Wilfried Zaha - Sold to Crystal Palace

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Its amazing how soon some will give up on a player who's still learning the game although he's obviously not first team material at United yet. He's probably just off the pace having not played regular football first team for possibly the longest period in his short career since he first broke through at Palace. I'd expect him to be a first team player for Cardiff before the end of the season, then maybe a whole season on loan at a prem club is the answer next season.
 
He still has the talent but I think his attitude needs improving. Worrying that he's not getting off the bench for Cardiff btw.
 
Rednotdead said:
Not at all. If he can't even get into a team struggling along at the bottom of the Premier League it's not the greatest advert for him is it?

Clearly the rumours coming out of Carrington were true - he simply wasn't learning and developing in the way the coaches expected. I'd be very surprised if we ever see him wearing a Man Utd shirt again.
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How long has he been there? A bit over a month? A relegation battle isn't the best place for a young, flair type of player. He will get a gig in the Premier League, no doubt about it. He will be an England player in the future, there is no doubting that, so he will be in the Premier League, simple.
 
If he isnt working hard with a good attitude and isnt better than Young and Valencia, then sell him already. Wouldnt be hard to find a replacement that is better than them and we have Januzaj as our young winger.
 
Eric'sCollar said:
How long has he been there? A bit over a month? A relegation battle isn't the best place for a young, flair type of player. He will get a gig in the Premier League, no doubt about it. He will be an England player in the future, there is no doubting that, so he will be in the Premier League, simple.
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So............if your argument is valid you'll need to explain why he was loaned to Cardiff when they were already in a relegation battle?

His problem isn't his potential, it's his attitude - as witnessed by his turning up late for a reserve game and Southgate being very unhappy with him last Summer with the England u/21s when he apparently was of the opinion he should have been with the big boys in Brazil. He's not learning that he needs to change his attitude. Even Holloway alluded to that a few weeks ago when talking about him.
 
Rednotdead said:
So............if your argument is valid you'll need to explain why he was loaned to Cardiff when they were already in a relegation battle?

His problem isn't his potential, it's his attitude - as witnessed by his turning up late for a reserve game and Southgate being very unhappy with him last Summer with the England u/21s when he apparently was of the opinion he should have been with the big boys in Brazil. He's not learning that he needs to change his attitude. Even Holloway alluded to that a few weeks ago when talking about him.
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I don't need to explain it. Some decisions have both positives and negatives to it. Some decisions make no sense, some do. I said it's not the best place for him, not that it is illegal for him to be there, tough luck for him, he has to deal with it and prove himself.

I am not questioning the issues he has, I'm saying that he will be picked up by a Premier League team if he doesn't continue at United.
 
Eric'sCollar said:
I don't need to explain it. Some decisions have both positives and negatives to it. Some decisions make no sense, some do. I said it's not the best place for him, not that it is illegal for him to be there, tough luck for him, he has to deal with it and prove himself.

I am not questioning the issues he has, I'm saying that he will be picked up by a Premier League team if he doesn't continue at United.
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Clearly there were no better options for his loan than a relegation-threatened club. Hardly evidence to support an assertion that he'll be picked up by any but another lower-level PL club at best. And as for England, well, no comment!!
 
Rednotdead said:
Clearly there were no better options for his loan than a relegation-threatened club. Hardly evidence to support an assertion that he'll be picked up by any but another lower-level PL club at best. And as for England, well, no comment!!
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Well what evidence do you have that points to him not being able to land a gig in the Premier League. Of course it's all up in the air but I would be willing to bet anything that he has a career in the top flight.
 
Funny because at the start of the season most folk on here thought he would play a big part for us. I was shot down for saying he should be loaned out. Now look at him, not even getting a look in at his loan club. Not a good year for Zaha. Maybe if at the start he was loaned then it may have been different.
 
Orton said:
Funny because at the start of the season most folk on here thought he would play a big part for us. I was shot down for saying he should be loaned out. Now look at him, not even getting a look in at his loan club. Not a good year for Zaha. Maybe if at the start he was loaned then it may have been different.
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I think most were happy to see him loaned out however, the form of our wingers made everyone believe that he should have been given a chance.
 
It's obvious he has some maturing to do, but I think it goes deeper than that. Put bluntly, I just don't see a lot of talent or potential. He can do stepovers, can beat a man and is physically imposing...what else? His touch is sub par, doesn't demonstrate great vision, woeful in terms of positioning (both attacking and defensive), what is it I'm missing with this guy?

I'd love for him to prove me wrong, but I thought the looked shit when we signed him and I've seen nothing since to change my mind.
 
I think the physical part is a bit of a question mark. I mean his build is fine, but the amount of times I've seen him go down with a small amount of contact when he should have been able to continue and its not an obvious foul, so sometimes he'll get it and sometimes he wont

What he showed for Palace was the ability to turn his turns or dribbles into some goals. He hasnt managed that at Cardiff
 
Bebe said:
It's obvious he has some maturing to do, but I think it goes deeper than that. Put bluntly, I just don't see a lot of talent or potential. He can do stepovers, can beat a man and is physically imposing...what else? His touch is sub par, doesn't demonstrate great vision, woeful in terms of positioning (both attacking and defensive), what is it I'm missing with this guy?

I'd love for him to prove me wrong, but I thought the looked shit when we signed him and I've seen nothing since to change my mind.
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i had the same thoughts, when i was looking at him when he signed, i saw that if you look just at his control over the ball when he's dribbling and ignore his step overs and circus tricks, there's nothing overly or innately impressive at that aspect. He's talented physically as he's got speed and a decent build on his frame, but he can't really turn his dribbling into a direct danger since he's not really capable of dribbling at speed.

i actually think he's got a decent through ball or long pass on him though, but since his game doesn't revolve around other players, it's not a common thing, pretty rare, but you'll see a nice through pass from zaha once in a while.

zaha has alot of room to grow into, and that's his worth, his potential, but at the present he's not that great, and even when we bought him, he wasn't really that impressive to me, i remember saying that he shouldn't have been worth more then 10m. i think he can become a good player, but it will take alot of focus and dedication, and adaptions for zaha.
 
'Nothing like someone who believes in you…' - Wilfried Zaha, 2014

Good job, Wilf. Now to the more important things like working hard in training and not thinking you are god's gift to planet earth.

He is a tremendous talent. A better player would come out stronger after a year he has had. It would be a shame if it all goes to bin because of a shitty attitude.
 
Shinjisan said:
'Nothing like someone who believes in you…' - Wilfried Zaha, 2014

Good job, Wilf. Now to the more important things like working hard in training and not thinking you are god's gift to planet earth.

He is a tremendous talent. A better player would come out stronger after a year he has had. It would be a shame if it all goes to bin because of a shitty attitude.
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I don't see how he has a shitty attitude? Slightly arrogant, but that's helped certain players in the past, he's no delinquent, he's just obviously finding it harder to keep his feet on the ground.

I think another few months of not setting the world alight will do his ego all the good, then perhaps we can start to see the talented boy that he is, I saw him in the championship last season and that doesn't disappear, the boy has real talent.
 
Same people criticising others for having a go at Moyes despite not seeing Zaha in training are casting aspersions about Zaha's attitude despite having never spent a second in his presence.

Gotta love the Caf
 
CLK_FPC said:
Same people criticising others for having a go at Moyes despite not seeing Zaha in training are casting aspersions about Zaha's attitude despite having never spent a second in his presence.

Gotta love the Caf
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If the criteria for being allowed to discuss the attitude of professional footballers involved spending time in their company it would be a very brief discussion.

Obviously, everyone is feeding off comments from people who have spent time with him, his managers past and present. It's really not that difficult to detect a theme from what they've said about him.

Ole:
“He is one of the best I have seen with the ball. He has quick feet and is brave like Cristiano and wants to go forward. “But he has got to make a decision about how good does he want to be and how much does he love this game. He can grow up to become a proper player like Ronaldo if he wants
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Moyes:
"At times you have to believe what the manager is seeing as well. I have seen Wilfried training every day as well. I am privy to that."
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Holloway:
"I will always be grateful to Wilf for the role he played in helping Palace to win promotion to the top flight when I was the manager at Selhurst Park. And that's why I have his best intentions at heart when I say the time has come for him to take stock of his life and career and grow up a little bit. Because, believe me, there is nothing more tragic than unfulfilled potential."
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Pogue Mahone said:
If the criteria for being allowed to discuss the attitude of professional footballers involved spending time in their company it would be a very brief discussion.

Obviously, everyone is feeding off comments from people who have spent time with him, his managers past and present. It's really not that difficult to detect a theme from what they've said about him.

Ole:


Moyes:


Holloway:
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"Good job, Wilf. Now to the more important things like working hard in training and not thinking you are god's gift to planet earth."

Those comments from Moyes, Ole and Holloway give credence that he believes he's 'god's gift to planet earth'? OK then
 
CLK_FPC said:
"Good job, Wilf. Now to the more important things like working hard in training and not thinking you are god's gift to planet earth."

Those comments from Moyes, Ole and Holloway give credence that he believes he's 'god's gift to planet earth'? OK then
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No but they certainly give credence to the idea he could be working harder in training. So he is, at least, half right.
 
He's young and so perfectible, he can get to that required level that would make him a real Man Utd player. He would need to simplify his football though, he's over elaborate
 
He has some simple basic issues.

1. He can't dribble past anybody unless he has already built up pace.
2. He is the worst player I have seen at making it easy for himself. He never gets away from his marker and gets 2 metres to built momentum - and when he does he usually waits until the opponent closes him down before he even tries to initiate his dribble.

These two facts together makes him very elaborate and flashy - but leads to little to no successful dribbles. The only time he is successful is running already and has built up his pace and is challenging someone.

If he can solve one of those two, he will be an absolutely brilliant winger. But in general players in his age do not improve massively in terms of dribbling ability and burst pace - so i wouldn't count on it.
 
Disclaimer: I do not claim to have seen any players in training. Neither am I an itk with contacts with in the club. I also sincerely apologise for that.
All my posts are based on my observations from watching games and reading stuff from different sources.

Sorry Jay, needed to get that out of the way.

Jaybezia said:
I don't see how he has a shitty attitude? Slightly arrogant, but that's helped certain players in the past, he's no delinquent, he's just obviously finding it harder to keep his feet on the ground.

I think another few months of not setting the world alight will do his ego all the good, then perhaps we can start to see the talented boy that he is, I saw him in the championship last season and that doesn't disappear, the boy has real talent.
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Some of the things I have read on him are not very positive. Apparently he showed late for a reserve game he was supposed to start. The thinly veiled dig at Moyes as soon as he got a couple of minutes at Cardiff. Some of the comments from the different managers, that Pogue posted. All these point to a player who has not got his head in the right place. Arrogance is good when you can back it up on the pitch. So far Zaha hasn't done that. He played a very good individualistic hand during Palace's promotion in play-offs last season but the expectations are different at a top club. His contribution suggested that he has the talent to make it here, not that he has already made it here and would walk into the team.

I agree that he has the talent, in fact amazing talent. A better player would use this tough period as a tool to motivate himself and come out on top. Let's hope that Zaha does the same. First and foremost for his sake and then ours.
 
Youthful arrogance, it's about harnessing that natural talent and seeing it blossom before your eyes. This player will come good.
 
Nathan said:
Youthful arrogance, it's about harnessing that natural talent and seeing it blossom before your eyes. This player will come good.
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I think that may be the problem though, he has potential rather than talent. He should be working on that potential and listening to and learning from the coaches in order to turn it into talent, as Ronaldo did. The whisper coming out of Carrington was that he just wasn't learning.

It's also pretty well known that Southgate was unhappy with his attitude with the England u/21s last Summer, when it appeared he thought he should have been with the big team in Brazil.
 
His current spell on the bench has also conincided with Cardiff's switch to 3 at the back with 2 wingbacks rather than actual wingers.
 
Some of the comments about him are indeed worrying. Needs to get his act together. Hopefully he does because he wasn't a cheap signing at all.
 
Was it Neville that said in the Bishops Blaize that he began off well, but started with the attitude/lack of effort a month of two into the season here, and that he was noted for it while at Palace. That he could get away with it there being their star player at the time.
 
I wonder if he would have been better managed and motivated if Fergie was still manager of the club. Zaha signed to play for him after all
 
SATA said:
I wonder if he would have been better managed and motivated if Fergie was still manager of the club. Zaha signed to play for him after all
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Possibly. But he's still a nobody and if he already has motivational problems playing for a lesser manager, he's likely never going to succeed.
 
MDFC Manager said:
Possibly. But he's still a nobody and if he already has motivational problems playing for a lesser manager, he's likely never going to succeed.
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Nobody ? Possibly , motivational problems playing for a lesser manager ? Are we still talking about wilf or half of our current squad ? He's a very talented kid who might make it .
 
Talent will only take you so far on its own. Hard work will only take you so far on its own. Talent and hard work will make you the best player you can be. I don't think he's learned that yet.
 
Those quotes that Pogue has bolded are all we need to know really. There's obviously some serious attitude problems with Zaha as managers don't just come out with things like that. I've only ever heard a manager or coach saying things like that once before, and that was in regards to Ravel Morrison.
 
This is exactly the type of thing you'd expect Fergie's fêted personality-focused scouting system to pick up on. Guess not.
 
Lu Tze said:
This is exactly the type of thing you'd expect Fergie's fêted personality-focused scouting system to pick up on. Guess not.
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remember when we bought obertan and the french especially blanc were surprised considering obertan's mentality issues?
 
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