[nick2004]

It would be great if we saw that fierced Rooney that showed everyone he still got it and belonges to the top players, but after him playing poor for quite of a long period, can you see it happening? Genuine question.

Genuine answer:

I was certain that Giggs as a player was finished when he was 31 and I was hopping that he joins MLS. However, I did not express those feelings (I wasn't a member of redcafe back then, ha ha!) and guess what... Giggs proved me wrong! In retrospect, it is easy to say that Giggs was a freak of nature or whatever, but back then, most people were certain that Giggs is finished as a Man Utd player.

I am not doing the same mistake twice. I don't assume I know the future. Rooney is not a rash kid any more, he seems balanced and mature. He is a top athlete, he has top professionals around him (doctors, physios, trainers, nutritionists, managers). If they (plus Mourinho) cannot find a solution, then there isn't a solution. But I don't believe that the average fan like you and me knows the answer.

 

[stu_1992]

Dropped by England now too. Happening very fast all of a sudden. Well over due of course,but I'm surprised at how quick Southgate has abandoned. Didn't think he'd have the bottle for it.

 

[sammsky1]

Please do shut up and stop yapping your hypocritical babbling. You spent an entire week slagging Pogba and rallying a brigade to join you on the onslaught yet you have the gut to come in here and point finger at others for sticking it to Rooney.

And no I don't go around slagging Rooney, I have my opinion about him currently which conform mostly with what is obvious to see but I don't need to repeat it everywhere. You come off extremely hypocritical(especially after your aggressive attacks you've had against Pogba) that I just had to step in and ask you to look yourself in the mirror before acting all pretentious.

Did I touch a nerve?

For the record I did not 'slag' off Pogba. Far far from it. I merely raised the question on why he was not performing to my expectations. Nowhere have I denigrated his character, talents or application, unlike many towards Rooney over the past 3 months.

 

[Matty7]

But he's still top with 2 assists?

According the the player performance threads, hes joint top with Blind and Martial if we only count 2... We need Mkhitaryan to get fit!!

 

[NinjaZombie]

It's funny how even after dropping Rooney, there is a lot of sugar coating and walking on eggshells when Southgate was explaining his decision to the press.

Proper old school football people would just go, "yeah he's dropped and he'll have to fight for his place" but the fragile egos of modern footballers means there are talks of how the manager wants this certain "profile of midfield" and other such bollocks.

 

[JaffyJoe]

Out of both club and international sides now, this should be it for him as a starter at this level. Think i'll be able to appreciate the last decade plus of Wayne Rooney more now that he won't be in the team holding it back. Fantastic footballer, didn't quite reach the heights or consistency his talent deserved but he's a club legend. I would say i can't see him staying on the bench for the next 2 plus years but he's getting paid so much there's no way he turns that down.

 

[Sparky10Legend]

The idiots on Twitter shouting abuse at him will be the same ones singing The White Pele when he breaks the record. A lot of our social media fanbase is rubbish.

Yeah, people will really be calling him the white Pele.

It's such an obvious likeness, Pele himself must look at chunk and think "there's my brother from another mother, innit"

 

[superdry]

Looked a bit thinner in the face in that press conference, is the pressure getting to him, is he training harder to prove us all wrong, or has his local McDonald's closed for a refurb?

 

[Bobcat]

So the anti Rooney brigade can rejoice that their hatchet job is complete.

Congratulations to you all, it must feel great to have defiled a Manchester United legend.

Yes, some no names on a Manchester United forum is the reason Rooney is getting axed. It has absolutely nothing to do with his rapidly deteriorating ability to even do the basics of football. Are you for real or just on a WUM?

 

[jojose]

I haven't wanted him out the United side for a long time. However, I hope England get beat and Wazza gets the winner at Anfield, for no other reason than to piss people off

 

[MoskvaRed]

Genuine answer:

I was certain that Giggs as a player was finished when he was 31 and I was hopping that he joins MLS. However, I did not express those feelings (I wasn't a member of redcafe back then, ha ha!) and guess what... Giggs proved me wrong! In retrospect, it is easy to say that Giggs was a freak of nature or whatever, but back then, most people were certain that Giggs is finished as a Man Utd player.

I am not doing the same mistake twice. I don't assume I know the future. Rooney is not a rash kid any more, he seems balanced and mature. He is a top athlete, he has top professionals around him (doctors, physios, trainers, nutritionists, managers). If they (plus Mourinho) cannot find a solution, then there isn't a solution. But I don't believe that the average fan like you and me knows the answer.

Giggs is the outlier. It's a one way street for the vast majority of top level players once they go into physical decline. Rio, Vidic and G Neville to name but a few from our recent past.

 

[Marcelinho87]

I haven't wanted him out the United side for a long time. However, I hope England get beat and Wazza gets the winner at Anfield, for no other reason than to piss people off

And this is just counter productive. Say England lose and Rooney scores against Liverpool, what then? He gets back in and gets another 6 months of shite performances before the question is raised again?

How does it help?

What Rooney needs to do is condition himself better and work on being a player who stays in or around the box rather than sprinting round the field like a pleb.

Then he needs to accept that at 30 going on 52 he is now a squad player and no more, the days of the untouchable are over and rightly so.

 

[jojose]

And this is just counter productive. Say England lose and Rooney scores against Liverpool, what then? He gets back in and gets another 6 months of shite performances before the question is raised again?

How does it help?

What Rooney needs to do is condition himself better and work on being a player who stays in or around the box rather than sprinting round the field like a pleb.

Then he needs to accept that at 30 going on 52 he is now a squad player and no more, the days of the untouchable are over and rightly so.

No, just resumes his position back on the bench. But a last minute win would piss people off in true United fashion

 

[clarkydaz]

Genuine answer:



I am not doing the same mistake twice. I don't assume I know the future. Rooney is not a rash kid any more, he seems balanced and mature. He is a top athlete, he has top professionals around him (doctors, physios, trainers, nutritionists, managers). If they (plus Mourinho) cannot find a solution, then there isn't a solution. But I don't believe that the average fan like you and me knows the answer.

eh?

 

[DannyCAFC]

What on Earth are professionals and pundits alike seeing? The Beeb article about Rooney aswell this morning is absolute rubbish, 'regarded as a superb leader and he hasn't declined to the point where he should be ditched altogether'... He's one of the worst players in the Premier League.

 

[Litch]

Simply a player that no doubt a Utd legend but at club and country, there are better options (ironically some are other than Utd players). I think the deference for other players at Utd playing deeper in their careers (or not), it's dependant on who's pushing to play in their position. Rooney's been on the decline for a while but his status as the England Captain and Utd's only worldwide recognised player for sometime I believed saved him. Look at the poster campaigns now, we have signed two of the most recognised footballers in the world.

The difference now for Rooney, it's just about football and not about his status or history...

 

[OL29]

Thankfully the match going fans have the decency to show him some respect unlike all the keyboard warriors.

Honestly, how does criticising an underperforming player on an Internet forum equal being a keyboard warrior?

Those people want what's best for their club where as you and a couple of others seem to want what's best for Rooney. And I don't know whether you go to matches at all (I'm guessing not) because i can tell you that there's been rumblings of discontent towards Rooney for a while now. I guarantee that if he wasn't dropped eventually, it would've turned toxic just like it was at Wembley on Saturday. If Ryan fecking Giggs can get booed by his own fans then what makes you think Rooney is so untouchable? It's not right but football's an emotional sport.

I hope you manage to get a grip because it looks like this could be Rooney's last season here and it'll be interesting to see whether you and few others continue to support united without your hero.

 

[Pexbo]

What on Earth are professionals and pundits alike seeing? The Beeb article about Rooney aswell this morning is absolute rubbish, 'regarded as a superb leader and he hasn't declined to the point where he should be ditched altogether'... He's one of the worst players in the Premier League.

It's not about what they are seeing. It's about the fact they all know each other, same golf clubs, same social events, they all go way back and they all know what it was like to be a player. They all expected the same sort of respect that Rooney expects now and they all thought that experience in the head counts more than energy in the legs and that when you've done your time with a club it earns you privileges.


Look at Gary Neville leaving his Golf shoes at Rooney's house the other day. You think he's going to play with him for 6 years, live in the same neighbourhood, coach him for England, play golf with him and then go into the MNF studio and tell the nation he's playing crap and needs to be dropped? Not going to happen.

 

[Smores]

Honestly, how does criticising an underperforming player on an Internet forum equal being a keyboard warrior?

Those people want what's best for their club where as you and a couple of others seem to want what's best for Rooney. And I don't know whether you go to matches at all (I'm guessing not) because i can tell you that there's been rumblings of discontent towards Rooney for a while now. I guarantee that if he wasn't dropped eventually, it would've turned toxic just like it was at Wembley on Saturday. If Ryan fecking Giggs can get booed by his own fans then what makes you think Rooney is so untouchable? It's not right but football's an emotional sport.

I hope you manage to get a grip because it looks like this could be Rooney's last season here and it'll be interesting to see whether you and few others continue to support united without your hero.

Some people here give discussion on an internet forum the same equivalency as shouting abuse or booing from the stands. As if those same discussions aren't happening amongst those who attend matches as well.

There seems to be an odd narrative forming that Rooney cant be criticised too much and i have no idea why apart from it possibly being youngsters who idolised him. Im sure they don't offer the same get out of jail to all our players.

 

[Robertd0803]

Whoever the next England manager is will be delighted that Southgate has had the balls to drop Rooney (even if he is claiming tactical reasons instead of saying outright he is past it). Now when the new boss takes over the precedent is set and he won't have to deal with the backlash.

 

[OL29]

Some people here give discussion on an internet forum the same equivalency as shouting abuse or booing from the stands. As if those same discussions aren't happening amongst those who attend matches as well.

There seems to be an odd narrative forming that Rooney cant be criticised too much and i have no idea why apart from it possibly being youngsters who idolised him. Im sure they don't offer the same get out of jail to all our players.

Couldn't agree more. From Ryan Giggs to Darren Fletcher, underperforming players have never been immune from criticism, so to be personally offended by criticism to Rooney, who up until now has received more support from his managers and sections of the media then any United player in recent memory is laughable.

 

[Dobbs]

Thankfully the match going fans have the decency to show him some respect unlike all the keyboard warriors.

Upto the Watford game you were happy with him, thought he warranted a spot. Two games later you want him dropped.

At least the rest of us want him out of the team based on a prolonged period of poor form. We've given him literally years to turn his form around. You've tolerated it for just 180 mins and you've already had enough.

If anybody's not showing him respect it's yourself and a few others I'm afraid.

 

[SteveJ]

Laying it on a little thick
‘IT WAS not easy for Wayne Rooney to talk, on the defining day of his career. The day everybody will remember what they were doing when they heard England’s captain had been axed’ – Neil Ashton, The Sun.

It’s like JFK being shot and landing on the moon all in one. Although Mediawatch is struggling to remember where we were and it was only yesterday.

(F365)

 

[pixel]

Upto the Watford game you were happy with him, thought he warranted a spot. Two games later you want him dropped.

At least the rest of us want him out of the team based on a prolonged period of poor form. We've given him literally years to turn his form around. You've tolerated it for just 180 mins and you've already had enough.

If anybody's not showing him respect it's yourself and a few others I'm afraid.

I made a similar point the other day. I guess after Watford, Rooney basically became impossible to defend. So his apologists have turned to the next best option. Instead of defending Rooney, they are now attacking the 'keyboard warriors', whatever the hell that means. Even a semblance of a half decent performance from Rooney or conversely a not too good display from Mata/Herrera/Pogba/Ibra etc, and they'll be back telling us how Rooney should never have been dropped.

 

[Dobbs]

I made a similar point the other day. I guess after Watford, Rooney basically became impossible to defend. So his apologists have turned to the next best option. Instead of defending Rooney, they are now attacking the 'keyboard warriors', whatever the hell that means. Even a semblance of a half decent performance from Rooney or conversely a not too good display from Mata/Herrera/Pogba/Ibra etc, and they'll be back telling us how Rooney should never have been dropped.

True, there's just a compulsion to defend him. I do sort of get it, there are some great memories.

It just amuses that they've become the harshest critics. We want him dropped because of three years of underperforming. We've actually been incredibly patient. For them it's just two games and boom they want him out the team.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Upto the Watford game you were happy with him, thought he warranted a spot. Two games later you want him dropped.

At least the rest of us want him out of the team based on a prolonged period of poor form. We've given him literally years to turn his form around. You've tolerated it for just 180 mins and you've already had enough.

If anybody's not showing him respect it's yourself and a few others I'm afraid.

Does "a few others" include Jose Mourinho, Moyes, Van Gaal and everyone in the England set-up? Only they all also thought he was worthy of his place until very recently.

 

[Borden]

Does "a few others" include Jose Mourinho, Moyes, Van Gaal and everyone in the England set-up? Only they all also thought he was worthy of his place until very recently.

And look where that got them.

 

[Dobbs]

Does "a few others" include Jose Mourinho, Moyes, Van Gaal and everyone in the England set-up? Only they all also thought he was worthy of his place until very recently.

I think this line of argument has already been picked apart. Several times over.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

I think this line of argument has already been picked apart. Several times over.

Well that's ok then. The point stands, though.

 

[pixel]

Does "a few others" include Jose Mourinho, Moyes, Van Gaal and everyone in the England set-up? Only they all also thought he was worthy of his place until very recently.

Including Mourinho in that list is misleading. It took him 5 or 6 games and less that two months to drop Rooney to the bench. The less said about Moyes, Van Gaal and the England set up the better. I mean you are talking about a manager who came up with gems like "My captain shall always play". The last competent manager we had, also didn't pick him in the starting 11.

 

[AngeloHenriquez]

Including Mourinho in that list is misleading. It took him 5 or 6 games and less that two months to drop Rooney to the bench. The less said about Moyes, Van Gaal and the England set up the better. I mean you are talking about a manager who came up with gems like "My captain shall always play". The last competent manager we had, also didn't pick him in the starting 11.

He was a lot better player 4/5 years ago and SAF still was dropping him, odd really but timing has been his friend, if SAF hadn't retired I believe he would have been sold that summer and not given a huge contract

 

[sunama]

he is a physical freak so we dont know what will happen, if he can adjust his position and training. The likes of Sheringham and Shearer managed a few more years, let alone Scholes and Giggs and then the OAP club from AC Milan.

You are right: he is a physical freak.
He matured much earlier than the norm. He peaked early. And unfortunately, this also means that he got older, earlier.
Look at his body, his face, the way he runs - he looks and moves like a 40 year old, not a 30 year old.

The problem with old age is that it cannot be reversed, so unless he has found a cure to old age, he will continue to decline. This has been shown by his steady decline, over the last 5 years or so.
He is a physical freak, no doubt....unfortunately this will now work against him, not for him. There is no way back for Rooney and I expect him to get worse.

 

[acnumber9]

Does "a few others" include Jose Mourinho, Moyes, Van Gaal and everyone in the England set-up? Only they all also thought he was worthy of his place until very recently.

There's always going to be an element of hope that he would recapture his old form and that it was only a bad spell though. We also can't downplay the shitstorm that dropping him causes. The fact is he should not have been starting week in week out based on form alone for at least a year. I'd argue longer.

 

[Sparky_Hughes]

And the manner it has come about? When Rooney makes his come back, and he will, none of his haters deserve any of the good feelings or success that will come with it.

Not going to happen, dont do it to yourself mate.

social media is rubbish.

Fixed

Thankfully the match going fans have the decency to show him some respect unlike all the keyboard warriors.

Ummmmm............

 

[Dobbs]

Well that's ok then. The point stands, though.

It doesn't even as a standalone point but it makes even less sense to use it as an argument against what I said.

My point was that many of his defenders want him dropped just because of the Watford and Northampton games. That's harsh. The rest of us are at least basing this desire on a large number of games. We want him dropped because of at least two seasons of underperforming.

So what's David Moyes' opinion of Rooney from three years ago got to do with that?

 

[sunama]

ha! Very clever! you rascal.

Not what I said. If you read my post earlier, I actually said he will have to adjust his training methods and approach, whilst getting more motivation which may also provide an extra 1%. That is very different to what you are implying I said.

He is suffering from old age and too many miles on the clock.
He will need to reverse the ageing process, itself, if he wants to improve. I'm not sure that even Wayne Rooney can do this.

 

[Attila]

So the anti Rooney brigade can rejoice that their hatchet job is complete.

Congratulations to you all, it must feel great to have defiled a Manchester United legend.

 

[sunama]

My point was that many of his defenders want him dropped just because of the Watford and Northampton games. That's harsh. The rest of us are at least basing this desire on a large number of games. We want him dropped because of at least two seasons of underperforming.

Who wants him dropped just because of 2 bad games? I've not seen anybody with this opinion.
The people who want him dropped, as you said, want him dropped due to 2 years of poor performances.

 

[Carlsen19]

He hit puberty at about 12 and his genes are closer to that of a Darts player than an athlete. If he didn't have a Y chromosome he'd be moaning about hot flushes right about now.

He shuffles around the pitch like his pants are round his ankles and there's nobody in the house to fetch him a new bog roll.

He's not going to suddenly hit a rich vein of form when he has been on a steady decline for 4 years and he has 4 superior players ahead of him in all positions he claims to be able to play.

Fcuking hell coffee everywhere

 

[kouroux]

I haven't wanted him out the United side for a long time. However, I hope England get beat and Wazza gets the winner at Anfield, for no other reason than to piss people off

Why does it matter for some of you to piss other people off (specially the ones who have wanted to see players play on meritocracy)? I mean wtf is this kinda logic People are too focused on scoring pointless internet points. One thing unites most of us, it's wanting to see Utd do well. If it means Rooney has to be benched for that then so be it. It should be as simple as that.