about it. If he says we can sign a player in 24 hours, I think he means it.
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