He really doesn't. And certainly not that high up the pitch. He should have stayed goalside Vardy and only leave him close De Laet down as an absolute last resort, which wouldn't have been until he'd carried the ball another 20 0r 30 yards. Blind was actually level with De Laet when he first touched the ball. He could definitely have got involved if De Laet was forced to dribble the ball instead of playing a really simple pass.
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He really doesn't. And certainly not that high up the pitch. He should have stayed goalside Vardy and only leave him close De Laet down as an absolute last resort, which wouldn't have been until he'd carried the ball another 20 0r 30 yards. Blind was actually level with De Laet when he first touched the ball. He could definitely have got involved if De Laet was forced to dribble the ball instead of playing a really simple pass.
You got to read the entire article to figure out what are his arguments. You cannot just quote one part and say that its a weak argument. For your benefit, I am pasting it here:
yes. thats true and you are right. That said Vardy´s ball is pretty good and blind would have never catched up. There are various different things that are way more concerning than a bad but understandable decision by a youngster.
Thank you so much @Mrs Smoker
Rooney's top speed was the highest in the game against QPR, even higher than Di Maria. People say he has slowed down, but he still has some pace about him.
Rooney's top speed was the highest in the game against QPR, even higher than Di Maria. People say he has slowed down, but he still has some pace about him.
Right now I wouldn't have RVP at the same level as those players, as I'm beginning to think his current/recent form is now his current regressed level. And I'd definitely rank Costa higher.
Without thinking up any other names I'd rank those players roughly:
Suarez, Ibrahimovic
Costa, Aguero, Lewandowski
Cavani, Falcao
Benzema, Neymar, Rooney
RVP
Maybe I'm being pessimistic but Rooney and RVP are also the only two that I don't think are capable of reaching around the current level of Suarez and Ibrahimovic. Costa and Aguero could still improve if they stay injury free, Falcao (hopefully) could return to his pre-injury level, Cavani and Benzema could be even better if they were the main forward somewhere (like Arsenal), and Neymar still has years to progress. Whereas Rooney + RVP, great 2/3 years ago, but not in the top bracket anymore in my opinion.
I agree, plus Blackett's decision is understandable because there really was no one at the left back position where the run was being made.
Yeah, it seems really harsh to single out such a an inexperienced players when there were at least two other blatant errors from United players in the move. It was a rookie mistake but what else can you expect when you pick rookie defenders?
And what should he have done, according to you? The only thing which I can think of is spreading himself more because of being in a one-on-one
I'd have Suarez at least on par with Ibra at the top.
Aguero is better than Lewandowski but forever injured so it's tough. RVP and Falcao would've been higher up but neither is in great form and both coming back from injury hit seasons/summers.
Don't hugely rate Cavani but he is playing out of position.
We've no idea where Rooney's best position is anymore. He's not effective behind the striker for me but then he's not being given much of a shot up front by LVG who doesn't rate him there. The way his physical attributes have declined makes him hard to place anymore.
Costa is in stunning form at the minute, continuing what he did last year, if he carries on he'll be way up there near the top you'd imagine.
Neymar is tough because how well he does entirely depends on the mood Messi is in. If Messi continues to be the creative force rather than the finishing touch then Neymar will score more and his confidence will skyrocket. If Messi suddenly decides he wants to hunt down Cristiano for the Pichichi then Neymar will be on the periphery instead.
He should have been at least 5 or 6 yards closer to Vardy when he reached the edge of the box. I've already been moaning about that in his own thread.
http://www.espnfc.com/club/manchest...-served-by-starting-wayne-rooney-on-the-bench
Delaney gives his take on Rooney
Delaney gives his take on Rooney
Louis van Gaal may have been attempting to shut down some of the debate on Wayne Rooney, but only ended up opening the discussion further.
"Rooney can play in more positions, he's a multi-functional player, and I have tried him in a striker's position," the Manchester United manager said this week. "He has played well, but not spectacular. [Radamel] Falcao is a striker, and I think he can do better."
In the space of three sentences, Van Gaal summed up the entirety of Rooney's Manchester United career since joining in 2004. He always plays relatively well, but rarely spectacularly. He can perform in pretty much any position across the front, but there's generally always someone better for the role.
Now, the growing question beyond Old Trafford is whether Rooney is even good enough for United's starting XI. It says an awful lot that dropping him would not be considered anyway outlandish. It would probably be fair.
To put it another way, ponder this: What tangible effect on United's overall play would it have for Rooney to be left on bench?
With Robin van Persie or Falcao, you'd obviously lose that force in attack. With Angel Di Maria, you'd already lose that sheer elevation in overall quality. With Rooney, it is actually rather unclear, but then that is the case with much of his career as a whole.
Wayne Rooney does everything well, but does he do any one thing better than the likes of Radamel Falcao, Robin van Persie, Angel Di Maria or Juan Mata?
Set to turn 29 in a month, he should be at the peak of his powers. Rooney should be at that purple-patch stage when the majority of players know their best position and are most comfortably attuned to their own game.
Instead, the United captain provokes more debate than ever before. The defining aspect of his career at the moment isn't splitting defences. It's splitting opinion. That nature of debate just doesn't happen with most elite players at a similar age to Rooney. Take the latest point of contention, that over his leadership skills as captain.
Much has rightfully been made of the unfair manner in which Rooney berated so many young players, particularly after his own mistakes at the weekend against Leicester City. At the same time, however, there was the creditable way he chased back for Jamie Vardy's goal to try and cover a defence that was utterly collapsing.
The first felt like it was leadership for show. The latter felt like leading by example.
Such contradictions fill his career, right down to the debate about whether he should start.
Every time it seems like he should be given up on, Rooney offers a big moment or goal like against Manchester City in February 2011. Every time he looks like he may finally move up a level, he suffers a drop in performance akin to his 2012-13 campaign.
Along the same lines, he stands out for another reason. There are very few individual elite-level careers that have seen so many different incarnations of the same player. Rooney has morphed into something rather different every few years, and that is relevant to the current question over whether he should start.
In his earliest days, between 2002 and 2006, he was a freewheeling and often fearsome young attacker. Between 2006 and 2009, he was a wide forward and sidekick, as Rooney was tactically constrained in order to get the best out of Cristiano Ronaldo. From to 2009 through to 2012, then, he became an out-and-out goal scorer as he replaced the Portuguese as the main focal point -- at least until United's signing of Van Persie.
Since then, it's been a little hard to say exactly what Rooney is.
As an exercise, try to describe his best attributes of role, or something high-end he's clearly better at than the world's elite players. It's, again, unclear.
The feeling persists he is good to very good at virtually every facet of the game, but not exceptional in any of them. Rooney is a consistent basics man.
Should that mean a consistent place in the team? He clearly can't play wide anymore, and is obviously not as good a goal scorer as either Falcao or Van Persie. A figure like John Giles has long argued Rooney should eventually move to a "No. 8" midfield role, but that position doesn't really exist in the current United formation.
Finally, there's his current position. Rooney may see himself as a playmaker, but he always looks a little makeshift in the role.
The type of incisive touches you usually associate with a No. 10 are instead replaced with something more industrial. It's difficult to dispute Juan Mata is a much purer playmaker, both technically and tactically. United look like they would flow better with play moving around the Spaniard's creativity. The speed of attack would almost certainly be quicker. That would also have a positive consequence on defence, since United would theoretically lose the ball less. Moves would not break down as often.
Forget starting over Juan Mata; should Wayne Rooney be a Man United starter at all?
The logical conclusion from all of this is that Rooney should become the ultimate utility player, ready to ably fill whatever gap is required across the front, but without a set position of his own.
That also means he should not be in United's best XI. It's a reality that's hard to escape, particularly in their current formation, and with so many global stars.
It's also mostly moot. Sources state Van Gaal prefers Rooney as a playmaker over Mata, and he clearly sees his captain as a certain starter.
It's Rooney's very "multi-functionality" that Van Gaal likes above all.
This is pointed, especially when you consider the football school the manager has come from. The long-term idea at Ajax has always been to produce "universalists" capable of playing in virtually any position, rather than specialists.
So, while Rooney's own career might be at an advanced stage, it is still very early in the Van Gaal regime. If United do eventually develop in the way the manager expects, that multi-functionality could be key. It is possible Rooney's wide range of abilities could be crucial to a fluid system where attackers interchange at will.
It certainly feels of huge importance to his career. It may be required to justify his starting place.
"Rooney can play in more positions, he's a multi-functional player, and I have tried him in a striker's position," the Manchester United manager said this week. "He has played well, but not spectacular. [Radamel] Falcao is a striker, and I think he can do better."
In the space of three sentences, Van Gaal summed up the entirety of Rooney's Manchester United career since joining in 2004. He always plays relatively well, but rarely spectacularly. He can perform in pretty much any position across the front, but there's generally always someone better for the role.
Now, the growing question beyond Old Trafford is whether Rooney is even good enough for United's starting XI. It says an awful lot that dropping him would not be considered anyway outlandish. It would probably be fair.
To put it another way, ponder this: What tangible effect on United's overall play would it have for Rooney to be left on bench?
With Robin van Persie or Falcao, you'd obviously lose that force in attack. With Angel Di Maria, you'd already lose that sheer elevation in overall quality. With Rooney, it is actually rather unclear, but then that is the case with much of his career as a whole.
Wayne Rooney does everything well, but does he do any one thing better than the likes of Radamel Falcao, Robin van Persie, Angel Di Maria or Juan Mata?
Set to turn 29 in a month, he should be at the peak of his powers. Rooney should be at that purple-patch stage when the majority of players know their best position and are most comfortably attuned to their own game.
Instead, the United captain provokes more debate than ever before. The defining aspect of his career at the moment isn't splitting defences. It's splitting opinion. That nature of debate just doesn't happen with most elite players at a similar age to Rooney. Take the latest point of contention, that over his leadership skills as captain.
Much has rightfully been made of the unfair manner in which Rooney berated so many young players, particularly after his own mistakes at the weekend against Leicester City. At the same time, however, there was the creditable way he chased back for Jamie Vardy's goal to try and cover a defence that was utterly collapsing.
The first felt like it was leadership for show. The latter felt like leading by example.
Such contradictions fill his career, right down to the debate about whether he should start.
Every time it seems like he should be given up on, Rooney offers a big moment or goal like against Manchester City in February 2011. Every time he looks like he may finally move up a level, he suffers a drop in performance akin to his 2012-13 campaign.
Along the same lines, he stands out for another reason. There are very few individual elite-level careers that have seen so many different incarnations of the same player. Rooney has morphed into something rather different every few years, and that is relevant to the current question over whether he should start.
In his earliest days, between 2002 and 2006, he was a freewheeling and often fearsome young attacker. Between 2006 and 2009, he was a wide forward and sidekick, as Rooney was tactically constrained in order to get the best out of Cristiano Ronaldo. From to 2009 through to 2012, then, he became an out-and-out goal scorer as he replaced the Portuguese as the main focal point -- at least until United's signing of Van Persie.
Since then, it's been a little hard to say exactly what Rooney is.
As an exercise, try to describe his best attributes of role, or something high-end he's clearly better at than the world's elite players. It's, again, unclear.
The feeling persists he is good to very good at virtually every facet of the game, but not exceptional in any of them. Rooney is a consistent basics man.
Should that mean a consistent place in the team? He clearly can't play wide anymore, and is obviously not as good a goal scorer as either Falcao or Van Persie. A figure like John Giles has long argued Rooney should eventually move to a "No. 8" midfield role, but that position doesn't really exist in the current United formation.
Finally, there's his current position. Rooney may see himself as a playmaker, but he always looks a little makeshift in the role.
The type of incisive touches you usually associate with a No. 10 are instead replaced with something more industrial. It's difficult to dispute Juan Mata is a much purer playmaker, both technically and tactically. United look like they would flow better with play moving around the Spaniard's creativity. The speed of attack would almost certainly be quicker. That would also have a positive consequence on defence, since United would theoretically lose the ball less. Moves would not break down as often.
Forget starting over Juan Mata; should Wayne Rooney be a Man United starter at all?
- 57%
Yes - 43%
No
The logical conclusion from all of this is that Rooney should become the ultimate utility player, ready to ably fill whatever gap is required across the front, but without a set position of his own.
That also means he should not be in United's best XI. It's a reality that's hard to escape, particularly in their current formation, and with so many global stars.
It's also mostly moot. Sources state Van Gaal prefers Rooney as a playmaker over Mata, and he clearly sees his captain as a certain starter.
It's Rooney's very "multi-functionality" that Van Gaal likes above all.
This is pointed, especially when you consider the football school the manager has come from. The long-term idea at Ajax has always been to produce "universalists" capable of playing in virtually any position, rather than specialists.
So, while Rooney's own career might be at an advanced stage, it is still very early in the Van Gaal regime. If United do eventually develop in the way the manager expects, that multi-functionality could be key. It is possible Rooney's wide range of abilities could be crucial to a fluid system where attackers interchange at will.
It certainly feels of huge importance to his career. It may be required to justify his starting place.
Typically sensationalist click-bait. Rooney inevitably attracts this sort of stuff but it's annoying nonetheless.
Drop him? Has he not watched any of our games this season?
Don't think you can call Delaney that- he often makes very good arguments.
He has written a well thought out article I say- the headline is misleading though. The penultimate paragraph:
If the defenders don't learn from this,then they must be the thickest defenders in the PL. Smalling, Blind, Rojo all in the opposition half with only Blackett defending. If your going to go up the pitch, go as line and stay as a line. No tactical awareness at all from these players and worst of all no communication between them. You'd think Smalling, after playing with Ferdinand and Vidic would have learnt to open his mouth and get everyone into position but it seems like he doesn't even know where he's supposed to be playing on the pitch.
Woow Rooney is rapid, shame he doesnt use that for attacking qualities. Cant remember the last time he went past a defender.
There was a moment in the game when Di Maria had the ball on the left wing, and Rooney was seen in middle sprinting like a madman hoping for a pass in the box. Never arrived, but boy, he was fast. As fast as in above gif, if not faster.
He used it last week, when he sprinted the length of the pitch alongside Di Maria and ended up setting up a goal for Herrerra. That was presumably the sprint that had him logged as the quickest player on the pitch in that match.
The blind spots that Rooney seems to cause in so many caftards is just so hard to understand. Can't think of any other player with such relentless focus on every error combined with an almost wilful determination to ignore every positive contribution.
That wasnt half as quick as this.
Could be, but you can also see in his way of running that he isnt at full speed.
Yeah, he only really sprints flat out over the last 5-10 yards. When he was getting back at Vardy it was full steam ahead from very early on.
I quoted another poster who had used it but can you deny that it was a weak point? . Back to article, so basically he is saying that We cannot afford to do anything but start ROoney every game? Then again it's not like we didn't know the dangers of that contract the moment it was announced.
Exactly.
For instance his pass for Herrera goal, I remember in match thread some posters were going about how his first touch was awful, very few mentioned he assisted Herrera and some even said every player would do that.
Similar Di Maria's lob vs Leicester, maybe one or 2 posters mentioned his very good pass to Di Maria for that goal..
When there's a chance they criticise him, even when there isnt sthing they will find it or make it up but if he's very good its really hard for them to give him any credit.
I dislike Rooney and I've made that very clear on this forum, but if we are to stick with the 4312 then Rooney isn't part of the problem at all. He's the most mobile out of all our forwards and we need that most. His finishing is also excellent. He isn't a #10 and I'll argue that until I'm blue in the face, but I'd play him as one of our main strikers ahead of both Van Persie and Falcao going forward. The latter should partner him.
That's the problem, moments. The old Rooney, when we used to call him Roonaldo, could be expected to take most good balls and use his pace and handling to pass a couple of defenders and create something dangerous. These days his movement is much more erratic, and the only place you expect something to happen is in poacher spots.
On this subject of 'tracking back' and 'busting their arses to do as much as they can' does anyone else get the feeling that only Rooney really does this? A lot of times I see some of our players just give up and 'pull up stumps' after a shit piece of defending and let players in and/or shoot on goal.
Rooney busting his arse to get around the pitch just reminded me of how little I see that in other players. The 'Oh Shit!' panic move at the moment from the defenders seems to be 'Oh well, he's in now, there's nothing more I can do then.....' instead of just trying anything and everything to stop it. I've seen Blackett do it a few times but I am not sure, maybe I am getting it wrong but it reminded me of how little I've seen it.
Rooney busting his arse to get around the pitch just reminded me of how little I see that in other players. The 'Oh Shit!' panic move at the moment from the defenders seems to be 'Oh well, he's in now, there's nothing more I can do then.....' instead of just trying anything and everything to stop it. I've seen Blackett do it a few times but I am not sure, maybe I am getting it wrong but it reminded me of how little I've seen it.
Ibra, Suarez, Lewa, Aguero, Falcao (pre injury), Costa and Neymar are miles ahead of both Rooney and RvP if you consider their poor form in the last 18 months. Benzema is the one closest to them at the moment I would say and he is still young. Oh and I don't rate Cavani much.
It's good to see Rooney's commitment to the chase in that GIF. Not sure what was up with Smalling, maybe couldn't reach top speed because he wasn't 100% fit? It would be nice if United could let Rooney run 100m and let RedCafe record it so this whole 'Rooney is slow/fat/fast/lost a yard of pace' argument can be settled.
Hahaha, that is another matter altogether. Can I take liberty and blame David Moyes
Man Utd 2:1 West Ham
Anyone else feel he has been a bit more 'precise' with his game since the formation change?
By that I mean, he has two proper CM's behind him, di Maria who makes driving runs around him and two top forwards in front of him capable of hold up and dragging defenders away. Before he'd have to worry about being both di Maria and Falcao (if that makes sense), whilst also making up for Carrick's partner. This role suits him more with the increased options he has (Herrera, di Maria, Falcao) rather than him looking round and only finding a wide player in space. We are linking play better, we are passing it well etc and Rooney has looked good.
By that I mean, he has two proper CM's behind him, di Maria who makes driving runs around him and two top forwards in front of him capable of hold up and dragging defenders away. Before he'd have to worry about being both di Maria and Falcao (if that makes sense), whilst also making up for Carrick's partner. This role suits him more with the increased options he has (Herrera, di Maria, Falcao) rather than him looking round and only finding a wide player in space. We are linking play better, we are passing it well etc and Rooney has looked good.
Yeah, he's looked pretty good these last couple of games in all honesty. Far better in that #10 role then he's looked for years/
The red card has come at such an annoying time.
That's pretty much how I feel about him.
What's worse is he'll come straight back into the side after the suspension and it's almost a guarantee he won't be as match fit as he should be.
Couldn't give a damn about his personal life or his flaws (every player has them), he's a highly productive player and who the hell would not want that in their team?
I'd say Blackett running away from the center is more baffling. Knowing that he was the last man, he kept their CF onside, while trying to close down a player near the touchline. Or are you mistaken Blackett for Smalling?
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Nah yeah, Blackett's position is pretty awful too but it's Smalling that's around 30th yard in their half, completly unnecessary then.
That Rooney gif reminds me of this clip.
Like Keane, Rooney is not known for his pace, but like Keane, he's pretty quick when he has to be
This video also serves as a reminder as to why I think Michael Owen is a little punk
Like Keane, Rooney is not known for his pace, but like Keane, he's pretty quick when he has to be
This video also serves as a reminder as to why I think Michael Owen is a little punk
Oh yeah, good point. Hadn't noticed that before I was so fascinated by Blackett's terrible decision. What the flying feck were the two of them doing so far apart? As the senior member of the pair I'm blaming Smalling. Woeful defending.
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