Hmm interesting story, I wonder how many more kids Obama has gotten into college through the income based repayment plan (capped at 10%) than some random kids Romney knew.
US Presidential Election: Tuesday November 6th, 2012
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Hmm interesting story, I wonder how many more kids Obama has gotten into college through the income based repayment plan (capped at 10%) than some random kids Romney knew.
After Obama's lacklustre performance he needed to do something to rouse the democratic base and I think this was aimed at them. And it seems to have worked to an extent, Obama needs to carry on the good work now though.
morning after....
all the republicans say it was a draw...
All the democrats say Biden destroyed Ryan.
all the republicans say it was a draw...
All the democrats say Biden destroyed Ryan.
And yet all the right-wing nuts claim the mod and Biden combined to attack Ryan, evident of a medial liberal bias. It's so funny that half the country feels this way.
Reading some of Jaz's comments on the previous page, I have no doubts this guy could find a hardened turd in the desert, scoop it up, and attempt to sell it by glossing it over as some ancient black diamond.
Speaking of right-wing gloss, here's a gem someone just posted to my FB comment about Biden whipping Eddie Munster's butt.
--Biden was a buffoon. I guess if you choose to interrupt and talk over your opponent you can dominate the conversation. Doesn't mean you have anything intelligent to say, but you definitely get to say it. One guy looked Vice Presidential last night and it was not the current VP.--
And now the attacks are coming in.
--Biden was a buffoon. I guess if you choose to interrupt and talk over your opponent you can dominate the conversation. Doesn't mean you have anything intelligent to say, but you definitely get to say it. One guy looked Vice Presidential last night and it was not the current VP.--
And now the attacks are coming in.
I just looked through my Facebook and twitter for the first time since the debate, it really is amazing how many people thought Ryan won and that the moderator did a terrible job. It's like they didn't even listen to what was said at all. Some of them are very intelligent people too. One lady said she wouldn't vote for someone who couldn't show respect. Yes, that's a great reason to not vote for someone, who cares about the ideas behind their platform.
I'm moving.
I'm not sure you've made anything any clearer with that post.
Democrats are super enthused...
Biden called Ryan on everything he said...even when he was occasionally factual.
That is how you win debates.
Yes. Biden did dominate Ryan and the moderator...
great show in how to do surgery on your opponent without giving him anthesia.
btw looking at Ryan drinking all that water, wonder if they had to wipe his chair off all the piss.
Biden called Ryan on everything he said...even when he was occasionally factual.
That is how you win debates.
Yes. Biden did dominate Ryan and the moderator...
great show in how to do surgery on your opponent without giving him anthesia.
btw looking at Ryan drinking all that water, wonder if they had to wipe his chair off all the piss.
Ryan was out of his depth on foreign policy, evasive on domestic. His lines all sounded far too rehearsed and bordered on cringe-worthy at times. His response to "47%" was basically, "Hey Joe, you're known to gaffe a lot, give Mitt a break". He said they'd pursue a pro-life agenda, were basically open to sending troops back to Afghanistan and still could not explain that tax-plan of theirs.
How anyone can think that was a capable debate performance is beyond me. Right-wing rhetoric delivered by a robot.
How anyone can think that was a capable debate performance is beyond me. Right-wing rhetoric delivered by a robot.
And Biden said..He always says what he means to the response on the gaffe.
Re Jaz's "snap polls 2 to 1", we've got CNN admitting their poll oversampled Republicans, which has been pointed out, and CNBC's "poll" was a web poll, meaning it got freeped.
To be honest that's not a very good response, if that means that Biden meant what he said about the middle class being buried in the last 4 years.
You mean, since the Great Recession?
Biden's job was to energize Democratic voters and he did it.
I only saw a few minutes of if but the media seem to be coming down on Biden's side for the most part. I can't stand Ryan or anything he stands for so I am obviously going to like what Biden said and hate every word out of Ryans mouth.
At the end of the day the VP debate is pretty irreleveant anyway. It will have zero impact on voting.
At the end of the day the VP debate is pretty irreleveant anyway. It will have zero impact on voting.
if it has the impact of energizing democrats...which it will then the Biden debate has been a job well done.
All the democrats I have spoken to are gleeful and very enthusiatic about voting.
All the democrats I have spoken to are gleeful and very enthusiatic about voting.
Someone gets it.
People say that the VP doesn't matter but surely Sarah Palin helped to sink McCain last time when people stop to think that the VP could be President at any moment. Can anyone imagine Ryan as President? I thought Biden did a good job though perhaps he could have laughed a little less. I saw one Republican say Biden was interrupting all the time but I guess when Romney did that last week and swamped the moderator that was fine.
The five thirty eight models show Romney making huge gains.
The CBS poll was a web panel poll: this isn't a problem, assuming they adjust for the panel. The issue is that their "uncommitted" had more democrats than republicans. I'm not sure if that's true at all. So there is a risk of oversampling democrats who are not real 'independents' and would have ended up voting for their candidate anyway. Even using the CBS poll: amongst uncommitted:voting preference is: Obama 32%, Romney 33% undecided 32% after the debate.
Independents in the CNN poll thought Biden won, Which everyone has failed to mention and probably the most important result of the night.
The Republican tactic this campaign has been to manufacture gaffes where none exist.
As to whether it'll matter, who knows, but Democrats needed that - the base was sagging after Obama's performance and the resulting poll drop. We didn't think the first debate would make much difference either (cheers Plech.).
Didn't see that (surprise surprise), what was the figure?
Are you daft? The term "web poll" doesn't mean "an Internet connection was used somewhere in the process." It means CNBC stuck a poll up on their site for anyone who wanted, and whichever side Liverpooled the poll the most won.
Blah misread a line in the CNN polling page. They were talking about the CBS poll straight after their own poll.
watching Morning Joe this morning...all the Repulicans calling it a draw and making snide comments about Biden's laughing and interupting.
Mika the only democrat there said what all us democrats felt. Biden won this by a huge margin.
and was very tough througout.
yes. It will help in turnout. At this time it is all about turnout.
Chuck Todd was analysing the national polls yesterday and he said, it probably reflected more republicans in red states moving towards Romney. But as we know, it is the Electoral votes that matter...and Obama has a solid lead in Ohio and even if the lead is slimmer in states like WI and MI, Romney cannot overhaul Obama.
Mika the only democrat there said what all us democrats felt. Biden won this by a huge margin.
and was very tough througout.
yes. It will help in turnout. At this time it is all about turnout.
Chuck Todd was analysing the national polls yesterday and he said, it probably reflected more republicans in red states moving towards Romney. But as we know, it is the Electoral votes that matter...and Obama has a solid lead in Ohio and even if the lead is slimmer in states like WI and MI, Romney cannot overhaul Obama.
Of course, I'm not talking about the CNBC poll, I'm talking about the CBS/gfk web panel.
I'm not sure where this stories of a lack of democrat enthusiasm are coming from?!
Anyway, I agree that without Ohio and Virginia, Romney will lose. Romney isn't close enough or ahead in enough states to remotely call this a close race.
I think the 538 models are taken too much as gospel. These things are hard to predict until right up until the election.
I'm a big Nate Silver fan since his days at Baseball Prospectus but he has a tendency to overstate his conclusions.
I'm a big Nate Silver fan since his days at Baseball Prospectus but he has a tendency to overstate his conclusions.
feck's sake. Yes, the CBS poll, the one that went for Biden in your "Snap Polls: Ryan 2, Biden 1" link, was fine. The two that "went for Ryan" were less so. One over-sampled Republicans, and the other was self-selecting and unscientific.
I can't help it if you misread what I put.So yeah, it's true it's a 1:1 poll. Both of the polls are close to shit.
With all due respect, Jaz, that's a bunch of malarkey.
Silver is pragmatic.
National polls are interesting. But as we all know, the electoral college determines who becomes President.
Obama looks solid in the states he needs to carry.
This is going to be a squeaker I think. If we get a tie, then it would be fun seeing a Romney/Biden White House.
At no point in this thread did I say that the CNBC poll was a good poll. I've been saying that the CNN and the CBS poll's are both very flawed, you can't pan the CNN poll and not pan the CBS poll, simple because you want to believe the answer to one of them. They are both very flawed.
I think we need a Nate style model in the UK. I should get to work on it...
I thought ties were decided in the Thunderdome?
He's just pissed that Paul Ryan didn't wink at him.
Has there ever been a tie and how is it decided?
Also has what happens if a candidate gets seriously ill just before the election and has to withdraw? Has this ever happened (not wishing to hex Romney of course
).That's a fecking brilliant piece.
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