United Risking a Vicious Cycle?

Will Absolute said:
Woodward is the Glazer's man, and I don't think fan discontent will remove him. If he presides over another shambles this summer, most likely a DoF will be hired who'll take over responsibility for the future signing of players.

Which mightn't be a bad idea anyway. If things with LvG don't work out, the club might be entering a period of instability - hiring and firing managers regularly in the next ten years. Particularly with absentee owners, we need a football knowledge base at the top of club to provide continuity.
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Its interesting they didnt bring a DoF in already given they had plenty of time to do so, itd have been much better to do it before we hired Van Gaal, bringing one in after the manager is only going to be a source of potential conflict for a man who clearly doesnt always work well with other people. Even if he was coming in to help Woodward, bringing people like that is often perceived as a raid on the manager's jurisdiction.

I think they are confident Woodward can do the job or they would have acted in that window.
 
Adebesi said:
Its interesting they didnt bring a DoF in already given they had plenty of time to do so, itd have been much better to do it before we hired Van Gaal, bringing one in after the manager is only going to be a source of potential conflict for a man who clearly doesnt always work well with other people. Even if he was coming in to help Woodward, bringing people like that is often perceived as a raid on the manager's jurisdiction.

I think they are confident Woodward can do the job or they would have acted in that window.
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It is indeed interesting that Woodward wasn't replaced in the whole transfer dealing department alright....

Most people with a footballing brain know he failed last season... The biggest thing on his side is the fact that he's glazers loyal lapdog... I know some of the more misguided members have an odd affection for him but he won't let any negotiation deals go public as he will always have a job with them on some level...

If they get in a director of football and it doesn't work out this person could easily publically disclose information that may make fans turn on the glazers (eg they were penny pinching while negotiating for players)....
 
Ed Woodwork will royally feck again this time around. During his tenure, we signed two players at clearly more than they are worth in the market, bent over to Rooney, completely ballsed up Moyes sacking in the media, and I also blame him for not making a fuss about Rio send-off considering they knew they had no intention of extending his contract...so I have very little confidence in him.

however I'm sure van Gaal would be able to lure a few decent players, but certainly not those with any sort of Europian football ambitions.
 
I am worried that so many "good" players are distancing themselves from a possible transfer to us.Okay maybe not many but the few we were all hoping for.
 
Bloxy said:
Ed Woodwork will royally feck again this time around. During his tenure, we signed two players at clearly more than they are worth in the market, bent over to Rooney, completely ballsed up Moyes sacking in the media, and I also blame him for not making a fuss about Rio send-off considering they knew they had no intention of extending his contract...so I have very little confidence in him.

however I'm sure van Gaal would be able to lure a few decent players, but certainly not those with any sort of Europian football ambitions.
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Exactly, he has done nothing to make anyone confident in his ability.
 
Mata is worth the price we paid in the current market, especially when you consider who we signed him from.
 
I don't think we're in any danger of entering a cycle tbh.
I'm confident that we can get in the top 4 and that's all we need to do. We just need to keep improving.

I think we have a great squad, our defence needs bulking and obviously midfielders but even if we didn't sign one of the best CB's in the world for example - that wont be the difference between us getting a top 4 position.
 
Adebesi said:
I think this is a bit complacent. He has won the league wherever he has been. But his record is not without blemishes.

I am confident he'll get us back into the top 4 but I dont think its a given because he has this immaculate record of winning or being in the top 3 wherever he has gone.
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Yeah no he will get us top 4.
 
Well it's great to see were not pissing about this time, straight out of the blocks nailing the transfers we need like Chelsea!
 
kouroux said:
I'm not optimistic about the signing of any real talented player this summer
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I don't think LVG is the type of manager to go after big stars anyway. Think he'll bring in younger players who'll fit his system and follow his orders to a tee.
 
It's difficult to judge why a particular deal goes sour in the absence of reliable info but it's quite clear that we need to change how we approach transfers . Maybe we aren't looking in the right areas because we surely weren't basing a major portion of our transfer strategy on Bayern selling us one of their prized assets, contract rebel or not . Or when we find the right player we are wasting time trying to save a few million ! I just don't know and currently it's too early to judge but if this summer turns out like the last one did then LvG or not we aren't meeting our prime objectives .
 
Ramshock said:
Louis van Gaal is too good of a coach to not have a team finish in the top four. Fckin relax people
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He was on course for getting Barca relegated in his second spell, got sacked and Antic came in and things improved. Of course, he has had many successes as well.
 
If United stuck with Moyes I could see u guys doing a Liverpool.

The board made the right decision to replace him with a much better manager who can build a strong team.

Success might not come straight away under LVG but he is definitely going to Improve the team immensely in the next couple of years.
 
I know a lot of people find the whole premise of this thread a bit over the top and hysterical, but I feels a lot of my concerns last season are being realised this window.

Hummels, Reus, Muller... Seems Vidal would be willing but if we look at the package being discussed in the press, it's very, very generous. Is that to compensate for the position we're in? Is it viable to offer those kinds of packages in every position we need to strengthen?

Just feel if the goal this summer was to close the gap on the club's above us, and being in real quality all over the park, we've come up short. We look no better than last season. One step forward (Herrera) three steps back (Rio, Vidic, Evra). Jury out on Rojo and Shaw but let's face it, not blowing anybody out of the water.

Obviously not a crisis yet but cause for concern. And if we don't get into the CL this year it'll be even harder next summer.
 
Its far too early to be drawing too many conclusions. We knew there would have to be a clear out of deadwood as well as those past it. We knew we'd have to pay over the odds to try and attract top quality bearing in mind we could not offer ECL football. We knew that the timing of LvG's arrival was not the best. Had it not been for the WC he could have taken over a lot earlier and been able to assess the squad and start making the necessary adjustments sooner. As it is he had to wait until after the Swansea game to get a clearer picture. The result of that game did not help either, casting doubt on any short term fix. Many of us felt that even if there were no additions to the squad beyond Shaw and Herrera, LvG would be good enough to get the club back into the top four. Can that view change just because of one result? Many pundits think it was a reality check but you simply can't cast judgement so soon. That goes for the teams who seem to have got off to a good start too.
 
I think the lack of signings is as much down to the clubs refusal to bring them in as anything else, Herrera, Shaw, Rojo are hardly crap players nor is Mata, so I don't think we can't attract the big names (at least not this season)

for me the big concern is that the Glazers feel they make enough money from the club just being top 8 that they don't need to spend on players to do any better than this, from their point of view the non-football revenue will compensate for any losses, and they can make more profit still by not investing too heavily in the squad, the problem is that if we don't invest we won't get back to the top four under the Glazers, that has to be a real fear now, that they have settled for less on the pitch...if they have then we definitely will see big names leave next summer and we will definitely struggle to attract any players that want to play in Europe.

I fear the glory days of the club are now over, and over for a very very long time lads.
 
LoiusVanGaal said:
I think the lack of signings is as much down to the clubs refusal to bring them in as anything else, Herrera, Shaw, Rojo are hardly crap players nor is Mata, so I don't think we can't attract the big names (at least not this season)

for me the big concern is that the Glazers feel they make enough money from the club just being top 8 that they don't need to spend on players to do any better than this, from their point of view the non-football revenue will compensate for any losses, and they can make more profit still by not investing too heavily in the squad, the problem is that if we don't invest we won't get back to the top four under the Glazers, that has to be a real fear now, that they have settled for less on the pitch...if they have then we definitely will see big names leave next summer and we will definitely struggle to attract any players that want to play in Europe.

I fear the glory days of the club are now over, and over for a very very long time lads.
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As yes, lack of signings.

Well, apart from the 4 players we've brought in in 2014 for a combined £115m, that is.
 
Massive Spanner said:
As yes, lack of signings.

Well, apart from the 4 players we've brought in in 2014 for a combined £115m, that is.
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you are counting the young GK? are you Woodward?

we needed at least 6 first team signings really to compete this year, so far we only have 3...
 
Massive Spanner said:
No, I'm counting Mata, you remember, that guy we spent £37m on? Decent player too iirc.
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that was January mate, it's old news in the transfer market we live in, we went into the summer needing 6 players, simple as that, so far we have 3, at best right now we will come 5th or 6th, even that seems ambitious if we have any injuries to first team players tbh.
 
LoiusVanGaal said:
that was January mate, it's old news in the transfer market we live in, we went into the summer needing 6 players, simple as that, so far we have 3, at best right now we will come 5th or 6th, even that seems ambitious if we have any injuries to first team players tbh.
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January of what year? This one? I'd say that counts.

6 players was always going to be an outrageous ask, you're making out like this squad is rubbish, it's not. It's definitely capable of getting top four, the confidence is just a bit shot after last season and we're adapting to a new formation at the moment. LvG also said himself he starts off quite slow.

There's also no guarantee that if we do sign 6 players we'll get top 4. If the right players aren't available then there's no point trying to get them.
 
I thought oh ok one season out of the CL is bad but we will be in next season now Moyes is gone and we have made a few signings.

Now I'm getting a bit worried, two seasons out could be VERY bad..
 
Massive Spanner said:
January of what year? This one? I'd say that counts.

6 players was always going to be an outrageous ask, you're making out like this squad is rubbish, it's not. It's definitely capable of getting top four, the confidence is just a bit shot after last season and we're adapting to a new formation at the moment. LvG also said himself he starts off quite slow.

There's also no guarantee that if we do sign 6 players we'll get top 4. If the right players aren't available then there's no point trying to get them.
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:rolleyes:

you think a squad with only 4 fist team CB's which plays 3 at the back, a squad with only 1 top quality CM who is likely to play most games, can finish top four in this league? are you high? this isn't the SPL where you can play whoever, wherever and if you are Celtic you still win easily.

sure, but not signing enough players is a definite guarantee of failure in this league...
 
Absolutely we are risking a vicious circle and Paul Scholes is spot on with his comments today. I don't think it is an exaggeration to say that the next week or so remaining of the transfer window could define the next 20 years at Manchester United. We cannot afford to miss Champions League football for a second successive season.
 
Sparky Rhiwabon said:
Absolutely we are risking a vicious circle and Paul Scholes is spot on with his comments today. I don't think it is an exaggeration to say that the next week or so remaining of the transfer window could define the next 20 years at Manchester United. We cannot afford to miss Champions League football for a second successive season.
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if we don't sign anyone then we won't come top four this season, I can guarantee you that right now mate.
 
LoiusVanGaal said:
:rolleyes:

you think a squad with only 4 fist team CB's which plays 3 at the back, a squad with only 1 top quality CM who is likely to play most games, can finish top four in this league? are you high? this isn't the SPL where you can play whoever, wherever and if you are Celtic you still win easily.

sure, but not signing enough players is a definite guarantee of failure in this league...
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I think a squad with van Gaal as a manager, De Gea in goal, three of the best attackers in the league up front, and lots of other good players can finish in the top four, yeah. It won't be easy but that's just how it is, sadly. I think it's a lot more complex than just signing a shitload of players in a single summer and hoping that's what sorts us out.

We're not in an ideal situation but we shouldn't just panic buy either. If we miss out on top four again, so be it, I'm confident we'll get back into it at some point. We're in a rebuilding process and signing loads of players at once to try a quick fix won't solve that.
 
Massive Spanner said:
I think a squad with van Gaal as a manager, De Gea in goal, three of the best attackers in the league up front, and lots of other good players can finish in the top four, yeah. It won't be easy but that's just how it is, sadly. I think it's a lot more complex than just signing a shitload of players in a single summer and hoping that's what sorts us out.
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Van Gaal is a much better manager than Moyes but frankly you are expecting a footballing miracle from him with that. 1 GK and 3 Attackers do not make you a good team, you need quality defenders and midfielders as well, we are lacking in both with our current formation.

it's not just signing a shit load of players but signing what we need, if we don't even try to sign what we need then it's basically accepting failure already.
 
LoiusVanGaal said:
Van Gaal is a much better manager than Moyes but frankly you are expecting a footballing miracle from him with that. 1 GK and 3 Attackers do not make you a good team, you need quality defenders and midfielders as well, we are lacking in both with our current formation.

it's not just signing a shit load of players but signing what we need, if we don't even try to sign what we need then it's basically accepting failure already.
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Precisely! What if what we need simply is not available this summer? As I said, it is not as simple as just going "right, I want six players, go go go!"
 
Massive Spanner said:
Precisely! What if what we need simply is not available this summer? As I said, it is not as simple as just going "right, I want six players, go go go!"
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The players we need are clearly available though. We just don't seem to want to do anything about it.
 
Massive Spanner said:
Who?
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just look at the players other clubs have signed, you will see plenty of defenders and midfielders who didn't cost the earth but could do very well for them.

Blind for instance has said he'd love to play for LVG here, but we are still not signing him.

Strootman is apparently available, but nothing is being done as well.

that's just two that are still available now...
 
Name Changed said:
The players we need are clearly available though. We just don't seem to want to do anything about it.
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I call shenanigans. We can't offer CL football so whilst the likes of Di Maria might be available, we just aren't an attractive proposition, simple as that. I don't believe for a second that money is the issue here, look at the amount we've spent in the last few years.
 
LoiusVanGaal said:
just look at the players other clubs have signed, you will see plenty of defenders and midfielders who didn't cost the earth but could do very well for them.

Blind for instance has said he'd love to play for LVG here, but we are still not signing him.

Strootman is apparently available, but nothing is being done as well.

that's just two that are still available now...
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Strootman who broke his leg and would fail a medical, and who Roma just said would cost £100m? No thanks.

Blind is hardly the sort of signing who would reignite us, he's decent, not great.

You've named two players there, neither of whom would be overly good signings this summer.
 
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