Wayne Rooney | 2012-14 Performances

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#07 said:
You're right it was, in part, a problem of United's making and I'm sure that factored into Sir Alex's thinking when he went for Kagawa and Van Persie. Still, Rooney's attitude has been awful. How must the other players in the squad feel? Chicharito has scored 50 goals in 3 seasons for United without ever being a regular starter and doesn't moan? Nani...as frustrating as he can be was only two years back the best player in our team and yet can't even get into the team. If you're in the squad, you're on form and you are dropped for a player who clearly isn't at the top of his game and is not looking like he'll return to form, how do you feel when you're instantly benched to make room for him?

Rooney has proved again why Ronaldo has gone on to be the better player. I remember when we bought Karel Poborsky after his sparkling Euroo 96 and everyone (aka the media) predicted it would the end of the young David Beckham. But Beckham rose to the challenge. Competition made him a better player not a worse one. You can say the same for Scholes when Veron arrived. Likewise Andy Cole when Yorke was brought in by all accounts to replace him. It has been the trademark of Man Utd greats that when the gauntlet is thrown down they stand up to be counted. I genuinely don't know how Rooney would react to being systematically booed like Ronaldo was after Germany 2006, just look at his childish behaviour at the last World Cup when England fans expressed unhappiness with him and that was one game. Ronaldo, was a Ferguson player, you hate him and it makes him stronger, you push him and he pushes himself further. Rooney lacks that. He's been weighed, measured and found wanting mentally. Made to fight for his place and reassert himself he's spat his dummy out instead.
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Beautiful.
 
He was at a career low at the start of the 10/11 season with all his off field issues and also the media being on his back for his WC performances. He then responded in the second half of the season with some of his best ever performances. Think West Ham away and his performances in the knock out rounds of the CL. He may not be as great mentally as Ronaldo but I don't think he's weak mentally.
 
#07 said:
You're right it was, in part, a problem of United's making and I'm sure that factored into Sir Alex's thinking when he went for Kagawa and Van Persie. Still, Rooney's attitude has been awful. How must the other players in the squad feel? Chicharito has scored 50 goals in 3 seasons for United without ever being a regular starter and doesn't moan? Nani...as frustrating as he can be was only two years back the best player in our team and yet can't even get into the team. If you're in the squad, you're on form and you are dropped for a player who clearly isn't at the top of his game and is not looking like he'll return to form, how do you feel when you're instantly benched to make room for him?

Rooney has proved again why Ronaldo has gone on to be the better player. I remember when we bought Karel Poborsky after his sparkling Euroo 96 and everyone (aka the media) predicted it would the end of the young David Beckham. But Beckham rose to the challenge. Competition made him a better player not a worse one. You can say the same for Scholes when Veron arrived. Likewise Andy Cole when Yorke was brought in by all accounts to replace him. It has been the trademark of Man Utd greats that when the gauntlet is thrown down they stand up to be counted. I genuinely don't know how Rooney would react to being systematically booed like Ronaldo was after Germany 2006, just look at his childish behaviour at the last World Cup when England fans expressed unhappiness with him and that was one game. Ronaldo, was a Ferguson player, you hate him and it makes him stronger, you push him and he pushes himself further. Rooney lacks that. He's been weighed, measured and found wanting mentally. Made to fight for his place and reassert himself he's spat his dummy out instead.
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This my friend is gold..
Thanks for that.
 
AttackingFlair said:
He was at a career low at the start of the 10/11 season with all his off field issues and also the media being on his back for his WC performances. He then responded in the second half of the season with some of his best ever performances. Think West Ham away and his performances in the knock out rounds of the CL. He may not be as great mentally as Ronaldo but I don't think he's weak mentally.
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I don't think he is weak mentally.

I know he is :D
 
He's a curious mix of personal shyness & footballing arrogance (anyone remember him sitting on the ball during an Everton match?).
 
I think we're all agreed that Rooney's generally been found wanting when he's been put under excessive pressure on or off the field unlike many of his counterparts but it should also be said that this kind of attitude - that relentless determination to achieve personal goals - is what ultimately led Ronaldo and Beckham to leave the club. I'm still hoping this failing of Rooney's ultimately benefits United as he decides to stay with us and propel us to another (few) titles. Rooney's clearly just a bit precious and needs to have people telling him he's amazing to play at the top of his game. It's definitely part of what stopped him from being one of the very best in the world but at the same time I don't think it's unreasonable to say that "failing" is also part of the reason he was willing to play in various positions and put the team before himself. As Iniesta said, having players like that is invaluable and it was a big part of our success in that period. The biggest reason for Rooney not becoming one of the very best players in the world is injuries though, I think. I'd hope to find out some day whether Rooney's approach to keeping fit had anything to do with the frequency of some of those major injuries a few years ago. I tend to think that there's nothing he could have done about them as they were almost all impact injuries and it probably had more to do with his style, but I do wonder.
 
Brwned said:
I think we're all agreed that Rooney's generally been found wanting when he's been put under excessive pressure on or off the field unlike many of his counterparts but it should also be said that this kind of attitude - that relentless determination to achieve personal goals - is what ultimately led Ronaldo and Beckham to leave the club. I'm still hoping this failing of Rooney's ultimately benefits United as he decides to stay with us and propel us to another (few) titles. Rooney's clearly just a bit precious and needs to have people telling him he's amazing to play at the top of his game. It's definitely part of what stopped him from being one of the very best in the world but at the same time I don't think it's unreasonable to say that "failing" is also part of the reason he was willing to play in various positions and put the team before himself. As Iniesta says, having players like that is invaluable and it was a big part of our success in that period. The biggest reason for Rooney not becoming one of the very best players in the world is injuries though, I think. I'd hope to find out some day whether Rooney's approach to keeping fit had anything to do with the frequency of some of those major injuries a few years ago. I tend to think that there's nothing he could have done about them as they were almost all impact injuries and it probably had more to do with his style, but I do wonder.
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I would tend to agree with that, but suspect his recovery/poor performances after injuries could have been helped by more dedication.
 
Just a little clarification concerning the reality of a written transfer requests versus a player's loyalty bonus:

"The sports lawyer Ian Lynam, from the Charles Russell practice, has observed through Twitter this week that by putting in a transfer request Rooney would not be jeopardising his wages or even any loyalty bonus due to him. Only any unpaid instalments of a signing-on fee would be lost if he leaves. The significance of transfer requests is overstated in the media."

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...ghts-footballers-once-fought-for-8721729.html
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This info is courtesy of ralph250 in the Newbies btw.
 
I'd tend to agree but at the same time I find it a bit strange that Sir Alex would not only stand by and let this happen but make excuses for it.
 
Hypothetically... (and I'm aware exchanges never happen) but, if Chelsea offered £20m + Lukaku for Rooney, would you take it?

I'd probably go for that.
 
Annihilate Now! said:
I don't think your club would mind as much though - they get the star striker and starter they want/need and have to give up someone who will be 3rd/4th down the pecking order?
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Without Rooney, Lukaku will start the season a 1st or 2nd choice. Also, he's still a baby (20) and is already a monster, just the sort of player and personality Mourinho loves.
 
duffer said:
Without Rooney, Lukaku will start the season a 1st or 2nd choice. Also, he's still a baby (20) and is already a monster, just the sort of player and personality Mourinho loves.
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True, but with Rooney he drops further down that pecking order (and I don't think he'll be above Torres) which makes such a hypothetical deal make more sense. I also doubt that Mourinho is suddenly going to start playing two strikers.

Also, if Mourinho had that much faith in him, he wouldn't be after Rooney as publically as he has been surely?
 
Annihilate Now! said:
True, but with Rooney he drops further down that pecking order (and I don't think he'll be above Torres) which makes such a hypothetical deal make more sense. I also doubt that Mourinho is suddenly going to start playing two strikers.

Also, if Mourinho had that much faith in him, he wouldn't be after Rooney as publically as he has been surely?
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I think our interest in Rooney is more to do with Jose's faith in Ba and Torres than Lukaku. Ba looked pretty poor in our pre season game (TOrres didn't play much due to our confed cup players having extra holiday).
 
#07 said:
You're right it was, in part, a problem of United's making and I'm sure that factored into Sir Alex's thinking when he went for Kagawa and Van Persie. Still, Rooney's attitude has been awful. How must the other players in the squad feel? Chicharito has scored 50 goals in 3 seasons for United without ever being a regular starter and doesn't moan? Nani...as frustrating as he can be was only two years back the best player in our team and yet can't even get into the team. If you're in the squad, you're on form and you are dropped for a player who clearly isn't at the top of his game and is not looking like he'll return to form, how do you feel when you're instantly benched to make room for him?

Rooney has proved again why Ronaldo has gone on to be the better player. I remember when we bought Karel Poborsky after his sparkling Euroo 96 and everyone (aka the media) predicted it would the end of the young David Beckham. But Beckham rose to the challenge. Competition made him a better player not a worse one. You can say the same for Scholes when Veron arrived. Likewise Andy Cole when Yorke was brought in by all accounts to replace him. It has been the trademark of Man Utd greats that when the gauntlet is thrown down they stand up to be counted. I genuinely don't know how Rooney would react to being systematically booed like Ronaldo was after Germany 2006, just look at his childish behaviour at the last World Cup when England fans expressed unhappiness with him and that was one game. Ronaldo, was a Ferguson player, you hate him and it makes him stronger, you push him and he pushes himself further. Rooney lacks that. He's been weighed, measured and found wanting mentally. Made to fight for his place and reassert himself he's spat his dummy out instead.
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Awesome post.
 
Brwned said:
I think we're all agreed that Rooney's generally been found wanting when he's been put under excessive pressure on or off the field unlike many of his counterparts but it should also be said that this kind of attitude - that relentless determination to achieve personal goals - is what ultimately led Ronaldo and Beckham to leave the club. I'm still hoping this failing of Rooney's ultimately benefits United as he decides to stay with us and propel us to another (few) titles. Rooney's clearly just a bit precious and needs to have people telling him he's amazing to play at the top of his game. It's definitely part of what stopped him from being one of the very best in the world but at the same time I don't think it's unreasonable to say that "failing" is also part of the reason he was willing to play in various positions and put the team before himself. As Iniesta said, having players like that is invaluable and it was a big part of our success in that period. The biggest reason for Rooney not becoming one of the very best players in the world is injuries though, I think. I'd hope to find out some day whether Rooney's approach to keeping fit had anything to do with the frequency of some of those major injuries a few years ago. I tend to think that there's nothing he could have done about them as they were almost all impact injuries and it probably had more to do with his style, but I do wonder.
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I have said this many times before Rooney lacks self discipline to become a player of the top tier!
How many times has he come back from his vacation looking worse than fellow Brit making his summer holiday at Magaluf ...
Can´t remember last time I though Rooney was in peak condition or if ever.. He has made little of his natural footballing abilities as they came to him in excessive portions.. Wanting to leave because we lack ambitions now wanting to leave because we signed some great players, make your mind up.. Or should we only have signed great players who didn´t play in his position?
 
For Mourinho it's win-win. He either gets a class player for (by their standards) a reasonable fee or he unsettles his key rivals and their new manager. It keeps his new players on their toes, demonstrating that they'll need to fight for their places, and keeps his name firmly in the media spotlight where he likes it. Jose doesn't strike me as a man concerned with serious long-term planning; the Roon's relationship with SAF had been sketchy for some time and he saw an opportunity to gain an immediate competitive advantage from it - such is football and, indeed, life.

All I care about in this is how we deal with the situation. It has been some time now since we've had the pick of the crop in terms of top class talent - money talks loud and clear and, to be fair, we haven't looked dominant in Europe either. Although this is the reality, we are still sufficiently well-positioned not to have to sell, like other clubs might be forced to when big name players cause ructions. This has almost moved beyond Rooney, and his all too obvious flaws, to being about who we are as a club and our future ambitions. In a way, this could be advantageous in focusing the new man - and I'm sure Moyes already knows - this consideration of the big picture is what separated SAF from so many of his weaker counterparts and the Rooney saga is bringing home the importance of the long game, big style.
 
#07 said:
You're right it was, in part, a problem of United's making and I'm sure that factored into Sir Alex's thinking when he went for Kagawa and Van Persie. Still, Rooney's attitude has been awful. How must the other players in the squad feel? Chicharito has scored 50 goals in 3 seasons for United without ever being a regular starter and doesn't moan? Nani...as frustrating as he can be was only two years back the best player in our team and yet can't even get into the team. If you're in the squad, you're on form and you are dropped for a player who clearly isn't at the top of his game and is not looking like he'll return to form, how do you feel when you're instantly benched to make room for him?

Rooney has proved again why Ronaldo has gone on to be the better player. I remember when we bought Karel Poborsky after his sparkling Euroo 96 and everyone (aka the media) predicted it would the end of the young David Beckham. But Beckham rose to the challenge. Competition made him a better player not a worse one. You can say the same for Scholes when Veron arrived. Likewise Andy Cole when Yorke was brought in by all accounts to replace him. It has been the trademark of Man Utd greats that when the gauntlet is thrown down they stand up to be counted. I genuinely don't know how Rooney would react to being systematically booed like Ronaldo was after Germany 2006, just look at his childish behaviour at the last World Cup when England fans expressed unhappiness with him and that was one game. Ronaldo, was a Ferguson player, you hate him and it makes him stronger, you push him and he pushes himself further. Rooney lacks that. He's been weighed, measured and found wanting mentally. Made to fight for his place and reassert himself he's spat his dummy out instead.
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One of the most articulate posts here over the summer.

Excellent, sir.
 
redhoop said:
I agree with this but I think that's why the old guard are coming out in support of him staying - to save Moyes having to show any perceived weakness. It is galling that the Roon is apparently so weak-willed but it is not at all surprising. There are few celebrities of his status - he was the equivalent of a child star in many ways - that handle themselves in a sensible and dignified manner over their careers. I worry he could piss the whole thing up the wall if he ends up at the wrong club. He wouldn't be the first or last.
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Lets get something clear - Gary Neville has nothing to do with United. He's entitled to his opinion but ex-players, especially those in the media, making comments on the situation without knowing the full facts or bring involved at the club is not helpful. Moyes and his staff will be well aware of what's gone on behind the scenes and they need to make the decisions.

As for Rooney, to me it seems he can't take criticism - even where due. I have no sympathy for him. He might see himself as the victim but Fergie, and no doubt others at the club have clearly tried to give him the benefit of their own experience. Seems he thinks he knows better so let him go. The players won't thank him for the way he's gone on either.
 
good post indeed #07. I have always backed Rooney..perhaps more so because he is the best English player we have seen since Gazza. On form Rooney has been awesome. But his continued demand for money and to be ahead of others when he has clearly not being on form, has worn out the patience for most of us. United are bigger than him. Best he does leave. I just hope we get good money for him, not because of the owners, but so we can use it to bring a quality player ..or two in. If you don't want to play for the greatest club on earth, you are wasting our time.
 
Red Dreams said:
good post indeed #07. I have always backed Rooney..perhaps more so because he is the best English player we have seen since Gazza. On form Rooney has been awesome. But his continued demand for money and to be ahead of others when he has clearly not being on form, has worn out the patience for most of us. United are bigger than him. Best he does leave. I just hope we get good money for him, not because of the owners, but so we can use it to bring a quality player ..or two in. If you don't want to play for the greatest club on earth, you are wasting our time.
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Paul Scholes says HI!
 
#07 said:
You're right it was, in part, a problem of United's making and I'm sure that factored into Sir Alex's thinking when he went for Kagawa and Van Persie. Still, Rooney's attitude has been awful. How must the other players in the squad feel? Chicharito has scored 50 goals in 3 seasons for United without ever being a regular starter and doesn't moan? Nani...as frustrating as he can be was only two years back the best player in our team and yet can't even get into the team. If you're in the squad, you're on form and you are dropped for a player who clearly isn't at the top of his game and is not looking like he'll return to form, how do you feel when you're instantly benched to make room for him?

Rooney has proved again why Ronaldo has gone on to be the better player. I remember when we bought Karel Poborsky after his sparkling Euroo 96 and everyone (aka the media) predicted it would the end of the young David Beckham. But Beckham rose to the challenge. Competition made him a better player not a worse one. You can say the same for Scholes when Veron arrived. Likewise Andy Cole when Yorke was brought in by all accounts to replace him. It has been the trademark of Man Utd greats that when the gauntlet is thrown down they stand up to be counted. I genuinely don't know how Rooney would react to being systematically booed like Ronaldo was after Germany 2006, just look at his childish behaviour at the last World Cup when England fans expressed unhappiness with him and that was one game. Ronaldo, was a Ferguson player, you hate him and it makes him stronger, you push him and he pushes himself further. Rooney lacks that. He's been weighed, measured and found wanting mentally. Made to fight for his place and reassert himself he's spat his dummy out instead.
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Making solid points all over the place. Well done mate.
 
#07 said:
You're right it was, in part, a problem of United's making and I'm sure that factored into Sir Alex's thinking when he went for Kagawa and Van Persie. Still, Rooney's attitude has been awful. How must the other players in the squad feel? Chicharito has scored 50 goals in 3 seasons for United without ever being a regular starter and doesn't moan? Nani...as frustrating as he can be was only two years back the best player in our team and yet can't even get into the team. If you're in the squad, you're on form and you are dropped for a player who clearly isn't at the top of his game and is not looking like he'll return to form, how do you feel when you're instantly benched to make room for him?

Rooney has proved again why Ronaldo has gone on to be the better player. I remember when we bought Karel Poborsky after his sparkling Euroo 96 and everyone (aka the media) predicted it would the end of the young David Beckham. But Beckham rose to the challenge. Competition made him a better player not a worse one. You can say the same for Scholes when Veron arrived. Likewise Andy Cole when Yorke was brought in by all accounts to replace him. It has been the trademark of Man Utd greats that when the gauntlet is thrown down they stand up to be counted. I genuinely don't know how Rooney would react to being systematically booed like Ronaldo was after Germany 2006, just look at his childish behaviour at the last World Cup when England fans expressed unhappiness with him and that was one game. Ronaldo, was a Ferguson player, you hate him and it makes him stronger, you push him and he pushes himself further. Rooney lacks that. He's been weighed, measured and found wanting mentally. Made to fight for his place and reassert himself he's spat his dummy out instead.
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Great post, sums up most of my main frustrations with Rooney after last season. At this point it's honestly not that he wants to leave that makes me dislike him, it's his attitude. I really thought bringing in RvP would motivate Rooney to improve and push on knowing that he is no longer undroppable. Instead he pouted and now wants to leave.
 
pocco said:
When was the last time Rooney was our player of the year and how many times has he won it in his time here?
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He has won the fans best player award twice, the last one was in 2010. Not sure about the players player award.
 
I don't think it will stop Chelsea going after him - and Rooney trying to force the move - but if we can stick to our guns it's probably good news, despite the misgivings people will have. This is a very important year for us. Giving ourselves a big problem - while solving Chelse's at the same time - would be just too risky. I suspect whatever whining he can do with us won't be as damaging as what he could do to us at Chelsea.
 
Like it or not, but looks like he's staying now.

Hopefully he gives us the 100%.
 
Aporkalypse said:
So when will we get the sob story counter to that from Neil Ashton?
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"In the dead of night, as his wife and children sleep, Wayne Rooney lies awake, restless, exhausted, tormented. What did he ever do to them, he wondered? What madness allowed it to get to this point? "fecking Frogie", he exclaimed, barely audible over the sound of the hoover. "fecking Frogie"......"[/quote]
 
Meh. Fatty has shown himself up but for United's sake hopefully he will do well.

Selling to Chelsea for the fees quoted was never going to be on. Pretty much handing them the title on a plate.

Unfortunately though this will probably rumble on for the next year as he and his scumbag agent will continue leaking stories until he is either sold or gets a contract.
 
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