Wayne Rooney | 2012-14 Performances

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Brightonian said:
All very true. I don't think Moyes actually meant his words to be interpreted that way - I think he was actually saying that if RVP gets injured, only Rooney is good enough to step up and fill the gap. He didn't mean that Roo would only play if RVP was injured. But Rooney isn't the brightest lad, so I guess it's possible he read it the other way. Don't buy the 'angry and confused' bollocks though, there was one Sky article with no quote or source and everyone else is just parroting that.
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You make a good point on the lack of quotes.

Although there's a chance he's simply been told to stay quiet by his agent, until I see a direct quote or a transfer request I don't personally believe he's desperate to leave.

He's a northern lad, he is still well loved by the majority of the fans (whatever this site would suggest), he's at the biggest club in the country, he's won a sh!Tload here, he's on massive money etc. I doubt he really wants to go unless he has been told he won't be that central to the big plans next year.

I don't actually think he's what Chelsea need. Bearing in mind they play Mata off the main striker, it's more that front line player they need, the player Rooney hasn't been for a while.
 
Devil may care said:
Is this just your Rooney love talking though? I mean everything that is brewing regarding Rooney is negative, it hardly seems conducive to a good working relationship going forward.
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Right, let's say he wants out. That seems very likely. The question then becomes, as it were, how badly he wants out. If United don't want to sell him at all, or don't want to sell him to his club of choice, it becomes a matter of how good Moyes is at dealing with a player in Rooney's category: I don't consider it impossible that the two of them can get a working relationship going - not at all. We're going into a World Cup season. Rooney will realize that he has nothing to gain from sulking around. If the willingness is there, on the part of the club, to let him prove himself on the pitch - I think he will sooner or later attempt to do just that, once he has realized that getting out isn't an option for the time being.

It will be an awkward situation, certainly, but not an unheard of one, nor an impossible one - not necessarily.
 
JaffyJoe said:
Not that is not what is happening. Rooney was called out by Fergie about not being at his best, a player who wanted to be here would put their head down and get back to their best. Almost every player who has been here has had a run in with the manager: Giggs, Scholes, Beckham, Keane, Van Nistelrooy, Ferdinand etc. you read that list those are mainly club legends. Rooney gets no special treatment anymore and he can't accept that.

What he has done over nine years has no effect on right now. We appreciate his contribution to the club we have cheered for him and watched him become one of the most decorated of his generation. This club has been run one way, no player is bigger than the club Rooney is not an exception. If you read the whole of Moyes quote you would know he did not call Rooney a back up to Van Persie at all, the press has spun the information and it seems they have suckered you in also. Before accusing the manager of the club of anything make sure you know exactly what he has said.

Nobody here doubts he is a good player and would work well at Chelsea, what we wanted to see was some loyalty and respect from a player who has held the club by the balls before. He has not been forthcoming at all, he isn't even man enough to come out and speak for himself instead he is using the press and his 'people'. This is the club vs Rooney and in that situation their can only be one winner.
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Exactly. If you read his twitter timeline he's come out and spoken up before about bollocks in the press.

He's 'angry and confused', doesn't deny it, then Chelsea put a bid in.

Far too convenient.

I think him and his agent know exactly what they're doing.

Great player, but it's time to feck him off.
 
Sandikan said:
I hate all this Rooney revisionism, it's like some people are preparing themselves to get into Rooney hate mode if he turns up at Chelsea.

He's been a really top player for 9or so years now, a real talent, been pissed about playing in various positions etc.

Yes the negatives are that he seems not to rate staying very fit as high as he could, and last season wasn't that great, but he still scored 16, barely playing as a striker.

People have horrendously short memories, and as much as I thought VP's contribution was very high last year, he's been here 1 year and people are suddenly acting like he's the long term massive player Rooney is.

I fear we'd soon realise what we'd lost if Rooney did move to Chelsea.
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Correct
 
Sandikan said:
I hate all this Rooney revisionism, it's like some people are preparing themselves to get into Rooney hate mode if he turns up at Chelsea.

He's been a really top player for 9or so years now, a real talent, been pissed about playing in various positions etc.

Yes the negatives are that he seems not to rate staying very fit as high as he could, and last season wasn't that great, but he still scored 16, barely playing as a striker.

People have horrendously short memories, and as much as I thought VP's contribution was very high last year, he's been here 1 year and people are suddenly acting like he's the long term massive player Rooney is.

I fear we'd soon realise what we'd lost if Rooney did move to Chelsea.
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This. It sort of happened with Tevez as well where people suddenly decided to completely revise their opinion of him after he left and the same has been happening with Rooney for a while now. The hatred plus the chance that he might be off is going to lead to some massive rewriting of history with respect to Rooney. It's a little hard to believe the amount of hate our player gets.
 
Sandikan said:
You make a good point on the lack of quotes.

Although there's a chance he's simply been told to stay quiet by his agent, until I see a direct quote or a transfer request I don't personally believe he's desperate to leave.

He's a northern lad, he is still well loved by the majority of the fans (whatever this site would suggest), he's at the biggest club in the country, he's won a sh!Tload here, he's on massive money etc. I doubt he really wants to go unless he has been told he won't be that central to the big plans next year.

I don't actually think he's what Chelsea need. Bearing in mind they play Mata off the main striker, it's more that front line player they need, the player Rooney hasn't been for a while.
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Was there a poll?
 
JaffyJoe said:
Not that is not what is happening. Rooney was called out by Fergie about not being at his best, a player who wanted to be here would put their head down and get back to their best. Almost every player who has been here has had a run in with the manager: Giggs, Scholes, Beckham, Keane, Van Nistelrooy, Ferdinand etc. you read that list those are mainly club legends. Rooney gets no special treatment anymore and he can't accept that.

What he has done over nine years has no effect on right now. We appreciate his contribution to the club we have cheered for him and watched him become one of the most decorated of his generation. This club has been run one way, no player is bigger than the club Rooney is not an exception. If you read the whole of Moyes quote you would know he did not call Rooney a back up to Van Persie at all, the press has spun the information and it seems they have suckered you in also. Before accusing the manager of the club of anything make sure you know exactly what he has said.

Nobody here doubts he is a good player and would work well at Chelsea, what we wanted to see was some loyalty and respect from a player who has held the club by the balls before. He has not been forthcoming at all, he isn't even man enough to come out and speak for himself instead he is using the press and his 'people'. This is the club vs Rooney and in that situation their can only be one winner.
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No question about it. And the recent quotes from both Moyes and Woodward state very clearly that Rooney is very much wrong if he thinks he's bigger than Manchester United. But the winner can attain the victory in multiple ways. The point is that we can still make use of Rooney's talents as a footballer, if we are inclined to, and if we play our cards wisely.

He won't be pampered, he won't get more money without having proven himself, none of this will happen - we have no reason to believe that, quite the contrary. He won't be allowed to pollute the atmosphere in the dressing room either. Moyes isn't a pussycat. He will force Rooney down in the reserves if he tries anything out of order, rather than allowing him to disrupt the day-to-day work at the club. In short, we don't have to sell him. If Moyes is willing to work on him, so to speak, I think it's worth a try. Better that than selling him to Chelsea.

Our fans is a different kettle of fish altogether. But as many have pointed out, the sentiments of the average Caftard isn't all that relevant. A couple of decent games and there's no risk of him being booed by our match going fans. We certainly shouldn't sell him because a bunch of forum gimps are sick of him. That's neither here nor there, even though I personally can see where these gimps are coming from in many respects.
 
So a few days on and it's only 1 reporter, Kaveh Solhekol ( who I've not heard of before and no clue how reputable he is ), said that Rooney is "angry and confused" - rest have just gone with his story. As many have repeatedly shown, Moyes actual comments didn't marginalize Rooney in anyway and so he has nothing to be angry and confused about. That only when you take some of the comments without the full interview does it seem really damning of Rooney - which the various journos tried to do - including Sky where the original story came from, do we get something that hints of controversy.

It's almost become gospel that Rooney does feel the way it was reported on Sky. Sure if you really dislike Rooney then it's easy to take one reporters word but, shouldn't most of us at least give him the benefit of the doubt or is it now just a matter of believe any negative story spouted about him?

I know it's fashionable to call him thick, stupid, feckhead but, I doubt when it come to comments that are so directly referring to him that he hasn't read exactly what was said by Moyes - which was he and RVP would play together and it will be important that Rooney is scoring as much as RVP in case RVP does get injured, the team can rely on him equally because he has the quality to play that role just as well and others as well.

So to him maybe Moyes comments have nothing to be angry and confused about but, the reporters are trying to create something out of nothing and he is just keep his head down rehabbing.
 
duffer said:
I disagree with that completely. All of my "real life" Man Utd supprting mates want rid of him and this place is pretty much feels the same.

The only Man United fans to whom he is still "well loved" are those who fell into comas a while ago.
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Your mates are probably representative enough. But there's a vast difference between not loving a player (even wanting him gone) and actually hurling abuse at him when you're watching a live football match. The latter would be quite embarrassing. Having people on the Internet rant on about how much of a cnut he is - is not that important in the bigger picture. And we all know that fans of any description are extremely fickle. If this is sorted out, in one way or another, and Rooney starts playing well again (scoring goals, not least), the grand majority of United fans won't spend much time venting their indignation. That's the way of the world.
 
duffer said:
Sandi said "he is still well loved by the majority of the fans" which I believe to be total balls.
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I'm not denying that at all. He probably is not "well loved" by the majority of the fans. The question is how significant that fact is.
 
Vasey20|13 said:
The majority of fans clearly couldn't drown out the booing at OT a few months ago then. That was before this current shit came out.
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It's not uncommon for a player to be booed now and then, for various reasons. It happens all the time. It tends to be quite isolated, though. How often have we experienced a lasting booing campaign against a player who has won matches for us? That's the relevant question.
 
Chesterlestreet said:
Your mates are probably representative enough. But there's a vast difference between not loving a player (even wanting him gone) and actually hurling abuse at him when you're watching a live football match. The latter would be quite embarrassing. Having people on the Internet rant on about how much of a cnut he is - is not that important in the bigger picture. And we all know that fans of any description are extremely fickle. If this is sorted out, in one way or another, and Rooney starts playing well again (scoring goals, not least), the grand majority of United fans won't spend much time venting their indignation. That's the way of the world.
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I agree with this, certainly with match going fans. I suspect he will never be 'well loved by the majority of fans', if he ever was after the contract dispute in 2010. But if he starts performing and banging them in, he will be most certainly be tolerated.
 
Why would anyone want to leave a club where they are getting paid a bomb and competing for the absolute top silverware for a little more money elsewhere whilst dragging their name through the mud?

Rooney is the most recent example of a want away player. He could have been considered along with Charlton, Best, Law, Giggs, Edwards and all the other pantheon of greats had he just kept doing what he was doing pre 2010. He was one of if not the most popular player in the squad among fans and was winning everything in the game whilst earning a bucket of cash from the club and enormous personal sponsorship. Now he will go elsewhere. He's never going to be at his new club long enough to set individual records like those on the cards at United, and he's so unpopular with most fans of English clubs he'll never be truly loved again anyway.

I know the answer is that he doesn't give a feck about all that and just wants a few dollars more but I can't for the life of me work out how such a short term attitude has prevailed here. It frustrates and saddens me.


(was going to start a new thread on the issue but didn't want another Rooney thread, maybe in the future)
 
Chesterlestreet said:
No question about it. And the recent quotes from both Moyes and Woodward state very clearly that Rooney is very much wrong if he thinks he's bigger than Manchester United. But the winner can attain the victory in multiple ways. The point is that we can still make use of Rooney's talents as a footballer, if we are inclined to, and if we play our cards wisely.

He won't be pampered, he won't get more money without having proven himself, none of this will happen - we have no reason to believe that, quite the contrary. He won't be allowed to pollute the atmosphere in the dressing room either. Moyes isn't a pussycat. He will force Rooney down in the reserves if he tries anything out of order, rather than allowing him to disrupt the day-to-day work at the club. In short, we don't have to sell him. If Moyes is willing to work on him, so to speak, I think it's worth a try. Better that than selling him to Chelsea.

Our fans is a different kettle of fish altogether. But as many have pointed out, the sentiments of the average Caftard isn't all that relevant. A couple of decent games and there's no risk of him being booed by our match going fans. We certainly shouldn't sell him because a bunch of forum gimps are sick of him. That's neither here nor there, even though I personally can see where these gimps are coming from in many respects.
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I might be one of those gimps :nervous: , I was all for selling him on the cheap just so the saga can end. That's because I feel like he will leave before this window closes, so holding out for 40-50 million seems risky. I can definitely see where your coming from, the club is coming out of this situation with the club getting the better end of the stick , which is why we won't sell him on the cheap to a direct rival makes little sense.

I'm all for your idea and from Moyes' comments he is happy to try it out for a year, if it doesn't work then fine we lose him next season. I think he will have a better season going into the world cup, whatever fitness doubts there may be Moyes will get the best out of him in that regard. Perhaps he is being so quiet because he knows playing all his cards so to speak won't help him, he has two years to run and we are in no rush to sell. My own problem is he may disrupt things and having Rooney in the reserves is no good for us even if Moyes is showing who is boss.
 
You know what's the most annoying thing about Rooney? It's the fact that despite all our complains about him being inconsistent/fat/injured/unfit, he's still bloody productive and even his worst season with us still shits on nearly almost every other player in the league.
 
Chesterlestreet said:
It's not uncommon for a player to be booed now and then, for various reasons. It happens all the time. It tends to be quite isolated, though. How often have we experienced a lasting booing campaign against a player who has won matches for us? That's the relevant question.
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I don't see that lasting long. Takes a special kind of fan to boo a player winning games for you.
 
elmo said:
You know what's the most annoying thing about Rooney? It's the fact that despite all our complains about him being inconsistent/fat/injured/unfit, he's still bloody productive and even his worst season with us still shits on nearly almost every other player in the league.
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That just shows how talented he is, if he ever dedicated himself like Ronaldo did what a player he would have been. Despite that is has been one of his generations best.
 
JaffyJoe said:
I might be one of those gimps :nervous: , I was all for selling him on the cheap just so the saga can end. That's because I feel like he will leave before this window closes, so holding out for 40-50 million seems risky. I can definitely see where your coming from, the club is coming out of this situation with the club getting the better end of the stick , which is why we won't sell him on the cheap to a direct rival makes little sense.

I'm all for your idea and from Moyes' comments he is happy to try it out for a year, if it doesn't work then fine we lose him next season. I think he will have a better season going into the world cup, whatever fitness doubts there may be Moyes will get the best out of him in that regard. Perhaps he is being so quiet because he knows playing all his cards so to speak won't help him, he has two years to run and we are in no rush to sell. My own problem is he may disrupt things and having Rooney in the reserves is no good for us even if Moyes is showing who is boss.
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Let's be honest here, does Rooney look like the kind of player who'll actually manage to keep himself in shape if we decide to hell with him and just keep him stuck with the reserves till his contract ends?
 
duffer said:
I disagree with that completely. All of my "real life" Man Utd supprting mates want rid of him and this place is pretty much feels the same.

The only Man United fans to whom he is still "well loved" are those who fell into comas a while ago.
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I don't love him....and I couldn't care less about that. I hope he keeps on playing for united. Baggage is overrated.
 
Irwynwastheking said:
Why would anyone want to leave a club where they are getting paid a bomb and competing for the absolute top silverware for a little more money elsewhere whilst dragging their name through the mud?

He could have been considered along with Charlton, Best, Law, Giggs, Edwards and all the other pantheon of greats had he just kept doing what he was doing pre 2010.
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I have no idea why, but just to point out, should he stay, Rooney still hasnt pissed on the club as badly as Bestie did, and he is rightly considered an all time great all the same, as you point out.

Rooney ends up staying and breaks the clubs scoring record, he will be a legend despite all the media bollocks.
 
elmo said:
You know what's the most annoying thing about Rooney? It's the fact that despite all our complains about him being inconsistent/fat/injured/unfit, he's still bloody productive and even his worst season with us still shits on nearly almost every other player in the league.
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Not true. He didnt shit on most of our players forget "almost every other player in the league". Carrick, rafael, de Gea, Rvp and vidic ( when fit) were all better than him. Possibly Evans too. It would be a long list if I were to include players from other teams.
 
amolbhatia100 said:
Not true. He didnt shit on most of our players forget "almost every other player in the league". Carrick, rafael, de Gea, Rvp and vidic ( when fit) were all better than him. Possibly Evans too. It would be a long list if I were to include players from other teams.
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In his position, Rooney was better than most players in the league.
 
Do people think Rooney can catch Shearer's record for goals scored in the Premiership era? 260 vs 156 as it stands. He could end up with more goals than Shearer but he won't have anywhere near the adulation Shearer got from Newcastle fans. Which means of course he'll never have a bar named after him at Old Trafford.
 
Nogbadthebad said:
I have no idea why, but just to point out, should he stay, Rooney still hasnt pissed on the club as badly as Bestie did, and he is rightly considered an all time great all the same, as you point out.

Rooney ends up staying and breaks the clubs scoring record, he will be a legend despite all the media bollocks.
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I don't know man. With Bestie it was totally different and it was a different time. Best was a United man though and through whereas Rooney grew up hating only Liverpool more than United. He doesn't have the same affiliation as the fans since 2010 and undoubtedly if he stays it'll be even harder for the fans to get on side with him again let alone put him in the 'greats' bracket.
 
amolbhatia100 said:
Not true. He didnt shit on most of our players forget "almost every other player in the league". Carrick, rafael, de Gea, Rvp and vidic ( when fit) were all better than him. Possibly Evans too. It would be a long list if I were to include players from other teams.
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I'm talking about in terms of productivity and not performance. His performance have been wanting, but combined goals/assists is still pretty good for a player who's mostly played rubbish when fit and mostly injured/unfit.
 
Gazza said:
Do people think Rooney can catch Shearer's record for goals scored in the Premiership era? 260 vs 156 as it stands. He could end up with more goals than Shearer but he won't have anywhere near the adulation Shearer got from Newcastle fans. Which means of course he'll never have a bar named after him at Old Trafford.
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I think he'll be near it, but won't break it. He's in his 11th season as a professional and have played much more football than most players his age. Coupled with his track record with injuries and the fact that he's not the most dedicated of athletes, I can't see him breaking the record as he'll inevitably drop deeper to play in midfield to save his legs.
 
Gazza said:
Do people think Rooney can catch Shearer's record for goals scored in the Premiership era? 260 vs 156 as it stands. He could end up with more goals than Shearer but he won't have anywhere near the adulation Shearer got from Newcastle fans. Which means of course he'll never have a bar named after him at Old Trafford.
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Not a chance.
 
Gazza said:
Do people think Rooney can catch Shearer's record for goals scored in the Premiership era? 260 vs 156 as it stands. He could end up with more goals than Shearer but he won't have anywhere near the adulation Shearer got from Newcastle fans. Which means of course he'll never have a bar named after him at Old Trafford.
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I'm pretty sure he will, if he spends the rest of his career in the league.
 
TheBest said:
I don't love him....and I couldn't care less about that. I hope he keeps on playing for united. Baggage is overrated.
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That's a fair enough opinion and you're entitled to it. He's a great player and adds a huge amount of talent to the squad. My only worry is that he's setting a mental bad example to other players at a time when we need our senior guys to be proper pros.
Vasey20|13 said:
Not a chance.
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Nonsense. If he was played at No9 which he could be at Chelsea he could easily break it in a few seasons.
 
Gazza said:
Do people think Rooney can catch Shearer's record for goals scored in the Premiership era? 260 vs 156 as it stands. He could end up with more goals than Shearer but he won't have anywhere near the adulation Shearer got from Newcastle fans. Which means of course he'll never have a bar named after him at Old Trafford.
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Well, if he's going to get anything named after him, it has to be a fecking bar, I know that for sure.
 
Fergus' son said:
Why 'no chance' out of interest? 20 goals a season for 5 more seasons doesn't seem ridiculous to me, and we know he scores even when not at his best.
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He's only scored more than 20 goals a season twice in the league. Can't see him doing it five years in a row.
 
shaggy said:
He's only scored more than 20 goals a season twice in the league. Can't see him doing it five years in a row.
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He's not been playing as a number 9 generally though, if he went to Chelsea he would be so it is possible.

I doubt he will though, and even if he did he wouldn't be as good a goalscorer as Shearer was.
 
Irwynwastheking said:
I don't know man. With Bestie it was totally different and it was a different time. Best was a United man though and through whereas Rooney grew up hating only Liverpool more than United. He doesn't have the same affiliation as the fans since 2010 and undoubtedly if he stays it'll be even harder for the fans to get on side with him again let alone put him in the 'greats' bracket.
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I don't think so, mate. Perhaps it shouldn't be so, but I can all but guarantee you that if Rooney stays at United, things calm down, Moyes gets him going and he goes on to break Charlton's record he will go down in history as a United great. It will be different from Best, without a doubt, but we have all sorts of greats at this club. Some are great because they are considered "United through and through", as you say. Others are great because of what they have - undeniably - done for us on the pitch. Some are both. And some are just born to be adored by the masses, like Cantona or Best. But these varieties of "greatness" are, in many ways, as unsubstantiated and irrational as all the rest that comes along with being a football fan.
 
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