UK General Election - 12th December 2019 | Con 365, Lab 203, LD 11, SNP 48, Other 23 - Tory Majority of 80

How do you intend to vote in the 2019 General Election if eligible?

  • Brexit Party

    Votes: 30 4.3%
  • Conservatives

    Votes: 73 10.6%
  • DUP

    Votes: 5 0.7%
  • Green

    Votes: 23 3.3%
  • Labour

    Votes: 355 51.4%
  • Liberal Democrats

    Votes: 58 8.4%
  • Plaid Cymru

    Votes: 3 0.4%
  • Sinn Fein

    Votes: 9 1.3%
  • SNP

    Votes: 19 2.8%
  • UKIP

    Votes: 6 0.9%
  • Independent

    Votes: 1 0.1%
  • Other (BNP, Change UK, UUP and anyone else that I have forgotten)

    Votes: 10 1.4%
  • Not voting

    Votes: 57 8.3%
  • Undecided

    Votes: 41 5.9%

  • Total voters
    690
  • Poll closed .
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Looks like the Labour vote is doing the same as last time. In which case we're perhaps heading for another stalemate.

And honestly, we might face that issue for a while longer. With the Corbynite left and Johnson's anti-EU nutcase right in charge of their respective parties, I really don't see any major swings in the vote share from one party to the other. When Wilson won with Labour in 64, he only had a majority of 4 MPs. So he had a snap election 18 months later and had a majority of almost 100. That kind of thing appears impossible as things stand. And with FPTP all but guaranteeing no new entrants to disrupt the system, we could be stuck here for several more elections.
 
This is what the NHS Confederation report has to say about it:


So if I understand this correctly, there would be pressure for the UK to recognise drug patents for longer than current EU regulations, which would allow US drug companies to maintain their patents for longer which would then cause the NHS to have to purchase more branded drugs than generic drugs if those branded drugs come from US companies ?

Is that correct ??

If so, then it would certainly end up more expensive than the current NHS drug spend, but is hardly an NHS Privatisation when compared to all the other privatised services in the NHS already, such as cleaning, laundry, PFI contracts for hospitals, agency nurses and medical staff, procurement, catering, and the biggest of them all, the UK's GPs and Consultants who are all self-employed and contract / invoice their services to the NHS.

Bringing some of these services back ' in-house ' and paying off those crazy PFI contracts would probably cover the additional cost of purchasing drugs from US companies and more, but I'm open to correction.
 
The massive bias from the media doesn't help. Look at this for instance.
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And I remember a few years ago when The Sun and Mail put articles up about Corbyn 'dancing' on Remembrance Sunday, cutting out the WW2 veteran he was walking and talking to. Article from a former member about it.
 
If you thought islamic ray guns were bad just look at what the leader of the opposition is wearing


"islamic jihad scarf"

 
So if I understand this correctly, there would be pressure for the UK to recognise drug patents for longer than current EU regulations, which would allow US drug companies to maintain their patents for longer which would then cause the NHS to have to purchase more branded drugs than generic drugs if those branded drugs come from US companies ?

Is that correct ??

That's one strand, the other is to undermine VPAS and the whole notion of collective bargaining and the setting of a maximum price for barter (the price cap).

If so, then it would certainly end up more expensive than the current NHS drug spend, but is hardly an NHS Privatisation when compared to all the other privatised services in the NHS already, such as cleaning, laundry, PFI contracts for hospitals, agency nurses and medical staff, procurement, catering, and the biggest of them all, the UK's GPs and Consultants who are all self-employed and contract / invoice their services to the NHS.

Bringing some of these services back ' in-house ' and paying off those crazy PFI contracts would probably cover the additional cost of purchasing drugs from US companies and more, but I'm open to correction.

I've only linked the portion of the report relating to drug pricing. That doesn't represent the entirity of US economic aims in the area. Here are some more:

NHS Confederation said:
On Public Procurement:
In relation to government procurement, the USA’s stated objective is to “increase opportunities for US firms to sell US products and services to the UK”, mirroring existing USA government procurement practices. It would clearly press for as much access as possible to UK public procurement markets, specifying that where any services are excepted this should be “on a negative list basis of the narrowest possible exceptions with the least possible impact on NHS firms”.

The primary consideration for the NHS is always to provide the best possible quality of service for patients while obtaining value for money. NHS services in England (not Scotland, Wales or Northern Ireland) already operate on a competitive tendering basis where they deem this appropriate, and can invite bids from USA-owned companies if they so wish. In practice local commissioners do not invite bids for the majority of NHS services as they are considered unsuitable for competitive tendering: it is not cost-effective or in the best interests of patients to go through an expensive and time-consuming procurement process in the absence of a realistic market. Such decisions could be challenged, should the UK choose in an FTA explicitly to open healthcare services to market access by USA companies.

It is debatable how successful the UK would be in extracting reciprocal commitments from the USA given the USA’s stated objective of excluding sub-federal (state and local governments) from commitments, and favouring preferential local arrangements (“Buy America”).

On Sanitary and phytosanitary measures (SPS), and technical barriers to trade (TBT):
Regarding trade in goods, the USA singles out “non-tariff barriers that discriminate against US agricultural goods”. On sanitary and phytosanitary measures (SPS), it refers repeatedly to the obligation to adopt “science-based” SPS regulation (standards, for example, on food, based on scientific evidence of risk), as opposed to the EU’s “precautionary principle” which is more cautious (excluding products where risk cannot be definitively ruled out).

The objectives contain strong wording about “unwarranted barriers” and “unjustified… restrictions or… requirements”. Particularly concerning regarding the UK’s right to regulate are the USA’s intentions to “require the UK to publish drafts of regulations, allow stakeholders in other countries to provide comments on these drafts, and require authorities to… explain how the final measure achieves the stated objectives”.

Similar wording is employed in the section of the summary of USA negotiating objectives concerning technical barriers to trade (TBT), requiring the UK to publish and justify proposed standards, technical regulations and conformity assessment procedures.

The USA also seeks to restrict the UK’s freedom to decide what to require of other third countries in trade agreements, by aspiring to obtain a commitment from the UK not to require third countries with whom the UK concludes deals to align with “non-science based” restrictions and requirements. This is clearly an attempt to prevent the UK maintaining EU standards based on the precautionary principle and requiring its trading partners to adhere to the same standards, with which the USA could not comply.

Public health bodies in the UK have expressed concern that this could lead to lower standards, for example, of food hygiene, than current EU standards.

Of course all these things are dependent on the willingness of the UK to make concessions, but this leads back to who has the greatest need of a deal in this scenario and who holds the competitive advantage.
 
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Always laugh hearing British people go on about terrorists like the British army and the British empire aren't some of the biggest war mongering terrorists the world has ever known.

Worse is the clown in the video will be a Tory whose manifesto promises this: Military veterans will be given new legal protection to prevent them being prosecuted over killings during The Troubles, in a pledge to be made in the Conservative Party manifesto.

But tell me again who the terrorist sympathiser is :rolleyes:
 
Fun little exchange:



Jesus, what a car crash. People rarely seem to pay much attention though, at the last general election there was so much talk about the costings of Labour's manifesto being crazy but little about how the conservatives didn't even bother to cost theirs.
 
Nigel Farage tells Eddie Mair he will not refund dropped Brexit Party candidates

 
Jesus, what a car crash. People rarely seem to pay much attention though, at the last general election there was so much talk about the costings of Labour's manifesto being crazy but little about how the conservatives didn't even bother to cost theirs.
Yeah it's madness. Still heard a few people mention it. They say they don't want to vote Labour because they don't know where the money is coming from. I say it's in the manifesto. They ask what it says there. Surely if it's their issue they should be looking? Obviously they just want it to be an issue. They don't want the answers.
 
Fun little exchange:



If this was Dianne Abbott, she’d be ridiculed by every newspaper for years, and seen as incompetent at the very mention of her name.

This will of course be forgotten by the end of today.

If you thought islamic ray guns were bad just look at what the leader of the opposition is wearing


"islamic jihad scarf"



Islamaphobia is apparently acceptable.
 
I'm already extremely sick of the propaganda and I'm not even back in the UK yet.
 
While Boris bumbles around the country like Orinoco from the Wombles, Jeremy finds himself embroiled in a jazz hands scandal. It's all happening in The Country Formerly Known As Merrie England.

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They want to abolish the NHS expenditure cap on prescription drugs. The average American spends $1200 a year on prescription drugs. Do we need anymore reasons beyond that?

Thing is why would any UK government agree to this? That's what I don't understand. In any negotiation if there terms from the other side that you cannot agree to you don't have to sign the deal.
 
Don't worry I'm sure Laura K and the rest of the BBC will dutifully tell us his background any minute now.....any minute now...


This is the only tweet she has made on this topic, a retweet of this. She's a fecking joke.
 
Thing is why would any UK government agree to this? That's what I don't understand. In any negotiation if there terms from the other side that you cannot agree to you don't have to sign the deal.

We don't have any real leverage to hold over the US though, do we? The Tories have been talking up potential deals with the US - for them to then fall apart would be a PR embarrassment. That's more likely when you consider Trump approaches political dealings like business transactions in which he has to not only get favourable terms but win outright.
 
And so the next concocted outrage against Corbyn will be..... *checks notes*...... his support for international law.



Also didn't al-Baghdadi blow himself up before being captured? I don't see how Corbyn is questioning the US account here.
 
We don't have any real leverage to hold over the US though, do we? The Tories have been talking up potential deals with the US - for them to then fall apart would be a PR embarrassment. That's more likely when you consider Trump approaches political dealings like business transactions in which he has to not only get favourable terms but win outright.
A greater PR embarrassment than agreeing to pay substantially more for medicines? I'm not saying it could never happen, but I remain to be convinced.
 
We don't have any real leverage to hold over the US though, do we? The Tories have been talking up potential deals with the US - for them to then fall apart would be a PR embarrassment. That's more likely when you consider Trump approaches political dealings like business transactions in which he has to not only get favourable terms but win outright.

Australia signed a what seems to be (I obviously don't know intricate details, but seems generally well received on both sides) a good free trade deal with the US and they are a much smaller economy than we are. I think in general free trade deals are overrated, especially for a service economy such as ours, but all the pointers suggest that we could get something mutually beneficial with the US. As I say Trump likes the anglosphere, he's actively trying to get more visas allocated to the Irish apropos of nothing.
 
I wish Labour had a serious Tony Blair/David Milliband type leader in this election. I think the country is in a really delicate position and needs a proper conversation, and the presence of Corbyn is making this whole thing a bit of a joke.
 
People who can’t even win leadership elections within their own family = serious electable leader material

I swear centrists live in another fecking universe sometimes.
 
People who can’t even win leadership elections within their own family = serious electable leader material

I swear centrists live in another fecking universe sometimes.

"Maybe we'd all like politics a lot more if it was actually just...2002?"
 
People who can’t even win leadership elections within their own family = serious electable leader material

I swear centrists live in another fecking universe sometimes.

To be fair his family got to see him up close. Centrists only have years of lies, incompetence, distortion, corruption, and general buffoonery to judge him on. And they see themselves in him.
 
I wish Labour had a serious Tony Blair/David Milliband type leader in this election. I think the country is in a really delicate position and needs a proper conversation, and the presence of Corbyn is making this whole thing a bit of a joke.
Genuine question - How do you think Britain got itself into this ''delicate position'' and how can it get out ?
 
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