Democracy is overrated.
Trump and Brexit: What has happened to the world?
- Thread starter sullydnl
- Start date
Nope, but you can still blame them when they do stupid things
If you make Donald fecking Trump POTUS because of some reactionary whim, well then you are as thick as can be, reap what you sow and deserve what ever is coming your way.
The universal condemnation of him is not some hive-mind, mob mentality thing either. This is a man whit no political experience what so ever, a humongous narcissists and a man lacking any moral fiber, which in turn has built his entire campaign on hate and discontent, and he is now the most powerful man in the world. Hillary might have been a corporate shill, but hes nothing but a snake oil salesman, and a big cnut as well.
I wish i could say it was "funny", because it's quite clear he will never be able to live up to any of those ridiculous claims he has made, but he could potentially throw the world into disarray and there is nothing funny about that
Its not politics, it's economics. Lives are stagnant. Twice now people have picked a jump into the dark over the steady course.
She did also lose a damaging proportion of millennial voters in important run-offs, or do you refute that point? White women too saw a noticeable decline, as did university educated white men IIRC.
She didn't excite her base
Will check that tomorrow. TBH I'm not sure how reliable the exits were, given the discrepancies with the actual outcome.
That is so so far from the truth.
So when will they start building the wall?
I do believe it is part of it. The reasons for Brexit and Trump are multifaceted though. Reductive hysterical arguments don't really help anyone.
Soon as Mexico stump up the cash.
Any experts call this one correctly?
I feel sorry for amateur statisticians in the election thread. Must've been 1,000s of polls posted over the course of campaigning.
People voted for any alternative to the status quo rich/poor divide, a working class revolt if you will. You can't call that a left wing system.
For white people.
Feels like the world is reaching a tipping point towards some sort of major shift or revolution in the way way we do politics.
Now watch him become a total mellowed down and uneventful president. "The Wall" will be explained as a "method of speech" and all his other more extreme viewpoints will just be forgotten.
Meh, we'll hardly notice any difference from the previous ones.
Meh, we'll hardly notice any difference from the previous ones.
Populism, left or right.
India, Philippines, UK, US, Greece (the only left populists), Holland, France.
A lot of the 'white people' @Mockney refers to believe the staus quo to be a left wing liberal elite focused on bringing the world multiculturalism. A lot of these voters are definitely railing against 'cultural Marxism'.
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The SJW meltdown will be fun to watch before Trump starts fecking everything up.
They were also voting against things like TPP, of which the incumbent was a leading supporter. Many of these people have been forgotten by the mainstream right and left for decades.
When is the last time the left had power if at all? Obama may have some lefty ideals but he's centrist and Hillary is more right than left. I don't see how the left are really involved in this at all?
The one thing I will say, it won't take long before rural America realises he offers them nothing.
Bingo.
This is what I don't get. Did they really think Trump was gonna open a factory for all of them?
Russel Brand for Prime Minisiter it is
For all intents and purposes, the Democratic Party is the left in America. I also think you are wrong about Obama's individual politics but that is a small matter.
And if we continuing the specious link to Brexit, the British left has a great deal of culpability. Labour and the Lib Dems have been ignoring sections of their base for a decade-and-a-half, and lied to the wider electorate to boot. Thee are other threads for Brexit discussion mind.
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This is exactly it - while there may be xenophobes, racists and other kinds of terrible people in both Brexit and Trump voters, they wouldn't have been enough to make them win. The real reason is that people are just fed up and disenfranchised. For them this is a protest vote to the establishment. In both cases the votes have come from the less well-off (not necessarily uneducated or old), especially those negatively affected by globalisation.
And in both cases it's turkeys voting for Christmas. That's what is so sad about all of this. People who wanted to make a statement about being sick of the way powerful people always act in their own interest end up being fooled into helping political opportunists making a naked power grab of their own.
Exactly. I've found making posts in favourite of Trump a rather pointless exercise since the majority of posters here are blindingly intolerant of views that differ from their own. The post-election analysis on TV reflects the same attitude by the democratically-leaning commentators, who refuse to consider that there are intelligent people who don't share their points of view.
Isn't Trump part of the self interested establishment? At least he was upfront about it, I'll give him that.
Absolutely. Well said!
One could equally state 'You know what? They were wrong. All of them.' We advance no further.
More than half the people hate arrogant people like you, simple as that.
It's because the Remainers and the Democrats both ran spectacularly bad campaigns.
Labelling those who think differently to you as racists and idiots is never a good way to get them on your side.
That's another obvious similarity. On the flipside, this is the first time I can ever think of when the successful campaign(s) were based on so many blatant lies.
Let's be honest, it is stupid and racist people that are swaying these votes.
I've never looked down on all these people or marginalised them until they've fecked us all over, personally, so it's tough to accept that as a reason for them voting that way.
They've turned the most accepting generation against them by doing these things.
A generation that is more in tune with politics than ever at this age (or so it seems, I could be wrong there), who will have to endure the brunt of their ridiculous reasoning.
Why should anyone be accepting of this and how can you blame them for being angry?
I've never looked down on all these people or marginalised them until they've fecked us all over, personally, so it's tough to accept that as a reason for them voting that way.
They've turned the most accepting generation against them by doing these things.
A generation that is more in tune with politics than ever at this age (or so it seems, I could be wrong there), who will have to endure the brunt of their ridiculous reasoning.
Why should anyone be accepting of this and how can you blame them for being angry?
Yeah, they both decided to defend the status quo vs. some vague hopeful dream of the future... really hard to win it if you frame it like that.
Pretty much.
I think there's a few things going on here. There's this section of society that you speak about which are angry at the status quo. They're continually shafted, they live in areas with high unemployment, see large groups of foreign migrants moving in and egged on by right wing media they look think there are simple answers to complex problems.
Then there's an older generation who let's be honest are old enough to remember black people not being allowed to vote. It's too much change for them to take in such a short period of time. They don't like being told what to say and think and this in some ways is them voting to turn back the clock.
I think the sleeping giant has been awakened and these people (particularly the first group) have come out (for this and the EU referendum) to vote in numbers that nobody predicted not helped by a younger generation who haven't been engaged or motivated to vote either way.
I called Brexit because I could feel the mood in the country. This one is more of a head scratcher though as despite everything he's promised I still struggle to understand the logic in voting in a billionaire proud that he has managed to avoid taxes and expecting him to give a damn about the likes of Cletus in Bumfeck Arizona. What a woefully misjudged campaign from the Democrats too though. They've got to accept that they made a massive mistake pushing Hillary over Bernie. That can't have helped. It's just sad when in a supposed democracy people are forced into voting for the lesser of 2 evils.
What I hope from all of this is that there is some real political change of the back of these 2 monumental events. I've never known a world as divided as it is now, literally across households in many places. Perhaps we need to go backwards before we can all move forwards. I don't know.