No matter what you do ref offside there's always going to be extreme margins between onside and offside.
VAR, Refs and Linesmen | General Discussion
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) and Jamie (@Vault Dweller) are here to celebrate rare back-to-back victories for Manchester United! They analyse the late win in the Europa League vs. Rangers and then try and find things to analyse in a pretty dour game vs. Fulham. They also chat about the latest Marcus Rashford news, and look at the latest transfer news.
We'll have that Hawkeye shit soon so be prepared for the skin of their kneecap or the very tip of their boots ruling out goals.
Clearly not as objective as people are making it seem when those who draw the lines get them in the wrong spots
It's currently based off the armpit so I think that's fair enough. I don't see how the feet would be any fairer.
However, we don't know what they're going to do with the automated system. Will they keep it at the armpit given they'll no longer need to draw lines?
I'll take that over a Liverpool fan deciding where to draw lines on a screen.
Wouldn't that cause more offsides? I think they made the lines thinner to avoid situations like that. It should rule out a goal because he was offside, I don't get the confusion. If they made the attacker have more leeway we'd just be arguing about whether there was enough leeway given or not. Objectivity is the way to go. There were plenty of tight calls made incorrectly before VAR, nothing worse than scoring a good goal and have it incorrectly ruled out, or situations like the Drogba goal.
Those margin are somehow always ending in negative way for us.
How can people be certain that it is offside is beyond me.
Explain to me how it’s offside
They’ve done the line from Fulham’s armpit and United’s hand…
This should be fun..
You’re completely missing how arbitrary where the lines are drawn is. You’re still going to have offsides which are impossibly tight and equally frustrating if you give the attacker an additional inch, foot or yard. A line has to be drawn and occasionally there will be a tight one like this.
If your argument is you want the VAR to exert some subjective benefit of the doubt in cases like this, I promise you you will be screaming bloody murder when Michael Oliver ignores the lines and gives a goal against us and then refuses to do the same thing down the other end.
They haven't.
Clearly not as objective as people are making it seem when those who draw the lines get them in the wrong spots
and when dealing in millimetres freezing it after the ball has left mainoos foot.
Fulham arm playing him on?
It's based on whatever part of your body you can play the ball with is furthest forward, be it armpit, foot, head, knee, backside
Actually zoom in and look at the picture. The red line is United. How is that line anywhere near Amad’s armpit? It’s not even close to it
They have made the lines thicker a few years ago as there were a lot of goals being ruled out when it was very tight and to account for the margin of error inherent in using a single frame of video. For you the be onside the lines need to overlap.
How’s the right arm not playing him onside?
You can't score with your arm
It's besides the point. No matter how you redefine offside you'll still have marginal calls like this.
Got no idea why it’s not automated. Technology is there and it removes human error. Cause clearly we can’t rely on these plonkers.
Christ I know I’m bad for moaning about referees, it’s probably 75% of my posts these days but pick your battles for Christ sake Amad was visibly offside there, the offside call was entirely expected.
Amad was visibly offside there, the offside call was entirely expected.actually starting to think now that it should be the linesmans call, with var only intervening if its the assist making pass. today for example, it clearly can be argued that he was on, and then fulham still had plenty of ways to stop a goal - its such an absurd advantage for a defending team.
never even got a replay with the lines of the gakpo goal remember.
Amad's hand is in line with his shoulder, they've drawn the line from both players shoulders. Amad is leaning forward so his shoulder is slightly ahead of the defender's shoulder. Pretty cut and dry in my opinion.
A thicker line for the position of the defender would absolutely reduce the number of razor-thin offside calls.
I just think the armpit makes no difference to who gets to the ball first. It's all about moving the feet
It wouldn't. You'd just move the threshold.
VAR. Never not finding a way to make football less enjoyable. What a heap of shit. Even on something that should be completely objective like offside we end up going down rabbit holes about margins of error. The offside law is supposed to prevent goal-hanging, not someone being an inch or two beyond the last defender in the build up to a goal. This shit is a gross misuse of technology. I absolutely hate it.
I'm pretty sure you cannot score from your shoulder.
It's visuals for representation after lines have been drawn, not that Amad's shoulder is that much ahead.
Only it wouldn’t. Because lines are 2D and no matter how fat or thin they are there is still one edge that counts and that edge is always exactly the same thickness. All you’re doing is moving the problem around.
If the defenders line is far thicker than the forwards line, then yes, it would. Hence why this approach has already been implemented, to a degree.
Stevoc? Probably not. But there isn't any rules against it
No. If the defenders line is, say, five times thicker than the forwards line, then the forward would have to be even more ‘offside’ than they currently are, for an offside call to be made.
Of course you can
You move the threshold sure, but at least we are not calling offside using technology that in no way can accurately tell us it is actually offside when it's that tight.
It's absurd really and nothing than a calculated guess.
It wouldn't. You're just creating an arbitrary line, there's always going to be extremely thin margins. You could say that a player is allowed to be offside by 1,5 and you'll still have the very same "issues" we have today.
They would appear less tight in respect of the position of the players relative to one another.
But you'd still be using the same technology only for a different line.
I don’t think you know what a shoulder is. Unless you think Amad is the Hunchback of Notre Dame, you’re not even close