Who still has faith in The Philosophy? / LVG Supporters' Thread

[Balu]

in a much less competitive league. Each game LVGs excuse for not breaking teams down is 'they were well organised'. like they are not allowed to be. Leicester are top of the league with the least possession. When LVG arrived he openly said he wanted to change English mentality, prefers players to play with their head and not their gut. Then makes Wayne Rooney captain

It's not even the big question of a much less competitive league. The Bundesliga actually was crazy competitive at his time, it just lacked quality at the top until Dortmund raised the bar and pushed Bayern to an elite level again, something van Gaal clearly couldn't cope with. Our sensational, but also quite lucky CL run in 09/10 really detracts from the actual performance level of the team back then. We were outplayed by Bordeaux twice, finished 2nd in the group, got lucky draws in the knockout rounds, were outplayed by Fiorentina and United, but went through on away goals thanks to red cards and Robben wondergoals before getting the easiest CL semifinal draw ever with Lyon and then eventually were again clearly outclassed by Inter in the final.

Compared to United, he just took over a significantly stronger team with a few academy players ready to make the step up to become superstars. It worked well for us and he was a good fit for that, realising Müller's talent and making him a regular so soon. But in the end, he only improved the team by 3 points over the disaster of the Klinsmann season in his first year despite spending crazy money and buying quality players like Robben and then finished below Klinsmann's points in his 2nd year. It's similar to how he slightly improved United over the Moyes season and now dropped below it in the 2nd season. Just with a significantly higher starting point in terms of squad strength. It's also comparable that he finished 4th with a rather underwhelming points tally last season, one that wouldn't have been enough to get CL football in the Moyes year.

 

[Sarni]

This is not a Sunday League like in Spain or Italy, you have to fight in every game.. Also, those "hundreds of millions" have been earned and spend during a long period(from Rooney and Carrick to Martial co.)

Sunderland would be top 4 in Spain or Italy indeed, while United would be running away with the title in the pub leagues over there. We will see how amazing United are in comparison to sides outside of England in Europa League. We battered CSKA, PSV and Wolfsburg in CL.

 

[K2K]

Bayern knocked us out on the way to that final, and it was the beginning of an awesome Bayern Munich team. We can look at the positives, and the negatives of Van Gaal, but in the end it doesn't matter. He's retiring next year, and his blunders in the transfer market will cost him his job. He has been an excellent coach, but it hasn't worked at United because he bought and sold very badly, and has been unlucky with injuries. He is screwed, and he knows it, but he will always be remembered as a great coach by those who remember him at Ajax, Barca, Bayern, and AZ.

I've always admitted that he was a good manager, but with many frailities too. When he's good, he can be very good. But when he messes up, its disastrous.

His legacy at United , just like Moyes will be that of failure. My point which i've adequately proven is that the failure was down to him, just like most of the failures in his past. Passing the blame to anyone else is just silly.

 

[TheRedDevil'sAdvocate]

It's not so much about the philosophy itself as it is about giving it flesh and blood through good pre-season planning and good choices off the pitch.

A couple of seasons ago, Rodgers almost won the league with Suarez and the, unexpectedly injured-free, Sterling and Sturridge. There's no doubt that with a forward like Ibrahimovic or Lewandowski plus a winger of the" Robben type", we would probably be in a much better position right now. If we also had a proper b2b midfielder, we could be challenging for the title. But we don't and therefore we are fighting for a top four finish.

I understand that LvG was appointed to implement his vision of how football should be played on our current squad. I respect that but after nearly 20 months with little progression and at a point when the whole plan seems to have stagnated again, he should really reconsider his options.

At Ajax he was blessed to have a bunch of really world class youth players to work with. During his first spell at Barcelona he could search for Dutch players who understand his brand of football well and bring in the likes of Cocu, the De Boer brothers, Reiziger and Kluivert. At Bayern he inherited Robben and Ribery and the board had the final say at who's staying and who's leaving the club.

Sadly, we don't have a new class of '92 to offer him, there's not enough top class talent in the Netherlands nowadays and our board gives the impression that they want absolutely no involvement in the footballing matters. As a result, we have a team that struggles to perform the manager's instructions at the required level and the three highest earners in the first team, Rooney-Mata-Schweinsteiger, look utterly useless on the pitch.

Well, no one has won anything under these circumstances. And the most annoying thing of all is that both Rooney and Mata never looked like players who could thrive in a possession side and lead it to winning titles. But here we still are, waiting for them to shine...

 

[K2K]

Sunderland would be top 4 in Spain or Italy indeed, while United would be running away with the title in the pub leagues over there. We will see how amazing United are in comparison to sides outside of England in Europa League. We battered CSKA, PSV and Wolfsburg in CL.

Spanish teams have won the UCL and Europa league for the last two seasons (a first in history)

You are wasting your time with some people on here Sarni. Ignorant statements like that are usually the norm from people who have no idea what they are talking about.

 

[Kostur]

How is the laying of foundations going?

 

[golden_blunder]

How is the laying of foundations going?

They're built on quick sand

 

[jojojo]

They're built on quick sand

We bought the wrong sort of sand apparently.

 

[clarkydaz]

They're built on quick sand

takes 3 months to set

 

[Kostur]

Sand is a process.

 

[Dr. Funkenstein]

in a much less competitive league. Each game LVGs excuse for not breaking teams down is 'they were well organised'. like they are not allowed to be.

No, like they are making it difficult to get through so you have to move the ball around quicker. And that's the difficult part, when they manage that it looks good, but they lack the technique and vision to do it consistently.

Leicester are top of the league with the least possession. When LVG arrived he openly said he wanted to change English mentality, prefers players to play with their head and not their gut. Then makes Wayne Rooney captain

Rooney is an intelligent player. It's his leadership I doubt and in lesser form he's just not dependable, his first touch fails him.

I'm still behind him. I know I'm in a very small minority but I'm fully in the belief that the players are just not up to it. DDG, Martial and Shaw are the only first team players that would be classed as current quality. We have some promising youth, but the rest fall way short for me. Rooney has done little for years and he looks so lacking in leadership qualities, I'm staggered he is our captain, let alone England's too! Smalling is a good player but he and blind have had protection of 2 X DM all season.
I'm only sticking with LvG as I feel he can do a good job building a decent squad and to change now would be pointless as I don't feel Jose, Pep or whoever else could get much more of a tune out of this squad.
Like I say, I know I'm in a minority and my opinions on the squad is going to be unpopular but 2 managers have now struggled with many of this squad and as much as many don't like them managers, they are not bad managers.

Of course it's wishful thinking that Van Gaal, a manager responsable for a few of the most spectacular overachievements in football history, has no idea and with another manager all problems will be gone. Pep couldn't do anything with a squad like this and Mourinho's best days are over. But this isn't working either. I've defended him staying because once it clicks it's better football and a stronger team than could be expected from a squad with this quality, but that is of no use when the players grasp of the tactics, the system and their execution is this fragile and it keeps crumbling. This early in 2016 it has already crumbled against Sunderland, Southampton and Sheffield, Liverpool was no feast for the eyes either and it crumbled during the matches against Newcastle and Chelsea. That's just way too often.

There has been progress, and he has actually made a lot of players better, but there's been no progress in the consistency. It's just as fragile as it turned out to be after Spurs away in 2015, after the good run in the spring of 2015 and after a boring but decent start of this season. If they'd play the next match like they did against Chelsea for the full 90 minutes, it would not give me any confidence anymore, because it could just fall apart again like it has done so many times before.

I ventured into this thread willingly so need to stay calm. Here we go. I get what you are saying in that some of the players are not United material, let alone first XI. That said, you do realise he spent 250m to get his team in, gotten rid of some very good players who didn't buy into his philosophy, got rid of Di Maria who was his purchase and the creative player that he said he so sorely needed. The team after 18 months is entirely of his construction.

I don't think that's fair criticism. I'm not saying any criticism on his signings is wrong, but the squad he inhereted wasn't United material at all. The United material that was in the squad, was past it's expiration date. That probem can't be solved by money, not even if it actually was 250m. There are just not enough world class players for sale to construct a squad of United material in two seasons. It's a matter of buying young talents and a couple of benchwarmers from Europe's elite like ADM and Schweinsteiger. Times have changed, there's a very stable elite from which United wants to be part again but who hang on to their best players and compete for the young talents. It's impossible to catch up with them in less than 5 years.

So you surely cannot compare DM's team with LVG's team because LVG purged that old team a long time ago. So say you need world class players to make the system work is a bit nonsensical. Yes, we realise that we do need more world class players but isn't this fantastic LVG philosophy supposed to go a long way to improve the performance of the team as a whole?

You don't need world class players to make the system work, although it would make it work better, but you need players with a relatively high level of the basic technical skills. Players who are consistently good at simple passing, who have a good first touch with a defender on their back. There are too many players who struggle with that.

So the philosophy is to have better players than the opponent. Genius.

Or you just read what I write.

 

[Sarni]

Spanish teams have won the UCL and Europa league for the last two seasons (a first in history)

You are wasting your time with some people on here Sarni. Ignorant statements like that are usually the norm from people who have no idea what they are talking about.

If those people are right, we will walk Europa League unless Tottenham stop us. Cannot see past United v Tottenham final unless we meet earlier.

 

[clarkydaz]

Rooney is an intelligent player. It's his leadership I doubt and in lesser form he's just not dependable, his first touch fails him.

is he? rooney is/was an instinct player, Ferguson even said in his book he doesn't take instructions well and reverts to type. Now his physique has declined he is relying on poor first touch and limited skillset with predictable play. you rightly say we are too slow moving forward, most of the season he was the main culprit slowing down our attacking play as our 'talisman'. Who plays every game all game

How many players has LVG improved? top my head I say Young and Fellaini isn't a blatant laughing stock as much, and made Valencia a solid right back instead of limited winger. Smalling was held up for bombing forward a few times, our defence has 2 holding midfielders and when they are pressurised to defend they still look shaky. it seems more have stalled/regressed under him

 

[K2K]

If those people are right, we will walk Europa League unless Tottenham stop us. Cannot see past United v Tottenham final unless we meet earlier.

No English club has won the Uefa cup/Europa league since Liverpool in 2001.

Maybe they just dont feel like it.

 

[spwd]

At this point, anyone who wants LVG to stay clearly does not hold the best interests of mufc to heart.

Our allegiance should be to Manchester United.... Not LVG.

Exactly this!

 

[RedPed]

This is the LVG supporters thread. If you're not supporting him go to the appropriate thread eejits

You mean there are STILL some of you left???

FFS!!!!

 

[Oneunited26]

Its always someone else's fault.

Not properly assessing your strenght and weaknesses is the basic error a manager can make.

Anyone can take his phylosophy and instill it, but knowing how to adapt along the way is what separates genious and charlatans

He's not a charlatan, but he's too stubborn to learn new things and accept that either we're not ready for the philosophy or the bpl is too strong for the phylosophy

That is one point I brought up a few times, he is just like a doctor years behind the times, refusing to adapt to the modern day era.

You mean there are STILL some of you left???

FFS!!!!

HAHAHA, VG's terrible job has been like a virus, its a shock anyone is still supporting VG lol

 

[Esquire]

No, like they are making it difficult to get through so you have to move the ball around quicker. And that's the difficult part, when they manage that it looks good, but they lack the technique and vision to do it consistently.

Rooney is an intelligent player. It's his leadership I doubt and in lesser form he's just not dependable, his first touch fails him.

Of course it's wishful thinking that Van Gaal, a manager responsable for a few of the most spectacular overachievements in football history, has no idea and with another manager all problems will be gone. Pep couldn't do anything with a squad like this and Mourinho's best days are over. But this isn't working either. I've defended him staying because once it clicks it's better football and a stronger team than could be expected from a squad with this quality, but that is of no use when the players grasp of the tactics, the system and their execution is this fragile and it keeps crumbling. This early in 2016 it has already crumbled against Sunderland, Southampton and Sheffield, Liverpool was no feast for the eyes either and it crumbled during the matches against Newcastle and Chelsea. That's just way too often.

There has been progress, and he has actually made a lot of players better, but there's been no progress in the consistency. It's just as fragile as it turned out to be after Spurs away in 2015, after the good run in the spring of 2015 and after a boring but decent start of this season. If they'd play the next match like they did against Chelsea for the full 90 minutes, it would not give me any confidence anymore, because it could just fall apart again like it has done so many times before.

I don't think that's fair criticism. I'm not saying any criticism on his signings is wrong, but the squad he inhereted wasn't United material at all. The United material that was in the squad, was past it's expiration date. That probem can't be solved by money, not even if it actually was 250m. There are just not enough world class players for sale to construct a squad of United material in two seasons. It's a matter of buying young talents and a couple of benchwarmers from Europe's elite like ADM and Schweinsteiger. Times have changed, there's a very stable elite from which United wants to be part again but who hang on to their best players and compete for the young talents. It's impossible to catch up with them in less than 5 years.


You don't need world class players to make the system work, although it would make it work better, but you need players with a relatively high level of the basic technical skills. Players who are consistently good at simple passing, who have a good first touch with a defender on their back. There are too many players who struggle with that.


Or you just read what I write.

At this point, there is really no rational way to discuss why he should stay, when all evidence points to a drastic failure of a season. No one, not even you LVG supporters, can honestly say this season has been anything otherwise. All I can say is that your reasons, no matter well articulated, sound just like excuses or rationalisation to the VAST majority of supporters (who are just as intelligent and rational as you are) who want him gone from this club. I do give you a lot of respect for defending LVG, but on merits, on morale, on just about any criteria you want to assign as a metric, LVG's performance this season has been wanting. The reason he is around is not because he deserves it but down to a cowardly and incompetent management which does not have the courage to make the change. That irks me more than anything else as to why our management wants to keep alive a relationship which has clearly failed.

 

[ravi2]

No, like they are making it difficult to get through so you have to move the ball around quicker. And that's the difficult part, when they manage that it looks good, but they lack the technique and vision to do it consistently.

Rooney is an intelligent player. It's his leadership I doubt and in lesser form he's just not dependable, his first touch fails him.

Of course it's wishful thinking that Van Gaal, a manager responsable for a few of the most spectacular overachievements in football history, has no idea and with another manager all problems will be gone. Pep couldn't do anything with a squad like this and Mourinho's best days are over. But this isn't working either. I've defended him staying because once it clicks it's better football and a stronger team than could be expected from a squad with this quality, but that is of no use when the players grasp of the tactics, the system and their execution is this fragile and it keeps crumbling. This early in 2016 it has already crumbled against Sunderland, Southampton and Sheffield, Liverpool was no feast for the eyes either and it crumbled during the matches against Newcastle and Chelsea. That's just way too often.

There has been progress, and he has actually made a lot of players better, but there's been no progress in the consistency. It's just as fragile as it turned out to be after Spurs away in 2015, after the good run in the spring of 2015 and after a boring but decent start of this season. If they'd play the next match like they did against Chelsea for the full 90 minutes, it would not give me any confidence anymore, because it could just fall apart again like it has done so many times before.
Or you just read what I write.

Even LVG has thrown in the towel, but for some reason you still believe in him and think our squad is crap.

You are like one of those Japanese soldiers still fighting the allies years after WW2 officially ended. It's over man... Let it go.

 

[K2K]

At this point, there is really no rational way to discuss why he should stay, when all evidence points to a drastic failure of a season. No one, not even you LVG supporters, can honestly say this season has been anything otherwise. All I can say is that your reasons, no matter well articulated, sound just like excuses or rationalisation to the VAST majority of supporters (who are just as intelligent and rational as you are) who want him gone from this club. I do give you a lot of respect for defending LVG, but on merits, on morale, on just about any criteria you want to assign as a metric, LVG's performance this season has been wanting. The reason he is around is not because he deserves it but down to a cowardly and incompetent management which does not have the courage to make the change. That irks me more than anything else as to why our management wants to keep alive a relationship which has clearly failed.

Funkstein is more of a Van Gaal fan that a United, and has already said that he's interest will wane when he does leave, especially if expected Jose replaces him.

In his mind, Van Gaal is the best possible manager we can get. I think he's beyond convincing at this point.

 

[LeftyBlaster]

How the feck this thread is even in existence is beyond my comprehension.

 

[Dr. Funkenstein]

At this point, there is really no rational way to discuss why he should stay, when all evidence points to a drastic failure of a season. No one, not even you LVG supporters, can honestly say this season has been anything otherwise. All I can say is that your reasons, no matter well articulated, sound just like excuses or rationalisation to the VAST majority of supporters (who are just as intelligent and rational as you are) who want him gone from this club. I do give you a lot of respect for defending LVG, but on merits, on morale, on just about any criteria you want to assign as a metric, LVG's performance this season has been wanting. The reason he is around is not because he deserves it but down to a cowardly and incompetent management which does not have the courage to make the change. That irks me more than anything else as to why our management wants to keep alive a relationship which has clearly failed.

I think the easy decision is to sack the manager, I'm not saying cowardly but it takes more courage to keep him on than to sack him. But the most courageous decision is not always the right one. It's not about what LvG deserves or not deserves either. He deserves to be sacked because he's responsible, and he deserves to stay because he's an honest hard working man caught in a bad situation. So courage nor deserve are arguments for any of the two decisions.

I've always defended him, and will continue to defend him against unfair criticism, from the viewpoint that once it clicks a corner is turned, you can move on from there and everything will be sunshine and halleluja from then on. But it has already clicked so many times, and the corner isn't turned, the next match or the next 20 minutes in a game it is like it has never clicked. I think we played really good football against Chelsea, i'd be happy to defend a contract extension for the responsible manager if it would be consistent, but they've fallen back one time too many. The positives you can take from a game like that aren't for the take anymore, because the players probably will not take it to next match either. But I will still defend the need for change to a different style of football, not necessarily a Van Gaal style or the closely related Pep style (who will have troubles implementing it also), but I think over the years United has been outplayed in the CL a few times too many, and not just in recent years and not only by Barcelona to not change the style. Besides beeing outplayed there's also the slow slipping out of Europe's elite.

One good thing about the signing of Van Gaal was that there was a plan how to get United back to the top and a vision of the football needed to stay there. If he's sacked, there has to be another plan. Allthough he would do allright with the European vulnerability, I don't consider Mourinho as a good plan. I think he's past it, and he's been reliant on the most expensive squads lately, which United will not have the coming 3 years, at least not without seriously overpaying for players who are not that great. So I wonder if it would actually make sense to sack Van Gaal, for the remainder of the season and for the future beyond.

Even LVG has thrown in the towel, but for some reason you still believe in him and think our squad is crap.

Obviously the squad lacks character and technique, at least in depth.

You are like one of those Japanese soldiers still fighting the allies years after WW2 officially ended. It's over man... Let it go.

As I wrote, I'm prepared to let him go. Gutted that it hasn't worked out, but I don't think it will still work out and that's why I've defended him. But what about Japan now? Unlike most here, I will not get any satisfaction from the sacking itself, it's perfectly all right to have a sense of justice or relief about it, but I personally won't. So for me it's about what comes after that, not the sacking itself.

What I liked about the signing was that is was the choice to take the club and it's football in a certain direction. That had to be done, with SAF leaving a new chapter begins and there are choices to be made, you can't just get a new manager in like Ferguson has only been there for a couple of years, you've got to redefine the club without Ferguson: What kind of football are we going to play, what kind of players do we sign and from where, and what kind of position does the manager have? The board doesn't have to make the same choices as for example Bayern or Barcelona did in the past, but they do have to make important choices for the long term.

Funkstein is more of a Van Gaal fan that a United, and has already said that he's interest will wane when he does leave, especially if expected Jose replaces him.

No, I said that if Mourinho would be the next manager my interest would probably fade. If they get a different manager with a plan (footballing plan that is, not a plan to gain advantages from beeing a cnut) I can believe in and is an expression of a chosen direction, I don't see why it should fade.

 

[mu77]

^

 

[caisenma]

I have a friend in real life, as odd and unbelievable as it sounds in itself, who adamantly believes LVG will come good. ... I don't look at him the same, and will certainly NOT be wishing him a happy valentines today.

 

[Henrik Larsson]

This thread is great

you tell em Funkenstein!

 

[golden_blunder]

So I wonder if it would actually make sense to sack Van Gaal, for the remainder of the season and for the future beyond.

oh my god! someone likes punishment

 

[ManUchosenbosslvg]

How the feck this thread is even in existence is beyond my comprehension.

It's like those cases of hostages that suffer so much stress in a situation, that they actually begin to try justify what the hostage taker is doing, just to try bring some semblance of control over the situation in their puny minds.

 

[Garethw]

It's like those cases of hostages that suffer so much stress in a situation, that they actually begin to try justify what the hostage taker is doing, just to try bring some semblance of control over the situation in their puny minds.

Stockholm syndrome should be re-named Van Gaal syndrome.

 

[pseudo_canadian]

How the feck this thread is even in existence is beyond my comprehension.

People will go to far lengths to prove how much of a T0p red they are in supporting a hopeless and directionless manager.

You almost have to respect that level of commitment and delusion, almost.

 

[pseudo_canadian]

I have a friend in real life, as odd and unbelievable as it sounds in itself, who adamantly believes LVG will come good. ... I don't look at him the same, and will certainly NOT be wishing him a happy valentines today.

Cold-blooded.

 

[LeftyBlaster]

It's like those cases of hostages that suffer so much stress in a situation, that they actually begin to try justify what the hostage taker is doing, just to try bring some semblance of control over the situation in their puny minds.

Is that what they call Stockholm Syndrome?

 

[VP]

@Dr. Funkenstein, what are these spectacular over-achievements LVG is responsible for? If you're including winning the league with Barca and Bayern as a spectacular over-achievement, what would you call what's he done to United? Also, Mourinho's past it and LVG isn't?

Just face it, LVG was a good manager (and given what I've seen, I'd say more lucky than good) but right now he's competing with Moyes.

 

[SoCross]

I'm confused though. We've seen some really good performances and then some abysmal ones...why this inconsistency?!! Is that down to the manager or the playing staff?

 

[Dr. Funkenstein]

@Dr. Funkenstein, what are these spectacular over-achievements LVG is responsible for? If you're including winning the league with Barca and Bayern as a spectacular over-achievement,

No.

what would you call what's he done to United?

Disappointing.

Also, Mourinho's past it and LVG isn't?

Mourinho did worse in his last job and his previous one. Just facts. People are clinging on to a false sense of security, like Mourinho is certain to be succesful, while he messed up at Chelsea and was a disappointment at Real and his antics have only become more desperate.

Just face it, LVG was a good manager (and given what I've seen, I'd say more lucky than good)

So you haven't seen much?

but right now he's competing with Moyes.

In points yes. But the problem with LvG's United is the inconsistency, I don't think anyone has problems with the best football United have played under Van Gaal. The problem with Moyes was the consistency, I don't think anyone was satisfied with the best football Moyes' United has played.

It hasn't worked out, but at least there was a plan. Why it hasn't worked isn't an easy question to answer, but the idea that the manager doesn't know what he's doing is just as reasssuring as it is stupid. Just change the manager for a suppused certain PL-winner, and everything will be sunshine and hallelujah again. Yeah, right.

 

[JPRouve]

Mourinho did worse in his last job and his previous one. Just facts. People are clinging on to a false sense of security, like Mourinho is certain to be succesful, while he messed up at Chelsea and was a disappointment at Real and his antics have only become more desperate.

That's factually wrong, Mourinho and Chelsea are the current champions of England and he won La Liga and reached the CL semi finals every year with Real Madrid.

 

[Dr. Funkenstein]

That's factually wrong, Mourinho and Chelsea are the current champions of England and he won La Liga and reached the CL semi finals every year with Real Madrid.

You want to sack the manager because he hasn't done well enough this year, OK that's fair, but you want to replace by a manager who has done much worse this year? That doesn't seem very sensible to me.

Was this just a one off then? I don't think so, his troubles with the players and the fysio have a lot to do with his methods. In his previous job, he also had troubles with the players and the performances ended up beeing disappointing, while Van Gaal in his previous job was overachieving considerably. I think the success of Mourinho was based on the players having unconditional confidence in him, he knew how to get that but has somehow lost this ability. If he walks into a club right now, players will look different at him than when he met his new players at Inter for example.

 

[lem8sh]

How the feck this thread is even in existence is beyond my comprehension.

It makes great reading entertainment, absolute batshit crazy theories banded about.

 

[bugmat]

Yes he said he wanted ADM, got him and then sold him inside 12 months because he stifled the life out of him, he also decided the player who has been named Bundesliga player of the month three months running wasn't worthy of playing for United anymore, and also decided it was a good idea to shift out good squad players without any real replacement, it was more through luck than planning that we managed to get Martial in at the last minute imo, imagine where we'd be without him.

Then people harp on about the youth, other than Lingard which offensive player has been given a proper chance? Wilson loaned, Januzaj loaned, Pereria never played, etc, he has been forced into playing players lile McNair, Blackett, Varela, and Borthwick-Jackson through sheer lack of options, the fact Borthwick-Jackson looks a good player is sheer good luck imo, he also deems it fit to constantly play two DM to protect these players.

There is no progression, no style, no fight, people give him so much benefit of doubt becasue of what he's done in the past, but he is done at the top now, the fact we have persisted 18 months with this says more about our club management than anything else, the mid boggles that people still stand by him at this point, but it seems some do.

Totally agree - a stroke of luck Monaco failed to qualify or we'd have no martial and be back in 11th or 12th place right about now. Almost all the youth have been played due to a raft of injuries at the back rather than any philosophy. Given how much he's stripped the squad he had no choice. Pereira is one of our most talented youth and he can't get a look in, the use of Wilson, then Powell & Keane have been throws of the dice rather than any strategem. We need to move on.

 

[ShakeUnBake]

I know a lot about the philosophy of Louis van Gaal, and it is not so much a formation or a specific way of playing. It is getting your players to think on the pitch instead of reacting on instinct. For whatever reason, it doesn't seem to be working out.

Maybe the game has passed him by, or maybe the players aren't up to it. Maybe a bit of both.

 

[Roboc7]

You want to sack the manager because he hasn't done well enough this year, OK that's fair, but you want to replace by a manager who has done much worse this year? That doesn't seem very sensible to me.

Was this just a one off then? I don't think so, his troubles with the players and the fysio have a lot to do with his methods. In his previous job, he also had troubles with the players and the performances ended up beeing disappointing, while Van Gaal in his previous job was overachieving considerably. I think the success of Mourinho was based on the players having unconditional confidence in him, he knew how to get that but has somehow lost this ability. If he walks into a club right now, players will look different at him than when he met his new players at Inter for example.

You may have a point about mourinho but the problem is LVG suffers from all the same flaws as well and his failures far outweigh the mourinhos, even when things go well for LVG it tends to end badly and with him falling out with people.

Too many people were/are taken in with this idea of LVG as some sort of genius, he isn't and never has been that. He fails as often as he succeeds and he can only be successful for short spells, mourinho has baggage but wherever he goes he has been a success, LVG hasn't been able to do the same because he is dependent on having the right players and things going his way, he lacks too many skills to succeed more regularly.

Mourinho is a better motivator, better tactician and better at adapting, his teams even play good football at times but he adapts to win something LVG simply can't do, maybe mourinho has peaked but he would still be better than LVG, at this point anyone would to be honest because there is nothing to suggest LVG has any hope of turning things round.