Westminster Politics


State of these Tory MPs.

I wonder if people will ever realise the smear campaign against Labour last election was just that. At the very least, they were certainly the lesser of 2 evils.

Most of the dirt thrown at Labour could have been thrown at the Tories ten times over if the media coverage was not so biased.
 
In a room full of bastards, Priti Patel stands head and shoulders above the rest...

Boris Johnson could block release of investigation into Priti Patel bullying, head of civil service says

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/ukne...llying-head-of-civil-service-says/ar-BB1aixnx

And then there's this...

Child refugees ‘betrayed’ by UK as Home Office sends them to adult detention centres

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/ukne...s-them-to-adult-detention-centres/ar-BB1ajO8S

But calling them scum is apparently beyond the limits of acceptable behaviour.
 
Seems to be a running theme with the Tories. 'Stop being mean/loud Labour, or we'll reject everything.' Pathetic response, it's really disgusting.
It doesn't even work as a logical argument.

She called the bloke scum because he was already arguing that the government shouldn't fund kids during school holidays.

She was being generous to him.
 

Phil Davies. Known for not only consistently reducing all benefits of any kind for anyone, but also not supporting VAT rises or fair pay for anyone who makes less than £150k a year. So I'm not sure how he intends for people to be able to pay for it themselves.

Oh, wait. I forgot. He's a cnut who lives in a bubble.
 
The absolute gall of this. After all of the stuff their MPs have said including recent comments about do good lawyers. Pathetic. It’s obvious these comments are related to their vote on free school meals and they are gaslighting.

 
The absolute gall of this. After all of the stuff their MPs have said including recent comments about do good lawyers. Pathetic. It’s obvious these comments are related to their vote on free school meals and they are gaslighting.


They're either the biggest narcissists on the planet or they're using typical bully tactics. Being Tories I wouldn't be surprised if it's both.
 
The absolute gall of this. After all of the stuff their MPs have said including recent comments about do good lawyers. Pathetic. It’s obvious these comments are related to their vote on free school meals and they are gaslighting.



She's getting roasted in the comments. Wankers are so out of touch is astonishing, distract, distract, distract seems to the be their strategy.
 
The tories literally are scum though. Can't see how they can complain about that one.
 
The Tories have been abusing the poor, the disabled, minorities, children for the last over 10 years. They are scum and they are cnuts. Not in a my team is better than your team way but a literally hurting people way:

https://www.ohchr.org/Documents/Issues/Poverty/EOM_GB_16Nov2018.pdf
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Kingdom_government_austerity_programme#Child_poverty
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...ism-muslim-gay-comments-columns-a9214561.html

If this country is worth a penny then these bastards should be receiving an endless stream of abuse for their cruelty. Maybe if you're in the opposition you would be better off maintaining a polite facade but the public have every right to give them dog's abuse.
 
What I find astonishing is that they consistently have opportunity to win some kind of goodwill or at least not damage their reputation further, yet they don’t give a shit enough even for that.

To think getting a 3 grand pay rise during of all of this was a good idea is just so incredibly disrespectful to the country.

I know that’s old news now but I can’t stop thinking about how ridiculous it is. They could’ve made a song and dance about not doing so. You’d think they’d be clambering to get some good press, anything, but nope, not a single feck was given.
 
Precious fecking wankers... Can spend the whole week throwing all sorts of insults/assumptions at the poorest in our nation... But get called a scum and its the end of the world.
 
What I find astonishing is that they consistently have opportunity to win some kind of goodwill or at least not damage their reputation further, yet they don’t give a shit enough even for that.

To think getting a 3 grand pay rise during of all of this was a good idea is just so incredibly disrespectful to the country.


I know that’s old news now but I can’t stop thinking about how ridiculous it is. They could’ve made a song and dance about not doing so. You’d think they’d be clambering to get some good press, anything, but nope, not a single feck was given.
Tbh we don't pay anywhere close to enough to attract the top talent to become mp's given the nature and responsibilities of the roll ... thats probably half the problem as to why we end up with the quality of mps we have
 
What I find astonishing is that they consistently have opportunity to win some kind of goodwill or at least not damage their reputation further, yet they don’t give a shit enough even for that.

To think getting a 3 grand pay rise during of all of this was a good idea is just so incredibly disrespectful to the country.

I know that’s old news now but I can’t stop thinking about how ridiculous it is. They could’ve made a song and dance about not doing so. You’d think they’d be clambering to get some good press, anything, but nope, not a single feck was given.

MPs pay is set by IPSA and I'm not sure there's a mechanism to reject it without fundamentally rewriting the role of IPSA.

Not sure who is in charge there, but I once applied for a job with them and they didn't even acknowledge it so I assume they're all cnuts.

Seems likes it would be a cheap win for Labour to bring that to the Commons though and force the Conservatives to vote for their own pay rise.
 
Tbh we don't pay anywhere close to enough to attract the top talent to become mp's given the nature and responsibilities of the roll ... thats probably half the problem as to why we end up with the quality of mps we have
Hmm not sure I agree with that. Attraction to money is surely one of the issues with MPs at the moment.

The biggest problem though is career politicians, looking for any way to leave a mark and make their way up the ladder by any means possible. Boris completely switching what he supposedly believed in with Brexit has to be the biggest example of that fecking the country.
 
The tories literally are scum though. Can't see how they can complain about that one.
Because it goes against parliamentary procedure and they strive to maintain all of the historic practices possible so they can pretend they're dignified people. It's nothing but a veneer of prestige but when you don't have to worry about normal things - like keeping a roof over your head or working a job with low wages and high risk of being held accountable for your actions - you have the luxury of being concerned with this sort of bullshit without actually caring about following through with anything other than a thin veil of it. Sort of like when you hear that someone like Jacob Rees Mogg talking about his Christian beliefs when, at the same time, giving the middle finger to the poor.
 
The Saxby one is as bad. I assume they've been told to go on the attack because it was playing very badly for them, seems they've made it several times worse. I doubt the main stream media will pick any of it up.

 
Tbh we don't pay anywhere close to enough to attract the top talent to become mp's given the nature and responsibilities of the roll ... thats probably half the problem as to why we end up with the quality of mps we have
I very much doubt that. The MP wage of over £80k per year is no excuse for the billions of pounds of sweetener contracts going to Tory mates.

We need people with integrity, not people who want the highest amount of money.

Just trying to think of the last political leader around with any serious integrity, can't quite recall your views on him...
 
The Saxby one is as bad. I assume they've been told to go on the attack because it was playing very badly for them, seems they've made it several times worse. I doubt the main stream media will pick any of it up.


It’s astonishing really. As others have said they could have gotten some good PR by implementing a policy which in the grand scheme of things doesn’t even cost that much.

Scum is too kind a word for some of those Tory MP’s.
 
Precious fecking wankers... Can spend the whole week throwing all sorts of insults/assumptions at the poorest in our nation... But get called a scum and its the end of the world.
Killing folk for a decade but THIS is what gets them riled up. How dare someone be offensive to THEM.
 
Tbh we don't pay anywhere close to enough to attract the top talent to become mp's given the nature and responsibilities of the roll ... thats probably half the problem as to why we end up with the quality of mps we have

I think a bigger problem is that we have two party fptp politics but no primary system. So the incentive from the parties is to appoint shitty candidates who just follow the party line, and then in most seats there is no possibility of changing the candidate once they are in place.
Of course when the left tried to change that within the Labour Party they were made out to be extremists, but now we can all go back to wondering why MPs are bad.
 
I think a bigger problem is that we have two party fptp politics but no primary system. So the incentive from the parties is to appoint shitty candidates who just follow the party line, and then in most seats there is no possibility of changing the candidate once they are in place.
Of course when the left tried to change that within the Labour Party they were made out to be extremists, but now we can all go back to wondering why MPs are bad.
I agree a change to pr would also be a big benefit... personally I'd like compulsory voting similar to Australia as well (perhaps with a none of the above option on the ballot as well)
 
I very much doubt that. The MP wage of over £80k per year is no excuse for the billions of pounds of sweetener contracts going to Tory mates.

We need people with integrity, not people who want the highest amount of money.

Just trying to think of the last political leader around with any serious integrity, can't quite recall your views on him...

Guts and competence are at least as important as integrity in a successful politician.
 
Looking at it from the outside, the most obvious problem with UK PMs is the fact that they're nearly always from an Oxbridge background (over 3 out of every 4 since the 1720's I think). That speaks to a political system with very narrow borders, which the MPs fall into as well.
 
I found the school meal vote a gut wrencher. Years of austerity, cuts to benefits and all public services and the carnage of Universal Credit. Then a global pandemic. In light of all this, the majority of our MPs essentially vote not to feed children.
That blue block that voted against it live in such a completely different world to those that need it, I dont think they can empathize in the slightest. Scum doesn't begin to describe them. But in their world, name calling is probably their biggest problem. Feck the lot of them.
 
Looking at it from the outside, the most obvious problem with UK PMs is the fact that they're nearly always from an Oxbridge background (over 3 out of every 4 since the 1720's I think). That speaks to a political system with very narrow borders, which the MPs fall into as well.

I definitely agree with this. A significant number, certainly at the very top of the political field in this country, have all done the same degree to boot too, then gone straight into some job or other in either the city or in their party political apparatus and never done anything which would be considered by most 'normal' people in the country to approach their typical lives.

I try to be objective and empathetic in all aspects of my life but it is really difficult for me to look at Tory MPs with anything other than total contempt. And their conduct over the pandemic (really past 10 years) hasn't exactly helped the situation.
 
I definitely agree with this. A significant number, certainly at the very top of the political field in this country, have all done the same degree to boot too, then gone straight into some job or other in either the city or in their party political apparatus and never done anything which would be considered by most 'normal' people in the country to approach their typical lives.

I try to be objective and empathetic in all aspects of my life but it is really difficult for me to look at Tory MPs with anything other than total contempt. And their conduct over the pandemic (really past 10 years) hasn't exactly helped the situation.

In effect it means the country has a ruling class and a ruling culture, people who because of their background know from a relatively early age that they and their friends will inevitably run the country, either through politics, business, media or (for some individuals) all three.

Plus, as you say, that already narrow group is further whittled down by degree choice, as the below from a Guardian article highlights:

MONDAY, 13 April 2015 was a typical day in modern British politics. An Oxford University graduate in philosophy, politics and economics (PPE), Ed Miliband, launched the Labour party’s general election manifesto. It was examined by the BBC’s political editor, Oxford PPE graduate Nick Robinson, by the BBC’s economics editor, Oxford PPE graduate Robert Peston, and by the director of the Institute for Fiscal Studies, Oxford PPE graduate Paul Johnson. It was criticised by the prime minister, Oxford PPE graduate David Cameron. It was defended by the Labour shadow chancellor, Oxford PPE graduate Ed Balls.

Elsewhere in the country, with the election three weeks away, the Liberal Democrat chief secretary to the Treasury, Oxford PPE graduate Danny Alexander, was preparing to visit Kingston and Surbiton, a vulnerable London seat held by a fellow Lib Dem minister, Oxford PPE graduate Ed Davey. In Kent, one of Ukip’s two MPs, Oxford PPE graduate Mark Reckless, was campaigning in his constituency, Rochester and Strood. Comments on the day’s developments were being posted online by Michael Crick, Oxford PPE graduate and political correspondent of Channel 4 News.

On the BBC Radio 4 website, the Financial Times statistics expert and Oxford PPE graduate Tim Harford presented his first election podcast. On BBC1, Oxford PPE graduate and Newsnight presenter Evan Davies conducted the first of a series of interviews with party leaders. In the print media, there was an election special in the Economist magazine, edited by Oxford PPE graduate Zanny Minton-Beddoes; a clutch of election articles in the political magazine Prospect, edited by Oxford PPE graduate Bronwen Maddox; an election column in the Guardian by Oxford PPE graduate Simon Jenkins; and more election coverage in the Times and the Sun, whose proprietor, Rupert Murdoch, studied PPE at Oxford
 
Guts and competence are at least as important as integrity in a successful politician.
The current government have got lots of guts. I'll give them that. The gall of handing billions of taxpayers money to your friends/donors while criticising the opposing party for overspending requires it.
 
In effect it means the country has a ruling class and a ruling culture, people who because of their background know from a relatively early age that they and their friends will inevitably run the country, either through politics, business, media or (for some individuals) all three.

Plus, as you say, that already narrow group is further whittled down by degree choice, as the below from a Guardian article highlights:

MONDAY, 13 April 2015 was a typical day in modern British politics. An Oxford University graduate in philosophy, politics and economics (PPE), Ed Miliband, launched the Labour party’s general election manifesto. It was examined by the BBC’s political editor, Oxford PPE graduate Nick Robinson, by the BBC’s economics editor, Oxford PPE graduate Robert Peston, and by the director of the Institute for Fiscal Studies, Oxford PPE graduate Paul Johnson. It was criticised by the prime minister, Oxford PPE graduate David Cameron. It was defended by the Labour shadow chancellor, Oxford PPE graduate Ed Balls.

Elsewhere in the country, with the election three weeks away, the Liberal Democrat chief secretary to the Treasury, Oxford PPE graduate Danny Alexander, was preparing to visit Kingston and Surbiton, a vulnerable London seat held by a fellow Lib Dem minister, Oxford PPE graduate Ed Davey. In Kent, one of Ukip’s two MPs, Oxford PPE graduate Mark Reckless, was campaigning in his constituency, Rochester and Strood. Comments on the day’s developments were being posted online by Michael Crick, Oxford PPE graduate and political correspondent of Channel 4 News.

On the BBC Radio 4 website, the Financial Times statistics expert and Oxford PPE graduate Tim Harford presented his first election podcast. On BBC1, Oxford PPE graduate and Newsnight presenter Evan Davies conducted the first of a series of interviews with party leaders. In the print media, there was an election special in the Economist magazine, edited by Oxford PPE graduate Zanny Minton-Beddoes; a clutch of election articles in the political magazine Prospect, edited by Oxford PPE graduate Bronwen Maddox; an election column in the Guardian by Oxford PPE graduate Simon Jenkins; and more election coverage in the Times and the Sun, whose proprietor, Rupert Murdoch, studied PPE at Oxford

That was actually the exact article I was thinking of. It is a total moral failing of our political system. Do other countries have anything similar? France and the ENA potentially? I don't know enough about their politics and society to properly comment.
 
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...o-earn-only-20480-after-home-office-climbdown

Government reduces minimum salary for migrants to settle in UK

Interesting move, quietly introduced by the government in the last few days.

Which goes along with what I've been thinking since Brexit. I don't think the country will close in on itself but I do think our immigration numbers will stay roughly the same but the patterns are going to become a lot more......non-White :D.
 
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...o-earn-only-20480-after-home-office-climbdown

Government reduces minimum salary for migrants to settle in UK

Interesting move, quietly introduced by the government in the last few days.

Which goes along with what I've been thinking since Brexit. I don't think the country will close in on itself but I do think our immigration numbers will stay roughly the same but the patterns are going to become a lot more......non-White :D.
Wasn't that the assumption all along though? At least until the British economy truly becomes the brexit economy it is destined to become?
 
Wasn't that the assumption all along though? At least until the British economy truly becomes the brexit economy it is destined to become?

Was it the assumption all along? Certainly some of the people who voted Brexit wanted to totally slash immigration/ had racist reasons, while some people who voted remain tended to caricature all those who voted Brexit as being racist/ against all immigration.

One thing I'd tried to explain on here in the past, whilst trying to move past stereotypes, regarding why some people from immigrant backgrounds voted for Brexit is that, in their own words, they didn't feel it was right that a Frenchman or Italian should have it so much easier to come here than an Indian or Egyptian. Now I am not saying that their reasoning isn't still potentially dangerous for the country but its already being put into action and I imagine we will increasingly see the effects of this over the next years.

What exactly is the Brexit economy?
 
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Was it the assumption all along? Certainly some of the people who voted Brexit wanted to totally slash immigration/ had racist reasons, while some people who voted remain tended to caricature all those who voted Brexit as being racist/ against all immigration.

What exactly is the Brexit economy?
At this rate it's just going to be a bunch of former bankers and steel workers selling local marmalade and Hotpoint washing machines (if the parts from Germany and China make it through customs).
 
At this rate it's just going to be a bunch of former bankers and steel workers selling local marmalade and Hotpoint washing machines (if the parts from Germany and China make it through customs).

Ha! We will see what happens I guess.

I am as pessimistic as most about the short to medium term impact of Brexit (as well as sad about what it says about us as a country) but perhaps slightly less pessimistic than many about the longer term impact.