Now taking a stupid amount of time over an obvious Arsenal goal. Get rid of this monstrosity of an interference.
VAR, Refs and Linesmen | General Discussion
- Thread starter Samid
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It’s amazing the detrimental impact VAR is having on the world’s most popular sport.
I genuinely think he’s (Oliver) biased against us, whether consciously or not. There’s a clear pattern of his dodgy decisions against us that doesn’t align the same with any other team. He’s also just a crap ref in general, as bad in the VAR box as he is on the grass.
The only thing in doubt is whether or not it was a "clear and obvious error" from the ref.
It was a soft pen but De Ligt missed the ball and kicked the West Ham player for sure.
I get why you lot are angry, it's an extra time penalty but shouts of "worst ever decision" are madness.
Tend to agree. I didn’t watch the game, so sought out the incident after expecting some major miscarriage of justice.
It’s very soft, but in the VAR era, slowed down, I’ve seen them given. Shouldn’t be a pen, but you do see them.
Again here a ridiculously long check to confirm the Arsenal goal. How is this game still enjoyable for anyone? It’s every single goal being checked to see if they can find the smallest excuse to overturn it.
Considering Ings also made no contact with the ball (in fact it looks like De Ligt's thigh does touch the ball but I am not 100% sure about that so I'll go with both missing the ball), how can you say de ligt kicked Ings and not the other way around?
I mean, it's obvious from the idiot ref they have in commentary; referees are utterly stupid, and asking them to do something as complicated as analyse an incident using technology is going to overheat their processors.
9 games in:
An absurd, overturned, red card against fernandes.
Mind boggling decision to send off de Ligt with seconds to play, for a wound that had already been treated, was untouched on sideline before he was allowed to return in the exact same condition he was sent off in.
Todays call was the worst penalty decision I have ever seen. Theres nothing to add. Michael Oliver is a compromised offical.
and lower level:
personally thought casemiro was fouled by diaz, and looking at what we got a penalty against for today, then yeah.
Against Brighton, Veltman literally sprawled out and swept the ball away with his arm and got no booking. Not a game changer but inexplicable.
Again, i thought the late palace handball was a penalty, but like the casemiro one, these judgement calls never seem to go our way or balance out.
An absurd, overturned, red card against fernandes.
Mind boggling decision to send off de Ligt with seconds to play, for a wound that had already been treated, was untouched on sideline before he was allowed to return in the exact same condition he was sent off in.
Todays call was the worst penalty decision I have ever seen. Theres nothing to add. Michael Oliver is a compromised offical.
and lower level:
personally thought casemiro was fouled by diaz, and looking at what we got a penalty against for today, then yeah.
Against Brighton, Veltman literally sprawled out and swept the ball away with his arm and got no booking. Not a game changer but inexplicable.
Again, i thought the late palace handball was a penalty, but like the casemiro one, these judgement calls never seem to go our way or balance out.
That is absolutely not a penalty.
Absolutely! But won't happen!
Because idiots like gary neville will be saying on tv that it doesn't look good when clubs question referees .
But we mustn't complain....
Pathetic officiating that always seems to be killing us, while we are already shite enough without officials interfering.
This is the main gripe to me. If the ref gives it first time, harsh but fair enough. I don't see how it's sufficient to be flagged by VAR, we see worse incidents let go by VAR every match in my opinion. If VAR is consistently interfering with incidents like that then it's a problem.
I would rather VAR takes away soft penalties rather than giving them.
You must be on a wind up if you think that’s a potential penalty in anyway. Ings has come in and he’s falling over before De Ligt makes contact. It’s a clear dive. VAR simply shouldn’t get involved. If it does don’t show the same replay over and over again until the ref is convinced to make the decision Oliver wants. The whole VAR process is a joke, driven by refs. In Oliver’s case both incompetent and clear bias against United over the years.
And De ligt does? That incident is the perfect definition of 2 players "coming together". How that can judged as a foul by either one is beyond me and pretty much every pro on TV including the ones commenting on the game and the ones doing the post match. The only other time I saw such a unison in an opinion of a referee error was the Bruno red card against spurs the other day.
Reading some of the comments on the BBC website, my God,its clear Utd ruined so many peoples lives!!
Sry but you are allowed to be on the field… storming in the penalty area and clashing into someone is not a foul and should never be a penalty… no one was in control of the ball either
Laugh at us if you want but this decision is a joke and michael oliver should collect his oil money in the saudi league …
No amount of ellipses will make me agree with you.
Bloody hell. Clear as I have seen. And Konate tackle first half inside the box. Penalty?
De Ligt being sent off the pitch while bleeding is not an absurd call, that is on the incompetence of the Utd medical team.
And why the feck did the ref give a free kick there?
It's Liverpool. So it isn't. I think you will find that in the PL Rulebook if you look hard.
Yeah I’m fecking done with this sport. It’s WWE, referees scripting the result on a whim. Game is completely broken.
It’s on the front page
Would the same ref give a freekick if VVD won a header in a sinilar way against Havertz in that position? Never in a million years
Kilman actually fouls Ings with his studs, and then Ings handles before De Ligt catches Ings with his knee.
It's just a coming together of three players. Impossible to lay blame on any one player there and award a pen to decide a game.
You can isolate what De Ligt does to in some ways prove it was a foul (which is what Oliver has done) but it doesn't deal with Kilman and Ings' foul play.
It's just a coming together of three players. Impossible to lay blame on any one player there and award a pen to decide a game.
You can isolate what De Ligt does to in some ways prove it was a foul (which is what Oliver has done) but it doesn't deal with Kilman and Ings' foul play.
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Anthony Taylor gave Arsenal absolutely feck all that second half
That's a red card, never mind a booking.
https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/s/nafvA7bCiB
I dont think there is a single non-united fan there who thinks it's a pen.
I dont think there is a single non-united fan there who thinks it's a pen.
There’s loads of non-United fans on X calling it out, ex players, Whitwell/Crafton from The Athletic, ex ref Keith Hackett (one of the best refs for some time). Even Shearer has called it out and EVEN Sam Luckhurst (the ABU at MEN) has said it’s an awful decision.
As a combined VAR/ref feck up, it’s the worst decision I’ve ever seen since VAR came in.
- Ref makes an on field decision
- VAR has no right to call him over - not clear & obvious and especially with Howard Webbs “higher bar” and “refs call”
- VAR shows one replay and slow-mo… doesn’t show Ings running from distance at full pelt, his studs raised just before, doesn’t mention hitting his hand or Kilman invokvement
- Ref doesn’t look at replay and ask for full speed or other angles or a longer clip to show lead up which would show Ings piling in and main initiator of contact. Ref also ignores hand
- Ref shaking like a shitting dog because he’s desperate to stick to decision but (for some reason) scared of disagreeing with Oliver… watches same reply a dozen times and KNOWS not a mistake but bottles it
Club should write to PGMOL asking for audio and public explanation of how decision arrived at. Should also send said letter to all journalists. We’re far too soft and this shit has being going on for ages.
It was a bad decision for sure, but I maintain both the Casemiro 'neck' (which was actually the collar) and the Maguire 'inteference' were both objectively worse calls, and screamed - like today - of refs looking for a reason to intefere.
I also agree the club should go on the offensive. It's pathetic how weak we are on these things. Jose would have turned this into the main talking point of the week - which would undeniably put pressure on refs to f*cking get it right next time.
We have to not be quiet about this.
I also agree the club should go on the offensive. It's pathetic how weak we are on these things. Jose would have turned this into the main talking point of the week - which would undeniably put pressure on refs to f*cking get it right next time.
We have to not be quiet about this.
With all the evidence of Mike Oliver making dodgy calls against us, we should be able to ask that he is nowhere near our games
Forest did that and got a massive massive fine didn't they?
As always, the 'clear and obvious error' criteria is causing more problems than it's worth with VAR. Essentially the 'clear and obvious' thing is saying that they'll only intervene if it's an absolute howler of a mistake from the referee rather than just intervening on any mistake as they should so now people lose their shit when VAR intervenes because they don't think it's enough of a mistake.
I say that because it's clearly a foul by de Ligt and if he'd gotten away with that and the reasoning was 'yeah, it's a mistake, but it's not the worst howler you'll ever see so we'll play on' then surely that would be an injustice, no? Wouldn't West Ham fans then be the ones complaining and going nuts over refereeing decisions?
If they'd scrap that 'clear and obvious' BS we'd have much less controversy around decisions like these imo.
edit: The lack of consistency is a killer though. TAA stamping on Sancho's foot last week was an obvious foul too and yet they played on. That's where fans rightly lose their shit.
I say that because it's clearly a foul by de Ligt and if he'd gotten away with that and the reasoning was 'yeah, it's a mistake, but it's not the worst howler you'll ever see so we'll play on' then surely that would be an injustice, no? Wouldn't West Ham fans then be the ones complaining and going nuts over refereeing decisions?
If they'd scrap that 'clear and obvious' BS we'd have much less controversy around decisions like these imo.
edit: The lack of consistency is a killer though. TAA stamping on Sancho's foot last week was an obvious foul too and yet they played on. That's where fans rightly lose their shit.
And then you have this
And that’s quite an achievement for that sub.