Westminster Politics

Mr Pigeon said:
Oh totally. They practically had the same upbringing after all.

Sunak was raised in this house.

the-childhood-home-of-rishi-sunak-at-number-21-spindlewood-close-on-picture-id1436669359


And Starmer was raised in a totally identical house that doesn't at all look like a council one.

EdTYby6WAAIM3nG.jpg


Combine that with Starmer going to a state school and Sunak going private, plus their personal career progressions being nearly identical where Starmer had to succeed whilst Sunak coasted, and yeah I can see why they are completely the same.

And, of course, we all know that once we start making money we immediately forget everything from our past. Because of selective amnesia or something. I haven't quite figured out where we're going to move the goalposts next so hopefully you'll oblige
Click to expand...

It's a good job the Queen isn't around anymore, she'd have had his head cut off for living in a bigger house than her! Do you need to grow up in a UN tent to have had a modest upbringing in your view? There are millions of people living in houses like that up and down the country. Probably half the people in this thread complaining about his wealth grew up in houses just like it. I mean, its hardly the stuff of Lords and Ladies is it?

@Frosty nailed it. Who cares how they grew up? Neither of them grew up as silver spoon Eton boys. What matters is the policies they bring. Right now we don't know, Sunak hasn't been in the job a week, yet everybody has already written him off. Why? Envy would be the most likely bet.
 
T00lsh3d said:
So, you’re not fussed on whether they went to private school or not? Good, going to private school doesn’t default make you a cnut as this thread would seem to believe
Click to expand...

I don't think you lot understand why diversity is important. It's not about whether one of them went to private school or not, it's about whether all of the feckers went to private school or just some proportion representative(ish) of the population. End of the day, getting a good education is important if you want to run a country, but going to Eton does not automatically equal getting a good education. You need different perspectives, experiences and ideas in order to run a successful, resilient, adaptable government. Same as you do for a business, a charity, a sports team...
 
11101 said:
It's a good job the Queen isn't around anymore, she'd have had his head cut off for living in a bigger house than her! Do you need to grow up in a UN tent to have had a modest upbringing in your view? There are millions of people living in houses like that up and down the country. Probably half the people in this thread complaining about his wealth grew up in houses just like it. I mean, its hardly the stuff of Lords and Ladies is it?

@Frosty nailed it. Who cares how they grew up? Neither of them grew up as silver spoon Eton boys. What matters is the policies they bring. Right now we don't know, Sunak hasn't been in the job a week, yet everybody has already written him off. Why? Envy would be the most likely bet.
Click to expand...

Sunak is literally on record saying/laughing he has no working class friends. He’s public schooled, took a fat dividend as a result of the 2008 crisis and has very recently said he wants to change the way deprived areas get funding.

He is patently not cut from the same cloth as Starmer or anyone else in the Labour party that much is obvious.

He didn’t go to public school, study PPE at Oxford and work at Goldman in a vacuum. Opinions are shaped by those around you and he’s been surrounded by the ultra rich his entire life without even mentioning his wife and her family. It’s not envy, but an obviously strong signal of where his priorities will be lying.
 
11101 said:
It's a good job the Queen isn't around anymore, she'd have had his head cut off for living in a bigger house than her! Do you need to grow up in a UN tent to have had a modest upbringing in your view? There are millions of people living in houses like that up and down the country. Probably half the people in this thread complaining about his wealth grew up in houses just like it. I mean, its hardly the stuff of Lords and Ladies is it?

@Frosty nailed it. Who cares how they grew up? Neither of them grew up as silver spoon Eton boys. What matters is the policies they bring. Right now we don't know, Sunak hasn't been in the job a week, yet everybody has already written him off. Why? Envy would be the most likely bet.
Click to expand...
Envy? No, track record/history, we’ve already seen how he said he took from poor areas to give to a rich area. You simply just need to delve into his history. Private school doesn’t make him a cnut but his actions do.

and after the shambles of Cameron, May, Johnson and truss, people have a right to be skeptical
 
11101 said:
It's a good job the Queen isn't around anymore, she'd have had his head cut off for living in a bigger house than her! Do you need to grow up in a UN tent to have had a modest upbringing in your view? There are millions of people living in houses like that up and down the country. Probably half the people in this thread complaining about his wealth grew up in houses just like it. I mean, its hardly the stuff of Lords and Ladies is it?

@Frosty nailed it. Who cares how they grew up? Neither of them grew up as silver spoon Eton boys. What matters is the policies they bring. Right now we don't know, Sunak hasn't been in the job a week, yet everybody has already written him off. Why? Envy would be the most likely bet.
Click to expand...


Possibly because he hasnt just appeared out of thin air? He's already had plenty of controversies in his time prior to becoming pm, just like Boris,Truss & May.

Then theres his cabinet...
 
Head of ITV news leaving her post to head up Sunak’s comms team.

One big circle jerk.
 
Sunak's dad was a GP and his mum owned a pharmacy. I can tell you that pharmacists who own pharmacies are the richest of the health professionals. I used to chair a Local Pharmaceutical Committee and it was like a motor show outside our offices when they had a meeting.

Funny story - we used to provide a small buffet as it was an evening meeting. One day we had lots of bags of crisps left over. As they were leaving, I asked if anyone wanted to take a bag of crisps. They all lined up for the freebie. That's how rich people stay rich.
 
@Frosty

Attlee may have been privileged but he went and lived among the poverty in his constituency of Stepney in his early political career. He was dedicated to public service in a way few politicians are now, let alone a guy like Sunak. I think that you have to look at it on a case by case basis rather than saying wealth and privilege does matter or doesn't matter at all.

edit: you did pretty much say that in your post!
 
Last edited:
Frosty said:
John Major left school with 3 O-Levels at the age of 16, with his parents health and finances poor, and living out of a small flat in Brixton.

Ramsay Macdonald was born illegitimate in the mid 19th century, and left school at 15 to work on a farm, becoming a teacher and dragging himself up by his bootstraps. He became a trades unionist and worked with the poor in London and Bristol, trying to better their lives.

Clement Attlee attended public school then Oxford, and used his family connections to get a well-paid job as a lawyer.

Two were shite, and the other built a Britain whose structures and welfare state we still enjoy.

I don't care about where they come from, I care much more about whether they have the ideas to change the lives of the millions of people who are barely hanging on by their fingertips, in what is meant to be a highly developed country in 2022.

I remain underwhelmed by Starmer and his non-existent plans. That wouldn't change if he had the upbringing Sunk did, or even if he left school illiterate at 16 and had been working minimum wage jobs for the past thirty plus years.
Click to expand...
Yep pretty much all of this.
 
golden_blunder said:
Envy? No, track record/history, we’ve already seen how he said he took from poor areas to give to a rich area. You simply just need to delve into his history. Private school doesn’t make him a cnut but his actions do.

and after the shambles of Cameron, May, Johnson and truss, people have a right to be skeptical
Click to expand...

Valid, but that's not why half this forum and wider public dislike him is it? It's his bank account and his wife. Thats what the majority of the memes and Twitter posts are all about. He's massively successful and wealthy and people hate him for that.

He's in charge whether we like it or not so why not see what he does before writing him off. If he's shit, he'll be gone in 2 years. But the worst thing for the country is another witch hunt and another leadership upheaval.
 
Sunak is young, fit, energetic and diverse, that’s a real novelty and fresh air at the very top, which is nice to see… he also seems to care a little more than Truss and Johnson. His first PMQs was pretty boyish and Starmer appeared short of breath compared to him, like a middle-aged teacher following the tail of a scoundrel. I mean, Labour need a change at top as well imho: would a Cooper + Rayner ticket destroy any Tory leader inside and outside Westminster?
 
Also it’s a British thing to value more the class background of someones upbringing rather than current class position that person may hold.

It’s a country where everyone sees themselves as working class because their granddad knew a guy who worked in a coal mine.
 
11101 said:
He's massively successful and wealthy and people hate him for that.
Click to expand...

He is also brown and married into wealth - probably the most “important” thing he did at Stanford.

That said, he has done well for himself but most of his “massive success” comes from his wife’s family.
 
11101 said:
Valid, but that's not why half this forum and wider public dislike him is it? It's his bank account and his wife. Thats what the majority of the memes and Twitter posts are all about. He's massively successful and wealthy and people hate him for that.

He's in charge whether we like it or not so why not see what he does before writing him off. If he's shit, he'll be gone in 2 years. But the worst thing for the country is another witch hunt and another leadership upheaval.
Click to expand...

A lot of people find his vast wealth and £4k suits alienating. Many people in the country are struggling financially so they doubt that someone as wealthy as Sunak can understand them and their struggles. I don't think it's envy, it's an issue of relatability.

Bepi said:
Sunak is young, fit, energetic and diverse, that’s a real novelty and fresh air at the very top, which is nice to see… he also seems to care a little more than Truss and Johnson. His first PMQs was pretty boyish and Starmer appeared short of breath compared to him, like a middle-aged teacher following the tail of a scoundrel. I mean, Labour need a change at top as well imho: would a Cooper + Rayner ticket destroy any Tory leader inside and outside Westminster?
Click to expand...

I'm not sure that many people would describe this as a dream ticket! Andy Burham is the most popular Labour politician going by the polls. In terms of pure electability I think him and Lisa Nandy would be Labours best hand. There's Dan Jarvis too, he's a former special forces commander but I'm not sure if he's interested in front line politics.
 
Last edited:
Buster15 said:
Maybe.
But in my opinion, climate change is not something you play games with.
Remember. Net Zero has been put into legislation to ensure that government departments must comply. Assuming of course that you actually believe in the methods used to validate it....

If the Tories still believe in Global Britain, we do need to show that on something as serious as climate change, we can be relied on to keep our promise.
Click to expand...

I agree, unfortunately it is something that because of the short-term nature (as well as political life) of our parliaments, 'games' will be played, not only in the UK but around the world. Whilst (now) virtually every country accepts the climate change threat and signs up to various targets, every government, in every country, when push comes to shove will find there are somethings of a short-term nature that take precedence.

Whether we like it or not we do all live 'in the moment', yes, we can 'resolve to do better', but the past is past, and the future will take care of itself... a sad fact but true.
 
11101 said:
Valid, but that's not why half this forum and wider public dislike him is it? It's his bank account and his wife. Thats what the majority of the memes and Twitter posts are all about. He's massively successful and wealthy and people hate him for that.

He's in charge whether we like it or not so why not see what he does before writing him off. If he's shit, he'll be gone in 2 years. But the worst thing for the country is another witch hunt and another leadership upheaval.
Click to expand...

Nothing wrong with wanting the Tories in turmoil
 
11101 said:
Valid, but that's not why half this forum and wider public dislike him is it? It's his bank account and his wife. Thats what the majority of the memes and Twitter posts are all about. He's massively successful and wealthy and people hate him for that.

He's in charge whether we like it or not so why not see what he does before writing him off. If he's shit, he'll be gone in 2 years. But the worst thing for the country is another witch hunt and another leadership upheaval.
Click to expand...
That’s literally the straw man you’ve been arguing about in this thread. He’s criticised because he’s completely out of touch. People discuss his wealth and upbringing because it’s the root cause of him being so out of touch.
 
11101 said:
It's a good job the Queen isn't around anymore, she'd have had his head cut off for living in a bigger house than her! Do you need to grow up in a UN tent to have had a modest upbringing in your view? There are millions of people living in houses like that up and down the country. Probably half the people in this thread complaining about his wealth grew up in houses just like it. I mean, its hardly the stuff of Lords and Ladies is it?

@Frosty nailed it. Who cares how they grew up? Neither of them grew up as silver spoon Eton boys. What matters is the policies they bring. Right now we don't know, Sunak hasn't been in the job a week, yet everybody has already written him off. Why? Envy would be the most likely bet.
Click to expand...
Envy? :lol:

If he's been written off it's because he is in the same party that has failed miserably for 12 years. With many many of the same failures in his cabinet.
 
Mr Pigeon said:
Oh totally. They practically had the same upbringing after all.

Sunak was raised in this house.

the-childhood-home-of-rishi-sunak-at-number-21-spindlewood-close-on-picture-id1436669359


And Starmer was raised in a totally identical house that doesn't at all look like a council one.

EdTYby6WAAIM3nG.jpg


Combine that with Starmer going to a state school and Sunak going private, plus their personal career progressions being nearly identical where Starmer had to succeed whilst Sunak coasted, and yeah I can see why they are completely the same.

And, of course, we all know that once we start making money we immediately forget everything from our past. Because of selective amnesia or something. I haven't quite figured out where we're going to move the goalposts next so hopefully you'll oblige
Click to expand...

Rishi looks like he grew up in a middle class family tending towards the more affluent end but the crucial thing is that his parents sent him to one of the most prestigious private schools in the UK. It put him in contact with the elite society.
 
Classical Mechanic said:
Rishi looks like he grew up in a middle class family tending towards the more affluent end but the crucial thing is that his parents sent him to one of the most prestigious private schools in the UK. It put him in contact with the elite society.
Click to expand...

Pretty typical for both upper middle class East and South Asians families in the US, not sure how it is in the UK. Education and sending kids to the top schools and colleges always takes priority over other luxuries.
 
SinNombre said:
Pretty typical for both upper middle class East and South Asians families in the US, not sure how it is in the UK. Education and sending kids to the top schools and colleges always takes priority over other luxuries.
Click to expand...

Over here it seems to be the same. I saw a documentary about class barriers to success presented by a guy called Amol Rajan. He grew up on a council estate in London, got into Cambridge and is now a presenter at the BBC. They spoke to his dad who said he wouldn't be happy about his son's achievements until he won a Nobel Prize. He was being serious. The ambition that Indian parents have for their kids is crazy.
 
Ah, now I know how the government is going to claw back money. We started going over the threshold for tax credits at the start of the year, so about six months ago we got a letter saying they've stopped payments, and for the last few months they've overpaid us and we owe them over £300. No bother, paid them. Over and done with.

Like a bunch of gangsters they've sent a new letter. They've overpaid us again and we owe them another £200. They've been paying us feck all since the start of the year. Didn't challenge the first one but you can bet to feck I will for this one.
 
Last edited:
Frosty said:


Thread.
Click to expand...

''Your dreams can come true''. Ok then why is he running for political office ? It's becoming a real habit of Starmer is say everything is bad due to the tories but then to also agree with the government. There was a story online a while back(So most likely rubbish I guess)that when Starmer was trying to ''negotiate'' some type of soft brexit deal demands, the tories simply reprinted his own demands and put it back to him. Starmer replied that these demands were completely unrealistic and impossible. Apparently he got very red in the face when it was pointed out to him what had happened.

For a lawyer, the guy isn't the brightest. Although as the polls show none of this matters.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.