This line of thinking has been amply discussed in the other thread.
Westminster Politics
- Thread starter altodevil
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This line of thinking has been amply discussed in the other thread.
I know, but when people spout shite like that it needs a reply.
You’ll let the Tories destroy the NHS, shovel shit in our waterways, pull billions out from our pockets to their donors, but Labour make one crass ad and suddenly it proves their absolutely no different.
It’s pathetic & simply showing the gaslighting is working!
So you’re ok to let one of the worst collections of individuals in the history of the country to continue in power?
The people who enable the Tories are the people that vote for them, instead of getting angry at the people moving away from labour either call out the shitty behaviour of the Labour party that is causing it, or the people that vote for the Tories and actively damage the country. If you want to endorse what Labour are doing, go for it, that's your prerogative.
See above.
I'd rather the Conservatives out, to be honest.
If that helps you sleep at night then go right ahead, but unless you’re tactically voting to oust your Tory MP then splitting the vote will only help then remain in government.
They won’t give a shit how it happens, so whilst they get another 5yrs of fecking our country dry, I guess you’ll be able to hold your head up high because you didn’t vote Labour, because of a crass advert.
No one gives a shit how they win.
The fact that instead of trying to find ways to encourage people to vote for Labour, or encourage Labour to be more appealing, you're on a forum trying to guilt trip and shame people into voting on them should be a big fecking neon sign for you, but apparently it isn't.
I’m fecking desperate to boot out these corrupt Tories from office!!!
I’d love for Labour to be better than Starmer right now but they aren’t.
Unfortunately they’re the only viable option in this FPTP two-party system. So you have two options:
- believe that a party headed by a former head of the CPS will have more integrity than the incumbent government
- decide that you’re happy for the Tories to win again as long as you can hold your head up high and say you voted for a party that had no earthly chance of gaining power
Again, I’d love for Labour to be the most honourable version they’ve ever been, but in this climate I’ll take what we have.
I’ve offered policy that they’ve offered / are offering and it gets turned around by those with bad faith, and the suggestion that their holding MPs to account is some crazed attempt to purge the left out of it.
If you can’t see that a party that offers more beneficial policy & holds their MPs to greater account is better than this horrific government that’s looked to tear away our workers and human rights, then I’m done with you.
Starmer is a proven liar with a track record as bad as Boris Johnson. He reneged on his 10 pledges for Labour leadership and will really do exactly the same on any "policy" announcements when he is PM. I'm afraid he can't be trusted. If you can't see that then I don't know what additional evidence you need.
He's also dangerously authoritarian which should be a red flag for a future PM.
So you ask me to offer policy and when I do you just say, “I don’t believe he’ll do that”
Absolute joke!
Meanwhile you’ll let this cabal that’s looking to strip back our rights and return the country to the Victorian era run amok !
This is exactly why I ask in my thread what the fecking point is!
We let the perfect be the enemy of the good whilst letting the ghouls run amok & carry on with their corruption.
Nothing will change until we acknowledge that, in order to change we need to crawl before we can walk, then walk before we can run.
We let the perfect be the enemy of the good whilst letting the ghouls run amok & carry on with their corruption.
Nothing will change until we acknowledge that, in order to change we need to crawl before we can walk, then walk before we can run.
I think the positive is that the points of view often expressed on this forum don't translate to what you will see from the majority of the public. Polling is still very positive for change.
I stand corrected, I forgot scousersI feel that the Labour Party can evolve in the right way should they get in. They have some competent people on the opposition bench.
however I feel with this collection of Tories, what you see is what you get. There’s no evolving in a good way for them. You know what they get up too. A vote to keep them in power is simply shouting yourself in the foot
You really need to stop enabling this bunch and get them out. Sure you may have to vote for someone else you don’t like but they can always change the leader. The Tories have changed leader multiple times and everyone has been an absolute disaster
I think you're being disingenuous here by trying to make out that that tweet is the only reason why people dislike current Labour. Will I hold my nose and vote for them? Not sure. Probably, to be honest. But that will be more through hatred of the Tories than any appreciation of the Labour Party.
I personally wouldn’t vote Labour currently because it would be a vindication of how awful they are at the moment. It would be seen as “see, you win by being a Tory lite party”… so that is all we will get served up in future. Tory A team and Tory B team. It’s a shame because I live in a seat which has a very reasonable chance to turn red for the first time ever.
I don’t care to be frank if it sounds disingenuous- look at what the Tories have done to the country and it’s people in the last 13yrs and then try and suggest that people claiming that Labour would be ‘just as bad’ aren’t somehow (I’ll be generous and say) ‘forgetful’ of the full extent of Tory corruption and destruction.
Well then be ready to spend the next 5yrs whinging about the next Tory government but take solace that you, ‘voted with your heart’.
So, Labour are bad so I can’t vote for them which means that the worse lot will get to carry on as if nothing happened!
Tbh there is very little difference between the two parties. “Left wing” policy from Labour is meaningless as they’ve backtracked on everything from the leadership contest. So any moral uproar is just pointless.
Vote for whoever, it’s not going to have much effect on the problems the country is facing.
Vote for whoever, it’s not going to have much effect on the problems the country is facing.
As things currently are I'll be voting for Liberal Democrats next time around. The country does need rid of the Tories but Starmer and Labour haven't shown they're capable of anything resembling leadership either. The best hope is a hung parliament where one of them needs another party to gain a majority, and keep a lid on any of the more insane policies they might want to enact. Realistically Labour plus Lib Dems would be most likely, but a term of government where nothing much gets done is better than the shite either of them would love to do if they got a simple majority.
Are the Lib Dems likely to win in your constituency? Are the 1st or 2nd t9 the Tories? If not you are wasting your vote.
"The tories got in in 2019 because of Corbyn. If they get in in 2024, it's because of YOU!"
It's never Centrists' fault. It's always the Left's.
It's never Centrists' fault. It's always the Left's.
The likelihood is I wouldn’t vote but yeah… I mean, I’d spend the next 5 years moaning about either shit Government.
Neither the Tories or Labour are offering meaningful change. Just a continuation of the the sort of policies that have screwed our country for most of my adult life. When Labour get in and don’t significantly improve things for most people… what do we think will happen? I suspect plenty of anger, disillusionment and the rise of a populist right-wing.
There’s not even an offence of “possession of a firearm with intent to harm”.
If you fast forward six years and say Labour wins the GE next year.
From the outside Labour look like a very slightly less incompetent and evil version of the current Tory government.
However, when you're approaching the subsequent GE in say 2029 is Starmer going to reverse all or any of the things that have been and will be put in place before the next GE.
As the next few years are going to be much tougher than the last few years, yep good old Brexit amongst other things, Starmer is unlikely to get re-elected in 2029 - so is all this Tory-lite and daren't mention Brexit going to be complete waste of time as the Tories will undoubtedly be back in 2029. Or is it because Starmer just wants to be PM and couldn't give a t*ss about principles or the country and spend five years trying to placate the same people who voted to get the UK in this mess?
Both parties are awful and nobody has the guts to do anything about it. In fifty years time future generations will be having the same discussions and nothing will have changed.
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I fear that unless everyone votes strategically this time around, splitting the vote is not going to be enough
Labour putting out unsubstantiated claims in ad campaigns has got everyone talking about it... as intended I'm sure.
I don't really get or like the ad- there are so many better attack lines, eg the NHS.
A large part of me doesn't give a shit though, particularly when you remember stuff like this.
A large part of me doesn't give a shit though, particularly when you remember stuff like this.
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/...tarmer-after-unproven-savile-claims-br0nd67cv
Aye, similar thoughts here. I'd rather they didn't try and label it as a Sunak thing rather than a Tory thing as well.
But when Sunak comes out with the following every week it's hard to care: https://www.upday.com/uk/rishi-sunak-pmqs-amid-asylum-seekers-criticism
The good thing about this ad fiasco is that from now on we'll surely finally see high levels of scrutiny over unsubstantiated and/or calumnious claims made by all political parties and their members.
Benton must've really pissed someone off at the Times
https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https://www...gainst-gambling-watchdog-candidates-dwn0ghtx0
https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https://www...gainst-gambling-watchdog-candidates-dwn0ghtx0
If you don't know by now that Starmer will say anything, but then renege on it at the first opportunity, then you need to look into all his broken promises over the last 3-4 years.
In addition to that, the policies are weak - hardly a large vision. Just a slight tweak on the Tories.
We have a choice, Victorian era Tories or Authoritarian liar Starmer who silences and purges any voices who dare to question him. Not to mention he now has the same corporate funding sources as the Tories after alienating many Labour members.
Yes, we need the Tories out, but within a few years of Starmer as PM the dissatisfaction with him will be just as large. The fault lies with Starmer for this lack of trust in him.
Way I see it, starmers job is to get the foot in the door and get labour elected. I don't see him lasting as PM but I do see him getting labour elected, then eventually standing down. Think someone more "left" will take over at that point and we'll see more left policies.
Home Office admits no evidence to support key claim on small boat crossings
UK government concedes it cannot substantiate assertion that majority crossing Channel are economic migrants
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...-to-support-key-claim-on-small-boat-crossings
UK government concedes it cannot substantiate assertion that majority crossing Channel are economic migrants
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...-to-support-key-claim-on-small-boat-crossings