[Ekeke]

If you think Smalling is a better CB you are having a laugh. Think most posters on here are pretty certain that the favoured CB pairing next season will be Lindelöf + new CB.

I'm not saying Smalling is a bad defender, he does a decent job and deserves to stay at the club, but Phil Jones? He wasn't better then and he hasn't been better since.

Lindelöf has been class this season emphasized by the fact that he's been nominated to Player of the month again, not just by the club but by the league.
I'd say arguably him and VVD are currently the best CBs in the league and have been for most of the season.
I think even most rival fans would agree on that. But you still can't let go of your precious Smalling. Laughable really.

Next you'll tell me Lindelof was better against Chelsea

I think its pretty obvious how much bias you have.

 

[A-man]

Next you'll tell me Lindelof was better against Chelsea

I think its pretty obvious how much bias you have.

I’m not so sure that’s biased. The cafe ratings for the match favoured Lindelof slightly (edit: I see now it has changed to 7.5 for both). For me they were both a 7, then considering Smalling got to play in his best position while Lindelof played his second best, that makes Lindelof the better player for me in this match.

 

[SwedishFish]

Next you'll tell me Lindelof was better against Chelsea

I think its pretty obvious how much bias you have.

Have a look at the United Stands combined XI with 100 percent Chelsea.

They all instantly agreed on Lindelöf for one of the CB positions. Now why, if Smalling is as good as you say he is (he's not) don't they pick him?

Smalling is solid next to Lindelöf and in my opinion the best option for now, even though he is very but next season the big expectation is that he won't be because United will most likely go into the market for someone like Koulibaly because of the fact that Jones and Smalling have shown time and time again that they have too many mistakes in them.

As for bias, I don't give a shit if a United defender comes from the Central African Republic or the Faroe Islands as long as he does a good job at the back, as a long sufferer of Uniteds defensive woes post Ferdinand and Vidic I'm fed up with excuses for those two.

It's clear that we've got a quality CB but your reluctance to admit that is baffling tbh.

As I said earlier I think even most oppo fans would admit we do.

 

[Wumminator]

I’m not fully sold on this guy yet either. Has the ability to be bullied by others.

 

[11101]

He's been better than Jones since then and in the running for our best CB this season, as Smalling hasnt been at his best. But I'd still just about go with Smalling

Doesnt change the fact that several players were playing better than Lindelof when he was player of the month for us.

We could go back in time and sign Franz Beckenbauer and Franco Baresi and you'd still ”just about go with Smalling”.

Lindelof has become our clear first choice CB now, and deservedly so. The question is currently which of Bailly or Smalling partners him, so far under Ole it's being done by the opponents. Smalling is getting games against strong target men and Bailly is getting the rest.

 

[podurban2]

Next you'll tell me Lindelof was better against Chelsea

I think its pretty obvious how much bias you have.

Lindelöf got better ratings from almost every single outlet, fan vote, etc.

I wonder who is biased.

 

[Kostov]

Lindelöf got better ratings from almost every single outlet, fan vote, etc.

I wonder who is biased.

Smalling was better against Chelsea, while both had moments that could have cost us. Smalling with his pulling and Lindelof with that slip that left the attacker free on goal.

 

[Fracture90]

Have a look at the United Stands combined XI with 100 percent Chelsea.

They all instantly agreed on Lindelöf for one of the CB positions. Now why, if Smalling is as good as you say he is (he's not) don't they pick him?

Smalling is solid next to Lindelöf and in my opinion the best option for now, even though he is very but next season the big expectation is that he won't be because United will most likely go into the market for someone like Koulibaly because of the fact that Jones and Smalling have shown time and time again that they have too many mistakes in them.

As for bias, I don't give a shit if a United defender comes from the Central African Republic or the Faroe Islands as long as he does a good job at the back, as a long sufferer of Uniteds defensive woes post Ferdinand and Vidic I'm fed up with excuses for those two.

It's clear that we've got a quality CB but your reluctance to admit that is baffling tbh.

As I said earlier I think even most oppo fans would admit we do.

Not sure you want to use them to prove your point since that channel's crap.

 

[podurban2]

Smalling was better against Chelsea, while both had moments that could have cost us. Smalling with his pulling and Lindelof with that slip that left the attacker free on goal.

Well, that’s your opinion not a fact.

 

[Ekeke]

Lindelöf got better ratings from almost every single outlet, fan vote, etc.

I wonder who is biased.

The one who did the defending was obviously better.

Lindelof made 0 tackles, 1 interception, 3 clearances, 1 blocked shot

Smalling made 2 tackles, 4 interceptions, 2 clearances, 1 blocked shot. Only Ander won the ball more than he did out of either side, which includes Kante

Lindelof did most of the defending overall next to Jones and Bailly. But when Smalling plays, its Smalling who takes charge and does the majority of the defending

 

[Ekeke]

Smalling was better against Chelsea, while both had moments that could have cost us. Smalling with his pulling and Lindelof with that slip that left the attacker free on goal.

Dont forget Jorginho's pass to Higuain running in behind him, where he had 1 good touch but then ruined it with a bad 2nd touch and put his shot over the net. And Hazard's run at him onto his left foot and shot on goal that Ander deflected over the bar.

 

[SwedishFish]

Not sure you want to use them to prove your point since that channel's crap.

I don't rate their channel either but you're deliberately missing the point. Opposition fans in general recognize that Lindelöf is a quality CB, this is just one example out of many.

 

[Kostov]

Well, that’s your opinion not a fact.

Of course, and I don't know which outlets you are referring but generally they can be misleading, especially some which use stats only.

 

[roonster09]

Dont forget Jorginho's pass to Higuain running in behind him, where he had 1 good touch but then ruined it with a bad 2nd touch and put his shot over the net. And Hazard's run at him onto his left foot and shot on goal that Ander deflected over the bar.

Smalling also lost Higuain for header which went just wide isn't it?

Anyways looks like Smalling and Lindelof is our best combination. Both compliment each other better than other combination.

 

[Ekeke]

I don't rate their channel either but you're deliberately missing the point. Opposition fans in general recognize that Lindelöf is a quality CB, this is just one example out of many.

So people who dont watch us the majority of the time think he's good. Okay then

 

[SwedishFish]

So people who dont watch us the majority of the time think he's good. Okay then

You're surely on a wind-up, no one can be this stupid.

As this is my last post of the day I'll sadly have to wait to reply to any more of your idiotic statements.

The United Stand and Chelsea fans UNANIMOUSLY agreed on Lindelöf straight away. He was the first suggestion, not Jones. Not Smalling. Lindelöf.

Now you can shill your Smalling is the best CB at United/in the world opinion on here but I honestly don't think anyone on here is buying it at this point.

 

[Robbie Boy]

GOAT!

 

[roonster09]

GOAT!

You are starting crap version of Messi Vs Ronaldo here.

 

[Kostov]

Dont forget Jorginho's pass to Higuain running in behind him, where he had 1 good touch but then ruined it with a bad 2nd touch and put his shot over the net. And Hazard's run at him onto his left foot and shot on goal that Ander deflected over the bar.

Yes you are right, he had some moments which luckily didn't cost us, but also recovered well as the game went on. Smalling could have cost us with his shirt pulling as well luckily that didn't cost us as well. All in all, we managed well but Smalling was better considering he just came back from injury.

 

[Ekeke]

You're surely on a wind-up, no one can be this stupid.

As this is my last post of the day I'll sadly have to wait to reply to any more of your idiotic statements.

The United Stand and Chelsea fans UNANIMOUSLY agreed on Lindelöf straight away. He was the first suggestion, not Jones. Not Smalling. Lindelöf.

Now you can shill your Smalling is the best CB at United/in the world opinion on here but I honestly don't think anyone on here is buying it at this point.

You are talking about something done before the match 6 days ago and using that as reasoning why Lindelof was better than Smalling in a match 2 days ago. Thats ridiculous. But its pretty much what I've come to expect from you and our Swedish player

 

[Robbie Boy]

You are starting crap version of Messi Vs Ronaldo here.

Lindelof v Smalling: Battle of the titans.

 

[Ekeke]

Yes you are right, he had some moments which luckily didn't cost us, but also recovered well as the game went on. Smalling could have cost us with his shirt pulling as well luckily that didn't cost us as well. All in all, we managed well but Smalling was better considering he just came back from injury.

Well the difference there is that the referee and VAR team saw Smalling and decided it wasnt a foul.

On the other hand Chelsea, our opponents, were the ones who let Lindelof off for a few moments where he let players get away from him.

It wasnt about whats fair and the judgement of the officiating team

 

[A-man]

The one who did the defending was obviously better.

Lindelof made 0 tackles, 1 interception, 3 clearances, 1 blocked shot

Smalling made 2 tackles, 4 interceptions, 2 clearances, 1 blocked shot. Only Ander won the ball more than he did out of either side, which includes Kante

Lindelof did most of the defending overall next to Jones and Bailly. But when Smalling plays, its Smalling who takes charge and does the majority of the defending

Stats alone dont tell much, really. If you position yourself good, they will not try the pass and no interception, they will do most of the attacking where they have the best players or where United have the worst defenders, etc. Stats are mainly reflecting the reactive moves from players and is not the proof who did most of the defending.

 

[podurban2]

Of course, and I don't know which outlets you are referring but generally they can be misleading, especially some which use stats only.

BBC, Guardian, Daily Mail all had Lindelöf better.
Irish Independent had them both at the same.
MEN, Independent had Smalling better.

Those were the ones I found. So it’s pretty divided out there.

 

[Ekeke]

I think its fairly close who has been better this season. Lindelof had the lowest moments, but his recent form has been good and hopefully he keeps improving.

I don't think its very close who was better against Chelsea though.

Smalling dominated Chelsea's attack and consistently won the ball back for us. Lindelof had a bunch of moments where Chelsea got in past him and either Shaw or Ander covered him, or Chelsea messed it up themselves like with Higuain's 2nd touch making the chance hard.

If it wasnt Chris Smalling he might even have been given man of the match.

 

[Ekeke]

Stats alone dont tell much, really. If you position yourself good, they will not try the pass and no interception, they will do most of the attacking where they have the best players or where United have the worst defenders, etc. Stats are mainly reflecting the reactive moves from players and is not the proof who did most of the defending.

And Chelsea got in behind Lindelof a bunch of times. Or is counting the amount of times Chelsea got past our CB a stat and therefore doesn't count?

 

[A-man]

And Chelsea got in behind Lindelof a bunch of times. Or is counting the amount of times Chelsea got past our CB a stat and therefore doesn't count?

I am referring to the stats you posted, go back and see in the quote if you have forgotten what you wrote.

 

[A-man]

And Chelsea got in behind Lindelof a bunch of times. Or is counting the amount of times Chelsea got past our CB a stat and therefore doesn't count?

And no, it is not useful stats alone. You have to see the whole picture, not just counting. If a team is under pressure for 90 more minutes against Barca and a CB lets through Messi 3 times he can still have had a top performance.

 

[Ekeke]

And no, it is not useful stats alone. You have to see the whole picture, not just counting. If a team is under pressure for 90 more minutes against Barca and a CB lets through Messi 3 times he can still have had a top performance.

But not as good as the guy next to him who had maybe 1 moment a player did well against him, who also won the ball a lot more

 

[A-man]

But not as good as the guy next to him who had maybe 1 moment a player did well against him, who also won the ball a lot more

You can’t see that from stats. That’s where you have to watch the match. And in this case I personally would say it is 50/50 who had the best match. And again, Smalling played on the preferred position while Lindelof moved to the left. That flexibility should also be taken in to account.

 

[Fracture90]

I don't rate their channel either but you're deliberately missing the point. Opposition fans in general recognize that Lindelöf is a quality CB, this is just one example out of many.

So you don't rate that channel but you use their selection of Lindelöf to prove your point?

Hm, you sure I'm the one who's missing the point here?

 

[Ekeke]

You can’t see that from stats. That’s where you have to watch the match. And in this case I personally would say it is 50/50 who had the best match. And again, Smalling played on the preferred position while Lindelof moved to the left. That flexibility should also be taken in to account.

Why would that be taken into account as to who had the better match?

I can say I've never heard such a thing from anyone when Lindelof was playing on the right and Jones was on the left. Nobody was saying Lindelof played better but Jones played just as well because he was playing at LCB.

But now we have to conveniently make that a big factor in deciding who played the best?

Ashley Young is a winger playing at right back, Lukaku was a striker playing right wing, I guess they were just as good as everyone else because they werent playing their natural positions which is much bigger than playing LCB instead of RCB

 

[Ekeke]

So you don't rate that channel but you use their selection of Lindelöf to prove your point?

Hm, you sure I'm the one who's missing the point here?

Their selection 6 days ago, 4 before the match, to decide who was better during the match. Yep.

 

[A-man]

L

Why would that be taken into account as to who had the better match?

I can say I've never heard such a thing from anyone when Lindelof was playing on the right and Jones was on the left. Nobody was saying Lindelof played better but Jones played just as well because he was playing at LCB.

But now we have to conveniently make that a big factor in deciding who played the best?

Ashley Young is a winger playing at right back, Lukaku was a striker playing right wing, I guess they were just as good as everyone else because they werent playing their natural positions which is much bigger than playing LCB instead of RCB

You have two CBs who are at their best to the right. One of them is too poor to the left, meaning that the other one has to move there. For me that flexibility and ability to play several positions are worth a lot. And to the team. Lindelof is good to the left, but his attacking skills suffer in that position and those skills are really adding to the game.

 

[Ekeke]

L

You have two CBs who are at their best to the right. One of them is too poor to the left, meaning that the other one has to move there. For me that flexibility and ability to play several positions are worth a lot. And to the team. Lindelof is good to the left, but his attacking skills suffer in that position and those skills are really adding to the game.

I think that versatility is good yes.

It has nothing to do with who performed better in the match though.

And once again, its never mentioned when Jones plays LCB. He's right footed too and LVG bought Rojo and then played Blind at CB because he decided Jones was better at RCB. This is a Lindelof only factor it seems

 

[A-man]

I think that versatility is good yes.

It has nothing to do with who performed better in the match though.

And once again, its never mentioned when Jones plays LCB. He's right footed too and LVG bought Rojo and then played Blind at CB because he decided Jones was better at RCB. This is a Lindelof only factor it seems

I don’t see how that is a Lindelof alone factor. For me that is always part of the evaluation and for me that is main reason why I like Jones. His flexibility and allowing Lindelof to play to the right. Probably why he got a new contract.

 

[Adamsk7]

I think Lindelof is comfortably our best centre back. Not only is he better on the ball than the rest (good passer, decent touch) but he’s also the only one that is able to play on their least comfortable side. Also, when playing on the left, it takes away his runs forward which we’ve only seen in the games where he plays in his best position.

He’s also not a sicknote like the rest.

 

[MikeKing]

I think almost all the games Smalling played with Bailly, he was a LCB and he did good in those. It is obvious a player who is comfortable on the ball will be better at adjusting but I don't see the problem either way. To me it looks like Lindelof has a direct route to Pogba from the LCB, and also opens up nicely for a pass to the left footed Matic who might not need to make that big turn just to bring the ball onto his preferred foot. I think there exists a few legit tactical reasons to justify him playing on the left.

On the Chelsea game he was great but clearly not better than Chris. Smalling had to deal with Hazard on multiple occasions and helped Young shut down their most dangerous point of attack, while Lindelof and Shaw had a bit more to do as far as last ditch tackles. Thought it was pretty obvious but Lindelof is a new name so will get a lot of time and lenience, but I do support that. He has been great.

 

[Kostov]

BBC, Guardian, Daily Mail all had Lindelöf better.
Irish Independent had them both at the same.
MEN, Independent had Smalling better.

Those were the ones I found. So it’s pretty divided out there.

Probably divided as you say, since I felt both of them had a good game. I sincerely don't check on stats and my opinion of Smalling was mainly due to watching the game. I rated Smalling as 1 higher on the ratings here on Redcafe, mainly due to the slip that could have been costly by Lindelof, otherwise they were pretty solid in most aspects.

 

[Kostov]

Well the difference there is that the referee and VAR team saw Smalling and decided it wasnt a foul.

On the other hand Chelsea, our opponents, were the ones who let Lindelof off for a few moments where he let players get away from him.

It wasnt about whats fair and the judgement of the officiating team

Well yes, but on another occasion some of these morons of referees could decide otherwise and it would cost us big time. Bottom line, I think it's unnecessary by Smalling, and he should stop doing that, he ripped someone's shirt if I remember correctly on Monday.