It's because they've both got flying studs and their feet meet. If Wan Bissaka was standing and matey stormed in like that it'd have been no debate.
VAR and Refs | General Discussion
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It's because they've both got flying studs and their feet meet. If Wan Bissaka was standing and matey stormed in like that it'd have been no debate.
Wan Bissaka has his eyes on the ball and lifts his foot to control it. He’s not even aware of Gomez and has no momentum whatsoever whereas Gomez comes flying in both feet off the floor with zero control. It’s quite frankly bollocks to suggest it was a six of one challenge.
The debate is whether it's a red. I'm perfectly fine with a yellow, just don't see any more in it.
The McAllister stud to Maguire chest not even getting looked at, and him getting the free kick baffles me more.
From 105:00 to 121:53 (since Amad scored on 120:07) I timed every single game stoppage (throw-in, foul, goal-kick, yellow, corner, injury etc) because I'm a bit drunk and/or neurodivergent.
That amounted to 07:27 seconds. Just over a minute for Rashford's goal, almost 2 minutes for Amad's and almost a minute for their ginger's timewasting and subsequent yellow being the major stoppages.
So technically, he was was right to add on five except it isn't consistent because think of all the fouls, throw-ins, corners, injuries etc in 45 minutes halves, no way they all get added on. So it was definitely drama-infused injury time.
That amounted to 07:27 seconds. Just over a minute for Rashford's goal, almost 2 minutes for Amad's and almost a minute for their ginger's timewasting and subsequent yellow being the major stoppages.
So technically, he was was right to add on five except it isn't consistent because think of all the fouls, throw-ins, corners, injuries etc in 45 minutes halves, no way they all get added on. So it was definitely drama-infused injury time.
It will be ignored because of the late drama, but the ref was an absolute disgrace. The latest corrupt official who favoured Liverpool on numerous occasions. Full credit to United for overcoming such a massive handicap.
Ref was awful, ridiculously bad. Thought VAR may have said this was worth a look too… studs, dangerous.
I think Dixon said they both got there about the same time
Worse than MacAllister hitting someone in the chest, collapsing and getting the FK
I dont see that as a red. Both boots at the same height and angle at the same time.
The one i dont get and havent seen up close to be fair is what looked like a clear foul on Bruno in the run up to their second goal.
The fact that there was just as much injury time in one second half of extra time, then both the first and second half of the actual full 90 minutes - the first of which had a few VAR checks, and the second which had loads of subs, was absolutely mental. there was literally one sub and one goal + a bit of timewasting from their keeper. How did that equal nearly 4 minutes?!
Ignore the boots and focus on the arse smashing into AWB’s head.
The studs/feet are irrelevant as they never place either player in any danger. The issue here is Gomez fecking launching himself at AWB and smashing his hip into his head. Which is the definition of reckless/dangerous.
It’s another example of this batshit idea the football authorities (and, evidently, some fans) have that a brain injury really isn’t that big a deal but god forbid a footballer ever gets studs to his shin.
Has anyone ever witnessed a home team being so shafted by refereeing decisions that benefited the away team so much in English football before?
And these Scouse pricks have the audacity and complete lack of self-awareness to think they were hard done by?
Their victim complex is unrivalled in world sports.
And these Scouse pricks have the audacity and complete lack of self-awareness to think they were hard done by?
Their victim complex is unrivalled in world sports.
Yes, us, regularly.
Yeah still dont see that as dangerous enough to warrant a red. We'd be furious if it was given against us.
It's hilarious coming from a fanbase that still bangs on about that Nani red against Real to think Gomez deserved a red yesterday. Both had high feet going for a bouncing ball, it's a collision, not every bit of physical contact has to be a foul or a card.
Another word for the ref. Even some of my most ABU wanker friends were getting annoyed with how there were different rules applied for the two teams. Exact same fouls called for Liverpool but not for us.
Completely different. Wan Bissaka was the player making the effort to control of the ball, as was Nani. Gomez had full view of the ball and player and he was making a challenge. A challenge with zero control, both feet off the floor, studs high and clattered the player with his hip with his momentum.
Remember when Raul Jimenez was sent off after doing just that and everyone was in agreement that it was a horror tackle. Hmm, I wonder what’s changed.
#protectshinsnotheads seems to be the official hashtag for the PGMOL, like we’ve previously said. But sometimes protect heads anyway. Just not United heads. And not if it involves a spectacular attempt at scoring a goal
Just look at the headline for a tackle with similar force, lead-up and everything with the only difference being the height.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/f...ised-dangerous-Newcastles-Sean-Longstaff.html
What's hilarious is you equating 2 situations that are nothing alike.
Grow up, Nani wasn't a red card and neither is this.
Both players go high, ball is bouncing, both have studs up, but Gomez should go because he had his other foot off the ground and momentum carried him over AWB. It's never a red, barely even a foul, it's a 50/50 as both players play the high ball in a similar manner.
That picture isn’t the evidence of it not being a red you seem to think it is.Grow up, Nani wasn't a red card and neither is this.
Both players go high, ball is bouncing, both have studs up, but Gomez should go because he had his other foot off the ground and momentum carried him over AWB. It's never a red, barely even a foul, it's a 50/50 as both players play the high ball in a similar manner.
But "grow up"
There was a second yellow card and red card on Mac Allister, I just couldnt believe my eyes it was giving a foul on Maguire instead.
The ref was a donkey of the first degree.
The ref was a donkey of the first degree.
Both players initially decided to leave the ground and go for a bouncing ball with studs up. AWB just pulls back a bit when he sees Gomez coming, momentum is against him anyway. Gomez falling all over him after the impact doesn't make it a red card offence.
Look at the whole sequence and where their feet actually meet, instead it's just saying his hip hit him in the head, that's a red card. Which is what we complain about VAR doing for challenges, just focusing on one little bit or image without judging the whole action leading up to it.
Here is the video
Are you crazy? Should have been a straight red to Maguire for attacking MacAllister's studs with his chest! Textbook violent conduct if I've ever seen it
The amad first yellow was more of a joke given he blocked them taking a free kick 5 yards into our half when it was actually given 10 yards in their half near the top of the centre circle.
I thought they got a lot of minor fouls and as usual we got very little of the ssme. The drag on garnacho is a regular decision we don't seem to get. Hoijland has been dragged around a fair few times this season as he receives the ball
Yep, double standards from Klopp. Mac Allister should have been off the pitch. Shocking tackle on Garnacho and generally putting himself about. Imagine if Casemiro had done any of that stuff! . Commentators and pundits would have been screaming for red cards. Booking Amad for trying to get the Scousers to take the free kick from the correct position ten yards away was a joke. That happens every week and nobody gets booked. They kicked the ball away several times which is a bookable offence, but no bookings. Twats.
Grow up, Nani wasn't a red card and neither is this.
Both players go high, ball is bouncing, both have studs up, but Gomez should go because he had his other foot off the ground and momentum carried him over AWB. It's never a red, barely even a foul, it's a 50/50 as both players play the high ball in a similar manner.
WTF? I feel like I’m going mad here. Why is everyone obsessing over the position of their feet when AWB gets smashed in the head?
Because that's just looking at one part of the impact and ignoring the full action. You know, what we complain about when the ref gets shown slective screenshots like this.
And this
So if they ignore the whole part leading up to it where both players go high with studs showing and only show Gomez hitting him in the head. Then yeah, it's a red card.
Because that's just looking at one part of the impact and ignoring the full action. You know, what we complain about when the ref gets shown slective screenshots like this.
And this
So if they ignore the whole part leading up to it where both players go high with studs showing and only show Gomez hitting him in the head. Then yeah, it's a red card.
I really couldn’t give a toss about freeze frames from this, or any other incident. My opinion is based on the video footage. Which showed Gomez launching himself towards AWB and smashing his hip into his head. Which is dangerous (much more dangerous than the stud to shin tackle that usually causes outrage) and should be punished by a red card. The position of their feet is irrelevant.
I paraphrased my original post “studs, dangerous” when what I meant was studs up AND dangerous collision as two separate events.
In my view, the studs up thing is close but I did think AWB pulls his boot down last second, Liverpool player doesn’t. I.e. AWB had some thought about the coming impact
The Liverpool player makes no attempt to change his boot position AND no attempt to try and minimize the impact… just flies straight into him at height.
For me, the lack of any thought to make that tackle safer (and that there’s clearly two parts to it) means it’s not a 50/50 or football coming together incident. I don’t expect a ref to see that (it’s too quick), I expect VAR to though
(Bruno one is probably a foul, nothing major and Bruno reaction (and dare I say, his recent well publicized history on similar tackles) probably puts doubt in a refs mind. It’s why I think he shouldn’t be captain. Covid Bruno was an animal, tearing through matches and taking all the hits,, this one seems “woe is me”)
This is not how it works. If the challenge (regardless of how the challenge comes about) is violent/dangerous there should be a card. It's not like VAR see you kick someone in the head but say 'he didn't mean it, look his eyes were on the ball'. It would have a bearing on the severity of the ban though, as if you actually deliberately did that they would increase the three match ban.
You’re wasting your time.. this is a repeat protestor on this exact type of thing.
Not sure if a rival fan, a WUM or Chopper Harris reincarnated.
I don't really get why so many people are going on about those challenges, neither of them registered whatsoever for me in terms of potential red cards while watching the match. MacAllister was hilarious rolling around after the Maguire one, but certainly don't see how it should have ended up with him being given a yellow.
Not a big fan of applying the rules of football on the pitch are you?
Red card every week. Studs up in stomach/chest. But we got a referee giving freekick to other team? Impressive.
Maguire is completely late to the ball, and it's not like it was studs up into his chest directly, I don't really see how it's anything more than a free for us at worst.
Let me remind you what you wrote 8 days ago regarding the incident between Doku and Mac Allister:
What are people talking about. What penalty?
Stop being so soft. Two players going for the ball.
"Nah he kicked him. You see free kicks given all the time for that" (random user)
Yes you do. You also see freekick being given for what Ederson did against Rashford and we didn't get anything.
He kicked the ball and then MacAllister went into him.
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By watching the video from Giggsyking a few posts higher up you can clearly see that:
1. No part of Mac Allisters studs hits Maguire.
2. Mac Allister cleary kicks the ball before the collision with Maguire.
On the contrary, you can also see in the same video posted by Giggsyking that:
1. Mac Allister is first to the ball
2. Doku kicks Mac Allister before the ball.
3. Studs are hitting Mac Allister in stomach/chest.
My point is not about the two incidents. I'm not particularly interested in discussing any of them. It's not about "outing" a user either. It's just a randomly chosen example.
My point is that potentially healthy discussions are drowning in extreme bias. Call it RAWKish bias if you'd like. It's pure noise in regard of the key aspects (the incidents) and it should be avoided as much as possible to keep standards.
I obviously do get that this is a United-forum, and bias etc is expected. But I feel that it's been taken to the extremes lately.
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I think the 'his studs were up!' is such an overstated and hysterical way of refereeing a football match (a bit like, 'He raised his hands! You can't do that."), so I'm inclined to think that Brooks, like Oliver in the previous week for the Doku challenge on Mac Allister, called it right. Having your studs up should not by definition endanger an opponent, but only when the tackle itself is forceful and reckless.
It's virtually impossible to play the game without your studs being visible. You should be able to compete for the ball with your boots and that will inevitably result in high studs up challenges.
There was nothing particularly reckless about any of the challenges that necessitated a red card (nor was there in Doku's the previous week). McAllister's you could argue was a yellow but it would have been soft.
If two players go for the ball with their heads and clash to gether, and it looks like the Doku challenge or the Gomez one, nothing much is said. Why should it be any different with feet? In most cases, studs up challenges don't result in injuries unless they're wild and reckless. A bigger problem in football is scissor challenges which are often viewed as fair, but they cause more injuries by far.
I think Brooks and his assistants MO was basically to let the game flow and that he was consistent in that regard and it produced a better game of football. He called the MacAllister goal right and got most if not all of the big decisions spot on. Diallo's red was unfortunate but refs get pilloried if they don't punish players who remove their shirts.
It's virtually impossible to play the game without your studs being visible. You should be able to compete for the ball with your boots and that will inevitably result in high studs up challenges.
There was nothing particularly reckless about any of the challenges that necessitated a red card (nor was there in Doku's the previous week). McAllister's you could argue was a yellow but it would have been soft.
If two players go for the ball with their heads and clash to gether, and it looks like the Doku challenge or the Gomez one, nothing much is said. Why should it be any different with feet? In most cases, studs up challenges don't result in injuries unless they're wild and reckless. A bigger problem in football is scissor challenges which are often viewed as fair, but they cause more injuries by far.
I think Brooks and his assistants MO was basically to let the game flow and that he was consistent in that regard and it produced a better game of football. He called the MacAllister goal right and got most if not all of the big decisions spot on. Diallo's red was unfortunate but refs get pilloried if they don't punish players who remove their shirts.
And there's probably been multiple threads about Nani's red card where people still don't think it was a red for that reason. There was a new one celebrating the 10 year anniversary last week. And you can almost guarantee people who said that wasn't a red thought Gomez should have been off yesterday.
Both players are gping for a high ball, both go with studs up. One's momentum took him over the other. Wan Bissaka didn't make much of a fuss about it, neither did the referee. He gave the yellow card and moved on. Pathetic to look for a red for that.
The Mac Allister one is a nothing challenge.
But the Gomez one is obviously reckless, flying in with that kind of force into someone's head is clearly endangering the safety of an opponent. He has zero control over the challenge. Leading with a straight leg just makes it even worse.