Wayne Rooney | 2012-14 Performances

[Varun]

Now i have pointed it out to you, keep a specific eye for it. It's not just him being closed down, it's him being tightly marked. It is one of the reasons i don't like him up front on his own, i don't think it suits him really.

Look at our 4-5-1 effort against City last season, the title decider. With no support and no service he cannot influence the game at all, because he cannot make enough space with his touch to hold the ball or create something for others.

I have seen that time and again. Contrast that to RVP last year, and you will note a dramatic difference in how his touch and close control can allow him to hold the ball under pressure, then turn to give himself enough space to either bring someone else into play, or have a shot on goal.

That is the difference imo. Scholes was very similar in midfield in his prime.

Not fair to judge him on the City game when the guy nearest to him was Park who had a real stinker. I dont really like Rooney leading the line but i dont think he's as bad in the role as some are saying. When helped with someone who's on the same wavelength as him, he'l do a good job. Had RVP not joined the club, a Rooney Kagawa partnership would have established itself at the club, i have no doubt about that.

Regarding RVP, he's slightly better at leading the line, i agree.

 

[Theon]

But Rooney is still better overall.

 

[Steven Seagull]

How the respective teams set up is irrelevant. The comparison was made to differentiate between both players ability to do something on their own, with no service or suport. Last season RVP scored a lot of goals with very little service due to his ability to make something happen off his own back.

Had Rooney a similar level of touch and close control he would have been able to do something similar, under the same circumstances. This is my whole point, it is not to detract from what Rooney does, but i believe truly great players have the ability to regularly create time and space for themselves under difficult conditions, because of their superior touch and control.

Some players like Hagi and Stoichkov were the only WC players in their teams, so they were very closely marked and often doubly so. Yet they still regularly managed to positively influence those games even under such testing circumstances, because they were so superior in their talent. That is what sets them apart, that ability to do something out of the ordinary, when their team needed it.

Rooney is our talisman and is supposed to be the one who we can look to for similar inspiration. But 11 defeats last year, only 3 points collected from losing positions, and he contributed very little in any of them.

Ronaldo used to do it for us regularly. how many times did it look like we were going to draw or get beat, and he would produce a run, or a pass, or more likely a goal out of nothing to salvage a win or a draw? Many, many times i would suggest, he was the difference so many times, and that is what i do not see with Rooney.

I agree that Van Persie is more likely to fashion a chance himself, but at the same time I think he's allowed a lot more freedom than Rooney when they play that role. It's almost as if the management at United know that Rooney is likely to become frustrated quickly and stress to him that he must stay higher up the pitch rather than leave us with no goal threat, so I don't think you can lay too much blame at his feet when he's in a proper #9 role.

I definitely think you're being unfair on him with the final point. He's scored loads of important goals for us. The nature of Ronaldo's game means he's more likely to produce something out of nothing, whether it's shooting from crazy angles or trying to beat half a team on his own. He's that good that it usually worked though.

 

[apotheosis]

I partly agree with you on what you said about him not being suited to the lone striker role in a 4-5-1. It's worked sometimes, but a lot of the time I feel it can just take him out of the game and it should only really be done if 100% necessary in my opinion.

That's how i see it too Cheesy. The times it has worked it has been because he has directly benefited from regular and quality service from the flanks.

It's not that i don't want him up there because im somehow slating him as a player. for me it doesn't benefit him or the team really, and the times he has played up there recently, he has been completely isolated and the team in general has suffered from the lack of an out ball as a result.

Which is why SAF has bought RVP imo, he proved last season there are few better at making something happen and holding the ball up when he has very little or even no support.

 

[Varun]

But Rooney is still better overall.

Rooney's the better footballer, yeah..

Both in the same team throws up exciting possibilities though.

 

[Cheesy]

That's how i see it too Cheesy. The times it has worked it has been because he has directly benefited from regular and quality service from the flanks.

It's not that i don't want him up there because im somehow slating him as a player. for me it doesn't benefit him or the team really, and the times he has played up there recently, he has been completely isolated and the team in general has suffered from the lack of an out ball as a result.

Which is why SAF has bought RVP imo, he proved last season there are few better at making something happen and holding the ball up when he has very little or even no support.

For me, the key to a lot of Rooney being up front on his own is Valencia. Valencia's direct and accurate service can work well for Rooney, especially when he's an excellent header of the ball. When he hasn't got someone like Valencia to provide him with that service though, he can often become isolated as the lone striker, which reduces his overall impact on the game greatly.

 

[Theon]

Rooney's the better footballer, yeah..

Both in the same team throws up exciting possibilities though.

Yeah true.

Apothesis is just judging him based on some very limited and strange criteria, not sure why people are pandering to him on this. Who cares if Van Persie is better at creating space with his first touch? It's just one facet of a their overall games.

 

[Varun]

Yeah true.

Apothesis is just judging him based on some very limited and strange criteria, not sure why people are pandering to him on this. Who cares if Van Persie is better at creating space with his first touch? It's just one facet of a their overall games.

Its because he's just comparing them on their abilities when leading the line on their own. More so when they are isolated. Touch and control becomes imperative then and RVP edges Rooney in that, no doubt about it.

 

[Theon]

Yeah, but why? It's a pointless thing to focus on, we don't even play 451.

 

[Varun]

We did in the game he's referring to, the City game. Wrong example to use though as i said with Park being totally shit in the game and the person responsible for supporting Rooney.

 

[apotheosis]

Yeah true.

Apothesis is just judging him based on some very limited and strange criteria, not sure why people are pandering to him on this. Who cares if Van Persie is better at creating space with his first touch? It's just one facet of a their overall games.

not really Theon, it started on a different tack completely and when people get the wrong implication, things develop into something else quite quickly.

i have made my point repeatedly over the past ew pages, and ironed out a few of the discrepancies about what i had to say. So people aren't really pandering as you put it. They have probably realised due to my lengthy effort, that i am not slating Rooney, just assessing his abilities honestly. there are some who agree and plenty who don't. Each to their own, but i am not knocking him nor was it ever my intention to do so.

Im out now, ive got a headache!

 

[Ash_G]

I would say his erratic touch and passing is more of an issue in a deeper role that as the main striker. Rooney on a bad day can still score, but he will have considerable difficulty with his passing and touch, more so then I would expect a top player to have. In the deeper position it's a big issue as that guy is the hub of the attack.

He's a world class striker no doubt, I just don't know if he has it in him to be top class in the deeper role. I thought he did after his initial breakthrough years but more and more I see him as being better off as the main striker, both for his sake and ours. That's why I was quite excited after seing Kagawa as he looks just what we need in the middle. Someone who can provide the quality on a consistent basis and is more natural in that role.

But looks like Rooney will be back in the hole with Rvp as the main striker. If Rooney can get back to his younger years in that position with the experience he has now then it could be an awesome combo, if not it could be frustrating, especially when in Kagawa we might have someone who is top class in that role.

 

[Rossa]

I've been giving this some thought and I've come to the conclusion that Rooney actually IS world class. Someone on this forum proclaimed that being world class means that you can walk into any team in the world! That I pretty much agree with, especially seeing that most great teams rotate a lot (no Downing, Liverpool isn't a great team and you aren't rotated because you are world class).

Rooney would go into Barca, either in Villa's role or as Iniesta, possibly even as a pure striker with Messi roaming freely somewhere making goals from somewhere. He is probably better than Villa would be now, or at least about the same level, and he offers something a bit different being quite versatile for a striker.

He would go into Real Madrid in Higuain's role, which would probably be pretty darn lethal, or he would replace Özil, either way he would get plenty of game time.

Now, he couldn't replace Messi or Ronaldo as they play every match every week if fit and the opposition isn't a random team from Norway, so that means that he isn't competing for the best player in the world, imo - nor does he have the attributes for that, but being a top ten player in the world, or top twenty for that matter, is still pretty awesome.

So instead of ranting on about how shockingly awful he was against Everton where Distin pissed on him and outpaced him properly (big fast fecker that one), I still think that he has a lot more in him.

To say that he isn't world class in the hole behind the striker - well, which other player would score 27 goals in one season in that role, bar Messi?

 

[I'm always right]

Rooney would go into Barca, either in Villa's role or as Iniesta

Just to clarify... you don't actually think he'd play ahead of Iniesta right?

 

[Rossa]

Just to clarify... you don't actually think he'd play ahead of Iniesta right?

To clarify withouth sounding like a politician - hell no!

What I meant was that he would be rotated in the squad in all those positions and could replace pretty much everyone bar Messi. Iniesta is a better player than Rooney, but Rooney could fill in and do a decent job with iniesta playing slightly lower down the field if required (say Xavi is injured or needs to rest his tired old legs)

At Barca I would rate Messi, Iniesta and Xavi all as better footballers, which means that it would be hard for Rooney to make it into my top five list

 

[Ash_G]

I'm hoping when you said he'd replace Iniesta you meant that iniesta would move back to attacking mid, if not, well you'd be seriously overestimating Rooney. As it is you'd imagine their first choice attack would be Iniesta one side and Pedro/Sanchez the other. Rooney is not better then any of them from a wide area imo. And I can't think why they would take Messi out of the middle where he's getting far more goals than Rooney.

I think Ozil gets over rated at times but as an attacking mid he's clearly better than Rooney so again, don't see why they'd swap him out. Rooney could probably edge out Benzema but I can see others arguing against that.

World class striker but I don't think he has enough to his game to out class the specialists who play in wide areas or in attacking mid. Also last season he didn't really play that deep that often, in some big games he went deeper but for the majority of the season he was pretty much a normal striker. His assist record was hardly great for someone playing in the hole either way.

 

[I'm always right]

To clarify withouth sounding like a politician - hell no!

Phew! I thought a was gonna have to give my whole "new favourite poster" thing a rethink.

 

[Rossa]

I'm hoping when you said he'd replace Iniesta you meant that iniesta would move back to attacking mid, if not, well you'd be seriously overestimating Rooney. As it is you'd imagine their first choice attack would be Iniesta one side and Pedro/Sanchez the other. Rooney is not better then any of them from a wide area imo. And I can't think why they would take Messi out of the middle where he's getting far more goals than Rooney.

I think Ozil gets over rated at times but as an attacking mid he's clearly better than Rooney so again, don't see why they'd swap him out. Rooney could probably edge out Benzema but I can see others arguing against that.

World class striker but I don't think he has enough to his game to out class the specialists who play in wide areas or in attacking mid. Also last season he didn't really play that deep that often, in some big games he went deeper but for the majority of the season he was pretty much a normal striker. His assist record was hardly great for someone playing in the hole either way.

As I said above, no way do I think that he is better than Iniesta, who had he scored more would be the best player in the world alongside Messi (and Ronaldo).

Playing in a 4-3-3, Rooney offers something different from Pedro/Sanchez and thus could be used quite extensively there. Both of which may have a higher top level (as does Nani) than Rooney, but they won't score as many goals.

Playing behind the striker, no one scored more goals than Rooney last year, even if several of those matches were played as a striker - but when we play with two strikers, Rooney is the one that falls deep (or when Berba played they both fell deep). So not sure that he wouldn't at least level up to Özil, and again offer something different.

I agree on his assist record for last season - simply too poor for his class.

I'm saying this, not as Rooney's greatest fan, but because I think he would be welcomed at any club as he is a bit of a different player than the other players considered world class.

 

[Rossa]

Phew! I thought a was gonna have to give my whole "new favourite poster" thing a rethink.

Haha, nono, sorry for my bad wording there, mate. Rooney will never be as good as Iniesta is - a player whom I consider to be the greatest in the world in his position, and alongside Xavi would be the great contributor to why Messi is so feckin good - even Bebe would score a couple of goals with those through passes served by Iniesta.

But, as I argued above, Rooney does offer something a bit unique and different from players such as Iniesta and Messi who are both technically superior to Rooney (who has an awfully heavy touch), but I suppose he has that certain je ne sais quoi as the French would word it.

 

[Ash_G]

As I said above, no way do I think that he is better than Iniesta, who had he scored more would be the best player in the world alongside Messi (and Ronaldo).

Playing in a 4-3-3, Rooney offers something different from Pedro/Sanchez and thus could be used quite extensively there. Both of which may have a higher top level (as does Nani) than Rooney, but they won't score as many goals.

Playing behind the striker, no one scored more goals than Rooney last year, even if several of those matches were played as a striker - but when we play with two strikers, Rooney is the one that falls deep (or when Berba played they both fell deep). So not sure that he wouldn't at least level up to Özil, and again offer something different.

I agree on his assist record for last season - simply too poor for his class.

I'm saying this, not as Rooney's greatest fan, but because I think he would be welcomed at any club as he is a bit of a different player than the other players considered world class.

Good stuff, doubt anyone could really argue Rooney is better than Iniesta.

I'm sure Rooney could be used in a rotation system in a 433 at Barca but if I had to pick my strongest team from there then Rooney wouldn't be in it. He'd have to play wide and simply put I don't think he has enough quality there and they don't need his defensive qualities. I really don't think he'd score much, his goal record for us when in wide areas isn't good from recollection and sure Barca are on another level attack wise, but personally I can't see it. Reckon Nani would have a much better time in that position that him and be more effective.

In general Rooney was slightly deeper but really I don't think it was much and if you look at how Kagawa played I really don't think Rooney was anywhere near as deep as him or drifted as much on a regular basis. It was much more of one of them dropping deep when we didn't have the ball then him noticeably being in the hole as such. Even then to me it looked like the majority of the time it was just two up front.

But yeah definitely any club would want him, like I said undoubtedly a world class striker, personally I think whilst he might once have been in line to be a world class player, playing in that deeper role, I don't think he's got enough consistency to that part of his game and is much better off as the main striker. Looks like he'll play in a deeper role this season though, so I'm hoping he proves me wrong.

 

[adexkola]

His only problem is consistency. At his best he'd walk into any team in the world.

 

[SteveJ]

An insight as to how other clubs' fans regard Rooney; for what it's worth, he's quite a popular choice here:

'Choose ONE player from every Premier League club':
http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=296800.0

Surprising, especially considering he's an ex-Everton player.

 

[KingEric7]

They'd only want him at the club so they could consistently get close enough to throw shit and bricks at him, to be fair.

 

[AttackingFlair]

 

[ricky-romeo]

to be fair to rooney, he has been one of the most consistent goalscorer in european football over the last decade or so. at the early stages of his career he was a 20 goal a season striker and when he started to take penalties he became a 30 goal a season striker. even great forwards such as henry and van nistelrooy used to get about this amount of goals at their peak.

from time to time he will suffer a bad patch and i got to admit, when he is off form he look like a pub team footballer. i think it is easy to say a player is inconsistent these days because we are seeing players like messi and ronaldo scoring 2 or 3 goals every weekend and end up the season with 60 70 or 80 goals which is insane. but these 2 are freak of a nature and maybe it would take us another 20 or 30 years to have an attacker like messi or ronaldo again.

 

[Vibhas]

Good stuff, doubt anyone could really argue Rooney is better than Iniesta.

I'm sure Rooney could be used in a rotation system in a 433 at Barca but if I had to pick my strongest team from there then Rooney wouldn't be in it. He'd have to play wide and simply put I don't think he has enough quality there and they don't need his defensive qualities. I really don't think he'd score much, his goal record for us when in wide areas isn't good from recollection and sure Barca are on another level attack wise, but personally I can't see it. Reckon Nani would have a much better time in that position that him and be more effective.

In general Rooney was slightly deeper but really I don't think it was much and if you look at how Kagawa played I really don't think Rooney was anywhere near as deep as him or drifted as much on a regular basis. It was much more of one of them dropping deep when we didn't have the ball then him noticeably being in the hole as such. Even then to me it looked like the majority of the time it was just two up front.

But yeah definitely any club would want him, like I said undoubtedly a world class striker, personally I think whilst he might once have been in line to be a world class player, playing in that deeper role, I don't think he's got enough consistency to that part of his game and is much better off as the main striker. Looks like he'll play in a deeper role this season though, so I'm hoping he proves me wrong.

On the right, Barca generally deploy Alexis or Pedro.

When Alexis plays, he's pretty much a striker. Alves makes up the width on the RHS of the pitch for him.

When Pedro plays, he plays with more width; (And Alves is more defensive but still bombs up heaps, but he isn't the width, i.e. Like Evra for us normally).

Rooney's much better at playing striker than Alexis.

I'm sure they'd rather have Rooney than Pedro on the right even if they do want some width. He can be a hard worker with a great engine, and Barca will demand that from him.

What's Rossa saying here?

Both of which may have a higher top level (as does Nani) than Rooney, but they won't score as many goals.

How are Alexis and Pedro players with higher top levels than Wayne? (Even Nani..?)

Rooney's renowned for being a complete player; he can play anywhere well.

If he's shunted out to be a wide forward like Ronaldo, you can't see him excelling? Alexis pretty much plays even more like a forward than a wide forward when he's on for Barca; Rooney's definitely better at that (and has a way higher ceiling), and even if he's asked for some more width, Rooney puts in good crosses. He's also a much better passer (passing range) and he'll just be another one of the best players in the world to play for Barca, if he went there.

Barca never play with a "Valencia" type winger (even Pedro isn't); Alves is the most width they've got, Pedro in between and Alexis pretty much central from the right. I can see Rooney being very good at the Pedro/Alexis role...
definitely first choice.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Alexis can actually run with the ball and beat a man, though which Rooney can't. So I'd have him as my wide forward 9 days out of 10 over Rooney.

I've said this before but today's Rooney wouldn't fit in at Barca. His first touch is probably the weakest out of all the top players. At Barca you need to be excellent at this stuff. Rooney is much more suited to the premier league.

 

[Art]

Alexis can actually run with the ball and beat a man, though which Rooney can't. So I'd have him as my wide forward 9 days out of 10 over Rooney.

I've said this before but today's Rooney wouldn't fit in at Barca. His first touch is probably the weakest out of all the top players. At Barca you need to be excellent at this stuff. Rooney is much more suited to the premier league.

He said in The Guardian: "Rooney is extraordinary, he could play for Barcelona.

"And before people imagine headlines like, 'Xavi says Rooney to join Barcelona' - although, I'd love him to! - what I mean is that he's our kind of player."

I think Xavi knows his football amol much more than anyone of us.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

I think Xavi knows his football amol much more than anyone of us.

I know he said that but footballers say funny things. Look at pele's random opinions on football. We watch Rooney week in week out rather that highlights reels or the odd game where xavi faces Rooney and the latter (and the rest of our team) spends all match chasing shadows.

I stand by what I said. Although I should be wary because the last time I did, a Rooney fanboi started hounding me via pms like a kid whose toy I'd stolen.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Since when do footballers only watch "highlight reels" of other matches? It's not like they lack the time or the technology to record games and watch them in full. Stands to reason that most footballers watch as much, if not more, football as most fans.

Anyway, even if the only time he ever watched Rooney play was when he was on the same pitch as him I'd rate Xavi's opinion over anyone on here.

 

[Art]

I know he said that but footballers say funny things. Look at pele's random opinions on football. We watch Rooney week in week out rather that highlights reels or the odd game where xavi faces Rooney and the latter (and the rest of our team) spends all match chasing shadows.

I stand by what I said. Although I should be wary because the last time I did, a Rooney fanboi started hounding me via pms like a kid whose toy I'd stolen.

I know what you mean but some on here with their pub footballer comments is just rubbish. It all arised from when he was 18. At 18 he was so good it was unreal.Back then I remember how we felt about him and how excited we were about such a frightening talent we laid our hands on. Its just that his game curve didn't rise as steadily and as steeply as Messi's. Probably because of all the success we've had since he's here.A pretty laid back 20 goal a season Rooney did the job. We won titles, The CL what not. His level of football was already at an amazing level for us coupled with Ronaldo's peak things were pretty rosey. Then Ronaldo left and Rooney stepped up, had a terrific season. Shame we didn't win it. I still remember the caf on the night Rooney was named against Bayern away in the CL. The caf was buzzing. After the brainfart incident by him it just doesn't feel that right to rate him as high as you used to anymore.

Aah my point being Rooney's talent was too good to believable at the start of his career at Manchester United.His potential and talent did not rise in a steady curve , If it did we'd be seeing an Englishman matching Messi. we had huge success at the club, though inconsistent with his performances he always did make significant contributions to our campaigns throughout the years. I still foresee huge debates here about how he's lost it or how he has a shit first touch but it will probably end with him giving us 25 odd goals this season.

Those cnuts with the whole 'who needs him when we have Kagawa and RVP' need to have a real talk with themselves. Twats.

 

[togg]

I think people forget just how long Rooney has been in the game and how consistent he really is. I don't think there is a footballer around who doesn't have bad patches, or periods where things don't go quite right. Apart from his skill, he is one of those English players that foreign players know can make a difference, can have that moment of sublime skill that turns a game. I know exactly why he is respected.

I hope to goodness he puts one in the back of the net today, or lays off a couple of orgasmic passes to RVP to knock in, even just to prevent an avalanche of the "rooney is crap" threads littering the forum!

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Since when do footballers only watch "highlight reels" of other matches? It's not like they lack the time or the technology to record games and watch them in full. Stands to reason that most footballers watch as much, if not more, football as most fans.

Anyway, even if the only time he ever watched Rooney play was when he was on the same pitch as him I'd rate Xavi's opinion over anyone on here.

I totally understand that and I expect everyone to obviously go with Xavi's opinion over mine. The guy is a footballing genius. But it's just something I believe based on what I've seen so it's what I'll go with until I see reason to feel otherwise.

Although how does one actually judge players when they play against Barca? Without the ball they're chasing shadows and with the ball they're looking hopelessly hurried and clumsy. It's extremely hard to judge players by games against Barca.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Not sure what your point is tbh. Why would any of that make Xavi think Rooney's better than he actually is?

 

[amolbhatia50k]

I know what you mean but some on here with their pub footballer comments is just rubbish. It all arised from when he was 18. At 18 he was so good it was unreal.Back then I remember how we felt about him and how excited we were about such a frightening talent we laid our hands on. Its just that his game curve didn't rise as steadily and as steeply as Messi's. Probably because of all the success we've had since he's here.A pretty laid back 20 goal a season Rooney did the job. We won titles, The CL what not. His level of football was already at an amazing level for us coupled with Ronaldo's peak things were pretty rosey. Then Ronaldo left and Rooney stepped up, had a terrific season. Shame we didn't win it. I still remember the caf on the night Rooney was named against Bayern away in the CL. The caf was buzzing. After the brainfart incident by him it just doesn't feel that right to rate him as high as you used to anymore.

Aah my point being Rooney's talent was too good to believable at the start of his career at Manchester United.His potential and talent did not rise in a steady curve , If it did we'd be seeing an Englishman matching Messi. we had huge success at the club, though inconsistent with his performances he always did make significant contributions to our campaigns throughout the years. I still foresee huge debates here about how he's lost it or how he has a shit first touch but it will probably end with him giving us 25 odd goals this season.

Those cnuts with the whole 'who needs him when we have Kagawa and RVP' need to have a real talk with themselves. Twats.

Disagree with the bit about Messi. He never had anywhere near that kind of potential. However, I do think you generally make good points. Maybe sometimes I am harsh on Rooney because his potential as a youngster was so ridiculous. I expected him to reach Henry's levels. So maybe in a sense, because of my high expectations, there's a feeling of being let down which isn't really fair because he is still a fantastic footballer.

However, this first touch thing is something I do believe in. If you compare Rooney's first touch to the other top top players - RVP, Aguero, Silva, Nani, Robben, so on and so forth, his first touch wavers like theirs rarely does. In terms of first touch and ball manipulation in tight spaces he can actually be quite terrible sometimes. He has other strengths that more than make up for it. He has drive, his long passing is excellent, his mind is very quick and his finishing now is superb. But I personally feel that the things that he isn't the best at (and everyone isn't great at something) is particularly important at Barca, more than anywhere else. Of course by that I don't mean he can't play for them at all. But I don't think he's a good fit there. Someone like Villa is a much better fit.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Not sure what your point is tbh. Why would any of that make Xavi think Rooney's better than he actually is?

My point is it surely can't be based on just his matches against Barca because every player looks a bit shit against Barca.

Anyway, I disagree with Xavi's opinion. Doesn't really matter why he holds his.

 

[Art]

Another thing I often notice about how people go about their 'ohh how I wish we had the 18 year old Rooney again'.

Thing is if we had young Nicholas Powell come in for us make truck loads of mistakes but still have 5 flashes of sheer brilliance in a match, the post match reaction would be something along the lines of " He's young and learnin but the those raw moments of genius were " . When you're a young prospect you have a point to prove to the manager, a point to prove to the fans and the club as to why they chose to play such a young player at such a high level. Your mistakes are generally expected. But Rooney is 26 years old. One of the senior players in our team. I'm not saying don't expect him to run past players get into a football frenzy. I miss that too but I've seen few forwards who can distribute the ball in attack as well as Rooney. He is part of a lot of successful attacks. The goals keep on coming. How are you lot not able to see this? Why is that majority of posters on the Caf have such a short term memory when it comes to a player's contribution to the club? That 09/10 season. Before that people criticized Rooney like they criticized Henry that he couldn't head for nuts. That season 18 of his goals were headers? Even Giggs in an interview recently spoke about how Wayne changed his game to poaching and how the goals come more frequently from in the box. Just because he doesn't score screamers anymore he isn't good enough? Oh wait. See Hannover friendly.

Having said all this Rooney has some really bad games. The everton one being one. But if you lot want to rubbish the player as 'having lost it' after one match or 'doesn't deserve to be playing' after one match just because you think he was responsible in the failure of a lot of our attacks in a match where everyone bar Kagawa and the goalkey was abysmal, then football must be some depressing stuff for you lot.

 

[Art]

However, this first touch thing is something I do believe in. If you compare Rooney's first touch to the other top top players - RVP, Aguero, Silva, Nani, Robben, so on and so forth, his first touch wavers like theirs rarely does. In terms of first touch and ball manipulation in tight spaces he can actually be quite terrible sometimes. He has other strengths that more than make up for it. He has drive, his long passing is excellent, his mind is very quick and his finishing now is superb. But I personally feel that the things that he isn't the best at (and everyone isn't great at something) is particularly important at Barca, more than anywhere else. Of course by that I don't mean he can't play for them at all. But I don't think he's a good fit there. Someone like Villa is a much better fit.

Thing with Rooney's first touch and why it seems to be criticized against the likes of Silva. Well I think its Rooney's positioning. He positions himself right in the hole ie just infront of the two Centerbacks with his back turned to goal which is basically him facing the 2 midfielders and 2 defenders at his tail in contrast to Silva who has an excellent first touch no doubt but more often than not drifts in from the flank with the ball at his feet. Its just my opinion that Rooney's room for error and time that can be spared to make something out of that move is much lesser than a Silva-esque player because of his positioning.But yes his touch can be volatile at times.

 

[Ash_G]

On the right, Barca generally deploy Alexis or Pedro.

When Alexis plays, he's pretty much a striker. Alves makes up the width on the RHS of the pitch for him.

When Pedro plays, he plays with more width; (And Alves is more defensive but still bombs up heaps, but he isn't the width, i.e. Like Evra for us normally).

Rooney's much better at playing striker than Alexis.

I'm sure they'd rather have Rooney than Pedro on the right even if they do want some width. He can be a hard worker with a great engine, and Barca will demand that from him.

Like I said barca don't need their wingers to be exceptionally hard wingers, not been a problem this far. I don't really agree that they do play as strikers. Yeah Rooney would be a better striker but he'a not a better wide forward or winger that them who are amongst the top in their position. I can't think of a time where Rooney has shown a great amount of attacking quality from the left for us.

As for xavi's comments, I never said he couldn't play for barca only that I don't think he would be first 11 because I don't see why they would move messi from his central position and as I said I don't think he would be better than what they have in a wide area. Personally I think nani would slot in more easier given that's the position he excels in, although he'd have his own issues such as trying to do to much.

Personally I think a Rooney in top form would look great for barca but I think the aspects of his game that seem erratic would stop him from fitting in ultimately. It's noticable in our team when he does it but it would be even more obvious at barca. They play in such a way that there just isn't took for error most the time and I don't think Rooney over a season could do it. At his best no doubt but not if he stays as inconsistent as he is in those aspects of his game. Not in the first 11 anyway.

 

[Sparky_Hughes]

Another thing I often notice about how people go about their 'ohh how I wish we had the 18 year old Rooney again'.

Thing is if we had young Nicholas Powell come in for us make truck loads of mistakes but still have 5 flashes of sheer brilliance in a match, the post match reaction would be something along the lines of " He's young and learnin but the those raw moments of genius were " . When you're a young prospect you have a point to prove to the manager, a point to prove to the fans and the club as to why they chose to play such a young player at such a high level. Your mistakes are generally expected. But Rooney is 26 years old. One of the senior players in our team. I'm not saying don't expect him to run past players get into a football frenzy. I miss that too but I've seen few forwards who can distribute the ball in attack as well as Rooney. He is part of a lot of successful attacks. The goals keep on coming. How are you lot not able to see this? Why is that majority of posters on the Caf have such a short term memory when it comes to a player's contribution to the club? That 09/10 season. Before that people criticized Rooney like they criticized Henry that he couldn't head for nuts. That season 18 of his goals were headers? Even Giggs in an interview recently spoke about how Wayne changed his game to poaching and how the goals come more frequently from in the box. Just because he doesn't score screamers anymore he isn't good enough? Oh wait. See Hannover friendly.

Having said all this Rooney has some really bad games. The everton one being one. But if you lot want to rubbish the player as 'having lost it' after one match or 'doesn't deserve to be playing' after one match just because you think he was responsible in the failure of a lot of our attacks in a match where everyone bar Kagawa and the goalkey was abysmal, then football must be some depressing stuff for you lot.

So just to clarify your last paragraph you are in the keep playing rooney when out of form camp?