[A-man]

To be fair, the last game we played without him in defence, we conceded 13 shots on target. I think he has been very good alongside Maguire for a while now.

It will be interesting to see how we cope without Maguire. He is been our best defender but still we have managed well with Lindelof plus Bailly/Tuanzebe. What I can see we have not lost yet and only one goal conceded but not so many matches:

PSG 2-1win
Brighton 3-0 win
Real Sociedad 0-0
Granada 2-0 win

 

[Foxbatt]

I have had more a couple of looks at the goal. Yes he could have done better but the moment Fred and McTominay fecked it up he was always going to be one on one with the defender. It was a very good touch and move by Traore. There was nothing much Lindelof could do once he turned him. It was inside the box and Lindelof was stretching and all he could get was a toe poke and it was not enough. To me his mistake in the second half was more serious than the goal we conceded.
People want to bash him because they do not want to say anything about Fred and McTominay.

 

[criticalanalysis]

He had a simple clearance and he missed kicked it, it's a mistake and it cost us a goal. He usually gets away with it but not this time. We're just lucky his 2nd mistake didn't cost us either.

I'd love to see the reactions if this was the Bailly thread is all I can say..

Even a blatant bit of poor defending is 'interpretated' as not a mistake The mental gymnastics of word play and unwillingness to admit is absolutely incredible.

The constant stream of normalisation and justifcation of 'it wasn't a mistake', 'he's a smart and intelligent player', 'defenders shouldn't engage because they may get beat/turned', 'it's better to wait (read: drag) your team mates back 30 yards to defend together', 'his mistake as the last man wasn't as great or bad as the people before him' is insufferable.

He's a comprehensively flawed player and that's fine to 'accept', if he had elite/really impactful attributes (e.g the way we appreciate and critisise Fred/AWB etc) but Lindelof is the Wayne Rooney (in his midfield stint) of Defenders at this point with his legion of defenders. And by that I mean, he's practicising the art of defending by not defending and basically performs 'Silent Domination' in the head of some posters. Utterly bizarre overrating.

 

[Red00012]

Sad state of affairs he’s our 2nd best CB at the club

 

[Adam-Utd]

Even a blatant bit of poor defending is 'interpretated' as not a mistake The mental gymnastics of word play and unwillingness to admit is absolutely incredible.

The constant stream of normalisation and justifcation of 'it wasn't a mistake', 'he's a smart and intelligent player', 'defenders shouldn't engage because they may get beat/turned', 'it's better to wait (read: drag) your team mates back 30 yards to defend together', 'his mistake as the last man wasn't as great or bad as the people before him' is insufferable.

He's a comprehensively flawed player and that's fine to 'accept', if he had elite/really impactful attributes (e.g the way we appreciate and critisise Fred/AWB etc) but Lindelof is the Wayne Rooney (in his midfield stint) of Defenders at this point with his legion of defenders. And by that I mean, he's practicising the art of defending by not defending and basically performs 'Silent Domination' in the head of some posters. Utterly bizarre overrating.

agreed.

I do think he’s been better recently, but you just can’t go making mistakes like that as a CB. I think it all stems from him being a “nice” defender. He should have smashed through the ball and taken the striker with him. instead he just tries to roll it out cleanly and makes a hash of it.

By all means if Traore span him and then smashed it without a chance to do anything you say fair enough great goal, but it’s frustrating the way he should have dealt with it.

They said that united this year have gone 1-0 down more times than we’ve gone 1-0 up. that’s not a great look for the team.

 

[Djemba-Djemba]

He just really struggles with any physicality. The way he was shrugged off the ball near the end was awful and it it wasn't for a great block by AWB it might have been 2-2.

He also had a poor game a few weeks ago against Burnley who are a very physical side. It's a major weakness with him and it prevents him being a top class centre back.

 

[Davie Moyes]

Weak as anything again. It's not like he does not have the strength but just can't or won't use it unless he's rugby tackling thieves.

I remember a match against Newcastle in the second season where he was out muscling Rondon. He must have been psyched up that day.

Likely that's where his Ice Man nickname must come from. Just can't get himself angry or psyched up enough as he should be.

 

[SambaBoy]

He's not good enough. Nothing much more needs to be said about him. We need to replace him as 2nd choice CB in the summer.

 

[Zlatan Ibrahomovic]

I’m guessing your Swedish. Lindelof has been very hit and miss this year and without doubt not ‘one of our most solid performers’.

Nah he really has been, playing almost every game in a very solid defense, especially after new years.
Many players have been really solid this season, and have stepped up, so we're on a really nice track with this team and it will be excited to see how we perform next season.

We're better off spending money on a really strong central midfielder to keep, Pogba out on the left, and of course extend with Pogba rather than spending 60 million or so on replacing Lindelof, which basically fixes something that aint broken.

 

[SATA]

If Pau Torres is anything like that, then we shouldn't go anywhere near him as well

 

[Kostov]

It was a mistake, but come on, he has been very very solid in the last couple of months, at times even better than Harry imo. We should eventually look to upgrade him, but he can do a job for now.

 

[kouroux]

He just really struggles with any physicality. The way he was shrugged off the ball near the end was awful and it it wasn't for a great block by AWB it might have been 2-2.

He also had a poor game a few weeks ago against Burnley who are a very physical side. It's a major weakness with him and it prevents him being a top class centre back.

For me, in isolation, that was worse than what he did for the goal conceded.

 

[Nickelodeon]

Not every Lindelof mistake has to be a call to sell him or replace him.

 

[Djemba-Djemba]

For me, in isolation, that was worse than what he did for the goal conceded.

Absolutely it was yeah.

The first one was weak defending but you can say he was still unlucky to have Traore blast it into the top corner from that angle.

That 2nd one was atrocious defending, he gets to the ball first and it should be a routine clearance. Muscled off the ball with embarrassing ease and then we're relying on a last ditch block by AWB to save us.

 

[11101]

We will have to agree to disagree. I’ve watched that goal multiple times now to see if I’m being harsh and it just makes me angry. I’ve never seen a cb so averse to physical confrontation, it’s a big problem

btw every single review I’ve read too has him down for being too soft. That’s before we talk about the 2nd half chance he coughed up too

See here for what happens when you get too tight to an attacker in the box:




The main thing he could have done better was his touch away, but I'm sure we have all been there when you are scrambling for the ball and can't quite get your feet right to kick it properly. I'm not going to get the pitchforks out for what was actually a very good turn and strike. Every defender from Baresi to Beckenbauer has conceded goals like that over the years.

 

[Berbasbullet]

See here for what happens when you get too tight to an attacker in the box:




The main thing he could have done better was his touch away, but I'm sure we have all been there when you are trying to keep up with the ball and can't quite get your feet right to kick it away harder. I'm not going to get the pitchforks out for what was actually a very good turn and strike. Every defender from Baresi to Beckenbauer has conceded goals like that over the years.

Great post, Lindelof should have toe poked it away but I felt like he was maybe trying to pass it to AWB. It happens.

It happens and I’d rather say the striker did really well for Villa.

Not every Lindelof mistake has to be a call to sell him or replace him.

You must be new here.

 

[VP89]

Lindelof is that player where if he makes a mistake it's like he burned someone's house down on the caf

 

[Who's Kissing Cameras?]

Throwback to his debut season yesterday. Weak performance. He’s been good generally this season but really poor yesterday.

 

[KiD MoYeS]

I just can't feel fully comfortable with him in defence - no matter how well he's playing his defending can result in a goal. I like the guy but anyone suggesting an upgrade is not required is completely delusional.

 

[Lukinho]

His style doesnt suit the Premier League. He would be better in Spain of Germany. This is the reason why he plays good in Europe most of the times.

 

[Hackman2210]

If we sold everyone who made a mistake - we’d be watching a blank screen. Lindelof and maguire are martially a defence on a team that has only lost 4 league games all season. Even the great Dias and stones have lost 5. Way too harsh on here.

 

[golden_blunder]

See here for what happens when you get too tight to an attacker in the box:




The main thing he could have done better was his touch away, but I'm sure we have all been there when you are scrambling for the ball and can't quite get your feet right to kick it properly. I'm not going to get the pitchforks out for what was actually a very good turn and strike. Every defender from Baresi to Beckenbauer has conceded goals like that over the years.

It’s not just one mistake yesterday though is it? (I don’t agree with you on that either)
Every defender has made a mistake yes, but the best ones keep them to a minimum, Lindelof has one in him every few games. They don’t always lead to goals but that’s through no doing of his. He’s just an accident waiting to happen. Him & Bailly need to be replaced

 

[11101]

It’s not just one mistake yesterday though is it? (I don’t agree with you on that either)
Every defender has made a mistake yes, but the best ones keep them to a minimum, Lindelof has one in him every few games. They don’t always lead to goals but that’s through no doing of his. He’s just an accident waiting to happen. Him & Bailly need to be replaced

I don't disagree with you on that, just concentrating on that one passage of play.

A mistake free defender does not exist though. Never has. It's like lining up the holes in Swiss cheese. The others are supposed to cover when one of them screws up. A goal usually comes from two or three small mistakes in a row.

 

[gajender]

Lindelof is that player where if he makes a mistake it's like he burned someone's house down on the caf

He has some very vocal critics that's for sure not that I believe he can't be upgraded upon but barring few most in our team can be.
And thing with Center Backs is if you forensically analyse everything they do most of them would come up short.

 

[golden_blunder]

He has some very vocal critics that's for sure not that I believe he can't be upgraded upon but barring few most in our team can be.
And thing with Center Backs is if you forensically analyse everything they do most of them would come up short.

We don’t have to forensically analyse him though, his errors are clear as day, and often. That’s why he gets talked about.

 

[golden_blunder]

I don't disagree with you on that, just concentrating on that one passage of play.

A mistake free defender does not exist though. Never has. It's like lining up the holes in Swiss cheese. The others are supposed to cover when one of them screws up. A goal usually comes from two or three small mistakes in a row.

I know a mistake free defender doesn’t exist, even Rio and Vida had the odd error in them. But ‘odd’ is the word here, not every few games

 

[Adam-Utd]

The main thing he could have done better was his touch away, but I'm sure we have all been there when you are scrambling for the ball and can't quite get your feet right to kick it properly. I'm not going to get the pitchforks out for what was actually a very good turn and strike. Every defender from Baresi to Beckenbauer has conceded goals like that over the years.

I think that's the annoying thing though, he did well up to the simple point of just kicking the ball way, then somehow just didn't kick it properly.

Yes it was a fantastic goal but it was a simple clearance that shouldn't really be possible to screw up.

1 thing I noticed was as soon as Maguire got injured, they immediately lined up 2 giant centre forwards - I think that says everything.

 

[KiD MoYeS]

If we sold everyone who made a mistake - we’d be watching a blank screen. Lindelof and maguire are martially a defence on a team that has only lost 4 league games all season. Even the great Dias and stones have lost 5. Way too harsh on here.

Man Utd have also been 1-0 down in more games this season than been 1-0 up. The comebacks are fantastic but can they keep it up?

 

[Eugenius]

I don't disagree with you on that, just concentrating on that one passage of play.

A mistake free defender does not exist though. Never has. It's like lining up the holes in Swiss cheese. The others are supposed to cover when one of them screws up. A goal usually comes from two or three small mistakes in a row.

There's the odd mistake but several times a season Lindelof will make an average player look like prime Drogba from his lack of physical application. It's a repeat flaw in his game. If anything he tends to be lucky to get away with his mistakes rather than being unlucky that it's a random brainfart.

 

[Floyd]

I think that's the annoying thing though, he did well up to the simple point of just kicking the ball way, then somehow just didn't kick it properly.

Yes it was a fantastic goal but it was a simple clearance that shouldn't really be possible to screw up.

1 thing I noticed was as soon as Maguire got injured, they immediately lined up 2 giant centre forwards - I think that says everything.

Noticed that as well. They would not make those subs with Harry on the pitch.

 

[Devil81]

You know someone isn't very good when fellow pro's are commenting on whether they are good enough. Generally most ex pro's will find excuses for a player if they've played bad or they won't name a player outright.

Last night on Talksport Darren Bent and Darren Ambrose both said he's awful. Physically he's not up to the job, in his head he's a good defender and he can read the game but he either switches off or he gets bullied for the ball.

I thought we could get away with the defence this summer but now I'm not that sure.

 

[romufc]

You know someone isn't very good when fellow pro's are commenting on whether they are good enough. Generally most ex pro's will find excuses for a player if they've played bad or they won't name a player outright.

Last night on Talksport Darren Bent and Darren Ambrose both said he's awful. Physically he's not up to the job, in his head he's a good defender and he can read the game but he either switches off or he gets bullied for the ball.

I thought we could get away with the defence this summer but now I'm not that sure.

Having an awful CB and 2 average CM and we still have only lost 4 PL games? We are 2nd in the league and in a Europa Final? How is that possible?

Talk Sport is probably the worst radio channel to draw any conclusions.

I mean if you follow the ex pros, alot of ex managers and pundits also doubt Ole.

 

[ivaldo]

He’s not just shit though it’s just that you keep making excuses for him. He’s below the standard we should accept

It's more that every single error he makes you and others posters blow it wildly our of proportion, as if other CBs aren't making errors. We're the hardest team to beat in the league for a reason. I'm also pretty sure that when Maguire and Lindelof partner at the back we concede the least, or close to the least, amount of goals in the league as well (when extrapolated across a full season). That doesn't happen if one of your CBs is as poor as this place claims him to be. That's not to say we can't upgrade on him, but he isn't nearly as bad as made out.

It’s not just one mistake yesterday though is it? (I don’t agree with you on that either)
Every defender has made a mistake yes, but the best ones keep them to a minimum, Lindelof has one in him every few games.

But no he doesn't. The cafe just tries it's very best to make it seem that way. Our fullback can lose his man, get our jumped in the air, and you see posts in this thread saying Lindelof shares the blame for telling his fullback where to be, or for being half a foot too far forward. That doesn't happen with other CBs.

Having an awful CB and 2 average CM and we still have only lost 4 PL games? We are 2nd in the league and in a Europa Final? How is that possible?

Precisely. Ole must be a fecking wizard if he can get half a team performing to the standards he has!

 

[Ekeke]

Having an awful CB and 2 average CM and we still have only lost 4 PL games? We are 2nd in the league and in a Europa Final? How is that possible?

Talk Sport is probably the worst radio channel to draw any conclusions.

I mean if you follow the ex pros, alot of ex managers and pundits also doubt Ole.

Easy. Special players carrying the load

Bruno is special up front. Cavani's recent form has been special. Shaw's chance creation from leftback has also been special. Rashford has also been a very good contributor

AWB is special at the back and Maguire is a very solid, mostly reliable CB. Henderson has been solid in goal and thats been a big improvement on De Gea over the past 3 or so seasons

These are players that go beyond doing their own job, they do more than that so we've got by with some players not doing everything they should do for their job in the team

But when it comes to improving what we have obviously we look to replace those that dont do everything with those that do, and relieve the stress and pressure on the players covering their weaknesses. We did the same thing with the likes of Brown, O'Shea, Heinze, P. Neville etc. We had success with them but we always looked to improve the team and we did so in their areas. Its no different now

 

[romufc]

Easy. Special players carrying the load

Bruno is special up front. Cavani's recent form has been special. Shaw's chance creation from leftback has also been special. Rashford has also been a very good contributor

AWB is special at the back and Maguire is a very solid, mostly reliable CB. Henderson has been solid in goal and thats been a big improvement on De Gea over the past 3 or so seasons

These are players that go beyond doing their own job, they do more than that so we've got by with some players not doing everything they should do for their job in the team

But when it comes to improving what we have obviously we look to replace those that dont do everything with those that do, and relieve the stress and pressure on the players covering their weaknesses. We did the same thing with the likes of Brown, O'Shea, Heinze, P. Neville etc. We had success with them but we always looked to improve the team and we did so in their areas. Its no different now

I am not saying that Lindelof, Fred, McTominay cannot be upgraded. We need a new CDM, 100% but I would not go with the theory that he is awful?

 

[A-man]

Having an awful CB and 2 average CM and we still have only lost 4 PL games? We are 2nd in the league and in a Europa Final? How is that possible?

It’s of course not possible. And 2 of those 4 rare losses came when Lindelof wasn’t even playing. Last time we lost with him was more than six months ago. If he had so many so big weaknesses as some claim, every team would take opportunity of that. But they haven’t. When he has a bad game or even 1-2 bad actions, it gets blown out of proportion and he needs to be replaced.

 

[romufc]

It’s of course not possible. And 2 of those 4 rare losses came when Lindelof wasn’t even playing. Last time we lost with him was more than six months ago. If he had so many so big weaknesses as some claim, every team would take opportunity of that. But they haven’t. When he has a bad game or even 1-2 bad actions, it gets blown out of proportion and he needs to be replaced.

Agreed, I have not seen 1 CB in the last 2/3 years who has made 0 mistakes.

I have seen Dias make a real blooper in the FA cup semi final.

Surely if there is a major flaw in a CB position where a player is awful, every team will be looking to play on that side and have a go at him, hardly see that.

Also, in the bigger games, we hardly concede either, in games where he is playing against better players?

I cannot make sense of it, he might not be the best CB but he is better than most people think.

 

[anant]

Lindelof has had a good season and one bad game shouldn't change a thing.

I think yesterday's goal was more on McT and Fred especially after they lost the ball right in front of 18 yard box and in most cases it is a goal. He may not have managed to get the toe-poke in, but he did cover the angle for the shot pretty well, it was unfortunate that the shot was a worldie and ended up in the top corner

 

[Eugenius]

It’s of course not possible. And 2 of those 4 rare losses came when Lindelof wasn’t even playing. Last time we lost with him was more than six months ago. If he had so many so big weaknesses as some claim, every team would take opportunity of that. But they haven’t. When he has a bad game or even 1-2 bad actions, it gets blown out of proportion and he needs to be replaced.

It is possible. Bear in mind we had the joint best defence in the league in 2015/16 with a back four of Valencia, Smalling, Jones and Blind under LvG.

 

[LawCharltonBest]

His big weakness is literally his weakness.

He gets outmuscled way too much. Any time he's up against a forward with a bit of timber he finds it very difficult. It's happened time and time again this season and I'm surprised people haven't noticed it more.

A prime Rooney or Drogba would have had a field day against him