Wesley Sneijder

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Scoreboard Red said:
Indeed I did.
I hope we keep Carrick and he regains his 2006-2008 form but if we were to get Sneijder, and that's a big IF, we'd have a guy who does the job of Carrick and Scholes in one.
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No we won't. Sneidjer can't defend or at least can defend as good as Carrick. He will be a direct replacement for Scholes and I m fine with that.
 
RDCR07 said:
No we won't. Sneidjer can't defend or at least can defend as good as Carrick. He will be a direct replacement for Scholes and I m fine with that.
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We wouldn't be looking at buying Sneijder to defend mate, and Carrick is hardly the most accomplished defender either, come on.
Sneijder can pass the ball around as well as these two as well as dictate the tempo, take free-kicks and get in and around the box, plus he's got goals in him and he's a big game player as his record in the Champions League and the World Cup for Holland suggests.
 
Scoreboard Red said:
We wouldn't be looking at buying Sneijder to defend mate, and Carrick is hardly the most accomplished defender either, come on.
Sneijder can pass the ball around as well as these two as well as dictate the tempo, take free-kicks and get in and around the box, plus he's got goals in him and he's a big game player as his record in the Champions League and the World Cup for Holland suggests.
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Carrick is a hugely accomplished defensive midfielder.
 
R_Nick said:
Carrick is a hugely accomplished defensive midfielder.
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A defensive midfielder is someone like Gattuso, Makelele, Hargreaves etc, not Carrick.
Carrick is a passer, plain and simple - as a midfielder, scrap that, as a footballer you're called upon to make tackles during a match but he is not defensive, he is a passer.
 
So the player to have made the most interceptions in the league isn't a defensive midfielder? When Carrick plays we concede, on average 0.57 goals, and when he doesn’t, we concede 1.15. But he's just a passer, he's not defensive.
 
Scoreboard Red said:
A defensive midfielder is someone like Gattuso, Makelele, Hargreaves etc, not Carrick.
Carrick is a passer, plain and simple - as a midfielder, scrap that, as a footballer you're called upon to make tackles during a match but he is not defensive, he is a passer.
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A defensive midfielder also makes interceptions and few are better than Carrick at doing that.
 
R_Nick said:
So the player to have made the most interceptions in the league isn't a defensive midfielder? When Carrick plays we concede, on average 0.57 goals, and when he doesn’t, we concede 1.15. But he's just a passer, he's not defensive.
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He is defensive so much so it is fair to call him a defender. He plays as deep this year Rio did in 2006-7
 
Scoreboard Red said:
A defensive midfielder is someone like Gattuso, Makelele, Hargreaves etc, not Carrick.
Carrick is a passer, plain and simple - as a midfielder, scrap that, as a footballer you're called upon to make tackles during a match but he is not defensive, he is a passer.
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Sergio Busquets is the best defensive midfielder in the world, he is very much cut from the same cloth as Carrick.
 
R_Nick said:
So the player to have made the most interceptions in the league isn't a defensive midfielder? When Carrick plays we concede, on average 0.57 goals, and when he doesn’t, we concede 1.15. But he's just a passer, he's not defensive.
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Christ, we're not gonna have three pages of this are we mate?
No, he's not a defensive midfielder, he's a passer. Throw any stats you want at me from Opta-Max dot com sponsored by Gatorade, but I watch the actual matches and Michael Carrick is a passing midfielder.
If you look at a profile of him on a website (without me even looking), I bet you can't find one that describes him as a defensive midfielder mate; I bet they will describe him as a 'passer of finesse' or something like that.
 
Cheltenham Red said:
A defensive midfielder also makes interceptions and few are better than Carrick at doing that.
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phelans shorts said:
Sergio Busquets is the best defensive midfielder in the world, he is very much cut from the same cloth as Carrick.
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OK, so Rafael is a right-winger then? Because he makes more runs forward than he defends, can we all agree on that then?
Carrick might make plenty of interceptions, but he's a midfielder and they are required to do so.
Beckham used to track back and tackle but he wasn't defensive.
Alan Smith used to track back and tackle, and he was a striker.
 
Scoreboard Red said:
OK, so Rafael is a right-winger then? Because he makes more runs forward than he defends, can we all agree on that then?
Carrick might make plenty of interceptions, but he's a midfielder and they are required to do so.
Beckham used to track back and tackle but he wasn't defensive.
Alan Smith used to track back and tackle, and he was a striker.
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Does that relate in any way to what I said?
 
phelans shorts said:
They both play the exact same way, so if one is defensive then so is the other, add into that your mentioning that Hargreaves is a defensive midfielder how do you explain Carrick being the deeper of the two throughout our 4-3-3 games in '08?
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To build from the back, very similar to Pirlo at Milan perhaps, a player who is hardly defensive but is stationed in front of the back four, not as a sweeper but as a passer to play the ball out from deep.
 
Just because Carrick doesn't run around pointlessly and tackle hard doesn't mean he isn't a defensive midfielder.
 
Any idea of the wages Sneijder will be looking for and will it cause problems with United's wage structure.
 
Scoreboard Red said:
To build from the back, very similar to Pirlo at Milan perhaps, a player who is hardly defensive but is stationed in front of the back four, not as a sweeper but as a passer to play the ball out from deep.
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The problem with this is the pigeonholing of defensive midfielders as your typical one who throws in tackles non-stop, if this was the case Spain would be described as not having a defensive midfielder, when all evidence points to having 2.

Maybe in this case a better definition would be that of a holding midfielder? I.E. Someone who rarely joins the team in attack whilst providing an extra body defensively and acting as an anchor to the midfield?
 
phelans shorts said:
The problem with this is the pigeonholing of defensive midfielders as your typical one who throws in tackles non-stop, if this was the case Spain would be described as not having a defensive midfielder, when all evidence points to having 2.

Maybe in this case a better definition would be that of a holding midfielder? I.E. Someone who rarely joins the team in attack whilst providing an extra body defensively and acting as an anchor to the midfield?
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I agree - this is what I'm trying to point out; Carrick is neither an attacking midfielder nor a defensive one, he is simply a midfielder and far too much emphasis is placed on the label, however he is known for his passing ability. I don't doubt none of your lot's ESPN stats, but that doesn't mask the fact he is a passer and that is by far his best attribute.
But he's certainly not in the same mould as a Makelele or any other 'sweeper' type of player.
That's the name we used to call them when I was growing up; the player who played in front of the defence, Mark Wright was the best exponent for England in Italia 90, then Makelele did the same job for Real and Chelsea but was known as a holding midfielder.
 
VoetbalWizard said:
i think rooney smashed it already.
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From what I hear, Sneijder's on 140K a week which would mean were he to come to United, he's most likely want more than what he's on.
In the current run of things at United, I would say he's worth paying between 150-175K a week, but it's not my money so I don't particularly care.People complain about Yaya Toure getting what he gets but City want to pay him that so fair dues to the lad!
 
Scoreboard Red said:
A defensive midfielder is someone like Gattuso, Makelele, Hargreaves etc, not Carrick.
Carrick is a passer, plain and simple - as a midfielder, scrap that, as a footballer you're called upon to make tackles during a match but he is not defensive, he is a passer.
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Makelele rarely tackled either. He used his positioning to constantly intercept balls before they could get to their target. Similar to Carrick (although better at it obviously).

So by your definition a defensive midfielder can't be a good passer? A player can't do both to a good standard? Carrick is a good passer, but he's also good enough defensively that he almost always plays as our most defensive midfielder. And has done so in the most successful period in our clubs history.
 
MadDogg said:
Makelele rarely tackled either. He used his positioning to constantly intercept balls before they could get to their target. Similar to Carrick (although better at it obviously).

So by your definition a defensive midfielder can't be a good passer? A player can't do both to a good standard? Carrick is a good passer, but he's also good enough defensively that he almost always plays as our most defensive midfielder. And has done so in the most successful period in our clubs history.
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I haven't stated that at all anywhere, I believe you can do both but I also believe rigidly Carrick is not a defensive midfielder, he plays in front of the back-line. For me, Fletcher is actually more defence-minded and better in the tackle, Carrick is there as the ball-player as I've mentioned earlier.
United don't tend to play defensively with our midfield, we play wholly as a unit supporting, tracking back and linking play with other obvious personal talents.
Even Hargreaves, who I would rate as a defensive midfielder gets forward, or GOT forward, with great ****** and was also a very, very good passer and crosser.
 
MadDogg said:
Makelele rarely tackled either.
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...and could I just add as well, Makelele NEVER got forward either, did he? Whereas Carrick and Pirlo will often find themselves in the last third of the field to provide further forward players the ball or even find themselves in a goal-scoring position themselves.
Makelele is therefore clearly a defensive-midfielder.
 
Scoreboard Red said:
We wouldn't be looking at buying Sneijder to defend mate, and Carrick is hardly the most accomplished defender either, come on.
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I never said we would buy Sneidjer to help defend. I said we will buy him only to replace Scholes.

Carrick is certainly not the best defensive midfielder but he is certainly adept at it and is the best defensive midfielder we have playing right now.
 
Sarni said:
Is there anyone on here who seriously believes that we will be able to buy Sneijder?
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Of course we can buy him. His stock has leveled off a bit since the CL and World Cup. He only went to Inter for 15m Euros and I'm willing to bet that he would come to United for significantly less than people believe. Somewhere in the 20-25m range.
 
Scoreboard Red said:
OK, so Rafael is a right-winger then? Because he makes more runs forward than he defends, can we all agree on that then?
Carrick might make plenty of interceptions, but he's a midfielder and they are required to do so.
Beckham used to track back and tackle but he wasn't defensive.
Alan Smith used to track back and tackle, and he was a striker.
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What exactly are you trying to say here?
 
I think Sneijder would come here, but whether Fergie wants to buy him/spend that kind of money is a different story.
 
Sarni said:
Is there anyone on here who seriously believes that we will be able to buy Sneijder?
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Yes.
1. Inter don't mind selling their stars at reasonable fees
2. They he a replacement for him already on their books.
3. They would like the money to further strengthen their squad an reduce the average age. So selling a saleable asset like Sneijder would be very attractive.
4. His stock isn't as high as it was at the tail end of last season.
 
Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber said:
Yes.
1. Inter don't mind selling their stars at reasonable fees
2. They he a replacement for him already on their books.
3. They would like the money to further strengthen their squad an reduce the average age. So selling a saleable asset like Sneijder would be very attractive.
4. His stock isn't as high as it was at the tail end of last season.
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Problem: we cannot afford him at all when they could easily get £40m from a club like City or even Chelsea.
 
Sarni said:
Problem: we cannot afford him at all when they could easily get £40m from a club like City or even Chelsea.
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The player will have his say if he wants to play for us; if he wants join his old Ajax mate De Jong at City and be an Indian, feck him he can go, or he can come play for the Champions and be the Chief in a team of incredibly talented youngsters like Hernandez, Da Silva twins & the next crop...
 
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