The Ronaldo of 06-08 was lightyears ahead of Rooney now, not to mention his current evolved freak form.
Wayne Rooney | 2012-14 Performances
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The Ronaldo of 06-08 was lightyears ahead of Rooney now, not to mention his current evolved freak form.
So it'd be okay to hold the club to ransom if you were one of the top two players in the world? But if you're one of the club's most important assets in a testing period it's not okay?
No, the point is that as a club you don't bend over for players, regardless of their status.
Wouldn't label discussing potential transfers with a senior player as bending over backwards.
I wouldn't mind giving him the captaincy. Let's be honest, only rooney fletcher and jones are captain material in our squad. The rest of them lack any kind of bollocks. I wouldn't give him any pay rise though.
Just feck him off, sell him to PSG or something. 300k per week for rooney! Insane.
Consistently brilliant in 2010-11? He was beyond awful during the first half of that season - Berbatov and Hernandez carried the goal scoring burden, along with Nani. Rooney only really came alive after that brilliant goal against City. He was amazing during the stretch of that season, but hardly consistently brilliant.
Making Wayne Rooney captain would be another step towards making him undroppable regardless of form (his own and others') and competition. I'm not sure that's such a good thing for Wayne Rooney. Unless Moyes knows (or thinks he knows) exactly how to manage him. Time will tell on that one I guess, but Moyes clearly thinks he can get the most out of him or he wouldn't be keeping him, talisman or not.
I just like that for whatever reason, either feeling liberated under Moyes or wanting a new contract, he is playing really well right now.
Hopefully if he gets that new contract he won't proceed to lack motivation or form
A big part of any potential deal, either renewing or selling, is going to be how he ages. United will either be stuck with a huge contract for a fat, under performing former star or he'll age relatively well and maintain his position as a cultured withdrawn striker, or he'll settle nicely into a central midfield role. I think if he stays fit and away from injuries, he'll continue to play that no 10 role. I don't know if he'll ever be that great of a CM, but I think they'll be an extensive trial and error period concerning Rooney and a deep lying role, wherever he happens to be
I know Sir Alex spoke about him eventually becoming a CM, and I'm pretty sure Rooney as said that though he wants to remain a striker, he eventually sees himself as a CM
Hopefully if he gets that new contract he won't proceed to lack motivation or form
A big part of any potential deal, either renewing or selling, is going to be how he ages. United will either be stuck with a huge contract for a fat, under performing former star or he'll age relatively well and maintain his position as a cultured withdrawn striker, or he'll settle nicely into a central midfield role. I think if he stays fit and away from injuries, he'll continue to play that no 10 role. I don't know if he'll ever be that great of a CM, but I think they'll be an extensive trial and error period concerning Rooney and a deep lying role, wherever he happens to be
I know Sir Alex spoke about him eventually becoming a CM, and I'm pretty sure Rooney as said that though he wants to remain a striker, he eventually sees himself as a CM
No player is undroppable, not matter if they are captain or not and 300k A WEEK that is an obscene amount of money to play football.
Servile gimp is going a bit too far. How dare you.
No doubt he'll get his own Spud u like for his pre match meal the fat wanker . And maybe Phil Neville will be thrown in as his personal PA also. . Anything else we can do for him?
Is 300k really enough?
Is 300k really enough?
As unpalatable as some may find these media reports, Rooney has been good for United this season and there's a case to be made that Moyes has handled him perfectly thus far.
If we are giving him a bumper deal, privileged access to transfer information and the captaincy, I'm sure it's all part of the over-arching strategy when it comes to handling him.
Overall, his on-pitch application has been excellent this season - we'd be higher up in the league, if 5 or 6 of our regular starters were producing at the same level.
If we are giving him a bumper deal, privileged access to transfer information and the captaincy, I'm sure it's all part of the over-arching strategy when it comes to handling him.
Overall, his on-pitch application has been excellent this season - we'd be higher up in the league, if 5 or 6 of our regular starters were producing at the same level.
Quite despicable how some fans are using Rooney's form and him signing a new contract as something to use against Moyes when it's something he should be credited with. You might as well have 'I hate Moyes' printed on your jumpers. Well done to Moyes and well done to the club for keeping our most important player. Some of you probably want both Rooney and Moyes to fail...
He was close to becoming undroppable before but if he's also the captain I can't see any manager dropping him.
I remember a long thread in 2010(?), when Rooney first went public with his desire to leave and questioned the club's ambitions, only to be rewarded with better contract shortly after. That thread was full of caftards, slagging him off, demanding him sold and labeling him ungrateful, judas and so on.
Now, after he's done it again, vast majority here seems to be happy to do anything to keep the fat bastard at OT, including a raise of his already obscene wages and even making him a new captain.
How times change.
Now, after he's done it again, vast majority here seems to be happy to do anything to keep the fat bastard at OT, including a raise of his already obscene wages and even making him a new captain.
How times change.
I don't think that's the case, it's that a few years back, his potential suitors/value meant we could get a reasonable return, I doubt now we'd still see that, I can't see someone paying more than £30m for him, a few years back I'd have imagined he'd be worth north of £50m around the Ronaldo deal time.
He's so bad at it it's almost sad. He should go back to being a decent poster instead of this wannabe WUM who can never get it right.
This is going to be like his last contract, he'll be on 450k a week according to the papers before long. Hell, the Guardian has repeatedly claimed he's on 300k already.
Don't believe the hype.
Don't believe the hype.
Similar reaction in summer when he was flirting with Chelsea but that was after another title winning season, at the moment we have got a new manager and were going to scrape it to 4th.
Indeed. I am shellshocked as well...
If 5 or 6 regular starters were producing at the same level as Rooney we'd arguably be playing better football than last season, what did we have then? Three? Carrick, Rafael and RVP?
Yes, ideally we wouldnt be as reliant on Rooney, ideally he couldnt hold us hostage like this over his wages and if he didnt seem interested in staying we could sack him off and the team wouldnt suffer. But that isnt the situation we are in, and Rooney cant be held responsible for that. In fact, that is precisely his point, he feels our squad lacks the quality you could expect for a club of this stature and how many people disagree with him about that? How might things be different if SAF had reacted differently when Rooney first approached him and said he felt we were slipping and should be signing a few more quality players?
I dont particularly have an opinion on the question of him being captain or being kept in the loop about prospective transfers. He wouldnt be the first disgruntled player to be appeased with the armband, or the first captain to be consulted about transfers. Its not like he is being given a veto is it? Seems like a lot of noise about very little to me. To be he seems like captain material so Im not that bothered about it, certainly if the papers are in the right ballpark about who is leaving next summer he is probably the obvious choice from who is left anyway.
People calling Moyes "weak minded" and other such things are being grossly unfair IMO. I would describe what we are seeing here as pragmatism. If Moyes fails as Manchester United manager it wont be down to the weakness of his mind, it will be down to an inability to motivate his players or tactical weakness. Moyes has been under incredible pressure but he shows no signs of cracking up to me, he looks very composed.
The situation this Summer and what happened in 2010 (was it really that long ago??) aren't really comparable. He went public last time saying he wanted to leave, slagged of the players and the clubs ambition. Not to mention the fact he was turning it tumescent performances.
This season he's kept his counsel (publically anyway) and has been carrying the team. Without him this season we would be bottom half.
I'd rather have De Gea as captain than Rooney to be honest but it's not like we can go wrong with Rooney as the captain. He's the type of player that can inspire others around him.
Depends when you appoint him IMO, if it's before the Summer, it could backfire..
If the media reports are true, can't say I'm over the moon with the prospect of what we're offering him. Though it's an absurd amount of money, the 300K thing probably sticks with me the least (though I will say - such a fee should represent one of the select very very best in the world - of which Rooney is not)... rather, the idea - if this is indeed how it went down - of offering him the captaincy as some sort of bargaining chip really grates with me. The captaincy of Manchester United should surely be something thats treated with respect - and is a great honour to have... so to offer that up as a poker chip in a game of cards just dosen't seem right to me... but hey ho, times change and what not.
As for the transfer targets/say/knowledge thing... well, I must have missed the point in life when Rooney became a top European scout, but I digress... the point where you blur the lines between simply a player and a player who actually has a say in the running/finance of the club could be a dangerous thing. What next? A player who gets to look-over the squad for a game? or the first-team lineup?
Anyway, all this - along with the 300K - just takes Rooney up to a new, seemingly undroppable level... which is fine if he's in his current form, as he's currently undroppable... but what if he hits one of his ruts (that we've all seen before?) for an extended period... wilL Moyes take him out of the team? This current rumoured offer suggests not.
It could all be bollocks of course... but still.
As for the transfer targets/say/knowledge thing... well, I must have missed the point in life when Rooney became a top European scout, but I digress... the point where you blur the lines between simply a player and a player who actually has a say in the running/finance of the club could be a dangerous thing. What next? A player who gets to look-over the squad for a game? or the first-team lineup?
Anyway, all this - along with the 300K - just takes Rooney up to a new, seemingly undroppable level... which is fine if he's in his current form, as he's currently undroppable... but what if he hits one of his ruts (that we've all seen before?) for an extended period... wilL Moyes take him out of the team? This current rumoured offer suggests not.
It could all be bollocks of course... but still.
When Cantona got the armband wasnt it because he was disillusioned with football and wanted to leave? Didnt SAF use it as a bargaining chip to make him stay - also to try and encourage him to be more responsible on the pitch, stop doing things that would get him sent off? Didnt Van Persie get the armband at Arsenal after first admitting he was thinking about leaving?
Ive always been against the idea of a player being undroppable but Rooney always has been, regardless of whether he was the captain or how much he was getting paid. Besides the Madrid game and perhaps some others around that time, when he was at war with SAF, he has always been pretty much an automatic pick as far as I can remember, as long as he was fit, even when he wasnt anywhere near his best. It seems like with some players you pick them regardless because of the moment of brilliance they are capable of, even when not at their best. Either way, Im sure we wouldnt go as far as actually making him undroppable, if it was in his contract that he had to get picked if fit or something like that it would be a clear red line, completely unacceptable. I see this more as recognising the situation we are already in, as opposed to fundamentally changing it.
To be honest I still feel that we shouldn't be pandering to him this much. He's one of our better player's, but as a club we seem to treat him as if he is on the level of Ronaldo or Messi. The reality is he isn't one of the best players in the world and probably isn't one of the best 3 players in the League, despite his salary suggesting otherwise.
You look at the form Suarez has been in over the last 18 months and the contract he's apparently just signed (200k a week) and realise Rooney has never produced that level. This is fine if you are paying him a premium for his 10 year loyalty, but the fact is he hasn't been particularly loyal; it's quite blatant that Rooney's loyalties lie in the depth of his own wallet.
On the flip side though are we really going to lose Rooney over a few million a year? If he's already of around £12m a season, is another £3m really a big deal vs the additional £20-30m that it would take to replace him? I wouldn't be that bothered about the contract, but no way should be get the captaincy. He's shown exactly the kind of qualities that no young player should be encouraged to emulate over these last few years. When the going was getting tough, he threatened to leave. He has history of criticising his team mates and later admitting it was all for a few extra quid. When he was in the worst form of his career and being left out of the occasional game, instead of being a role model and working harder on the training pitch and accepting that the name on the back of his shirt doesn't automatically guarantee him starting when in bad form; he threw his toys out of the pram and requested a transfer. Even this season he's implied that the reason he wanted to leave is because he has proven himself and shouldn't be drop-able, regardless of form. Likewise he has said that he will no longer play in positions other than up front apart from for the odd 10 minutes.
The last 5 years he has displayed every quality that you do not want for a captain: selfishness, laziness, arrogance and a lack of team spirit and leadership.
On top of this he's apparently been "carrying us" this season and therefore deserves the above. Carrying us to what exactly? 7th? I'd prefer not to be carried if that's the case.
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Not sure about Van Persie - but whatever happens at Arsenal isn't of that much relevance to us - but not heard that about Cantona I must confess. From what I recall, he was given it the club captaincy at the end of the 96 season after Bruce left - a time where he was very much back in love with United - even though that was actually his last season with us as it turned out anyway.
Bosnich was on talksport this morning and made a good rationale of the situation. Wayne (allegedly) will be on 300,000 a week which over the course of 5 years equates to about 60-70 million (i'm sure somebody will point out it's more). To buy a player of Wayne's caliber would almost cost that much in a transfer fee alone, then you get onto the subject of wages which, in the current climate, would be at least 175,000 a week. So all in all, although it's a disgusting amount of money, we're not really doing too badly keeping a hold of him from a financial point of view. I'm sure the Glazers, being the tight cnuts they are, have examined this too.
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You might well be right. I dont think using the captaincy as a bargaining chip is unprecedented at all, is my point. Which isnt to say it is a good tactic anyway.
If rather we sold him then offer him that contract if it does indeed come with the captain and transfer bullshit attached. I mean for 300k a week, which is insane money anyway and way above his actualy worth, he should be over the moon. Not demanding to be captain which in itself is annoying considering how much of a cnut he is, but add on the transfer stuff and it is just insane. I mean would you feel happy if this wasn't just Rooney doing it, and players like Van Persie, Juan Mata, Januzaj, Kagawa etc started demanding to be involved in our transfer process or have access to information that is absolutely none of their business? Would you feel it's alright for players to disagree with the manager and tell him who he should have signed or not and get involved in that side of it? I don't really care if Scholes or Giggs have ever had access to this sort of thing, they sure as hell didn't make that a requirement for them signing on a new year deal with us. I'm not sure if any of that stuff is true though, but if it is and these are the requirements to him signing a contract, I'd be happier with him out of the club than in.
Who said he's demanding to be captain? People here will believe tabloids and tales no matter how ridiculous they might be. The same Guardian, who at many times over the past year, have said that he's already on 300k a week now say that he's getting a pay rise and will be on 300k? To be honest, none of the papers really know how much he is on atm and how much he will be post new contract. I honestly think that even if it's 300k a week, it's going to include his image rights and all the other stuff that goes along with a contract. Replacing Rooney would cost a lot more than whatever amount we'll be paying to keep him at the club.
No one - but it's a strong rumour/big peice of news worth commenting on - whether true or not.
Most people have quantified their posts with "if it's true" as well.
It's an enormous amount of money but with Rooney you also have to factor in his marketability and what he brings in for the club commercially. He's our biggest and most media-popular player, appears in basically every ad we do and is always on the forefront of every poster, he's obviously worth a lot to the club in that regard, I mean he's one of the world's most marketable footballers, after all.
Just try and look at it less as him being a spoilt child making petty demands and more as a player with the same interests at heart as we have (ensuring Manchester United has the best team possible, putting it in contention for winning the league, at a time when our competitors are investing far more in players than we are), looking to get some assurances his concerns are being addressed. Maybe he's thinking, SAF said he was going to strengthen the squad last time I signed but then he just bought a player who plays in my position, fecked me off and that was the end of that. Arguably all he is doing is looking to make absolutely sure management is true to its word and that all the shit we hear in the papers about "4 or 5 more players of Mata's quality" doesnt end up being just words.
For me the money is the least hardest of the three to accept, even though to be honest he's not worth near that and I mean of course no player is worth that sort of stupid money, but within ridiculous contracts and as far as they go, he is not good enough or consistent enough for 300k per week.
Yeah, same, I always assumed that to keep him we'd have to fork out a ridiculous sum anyway. I don't think people take into consideration enough just how big he is for the club though, and not just from a footballing perspective. There's a reason the club are always so willing to make him our highest earner, because he's easily the most profitable player for them too. it's not worth the money, but as someone said, to bring in someone at his level we'd still end up paying more overall in fees and wages (Cavani, for example). I think it's worth it, but not in a way that makes me happy, more of a necessary annoyance that I'll deal with.
I think SAF is spot on here, it's absolutely none of his business and isn't something we should accept our players demanding.
Imagine if we have a bunch of players telling the manager who he should or shouldn't sign? How is that a good thing?
I don't know how Moyes gets stick for being "weak minded" didn't this exact scenario pretty much happen last time with Fergie? (Except the club captain bit) the club has bent over backwards for Rooney before and has been forced to do it again. Whether people like him or not he's out best player and that's not Moyes fault, heh as to do all he can to keep him.
I think people go slightly overboard with the captain stuff. It's just a bit of a "status" for me, I doubt it suddenly means players who aren't captain won't say a word etc and will just sit in silence. In modern football it is more of a PR thing, the "face of the business" but Rooney is pretty much already that anyway so it hardly makes a difference. Also who is a better choice who plays every week when he's fit? Rio and Evra will probably be gone, Vidic and fletcher our squad players and there's no one else that stands out. It's not like Ashley Young has been made captain.
We established Rooney was bigger than the club last time this happened if you're saying he is now, nothing has changed from the last negotiations, him and his agent know how important he is and are very clever with it.
People go over the top with some of this stuff as well. It's not like all them lot played for free. From Cantona downwards I'd hazard a guess that most were some of the highest paid players in the division at the time. From what I remember Keane did almost leave at one point because of money and on a free transfer, so it's no different to this.
Players know they can get a better deal elsewhere and are tempted. Again I'd say from Cantona down the only 1 out of them who wasn't tempted is Gary Neville. It's their job and it's a short career so you make all the money you can when you have a chance. Rooney isn't the first and he won't be the last to do it, it's an old romantic tale that these players love the club and will do anything for it. I'd say in our current squad that's true for none of them, they got the chance of winning stuff and being on big money. They'd all be at Chelsea or City to if they got offered similar deals. It's not loyalty it's protecting themselves and that's the way football is.
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