Utd now just another big club | All "United losing identity" stuff here

The reason why we bought 6 players this summer is because we only brought in 1 player last summer. The wrong player.

Last summer, the squad needed a little bit of freshening up after winning the league. It didn't happen, so by the time this summer rolled around and after the carcrash season under an inept manager, it needed major surgery. Both incoming and outgoing. It just had to be done.

If we hadn't have brought in world class reinforcements, United would have been lambasted for not doing so. They did bring in world class reinforcements, and not it's soulless.

Then again, earlier in the window, the likes of Herrera and Rojo were deemed as not good enough, mostly because pundits have not heard much of them probably. So we push the boat out and bring in two worldys. Bitterness ensues.

Regardless, United are spending United money, earned through their own means as a football club. It's not pocket money from rich daddy. I don't see how that is soulless. We will continue to bring in an even ratio of top players and academy graduates, and that ratio will be more even than Chelsea or City, I am sure.
 
journos thinking
United's need to spend big to compete, because their defence is not good, and blackett is inexperienced, sign german international Mats Hummels

United's spending is not giving youth a chance, they are losing their identity

See, the club cannot really win
 
I have to agree somewhat with the sentiment here. Not happy at all with this Welbeck transfer. This transfer window has kind of left me with the feeling that our players are no longer "our" players.

This is just largely because they're new, exacerbated by the fact there's a lot of them. This always happens with any new signing, particularly ones strongly associated with other clubs. RVP didn't feel like a United player for a whole year. Mata still doesn't. Ferdinand didn't for a while since he was strongly associated with West Ham, and Leeds had only just bought him for a huge fee. Cantona probably didn't for the first few games either. And the fact that none of us have even seen half of them play in a United shirt yet doesn't really help. So of course they don't feel like "our" players yet. Most of them haven't even played for us! It's a very silly argument really. Everyone's judging before anything practical has even happened. It's like people claiming Daneil Craig just simply wasn't James Bond before he'd even filmed a single scene.

A good handful of games and a few wins and all of a sudden Di Maria jumping on Falcao's back by the corner of the Stretford End will seem like the most Manchester United thing ever.
 
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All this is just based on vile hypocrisy, i'm pretty sure that i've seen a thread asking if we shouldn't have our own Sheikh.

Edit: And 10 players have left the club therefore we bought 6 and promoted 4, in order to replace them.
 
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This is my issue, everybody knew where we needed to strengthen, the centre of our midfield and centre of our defence.

Everyone said our forward line was our strength and some even said the best in the league. Instead the 2 world class players as you call them, are forwards, while our main weaknesses are being plugged by 2 guys that were nobodies before the World Cup. It feels like we tried to get our top targets in those areas like Vidal and Hummells and when we failed we just threw the cash into attacking players that were available if not really needed. I realise there would have been mass protests if we didn't spend big money but I would have liked to see some semblance of a plan to build the squad rather than give Jorge Mendes a blank cheque and let him fill it out based on who he wants to move on.

I don't agree with that tbh. Blind came away with 3 assists and a goal in the WC whilst Rojo was an integral part of the team which went to the final. I understand your concerns about not getting a commanding world-class defender or central midfielder. I will quote a recent post I made to better illustrate my point. Ignore the rather strong tone in that post, not directed at you but someone else on that thread.

I really wish people would give Rojo and Blind a chance before labelling them as fellaini-esque signings or unsatisfactory ones. I mean most of us, including me, haven't seen these guys play consistently barring the WC, yet most are quick to judge them negatively since they aren't big names... Give them a chance would you. Would I have loved to see us sign the likes of Hummels/Benatia or Vidal/Carvalho/Strootman? Yes absolutely.

However, we couldn't sign these guys for various reasons (unwilling to leave/join, injury concerns/lack of CL etc). It wasn't for a lack of interest or cash. Therefore, like any other club we sensibly moved on to our next targets in Rojo and Blind. They might not be muppetatsic but I'm sure the club has thoroughly scouted them and that LVG approves of them.

It wasn't as though the club had been unwilling to invest (which I initially suspected) or suffering from poor planning. Granted, we could have moved sooner in the market and been more firm in our transfer negotiations, but LVG joined late and wanted to genuinely run the rule over the squad before moving in on targets, whilst Ed couldn't afford a repeat of last summer.

I do have concerns over how we will line up with so many quality attacking players in the squad. I also have concerns over the compatibility of our strikers. Will Januzaj get enough gametime? How will we keep our players on the bench happy with limited gametime this season? However, who better than LVG to manage the super-egos in the squad and get the best out of the players. I'm confident he will handle these obstacles well.

Another positive aspect most are choosing to ignore is the competitiveness in the team right now. There were periods during last season and this season where some of our players were putting in anonymous performances on the run but were rather guaranteed a spot on the teamsheet next week.

Im looking at you RVP, Carrick, Rooney and Mata. We had Welbeck, Cleverley, Hernandez and Kagawa who were nowhere near challenging the first teamers or threatening to displace them. That was one of the main reasons why some of our 'stars' were performing well below their normal levels. Not. Anymore. Piss about and you will be replaced by Falcao, Blind or Januzaj and you won't missed. I assume we are playing 2 CBs from now on, which means 4 rather unestablished players competing for 2 spots. Just a pity about our full backs though...

Just wish people would focus on the positives and look forward to the season, esp after the trainwreck of a one last season... Much better than making statements like 'we are still a world class CB and CM away from achieving something or we lost our identity or we have bought the wrong players'. How about we at least wait till Christmas before making hasty judgements.
 
Your friend chats crap. First off using 'where money comes from' or 'how much is spent' to disregard a club is old, cliche and arrogant now, noone actually thinks like that.

The ironic thing is that it is actually often those who dont spend or dont have money that are anti-football. I always use an example of Arsenal from a few seasons back.

During a tie against Olympiakos in the final group game of the CL a win would have put Wengers men top of their group and facing a more desirable opponent in the final 16. However, prioritizing 4th spot next season over the last 8 that season because of the money the group games bring a second string team was put out. Arsenal lost the match 2-1, finished second in their group I think it was behind Schalke and faced Bayern Munich( I think) in the final 16.
I would say that the team that sets out not to win a tournament but just to be in it next season are the ones who are anti football as because of money they are not playing the game properly, and before you say it, clubs like PSG City and Chelsea are not the reason Arsenal have had to do that, as they have shown since by spending bigger money and still attracting top talent.
Also with owners spending money, is it just jealousy? I cant see any other reason, regardless of whether its the money the club earnt or money the owner is spending, you would sooner have some passionate about football owning the club than someone incompetent.

Yes you have done what we and City have done previously, but we don't care and neither should you, as I always said, were we supposed to just accept never winning anything just because of the way we were managed or owned in the past? Should the fact other clubs were lucky enough to become massive at one time mean that they should be the biggest clubs for eternity? No, like us United do not want to just accept mid table, this isnt the 1950's its 2014, you evolve or die.
 
Rubbish...we've used our own money to buy quality players from Europe/South America and we've got rid of a few under achieving home grown players. We're still developing youth and if good enough they'll be given a chance.
 
How dare we? how dare we spend our own money and didn't depend on Arabs and Russians to save our lives?

Sell Woodward , Sack LVG!!!. We want the united way. We want players like Cleverley , Evans , Fletcher and Welbeck in the 1st team squad. We want core of British players and managers. Bring back Moyes. That's the united way.
And finish 7th.
 
As a side note, it's very noticeable that the neutrals strongly would like Arsenal followed by Liverpool to win the league this season.

Is that note worthy? They're underdogs; and haven't won for ages. This is always the case. Most neutrals want a different winner every year. It's no fun rooting for the champions. I'd imagine most on here would root for Arsenal above City & Chelsea.

The only interesting bit is that Liverpool are below Arsenal, despite their longer drought
 
international break was the worst thing that could happen after the transfer window, people completely going overboard now with the same discussions. Dont want to imagine if we dont win againt QPR and Welbeck scores the winner for Arsenal, this place will be in meltdown for weeks.

No we are not as soulless as they are. We didnt spend enough the last 10 years, thats why we spend now. A lot of legends have left us lately, we spend to get back where we should be. Short term there will be a lot of chnages like this one, bu long term not that much will change.
 
Let's see....Chelsea and City only have top squads because of owners spending hundreds of millions of their personal money and putting their clubs in massive debt.

United spent the money they earned.

Not seeing the similarity.
 
international break was the worst thing that could happen after the transfer window, people completely going overboard now with the same discussions. Dont want to imagine if we dont win againt QPR and Welbeck scores the winner for Arsenal, this place will be in meltdown for weeks.

No we are not as soulless as they are. We didnt spend enough the last 10 years, thats why we spend now. A lot of legends have left us lately, we spend to get back where we should be. Short term there will be a lot of chnages like this one, bu long term not that much will change.

Likewise if as expected anyway you thrash a truly awful side 6-0 with ADM getting 2 assists and a goal and Falcao scoring a hat trick the place will meltdown too. Its going to be a rough weekend :(
 
Let's see....Chelsea and City only have top squads because of owners spending hundreds of millions of their personal money and putting their clubs in massive debt.

United spent the money they earned.

Not seeing the similarity.

We arent in massive debt, didnt Uniteds owners putting United in massive debt?

Money is money whether the club earned it or the owner earned it is irrelevant. People are just trying to get at United any way possible.
 
We arent in massive debt, arent United in massive debt?

Money is money whether the club earned it or the owner earned it is irrelevant. People are just trying to get at United any way possible.
Obviously most people disagree that is irrelevant where the money came from. Usually in life that's an important detail.

Does City not have debt? I thought they were on the hook if the owners ball, maybe I'm thinking of Chelsea. Apologies if I'm wrong there.

Yes United is in debt, not from buying players though, as I'm sure you know.
 
Obviously most people disagree that is irrelevant where the money came from. Usually in life that's an important detail.

Does City not have debt? I thought they were on the hook if the owners ball, maybe I'm thinking of Chelsea. Apologies if I'm wrong there.

I support Chelsea. No we are fine if for some reason RA bailed, the idea we are worried about FFP or debt is very old now, we had the advantage of a decade under the owner to sort things out, we arent PSG or Man City and we are sustainable now.

Football should be about football, thats why where money comes from is irrelevant. I couldnt give a shit where United got their money from, Im more concerned that we spend wisely and buy well to worry about where others get their money from.
 
We arent in massive debt, arent United in massive debt?

Money is money whether the club earned it or the owner earned it is irrelevant. People are just trying to get at United any way possible.

Because your owner made a fat check.

But it's not a problem for United, Chelsea or Man City aren't threats for United you are only new contenders. The real problem with sugar daddy clubs is with their "historical" rival (Aston Villa, Tottenham, Everton), or for Paris, the entire league. You screwd them all.

United Fans shouldn't care about how Chelsea or City "owned" their Money, like Munich don't care about Wolfsburg or Leverkusen.
 
I support Chelsea. No we are fine if for some reason RA bailed, the idea we are worried about FFP or debt is very old now, we had the advantage of a decade under the owner to sort things out, we arent PSG or Man City and we are sustainable now.

Football should be about football, thats why where money comes from is irrelevant. I couldnt give a shit where United got their money from, Im more concerned that we spend wisely and buy well to worry about where others get their money from.
Well, if Roman had made back his investment then kudos. If he's only stopped losing money every year, aka balanced the budget, that's less impressive.

I don't necessarily mind wealthy patrons of football. But Roman had no association with Chelsea, it wasn't about Chelsea, it was about Roman.
 
Because your owner made a fat check.

But it's not a problem for United, Chelsea or Man City aren't threats for United you are only new contenders. The real problem with sugar daddy clubs is with their "historical" rival (Aston Villa, Tottenham, Everton), or for Paris, the entire league. You screwd them all.

United Fans shouldn't care about how Chelsea or City "owned" their Money, like Munich don't care about Wolfsburg or Leverkusen.

Thats true, its none of anyones business where the money comes from. Although I wouldnt say we screwed Everton Villa or Spurs, they were miles off winning things a long time before we evolved. We screwed up the Arsenal/United duopoly thats for sure.
 
Well, if Roman had made back his investment then kudos. If he's only speed losing money every year, aka balanced the budget, that's less impressive.

I don't necessarily mind wealthy patrons of football. But Roman had no association with Chelsea, it wasn't about Chelsea, it was about Roman.

True, but he does now, plus he is a fan of football, I cant stand people who are involved with clubs who have no interest or passion for the game at all and who are simply running it like a business.
 
Because your owner made a fat check.

But it's not a problem for United, Chelsea or Man City aren't threats for United you are only new contenders. The real problem with sugar daddy clubs is with their "historical" rival (Aston Villa, Tottenham, Everton), or for Paris, the entire league. You screwd them all.

United Fans shouldn't care about how Chelsea or City "owned" their Money, like Munich don't care about Wolfsburg or Leverkusen.
Neither Wolfsburg nor Leverkusen have finished above Bayern recently.
 
He's talking nonsense about Liverpool but kind of agree with what he's saying about us becoming soulless, were basically doing what City and Chelsea did a few few years ago albeit with our own money.
That's the difference I think, it's with our own money.
 
We arent in massive debt, didnt Uniteds owners putting United in massive debt?

Money is money whether the club earned it or the owner earned it is irrelevant. People are just trying to get at United any way possible.

The debt of united is a thing of the past, there is debt at united but its like a common cold its not going to kill us. Debt interest is down, profits are at an all time high, the transfers this summer and in january 2014 speak for themselves
 
Neither Wolfsburg nor Leverkusen have finished above Bayern recently.

Because Munich is a well run club, and Wolfsburg won the league in 2009. While Leverkusen are professionnal bottlers. But both clubs are financed by big companies (Bayer and volkswagen)
 
That's the difference I think, it's with our own money.

Its a small difference to be fair, United fans might think its big but as you can see fans of others dont, to them its the simple act of spending big to win regardless.

Obviously its all crap anyway, I read too much shit all the time about money money money, just buy what the hell you want, and watch 38 games of a league season and see who has the best team, the best manager, and the best spirit to come out on top and stop being so worried about where the damn money comes from.
 
True, but he does now, plus he is a fan of football, I cant stand people who are involved with clubs who have no interest or passion for the game at all and who are simply running it like a business.

Roman has a lot going against him in the PR department, with his seedy personal history and unfriendly aura.

Then Chelsea are in a relatively wealthy area and that doesn't really endear them to people.

I'm not saying it's wrong to get angel investment, anyway, Roman is free (outside Russia) to do as he pleases.

But I think opposition fans have reasons to be proud of spending what they earn and to find other teams getting such wild investment to be somewhat distasteful to them.
 
Opposition fans all over England have loved our downfall and thought we'd fade into oblivion. As a result, you get stuff that your 'friend' has churned out. The same people will also be quick to say we didn't spend enough if we fail.
 
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Thats true, its none of anyones business where the money comes from. Although I wouldnt say we screwed Everton Villa or Spurs, they were miles off winning things a long time before we evolved. We screwed up the Arsenal/United duopoly thats for sure.

Just one nuance, Chelsea and City are trying to create big clubs by modelling Bayern, United and Real Madrid, i have no problem with that but i'm really bothered by the other group of sugar daddies (Anzhi, Zenith, Malaga, maybe Monaco, Portsmouth, etc..) these are dangerous, they kill football clubs.

Off Topic : The FFP has been created for this second group and PSG, he is not aiming at Chelsea or Man City.
 
Because Munich is a well run club, and Wolfsburg won the league in 2009. While Leverkusen are professionnal bottlers. But both clubs are financed by big companies (Bayer and volkswagen)

Ha, they're Bayer Leverkusen because they're owned by Bayer?

They're basically Advil Johnsonburg? Nice.
 
Just one nuance, Chelsea and City are trying to create big clubs by modelling Bayern, United and Real Madrid, i have no problem with that but i'm really bothered by the other group of sugar daddies (Anzhi, Zenith, Malaga, maybe Monaco, Portsmouth, etc..) these are dangerous, they kill football clubs.

Off Topic : The FFP has been created for this second group and PSG, he is not aiming at Chelsea or Man City.

Yeah I always felt FFP did not really apply to us and was more for the other clubs. The clubs that model their business like Monaco, Malaga etc are doomed to fail anyway, as time has shown.
 
Think we need to realise that we are going to get criticised for whatever we do because we are United and we are in a perceived 'downfall'. It's an ABU's wet dream. When we start playing like an actual football team again people will find something else to moan about. Probably about how far ahead we are of everyone commercially. Enjoy the criticism, it will make the return to success even sweeter.
 
I think mods should start clamping down on this bullshit to be honest. Not only is it ridiculous bullshit but its the same ridiculous bullshit recycled in numerous threads every day.
Either clamp down on this or open ONE thread then all the whiners can go in there.
 
Its a small difference to be fair, United fans might think its big but as you can see fans of others dont, to them its the simple act of spending big to win regardless.

Obviously its all crap anyway, I read too much shit all the time about money money money, just buy what the hell you want, and watch 38 games of a league season and see who has the best team, the best manager, and the best spirit to come out on top and stop being so worried about where the damn money comes from.
Do you know, that's exactly what I think.
It isn't MY money and I am there to be entertained.

Buy all the players you need regardless of cost, I say. :D
 
Think we need to realise that we are going to get criticised for whatever we do because we are United and we are in a perceived 'downfall'. It's an ABU's wet dream. When we start playing like an actual football team again people will find something else to moan about. Probably about how far ahead we are of everyone commercially. Enjoy the criticism, it will make the return to success even sweeter.

Yeh this. Whilst we were winning fecking everything I generally tried to avoid lording it over other fans. After the nationwide response to our recent struggles I can promise all those currently sticking the boot in that they are going to get it from me in spades when we get the title back. And the time after that, and the time after that etc etc :)
 
I think mods should start clamping down on this bullshit to be honest. Not only is it ridiculous bullshit but its the same ridiculous bullshit recycled in numerous threads every day.
Either clamp down on this or open ONE thread then all the whiners can go in there.
I certainly wish they were merged, personally.