Wayne Rooney | 2012-14 Performances

[Snipers Breath]

Misleading statistics IMO.

Rooney is like Gerrard in that his stats are better than how he actually performs. Like Gerrard he does possess very good delivery from set pieces and this makes it look very good on paper, when you look at goals and assists.
But like Gerrard, Rooneys best form is behind him, the tenacity that made them the players they were have gone, Gerrard through age, Rooney because he believes he has done it all and has nothing to prove (and with another ridiculous payrise in the making, cant blame him) Like Gerrard though, whilst he's capable of making a great cross field long ball here and there, his short passing is wayward, his first touch can be very ugly and like Gerrard he moves with the ease of a disabled horse.

Stop comparing him to Gerrard.

Gerrard is playing as a DM, yet still in the last two years is as creative as most of the best AMs in the league, while still fulfilling the functions of a CM. His top 20 in the league for amount of tackles made for example. Gerrard in the last two years has basically had the stats of a DM combined with the creativity of an AM, and its not just down to set pieces, go check on Whoscored for the amount of through balls he plays per game, he is frankly still playing at an incredible rate.

 

[JaffyJoe]

This is a good example of confirmation bias.

Time will tell. With the current supporting cast we won't get the best out of those 3.

I think that's the key point. Sure, maybe at some level they may not be the most perfectly compatible three in the world, but you just feel they could be doing better.

I hate to use Liverpool as an example, but look at how they are able to integrate Coutinho, Suarez and Sturridge. Sometimes Coutinho plays behind the two of them, sometimes Suarez and Coutinho both play behind Sturridge. Sometimes Sturridge starts wide right on paper, but then plays the inside right channel high up like a striker. They vary according to need, sometimes sacrificing Sterling on the left for an extra midfielder if they need more solidity.

Or indeed look at our 07-08 team. Ronaldo spent so much time up front, and Tevez and Rooney were both so flexible, that we operated as a 4-3-3 even when we didn't look like it on the team sheet. We used to use Park or even Hargreaves on the wing so they could make a midfield three when Ronaldo went forward - or we'd just sod it and play Nani and go for a mad kind of 4-2-4.

A trio of Mata/RvP/Rooney would operate differently to Ronaldo/Tevez/Rooney - but not so different that a similar approach couldn't work.

To me its just another example of the lack of tactical nous and surprisingly dogmatic approach of David Moyes.

I agree, I haven't given up on Moyes yet though. Let's see what happens when he is able to get 3-4 more players in.

This squad does not lack technicians at all. I just feel he hasn't been courageous with his playing style or tactics thus far.

 

[JaffyJoe]

Stop comparing him to Gerrard.

Gerrard is playing as a DM, yet still in the last two years is as creative as most of the best AMs in the league, while still fulfilling the functions of a CM. His top 20 in the league for amount of tackles made for example. Gerrard in the last two years has basically had the stats of a DM combined with the creativity of an AM, and its not just down to set pieces, go check on Whoscored for the amount of through balls he plays per game, he is frankly still playing at an incredible rate.

Let's not exaggearte. He has been good but I have seen quite a few games pass him by this season. He was always a great athlete so as his legs have gone he has had to adapt his game. In cm his was somewhat of a liability but as a dm I think he can get away with it.

He is a set piece and long ball specialist. He isn't particularly creative but he is doing a solid job. In a top team he wouldn't be playing though.

 

[Sparky_Hughes]

[quote.] Expect Rooney to come home and be the focal point for a shit storm.[/quote]
I really hope not as I'm pretty certain it would spark a period of his worst form, whenever he has had off field issues it has coincided with his worst spells of form.

 

[Snipers Breath]

Let's not exaggearte. He has been good but I have seen quite a few games pass him by this season. He was always a great athlete so as his legs have gone he has had to adapt his game. In cm his was somewhat of a liability but as a dm I think he can get away with it.

He is a set piece and long ball specialist. He isn't particularly creative but he is doing a solid job. In a top team he wouldn't be playing though.

That is a bit of an exaggeration actually you're right he was a bit hit and miss for the first part of the season,.But i'm talking all the way back to last season where he was excelling as a Deep lying playmaker, only second to Carrrick in the league for me (and Gary Neville)!

As for the part of him not being creative, thats wrong, he has been one of the most creative players in this league undoubtedly these past two seasons, away from his assists, he still manages to crack top 10 in the amount of through balls per game, Rooney for a comparison doesn't crack the top 20.

 

[Amar__]

Don't be a twat.

It's probably easier for him to act like twat rather than to defend his silly posts.

 

[UnofficialDevil]

http://www.zonalmarking.net/2010/03/20/teams-of-the-decade-3-manchester-united-2006-09/

Great, article, anyone that says Moyes is just carrying on what Sir Alex only knew should read it, "Unlike most sides on this list, Manchester United have not used a specific formation in their amazingly successful last three seasons. Sir Alex Ferguson has used a variety of formations – 4-3-3, 4-4-2, 4-5-1, 4-2-3-1, 4-4-1-1 – and probably a few others."

 

[johnmufc]

I give up. It's not even worth debating with such strange fans. The arrogance, hypocrisy, and ungratefulness emanating from so many fans of this club is truly disheartening and burdensome. It takes so much energy to argue against these fans who do not see logic. I applaud posters like Chabon who have the patience and resilience to continue the debate, but I think I have given up.

I read one poster bring up the point that Rooney had not won a Premier League Player of the Month award since January 2010. I mean, what is the point of even attempting to argue with such intellectual dishonesty. A poor argument even if it was not fallacious, is made to look absolutely baffling when one considers the player has won the PFA Players' Player of the Year, PFA Fans' Player of the Year, FWA Footballer of the Year, Barclays Player of the Year, and has been named in the PFA Premier League Team of the Year twice, and the FIFA/FIFPro World XI once since January 2010. But I suppose this all counts for nothing, since the player has not been named the Premier League Player of the Month again.

Rooney has 208 goals for Manchester United at the age of 28. Rooney is not good enough. Rooney scores 34 goals in 2009/2010 playing as the main centre-forward. Rooney is not good enough. Rooney scores 34 goals in 2011/2012 playing as a "number ten" behind Danny Welbeck. Rooney is not good enough. Rooney currently has the most assists in the top European leagues only behind Cesc Fàbregas. Rooney is not good enough.

 

[Adebesi]

Keep fighting the fight John. Dont give up.

 

[Massive Spanner]

Rooney is not good enough.

Agreed John, sums up your point and my overall feelings perfectly.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Agreed John, sums up your point and my overall feelings perfectly.

Be careful with him. It's not an easy topic.

 

[Adebesi]

Stop being intellectually dishonest Cina.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Stop being intellectually dishonest Cina.

This doesn't seem right.

 

[Adebesi]

Do you have to be intellectual to be intellectually dishonest? I dont even know anymore. All this Rooney hate has left me emotionally flaccid.

 

[SteveJ]

I give up. It's not even worth debating with such strange fans. The arrogance, hypocrisy, and ungratefulness emanating from so many fans of this club is truly disheartening and burdensome. It takes so much energy to argue against these fans who do not see that I'm right & that they're a bunch of twits. I applaud posters like me who have shot themselves several times.

 

[Mister Ed]

I'm sorry but that's rubbish. Rooney was never low on confidence at any point. He simply refused to perform or do his job wholeheartedly and its why Fergie kicked him out of the first 11 most times team and would have sold him this summer if he hadn't retired.

Bullshit...

You are just turning it around. Rooney didn't just simply refuse to perform and not do his job wholeheartedly, he did that because he didn't felt appreciated and supported by Ferguson anymore who brouhgt in RVP to play in fornt of him on the number 9 and Kagawa to play in fornt of him on the 10. I don't know what went on in the dressing room, but it is clear something snapped between Fergie and Rooney last year. If Ferguson would have stayed on, Rooney would have wanted out because of this. He is probably one of the few that is happy with the change of manager, because Moyes unlike Ferguson appreciated Rooney and wanted to keep him here no matter what. he supported him from the start and Rooney repaid that confidence from his manager by putting in a couple of worldclass performances that we hadn't seen from him for a while.

If he simply refused to perform and that had nothing to do with Ferguson he would have also simply refused to perform for Moyes aswell. A player doesn't just simply refuse to perform, it has underlying reasons and with Rooney its clear that last year it was a lack of confidence from his manager (he wasn't even involved in the massive Madrid game in the CL). I don't know why but something absolutley was not right between Ferguson and Rooney last year and that is clearly gone now with Moyes.

Btw not a dig at Ferguson or anything, just a factual assessment that Rooney and him didn't get along anymore (like he has had with previous players at this club like RVN for example).

 

[Ludens the Red]

Stop comparing him to Gerrard.

Gerrard is playing as a DM, yet still in the last two years is as creative as most of the best AMs in the league, while still fulfilling the functions of a CM. His top 20 in the league for amount of tackles made for example. Gerrard in the last two years has basically had the stats of a DM combined with the creativity of an AM, and its not just down to set pieces, go check on Whoscored for the amount of through balls he plays per game, he is frankly still playing at an incredible rate.

Steed Malbranque once led the way for amount of tackles in a Premier League season....

Gerrard has digressed as a player, there's no question about that. And it's not even a criticism, he's carried Liverpool for years and he's ageing, nobody is expecting him to be the player of old as his game was never based on some natural remarkable technical ability.L et's not sit here and pretend Gerrard is some midfield creative maestro like a Pirlo, Scholes or Iniesta. He delivers a great set piece and can ping a great long ball over the top. That is all.

That's a very good point. Rooney's assists stats portray him as a great creator of chances. The truth is that he isn't even in top 5 of the creators of "big chances", i.e. of clear cut chances. He isn't particularly creative from open paly.

He is still a great player mind. If I'm not mistaken, no one is against him signing a new contract. The question is that the conditions in that contract could make it quite difficult to (re)sign top performers on less than half of what Rooney is supposed to get, particularly if Rooney failed to improve on his performances over the last 2 years. Imagine that Januzaj, DDG, Mata, Rafael, Jones and other of our players develop into some of the worlds best performers in their positions. Or that we attempt to sign world class players. (Re)negotiating their contracts would be very difficult.

Yeah, that's how I see it too, I'm not against keeping him but by giving him this rise, it's giving potential leeway for other players to expect such massive wages. To me, it looks like a short term panic sort of move, rather than something that's been thought out.
The fact is Wayne Rooney is not going to be a better player in the next five years than he has been for the past five years, you'd think someone at the club would pick up on that but no, bending over again.

 

[Snipers Breath]

Steed Malbranque once led the way for amount of tackles in a Premier League season....

Gerrard has digressed as a player, there's no question about that. And it's not even a criticism, he's carried Liverpool for years and he's ageing, nobody is expecting him to be the player of old as his game was never based on some natural remarkable technical ability.L et's not sit here and pretend Gerrard is some midfield creative maestro like a Pirlo, Scholes or Iniesta. He delivers a great set piece and can ping a great long ball over the top. That is all.



Yeah, that's how I see it too, I'm not against keeping him but by giving him this rise, it's giving potential leeway for other players to expect such massive wages. To me, it looks like a short term panic sort of move, rather than something that's been thought out.
The fact is Wayne Rooney is not going to be a better player in the next five years than he has been for the past five years, you'd think someone at the club would pick up on that but no, bending over again.

Well you're in for a surprise, i advice you to watch him more often from now on, because its clear you've been missing out his recent performances.

His always had remarkable technical ability actually, i used the tackles stat to illustrate how effective he has been as a player in combining the best of his old attacking attributes and moulding it with a more defensive minded approach. Of course you result to bringing up an example of Steed Marlbranque which i fail to see how it correlates with my initial point.

And he is still one of the most creative players in the league, this is a fact, and not one you should be disputing if you've followed him in the past two seasons, but yes all he can do is deliver a great set piece and ping a ball over the top.

 

[Ludens the Red]

Well you're in for a surprise, i advice you to watch him more often from now on, because its clear you've been missing out his recent performances.

His always had remarkable technical ability actually, i used the tackles stat to illustrate how effective he has been as a player in combining the best of his old attacking attributes and moulding it with a more defensive minded approach. Of course you result to bringing up an example of Steed Marlbranque which i fail to see how it correlates with my initial point.

And he is still one of the most creative players in the league, this is a fact, and not one you should be disputing if you've followed him in the past two seasons, but yes all he can do is deliver a great set piece and ping a ball over the top.

Christ, such bias, Liverpool fan?

 

[Snipers Breath]

Christ, such bias, Liverpool fan?

Yes, but i think the way you describe Gerrard reeks more of bias tbh.

 

[Ludens the Red]

Yes, but i think the way you describe Gerrard reeks more of bias tbh.

In what way, I'm in a thread, having a go at "Our best player", how far do you really think my bias stretches?
I'm not even having a go at Gerrard or anything, I'm merely pointing out what he is and isn't. I think he's limited now(presently) I'm not questioning what he's achieved in the past. I don't think he was long ball and set piece 4 years ago but I think the good things he does now are limited to that.
You shouldn't be so defensive

 

[Snipers Breath]

In what way, I'm in a thread, having a go at "Our best player", how far do you really think my bias stretches?
I'm not even having a go at Gerrard or anything, I'm merely pointing out what he is and isn't. I think he's limited now(presently) I'm not questioning what he's achieved in the past. I don't think he was long ball and set piece 4 years ago but I think the good things he does now are limited to that.
You shouldn't be so defensive

I'm only replying because i don't agree with your assertions, maybe at the start of the season yes, but certainly not in the last couple months.

 

[Ludens the Red]

I'm only replying because i don't agree with your assertions, maybe at the start of the season yes, but certainly not in the last couple months.

20 times

 

[Snipers Breath]

20 times

Rooneys a great player though aye?

 

[kidbob]

[quote.] Expect Rooney to come home and be the focal point for a shit storm.

I really hope not as I'm pretty certain it would spark a period of his worst form, whenever he has had off field issues it has coincided with his worst spells of form.[/quote]

I could see it happening like it has in the past to be honest. The funny thing is Rooney hasn't been fully fit going into an International tournament since his first Euro Championship yet the fans or press never seem to cut him any slack whatsoever. Basically the attitude around the English national team is why I hope Adnan steers well clear of them.

 

[Nick 0208 Ldn]

well one thing is for sure..I can tell you. A lot of Caf members might not be shouting "Rooney..rooney" with this alledged contract...but match day fans will sing his bloody name to the rafters if he signs.

Ah, those same match goers who chanted YSB at their hero less than a year past.

probabaly a number of clubs wanting to sign him...and yes give him whatever he wants money wise..and yet decides to try to make history as a player for united...and be united.

Where were these abundant enthusiastic suitors last summer? All the riches of the East wouldn't be qutie how i'd describe Chelsea's offer.

People talk about Van Nistelrooy...he buggered off as soon as there was an inkling he wasn't top dog. Great player.. and will never forget him but hardly loyal really and certainly not the all round player that Rooney is. Come on guys...sure he has his off days...who doesn't..but statistic wise he is totally up there with one of the most effective players within a team there is.

And Rooney's reaction to the same turn of events last year was...?

 

[Pogue Mahone]

He's still here.

 

[JaffyJoe]

That is a bit of an exaggeration actually you're right he was a bit hit and miss for the first part of the season,.But i'm talking all the way back to last season where he was excelling as a Deep lying playmaker, only second to Carrrick in the league for me.

As for the part of him not being creative, thats wrong, he has been one of the most creative players in this league undoubtedly these past two seasons, away from his assists, he still manages to crack top 10 in the amount of through balls per game, Rooney for a comparison doesn't crack the top 20.

Does playing a lot of through balls make him creative? How many of those are creating good chances? I don't think Rooney is particularly creative anyway. Watching him creative isn't a word I would use to describe Gerrard. His long passing and set piece delivery is top quality. I agree he does well as a deep lying midfielder.

I give up. It's not even worth debating with such strange fans. The arrogance, hypocrisy, and ungratefulness emanating from so many fans of this club is truly disheartening and burdensome. It takes so much energy to argue against these fans who do not see logic. I applaud posters like Chabon who have the patience and resilience to continue the debate, but I think I have given up.

I read one poster bring up the point that Rooney had not won a Premier League Player of the Month award since January 2010. I mean, what is the point of even attempting to argue with such intellectual dishonesty. A poor argument even if it was not fallacious, is made to look absolutely baffling when one considers the player has won the PFA Players' Player of the Year, PFA Fans' Player of the Year, FWA Footballer of the Year, Barclays Player of the Year, and has been named in the PFA Premier League Team of the Year twice, and the FIFA/FIFPro World XI once since January 2010. But I suppose this all counts for nothing, since the player has not been named the Premier League Player of the Month again.

Rooney has 208 goals for Manchester United at the age of 28. Rooney is not good enough. Rooney scores 34 goals in 2009/2010 playing as the main centre-forward. Rooney is not good enough. Rooney scores 34 goals in 2011/2012 playing as a "number ten" behind Danny Welbeck. Rooney is not good enough. Rooney currently has the most assists in the top European leagues only behind Cesc Fàbregas. Rooney is not good enough.

He's been a great player for us anyone saying otherwise is bitter. Could he have been even better? yes. Is his game without holes and topics which can be discussed on a forum? No. Like I said you have to pay the price for top players and he is one. I think at times fans concentrate on all the things he doesn't do rather than appreciating everything that he has done.

 

[JaffyJoe]

That is a bit of an exaggeration actually you're right he was a bit hit and miss for the first part of the season,.But i'm talking all the way back to last season where he was excelling as a Deep lying playmaker, only second to Carrrick in the league for me (and Gary Neville)!

As for the part of him not being creative, thats wrong, he has been one of the most creative players in this league undoubtedly these past two seasons, away from his assists, he still manages to crack top 10 in the amount of through balls per game, Rooney for a comparison doesn't crack the top 20.

He only really started playing dm about a month or so ago when Lucas went down. I agree that he has done well in that role.

What does that through ball stat even indicate? I don't think that confirms he is creative it just confirms he plays a lot of through balls. He has fantastic set piece delivery and he plays great long passes. He gets a bit too into them at times, like Rooney but I just don't see Gerrard as a creative player when watching him. That wasn't his strength during his peak and it isn't now.

 

[charlenefan]

Rooney is a United legend and will end up as United's all time top scorer ever, he will go down in history as one of United's best ever players,we are extremely lucky to have him, deal with it.

I still don't consider him a United legend, he could break the all time scoring record and I still don't think I would

 

[togg]

Ah, those same match goers who chanted YSB at their hero less than a year past.




Where were these abundant enthusiastic suitors last summer? All the riches of the East wouldn't be qutie how i'd describe Chelsea's offer.




And Rooney's reaction to the same turn of events last year was...?

To be honest I give up on all this Rooney bashing. He'll stay hopefully, continue to score, continue to assist and continue to be one of our most valuable and most adaptable players. Yeah, he'll have his off times, like every other top player...like RVP this season. Sure he has been injured..but he hasn't really been the same player mentally this season, that is for sure.

 

[Nick 0208 Ldn]

Let's wait for him to get his first senior cap for Spain before we talk about him being in the top 3 best keepers in the world.

Does the judgement of Spain's international coach detract from De Gea's quality at club level then?

But let's afford some generosity to your scepticism and say that DDG is amongst the ten best keepers in world football, could a claim such as that be so readily made about Rooney and his position?

Contrary to what @Chabon would like to believe i don't think that you could even categorise Wayne as part of the ten best performers in the PL, an improvement on the previous campaign certainly however much of it was simply better application to the basics [what you would expect].

Bullshit...

You are just turning it around. Rooney didn't just simply refuse to perform and not do his job wholeheartedly, he did that because he didn't felt appreciated and supported by Ferguson anymore who brouhgt in RVP to play in fornt of him on the number 9 and Kagawa to play in fornt of him on the 10. I don't know what went on in the dressing room, but it is clear something snapped between Fergie and Rooney last year. If Ferguson would have stayed on, Rooney would have wanted out because of this. He is probably one of the few that is happy with the change of manager, because Moyes unlike Ferguson appreciated Rooney and wanted to keep him here no matter what. he supported him from the start and Rooney repaid that confidence from his manager by putting in a couple of worldclass performances that we hadn't seen from him for a while.

Bovine excreta yourself.

It is called creating competition, revitalising a squad that had fallen just short the year before. How about you consider Rooney's response to this challenge, a similarly lax attitude to that which had been adopted prior to the Euros took hold, no claims of "the fittest he has ever looked" from Sir Alex. On the pitch it was telling also, Fergie's patience had in all likelihood run out.

If he simply refused to perform and that had nothing to do with Ferguson he would have also simply refused to perform for Moyes aswell.

The same David Moyes who was so accommodating of Rooney's desire to play farther up the pitch?

Earlier on somebody referred to Wayne's superb performances as a No 10 at the beginning of 13/14, yet @MoneyMay was able to show that his improved performances were somewhat misleading, that the effectiveness of the team was in fact suffering through the lack of decent link play in the centre.

To be honest I give up on all this Rooney bashing. He'll stay hopefully, continue to score, continue to assist and continue to be one of our most valuable and most adaptable players. Yeah, he'll have his off times, like every other top player...like RVP this season. Sure he has been injured..but he hasn't really been the same player mentally this season, that is for sure.

So that's a failure to address any of the points put to you and just writing them off as slating of Rooney.

 

[Snipers Breath]

He only really started playing dm about a month or so ago when Lucas went down. I agree that he has done well in that role.

What does that through ball stat even indicate? I don't think that confirms he is creative it just confirms he plays a lot of through balls. He has fantastic set piece delivery and he plays great long passes. He gets a bit too into them at times, like Rooney but I just don't see Gerrard as a creative player when watching him. That wasn't his strength during his peak and it isn't now.

I think it does, especially when you look at the players in the top 5 of that stat. There are other stats as well, like big chances created, that be used as an example of a players creativeness, and going back to last year Gerrard is one of the top players in the league for that as well.

As for your last point, i think you couldn't be more wrong, the reason he has had great partnerships in the past with the likes of Owen and Torres is because he has a great final ball, and both these players would attest to this. In his prime from 07-09 you would find it hard to find more than a couple more creative players in the league and the stats back this up.

I think the whole idea of him not being 'creative' comes from the idea that 'creative' players are only exclusively for the most part small diminutive playmakers. But when Torres was the best striker in the world, it was Gerrard who was the main supplier for his goals, same thing with Owen when he was winning B'allon D'ors, Gerrard has always been able to unlock a defence with a pass, and he is still capable of that. Its funny you mentioned Pirlo before though, because statistically Gerrard is probably one of the closest players to him, in his new found role.

For me though Rooney is different, because he is essentially a number 9 playing as a 10. I would say Rooney is a creative player as well, of course he is, and i don't think given his output in the last few years you can argue with that notion. While i consider Mata a better number 10 for United at the moment, because for me not only is he arguably more creative, he understands the role in that he sees the role in a traditional sense, where number 10 is an extension of the midfield behind it, rather than an accomplice to the number 9. This wouldn't be so important if United had say Alonso and Mascherano in midfield, but given the midfield options at present, i think the number 10 needs to be a player who can act as a playmaker as well, at least until the time United get a couple top class Cms who can control games.

 

[RooneyLegend]

People need to open their eyes, perhaps even use their brain a bit more. It seems as though some united fans in desperation to prove a point have lost all sense of reality. Football isn't a 1 dimensional sport where there's only one way to do it, one way to be successful, 1 way to play beautiful game. Its a diverse sport with a large array of tactics and styles of play which can do what the sport like any other is about, getting the job done.

Rooney being dropped for either mata or kagawa sounds like a good idea to those with a myopic view of the sport, but for those of us who can see past the superficial surface we know it wouldn't be a good idea. The lad produces the good. Sure, his form has been neither here nor there but that doesn't take away what he was doing in the first half of the season where he was by quite a distance our best player. He produces the goods, and has done so more times than not throughout his career. Its why despite his constant pleas to leave those in charge have figured its better to keep him.

Now those that argue that he can't play or holds back a more modern approach of football from our team must have been living in a matchbox throughout his career. He's never harmed our football. The best phases of play we've had in the past decade have all been with him as one of the main players. His all round game is so good that he can play multiple styles. Its just the way it is. Or did anyone really think he was holding us back from 06-08 or perhaps in the beginning of the 10/11 season when we were playing the best football in a few years. They say kagawa should play instead while forgetting the best pieces of link up kagawa has produced since being here has been with him.

Now playing 2 strikers will never be the problem especially if the quality of those players are that of RVP, and Rooney however when playing with those two up top the supporting cast has to be of the highest quality because that's the only way to undo the number deficiency in the middle of the park. That isn't gonna happen with what we're putting out there. Not anytime soon anyways. Look at how city play, aguero and negredo in tandem. Neither a play maker in the traditional sense but the others handle the transition of the ball for them so they destroy teams in the final third. Look at the team bayern used to win the CL last season. You honestly think if you replaced Muller and Mandzukic with Rooney and RVP they'd have struggled to win it?

Let's stop the crap, play them together just sort out the rest of the side. Get in midfielders who understand what the role is about. Get some quality wide play going on, perhaps with combinations from mata/janu with their respective fullbacks. Get in a left back who can actually complete the task at hand. Just sort the team out and stop focusing on non issue's. If people really think taking rooney out of the side and replacing him with Kagawa or Mata is going to make us much better then they must've been blind to the facts that got us where we are at this present moment.

 

[adexkola]

People need to open their eyes, perhaps even use their brain a bit more. It seems as though some united fans in desperation to prove a point have lost all sense of reality. Football isn't a 1 dimensional sport where there's only one way to do it, one way to be successful, 1 way to play beautiful game. Its a diverse sport with a large array of tactics and styles of play which can do what the sport like any other is about, getting the job done.

What point are we desperate United fans trying to prove?

Rooney being dropped for either mata or kagawa sounds like a good idea to those with a myopic view of the sport, but for those of us who can see past the superficial surface we know it wouldn't be a good idea. The lad produces the good. Sure, his form has been neither here nor there but that doesn't take away what he was doing in the first half of the season where he was by quite a distance our best player. He produces the goods, and has done so more times than not throughout his career. Its why despite his constant pleas to leave those in charge have figured its better to keep him.

Rooney is an very good player, however he isn't a great number 10, and I would say Mata has definitely shown he is a better facilitator (through the middle and out wide) than Rooney. I haven't watched Kagawa in Dortmund, and so far he has been misused. Why play Rooney elsewhere than up top?

Now those that argue that he can't play or holds back a more modern approach of football from our team must have been living in a matchbox throughout his career. He's never harmed our football. The best phases of play we've had in the past decade have all been with him as one of the main players. His all round game is so good that he can play multiple styles. Its just the way it is. Or did anyone really think he was holding us back from 06-08 or perhaps in the beginning of the 10/11 season when we were playing the best football in a few years. They say kagawa should play instead while forgetting the best pieces of link up kagawa has produced since being here has been with him..

Rooney was underwhelming in 06-09. Ronaldo and the defense were the stars of that team. His best moments for us have been as a striker up top, 2009-10.

Now playing 2 strikers will never be the problem especially if the quality of those players are that of RVP, and Rooney however when playing with those two up top the supporting cast has to be of the highest quality because that's the only way to undo the number deficiency in the middle of the park. That isn't gonna happen with what we're putting out there. Not anytime soon anyways. Look at how city play, aguero and negredo in tandem. Neither a play maker in the traditional sense but the others handle the transition of the ball for them so they destroy teams in the final third. Look at the team bayern used to win the CL last season. You honestly think if you replaced Muller and Mandzukic with Rooney and RVP they'd have struggled to win it?.

Good. The problem is that we don't have an awesome supporting cast, and playing RVP and Rooney in tandem encourages playing defensive wingers to cover for the weak midfield, and it has marginalized Kagawa (a number 10 by the way). Mata hasn't looked his best out wide, prefering to come into a crowded center. A solution for us myopic fans living in a matchbox would be to play/rotate RVP and Rooney up top, and let Kagawa and Mata duke it out for the number 10 spot, with inventive wingers like Januzaj and Nani out wide. Not making a striker play in the no 10 spot, while the no 10 plays out wide.

Let's stop the crap, play them together just sort out the rest of the side. Get in midfielders who understand what the role is about. Get some quality wide play going on, perhaps with combinations from mata/janu with their respective fullbacks. Get in a left back who can actually complete the task at hand. Just sort the team out and stop focusing on non issue's. If people really think taking rooney out of the side and replacing him with Kagawa or Mata is going to make us much better then they must've been blind to the facts that got us where we are at this present moment.

We don't have midfielders who understand what the role is about. What we do have are 2 genuine bonifide number 10s who are being misused, archaic wingers who's only purpose is to cross the ball into the box, and an impotent midfield. Playing 2 strikers up top doesn't help the situation.

 

[kouroux]

It's weird to see the split reactions regarding Rooney on the caf and how the home/away crowd love him and chant his name in most matches.

 

[Zen86]

You can definitely count on someone called 'RooneyLegend' for an unfanboi-ish view on things.

 

[Tomalonge]

Rooney's not a great number ten either now?

Jaysus, I've clearly been watching the wrong Rooney.

 

[Tomalonge]

I think people do Rooney a great disservice. Even when he isn't on form or fit he covers every blade of grass on the pitch. You can't compare Rooney to anyone in my opinion. He has been Manchester United this season, without him we'd probably have been relegated.

Of course he thought he wanted to leave a few seasons ago and has had a few doubts. But if that really honestly gets you that angry then it's on you. At the end of the day he's been here over a decade, not bad for someone who doesn't give a toss about United.

Idiots.

 

[dogrob]

I think people do Rooney a great disservice. Even when he isn't on form or fit he covers every blade of grass on the pitch. You can't compare Rooney to anyone in my opinion. He has been Manchester United this season, without him we'd probably have been relegated.

Of course he thought he wanted to leave a few seasons ago and has had a few doubts. But if that really honestly gets you that angry then it's on you. At the end of the day he's been here over a decade, not bad for someone who doesn't give a toss about United.

Idiots.

Have to agree with this and what is the point of getting rid of the quality that we do have, I trust the club to know what they are doing with regards to getting Rooney to sign a new contract, if it wasn't worth it then why would they bother.