Wayne Rooney | 2012-14 Performances

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I think he's simply tired, pure and simple. Carried Arsenal last season, played for the Netherlands in the summer, carried us to the new year. Don't forget he didn't have a proper pre-season either.

EDIT: Just realised this is the Rooney thread, I was referring to van Persie.
 
Its a strange one all this, he is our best all round player, other players play better with him in the team, we play better with him in the team, yet Fergie is leaving him out of big games, I understood the Sunderland one, due to England, but Chelsea and Madrid are odd.

This happened with Beckham if I remember rightly, before he was sold. Hope he is just having time off to freshen up.
 
"..best all-round player..." :rolleyes:

What does that even mean? Rooney is a top player, so it shouldn't be surprising that the team performs better with him in the lineup. You can say that about pretty much any player of his level. Rooney is a key player for us, but he is definitely not our best player.
 
I would not be surprised at all if SAF sold him. And I would understand why, as long as replacements that illustrated SAFs new thinking showed why he had chosen to do so.

Unlike other players of this age, I cant see Rooney getting better than he currently is. 50million from PSG would be ample funds to provide further depth to RVP, Welbeck, Chica and Kagawa (e.g: Lewandowski - a rumour that refuses to go away) and for a world class CM.

If we signed 2 players like that, the squad improves.

Its sad, I like Rooney a lot, but his 'heartbeat' status was lost a while back, and I think our suqad can live without him, as long as we get quality new additions.
 
I'd be very, very surprised if Lewandowski did not end up at Bayern.

It would be very, very hard to find a quality replacement for Rooney and if we could not then we'd base all our hopes on Van Persie staying fit and in form.
 
Lewandowski and RVP up front wouldn't work imo and I'm sure the former wouldn't come here to be on the bench.
 
Of course Rooney will be sold, SAF has made up his mind. The only thing that will save him is if SAF leaves at the end of the season and as long as his health is good that won't happen.

Despite all the threads I have read He has lost too much over the past few seasons to be the top paid player at a club like Utd.
 
It's true. SAF has told Rooney he's going to be sold but urged him to keep quiet in the meantime and pretend to be injured.

I mean, it's so obvious that I don't see how nobody else can see it.
 
Feed Me said:
Fair point. In fairness though, in his entire United career, he has been benched once in a big game. On reflection, RvP getting the nod didn't make much of a difference. I think we could have had Wayne leading the line and the result would have been much the same.

Just my view, but with RvP's blistering start to the season, a few people got over excited and decided that Rooney was no longer pivotal. With Van Persie's subsequent drop off in form, I think we've seen the importance of Rooney to our side, if only to spread the load.

I feel that Rooney links the midfield to attack like no other player in our squad currently does - perhaps Kagawa will develop to the same level.

As an aside, it's now impossible to have a reasoned debate about Rooney on this forum - there's far too many people sore about the whole contract saga.
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I find it amazing how negative people are about Rooney. He hasn't had his best year, but he's still been productive, especially during RVP's quiet period. I think we very lucky to have both Rooney and RVP, and I think it's fair to assume that their partnership will only get better with time. Why some would like to see us get rid of Rooney I'll never understand.
 
AARRONB06 said:
Its a strange one all this, he is our best all round player, other players play better with him in the team, we play better with him in the team, yet Fergie is leaving him out of big games, I understood the Sunderland one, due to England, but Chelsea and Madrid are odd.

This happened with Beckham if I remember rightly, before he was sold. Hope he is just having time off to freshen up.
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He missed the Chelsea game due to a groin issue. If he was dropped, he'd still be on the bench atleast.
 
SteveJ said:
'Fact is, Arsenal made better use of/gave better service to RVP than we do.
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Interesting point. I saw this stat the other day: @ optajoe: 3 - Liverpool played more through balls than any other PL team this weekend & their season total of 39 is 2nd only to Arsenal (69). Thread

That means this season Arsenal have played 30 more through balls than any other team. I don't even know where we fall in the list. I just wonder if a lot of RvPs goals for Arsenal came directly or indirectly from through balls, or if its something they've developed to suit Giroud/Walcott?
I don't watch enough of them to be able to comment.

**Sorry if this should be in the RvP thread SteveJ's post just reminded me of that stat I saw.
 
Ole240599 said:
Of course Rooney will be sold, SAF has made up his mind. The only thing that will save him is if SAF leaves at the end of the season and as long as his health is good that won't happen.

Despite all the threads I have read He has lost too much over the past few seasons to be the top paid player at a club like Utd.
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Seriously, where do people get this from?
 
Ruud10 said:
We're a much weaker side without Rooney than with him. Does anyone here disagree with that?
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Depends which Rooney shows up. Obviously if he's at his best we are a weaker side without him. It's when people say that no matter what sort of form he's in he makes us a better team that I disagree.
 
Rowem said:
It's true. SAF has told Rooney he's going to be sold but urged him to keep quiet in the meantime and pretend to be injured.

I mean, it's so obvious that I don't see how nobody else can see it.
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How is it obvious? Sounds like making hay of very few details, to me. Even if it turns out to be right I wouldn't go so far as to say it is obvious. He might just be carrying a bleedin' niggle.
 
Quinton Fortune said:
I think the problem with Wayne is he doesn't seem a great bloke which means people will jump on him whenever they can.
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I don't agree. I believe he is a good, and generally very productive player - but I think he would seem better if the game was read and not watched. By this, I mean he gets goals and assists and all that, but very often, if you actually watch the football match, he doesn't look anything special at all when he has the ball. If you could somehow watch a clip of every single thing they have done this season apart from their goals and assists - van Persie would still look like a much better footballer than Rooney I think.

That's my view anyway. Of course, goals is the name of the game, and to that end Rooney is crucial, and I'm not even implying he's a Hernandez, who he is far better than in my opinion. Just don't buy that he's technically good enough to be amongst the very best. I'd rather he stayed than went, for what it's worth - although he can be replaced with decent funds.
 
Eriku said:
How is it obvious? Sounds like making hay of very few details, to me. Even if it turns out to be right I wouldn't go so far as to say it is obvious. He might just be carrying a bleedin' niggle.
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People said the exact same thing about Nani earlier and look how that turned out. Nani might leave still but he ended up actually being hurt and has played since his return from injury. It's a completely baseless guess.
 
Quinton Fortune said:
I think the problem with Wayne is he doesn't seem a great bloke which means people will jump on him whenever they can.
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I disagree. I actually think he's a good guy who's willing to make self-sacrifices for the team. Seems a good influence in the dressing room as well (you hear players telling of his pranks and stuff). I just don't think he's that good a player as some over here make out.
 
Sky1981 said:
This whole heartbeat and general play , link up shits was introduced to stroke his ego, the truth is, he's not a better striker than Ronaldo, and RvP, hence he is the one shifted all over the place.
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RvP only had three PL goals more than Rooney (30 and 27 respectively) last season, in what was considered his best season at Arsenal. He also played more advanced than Rooney who was often in behind Welbeck or Hernandez. I'm not criticising RvP in any way but people act like there is some massive gulf between the two in terms of productivity when actually there really isn't. Rooney's natural tendency to drop deep helps us out massively in midfield and wherever he is deployed he still remains a potent goal threat.

People in here are moaning about his 'shit touch' and wayward passes as though he plays like that in every game. Everton away and Swansea away, admittedly he played poorly in those, but in other games people moan about like the second half of Chelsea in the FA cup game at OT the entire team played badly not just Rooney.

Watching that last Chelsea game at SB really reminded me of Norwich away and the first half of Tottenham at home. Something was missing from our play and it's something that Rooney brings to the team. Key passes in the final third and more composure in the box with the ball at his feet than Welbeck and Hernandez put together.
 
So the PSG owner has admitted he likes Rooney, but has not approached.

Testing the waters im sure.

Realistically if he did leave, how much should we command for him?. Atleast £60 million surely.
 
Rozay said:
I don't agree. I believe he is a good, and generally very productive player - but I think he would seem better if the game was read and not watched. By this, I mean he gets goals and assists and all that, but very often, if you actually watch the football match, he doesn't look anything special at all when he has the ball. If you could somehow watch a clip of every single thing they have done this season apart from their goals and assists - van Persie would still look like a much better footballer than Rooney I think.

That's my view anyway. Of course, goals is the name of the game, and to that end Rooney is crucial, and I'm not even implying he's a Hernandez, who he is far better than in my opinion. Just don't buy that he's technically good enough to be amongst the very best. I'd rather he stayed than went, for what it's worth - although he can be replaced with decent funds.
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This perfectly sums up my opinion actually.

Adam-Utd said:
So the PSG owner has admitted he likes Rooney, but has not approached.

Testing the waters im sure.

Realistically if he did leave, how much should we command for him?. Atleast £60 million surely.
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Enough to buy someone who could (or would develop into a player who could) replace what he brings to the team - the likes of Wilshere, Bale, Gotze.

Probably £40-45m if you take wages into account.
 
Rozay said:
I don't agree. I believe he is a good, and generally very productive player - but I think he would seem better if the game was read and not watched.
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The problem is actually not that the current game is 'read and not watched', but that the past is read rather than watched, by people whose experience of watching Manchester United and indeed football is really rather limited. Rooney is compared to an ideal, rather than reality, an ideal created by a wildly distorted understanding of football.
 
Chabon said:
The problem is actually not that the current game is 'read and not watched', but that the past is read rather than watched, by people whose experience of watching Manchester United and indeed football is really rather limited. Rooney is compared to an ideal, rather than reality, an ideal created by a wildly distorted understanding of football.
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:lol:

What the hell are you on about
 
Rozay said:
I don't agree. I believe he is a good, and generally very productive player - but I think he would seem better if the game was read and not watched. By this, I mean he gets goals and assists and all that, but very often, if you actually watch the football match, he doesn't look anything special at all when he has the ball. If you could somehow watch a clip of every single thing they have done this season apart from their goals and assists - van Persie would still look like a much better footballer than Rooney I think.

That's my view anyway. Of course, goals is the name of the game, and to that end Rooney is crucial, and I'm not even implying he's a Hernandez, who he is far better than in my opinion. Just don't buy that he's technically good enough to be amongst the very best. I'd rather he stayed than went, for what it's worth - although he can be replaced with decent funds.
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I don't think anyone will argue that Rooney is as technical as van Persie but surely the fact he has technical limitations doesn't prevent him from being a top player? He's more technical than Gerrard and we have no problems calling Gerrard one of the best in the world at his peak, so why should it be held against Rooney? Rooney has technical limitations that Xavi doesn't have, Xavi has physical limitations that Rooney doesn't have...I just think the dominance of Spanish football has skewed people's views on the importance of technique. Everyone knows it's a key part of a players' game but now it seems like it's the be all and end all.
 
LR7 said:
RvP only had three PL goals more than Rooney (30 and 27 respectively) last season, in what was considered his best season at Arsenal. He also played more advanced than Rooney who was often in behind Welbeck or Hernandez. I'm not criticising RvP in any way but people act like there is some massive gulf between the two in terms of productivity when actually there really isn't. Rooney's natural tendency to drop deep helps us out massively in midfield and wherever he is deployed he still remains a potent goal threat.

People in here are moaning about his 'shit touch' and wayward passes as though he plays like that in every game. Everton away and Swansea away, admittedly he played poorly in those, but in other games people moan about like the second half of Chelsea in the FA cup game at OT the entire team played badly not just Rooney.

Watching that last Chelsea game at SB really reminded me of Norwich away and the first half of Tottenham at home. Something was missing from our play and it's something that Rooney brings to the team. Key passes in the final third and more composure in the box with the ball at his feet than Welbeck and Hernandez put together.
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Probably, but my argument remains the same, he's shifted all over the park because he's not better than the RvN, RvP, Ronaldo in his preferred position.

You don't claim to be the best striker when you can't even be guaranteed a spot in your starting XI, and being played out of position just to accommodate him in the team.

You can argue the things he brings in the midfield, but I would argue if we buy a proper "very good midfield" he will do a better job than Rooney (a makeshift Midfield)

Let's compare apple to apple, just because he tracks back and drop deep doesnt make him a better footballer.

I'm not saying he's shit, he's still very good, but shifting in and out of positions makes him the jack of all trades, and given the choice, i'd rather have a proper midfield to play in midfield and a striker to strike up there, instead of a hybrid
 
Brwned said:
I don't think anyone will argue that Rooney is as technical as van Persie but surely the fact he has technical limitations doesn't prevent him from being a top player? He's more technical than Gerrard and we have no problems calling Gerrard one of the best in the world at his peak, so why should it be held against Rooney? Rooney has technical limitations that Xavi doesn't have, Xavi has physical limitations that Rooney doesn't have...I just think the dominance of Spanish football has skewed people's views on the importance of technique. Everyone knows it's a key part of a players' game but now it seems like it's the be all and end all.
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But what are Rooney's strengths if not technique? You talk about his physicality, but he's not as fast or strong (or at least he doesn't often display these characteristics) as he used to be and isn't something I would say sets him apart from others. I'd say the same thing for his drive and determination, although I'm sure others will be up in arms about that.
 
Brwned said:
I don't think anyone will argue that Rooney is as technical as van Persie but surely the fact he has technical limitations doesn't prevent him from being a top player? He's more technical than Gerrard and we have no problems calling Gerrard one of the best in the world at his peak, so why should it be held against Rooney? Rooney has technical limitations that Xavi doesn't have, Xavi has physical limitations that Rooney doesn't have...I just think the dominance of Spanish football has skewed people's views on the importance of technique. Everyone knows it's a key part of a players' game but now it seems like it's the be all and end all.
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Rooney isn't as technical as RVP, and that's fine - few are. However, I also don't think he has a physical advantage over RVP anymore. He doesn't look faster (he used to be very fast, not so much anymore), he struggles to hold the ball with a defender at his back, unlike RVP, and he doesn't take as many lung-busting defensive runs like Welbeck does, anymore.

You need technique, vision, pace, strength, stamina etc, and if you are lucky or hardworking like Ronaldo, you have all of those attributes listed. Now I struggle to see where Rooney shines in any of those. He has great vision, but his terrible short passing messes that up way too often. He tries to take the ball into good open areas or flick the ball to a teammate (like we know he can), but too often his poor technique lets him down.

He's very good, no doubt, but imo he isn't world class. I think Kagawa can be just as good or better than him behind the striker and RVP is better as a striker, that leaves him as a second choice for both positions perhaps. As a CM, we can do better, imo.
 
His strengths are his intelligence, see his two assists for Kagawa against Norwich. Also his passing, not as good as top midfielders but he makes around 50 passes a game on average and still manages a high rate even if he plays up top on his own. His technique is criticised for its inconsistency but he is capable of some outrageous touches, that take and finish against Aston Villa when VDS hit a goal kick to him. He's also improved his finishing and is one of the best finishers in the league. All round he's an awesome player. His only weakness for me is dribbling.
 
It's really got to the point where we not only think Rooney's not a top class player but that he's expendable and easily replaced? Wow. That's insane. There's nothing I can say to argue against something like that.
 
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