I was actually really surprised that Cohle didn't die.
Television True Detective | Season 2 Spoilers
- Thread starter Dirty Schwein
- Start date
Shit, had no idea Errol was the same actor who plays Remus in Boardwalk Empire.
He really doesn't say this at all. You should watch it back again. He says he felt a deeper darkness under his level of 'vague consciousness' and in this darkness he could feel warmth and substance which was the love of his daughter and parents. He wanted to let go and be with them but then he woke up. The sad thing for him is that he didn't die which is why he says "I shouldn't be here"...although the message is ultimately uplifting and has made him re-assess his pessimistic outlook on life.
Yeah me too.
The green house thing gets more ridiculous the more I think about it.
Did anyone like the hallucination? I thought it destroyed a lot of the tension that had been building for 15 minutes at what was supposed to be its climactic point.
Did anyone like the hallucination? I thought it destroyed a lot of the tension that had been building for 15 minutes at what was supposed to be its climactic point.
It was a bit wtf certainly. I thought for a second we were gonna go full on X-Files but again they'd clumsily re-introduced this topic in the car earlier when Marty asked him about them.
Yeah, it disappointed me slightly but I suppose it gave an explanation as to how fatty Errol was able to jump a usually sharp Rust. That, or the alcoholism.
Anyway, I'd say the first three episodes were great, the next two were incredible, and the last three were alright. So pretty great overall.
Yeah I'd go with that.
Yeah, the only good thing about it was that they left it at that.
For a brief moment my heart completely sank...
The last three episodes were still a lot better than "alright".
Absolutely loved it. Wrapped everything up that needed to be.
I'm not remotely fussed with any of the foreshadowing and theorising and all that stuff and I don't think that tv series have a duty to wrap up every loose end in a neat little package so everyone is satisfied, but that was an incredibly underwhelming finale. Very atmospheric, very beautiful set design and I personally liked the last 5 minutes with Rust and Cohle but there's very little else I liked about that episode. Absolutely brilliant first five episodes, mostly mediocre final three. The green painting was an absolutely absurd leap. The thing is the story for me has always been secondary. It just provided the platform for brilliant acting, great character development, lovely cinematography and refreshingly original pacing for a crime/homicide series. Obviously the mythology and mystery helped build the atmosphere and the setting was crucial to the two main characters' motivations/attitudes/personalities but beyond that the story was unimportant. The fact that they botched up the story so badly that it completely ruined all the rest of it is a fairly remarkable feat. It was all so promising.
Yeah, I'd have weirdly preferred it if he did. Knowing he got his man but he was weirdly happy at the end. When they did the "FBI deny a link to the Tuttle family" I can see why he was pissed off hearing that. Their power is still strong
I would have prefered them all dying at that place.
http://douthat.blogs.nytimes.com/20...of-true-detective/?_php=true&_type=blogs&_r=0
Ross Douthat sums up my view pretty well.
Ross Douthat sums up my view pretty well.
I agree with some of his points there in that while we didn't want all the bad guys to go to jail in a predictable fashion, it'd have worked to perhaps leave some unsolved but give us a greater indication as to who else was involved/why they did it etc. Not all of that, but some of it since we didn't get a lot.
I disagree when he talks about the final act of a crime mystery essentially being the only important part. I get a lot of what he's saying and the point he's making, but it still massively undervalues the character driven show this often was, despite the precedence that was also placed on the crime.
Yep, mine too.
Funny earlier in the thread people were talking about 'filler', well the way the show ended sort of throws open the suggestion that a lot of what we thought was central to the plot turned out in the end to be nothing more than that.
I think the first 3 were perfect in establishing the relationship between the two protagonists, the middle 2 were the 'how shit went down' ones that should have set up the final 3 to sort of close out the main plot to some sort of satisfactory degree. I don't think it's too much to expect that those 3 hours could have been used more effectively. That's like one and a half Chinatowns.
Has anyone seen the film Kill List? I was kind of expecting (maybe more like hoping for) an ending like that.
I still say it was a very flat final 3. Like a bottle of coke left in the fridge too long.
I don't think it was a mystery narrative.
The Chinatown/Wicker Man comparison is a good call.
I still can't get over the green ears thing. It's just so bizarrely stupid that the only reason I can think they went for it is to create a mini-uproar and get people talking about it. A painter doesn't tend to paint his whole ears the same colour as the house. And the fact they both survived in those circumstances was pretty silly. Also how the giant somehow managed to brush off a few bullets like it was nothing. The previous two episodes were a bit flat but this one just had so many stupid moments that were so far away from what made the series so great in the first place. Very strange and very disappointing.
I still can't get over the green ears thing. It's just so bizarrely stupid that the only reason I can think they went for it is to create a mini-uproar and get people talking about it. A painter doesn't tend to paint his whole ears the same colour as the house. And the fact they both survived in those circumstances was pretty silly. Also how the giant somehow managed to brush off a few bullets like it was nothing. The previous two episodes were a bit flat but this one just had so many stupid moments that were so far away from what made the series so great in the first place. Very strange and very disappointing.
It was absolutely ridiculous.
I honestly gave it a few seconds thought and accepted it. A bit OTT--- yes. Episode ruiner? No.
It's one of the silliest things I've seen in a serious drama in recent years and probably right up there with anything the writers of Dexter came up with (until I gave up on it at least). I wouldn't say it ruined the show but that was a key turning point in the story and they somehow came to the decision that that was the best explanation. Batshit crazy stuff right there. It's genuinely the kind of thing a couple of stoners would come up with and then laugh off minutes later for the sheer stupidity of it.
I was all over the absurd examples of deus ex machina in Breaking Bad so it's only fair I mention them in True Detective also. The convenient way Rust and Cohle came across the killer was a tad excessive, but everything else about the case was expertly handled so I'm willing to overlook it. (Would it have worked better if the green ears idea was actually green ear-muffs, I wonder? I thought that was the idea considering he wore ear-muffs on the lawnmower when we first encountered him.)
Also, minor point, but there was no mention of how the two black detectives reacted to the news that the killer was who he was considering they met him and even spoke to him only prior to Rust and Cohle uncovering the story. Considering Rust remembered meeting him in the school grounds seventeen years earlier, it was rather ridiculous the two new detectives didn't realise their chance meeting with him also. (Although, to be fair, the reaction of the black, Dion Dublin lookalike detective - not Brother Mouzone - when he exited the car at the crime scene suggested he was somewhat familiar and shocked with his surroundings.)
Overall, it was a great series and McConaghey delivered one of the all-time great television performances.
Also, minor point, but there was no mention of how the two black detectives reacted to the news that the killer was who he was considering they met him and even spoke to him only prior to Rust and Cohle uncovering the story. Considering Rust remembered meeting him in the school grounds seventeen years earlier, it was rather ridiculous the two new detectives didn't realise their chance meeting with him also. (Although, to be fair, the reaction of the black, Dion Dublin lookalike detective - not Brother Mouzone - when he exited the car at the crime scene suggested he was somewhat familiar and shocked with his surroundings.)
Overall, it was a great series and McConaghey delivered one of the all-time great television performances.
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I think a lot of criticism can be made about the ending. One which IMO can not be is that it did not tie up the conspiracy part. To me it was very clear from the beginning that it was never a murder mystery oriented show. I honestly thought that they would in fact leave the case unsolved, may be hinting at a couple of suspects at best. There were several pointers given as to who were part of the conspiracy- the dead sheriff, senator, the guy whose house was robbed etc. Criticism about them not rounding up all these guys is pretty silly and not in tune with the kind of story being told here.
I don't know. I mean these detectives are people who meticulously go over old cases again and again. I imagine it was the 20th odd time they've gone through this.
It automatically reminded me of a book by David Simon where he spent a year with Baltimores detectives. One case was solved because one person had put slippers back in the wrong place. One detective solved a case because a glass seemed out of place on the mantelpiece. Just little things that these detectives are paid to put together. Was it OTT. Yes. Was it enough to be more than a petty annoyance? No.
"That's not the world we live in"
While overall I think it was a very good series, I am not sure why the shouts of best series ever are coming up.
I would say only episode 4 and 5 stand up to some of the best episodes of all time great series. The one thing the shows stand out is obviously the production setting. The cinematography was out of this world.
I would say only episode 4 and 5 stand up to some of the best episodes of all time great series. The one thing the shows stand out is obviously the production setting. The cinematography was out of this world.
I understand why some are so pissed off about the green ears thing. But Marty did always say that generally detectives miss something right under their nose.
I understand the frustration of some here. I have been there myself in the past with some shows. But somehow in this series I was not invested in the overall plot at all so I was able to brush past it easily.
I understand the frustration of some here. I have been there myself in the past with some shows. But somehow in this series I was not invested in the overall plot at all so I was able to brush past it easily.
It's not even just about Marty making the connection though, it's the idea that someone who paints a house green would end up with both ears covered in paint. Did they have a paint fight or something? It's just bizarre because there are surely a hundred better ways they could have written it.
No doubt something simple and innocuous can act as that trigger and it all comes together in one swift realisation, but green ears and him being a painter have absolutely nothing to do with each other. If they went down the green earmuffs route it would've been perfectly reasonable but the green paint was just completely and utterly mental.
Brilliant acting. Great directing. But as a piece of storytelling it was extremely unsatisfying. Shame.
All they had to do was give him green ear muffs and everyone would be so much happier...
What do you mean the opening scene with a shrouded guy, disposing of a body and setting a field on fire? Yeah, don't know why anyone would have thought this was a murder mystery.
I jest.
I know what you're saying though but the trouble it has is that it does stick to some tried and tested tropes of the genre (lawnmower man appearing innocuously at the end of 3) which are at odds with the character building stuff of the early episodes. On the one hand it's doing something new but when that part of the story ends it's quite an abrupt and jarring switch to a more standard police procedural show. The green house realization, Marty saying to Rust in the car "are you still seeing things?", are all stuff that I consider to be quite cliche and below the standard of writing that we'd seen up until that point.
I don't see why it couldn't satisfy both those interested in the mystery (and this doesn't necessarily meaning catching everyone involved at all) and the character arcs of Marty and Rust. I just don't think it's too much to aim for in a show that has 8 full hours to do so.
They didn't even need to do that. From what I can gather the old woman just told them that the guy who painted the house was a Childress. I thought it had already been established that the Childress's(?) and Tuttles were fecked up. Next thing you know they're pulling up old DVLA records and finding out that where the Childress boy lives. Surely they would've gone that route anyway?
What do you mean the opening scene with a shrouded guy, disposing of a body and setting a field on fire? Yeah, don't know why anyone would have thought this was a murder mystery.
I jest.
I know what you're saying though but the trouble it has is that it does stick to some tried and tested tropes of the genre (lawnmower man appearing innocuously at the end of 3) which are at odds with the character building stuff of the early episodes. On the one hand it's doing something new but when that part of the story ends it's quite an abrupt and jarring switch to a more standard police procedural show. The green house realization, Marty saying to Rust in the car "are you still seeing things?", are all stuff that I consider to be quite cliche and below the standard of writing that we'd seen up until that point.
I don't see why it couldn't satisfy both those interested in the mystery (and this doesn't necessarily meaning catching everyone involved at all) and the character arcs of Marty and Rust. I just don't think it's too much to aim for in a show that has 8 full hours to do so.
I saw a good explanation for the show on a blog -
That's mostly how I felt.
Exactly that. I think that's how most people felt.
Not bad. Not great either. Though the production was, certainly.
There's a difference between prioritizing character closure over narrative closure - which the show was obviously going to do from the get go - and setting things up specifically to hook viewers, but having no intention of paying them off, and then including a line of dialogue in the last scenes that says "LIFE DOESN"T ANSWER ALL THE QUESTIONS SO NAR NAR VIEWERS. WE'RE NOT SLOPPY, WE'RE PROFOUND!!" ..I mean, LOST did that.
The "change" in Cohle wasn't really a hugely epic and profound one either, as it didn't depend on the specific journey this story exposed his character to, as much as something he could've gotten from being hit by a tree, or eating some dodgy chicken. Also his daughter hadn't been mentioned for about 7 episodes, so, you know, I wasn't really bowled over with emotion. He acted it brilliantly though. Also it was bollocks.
The Carcosa stuff was great though. And the guy was suitably creepy, with his bonkers bout of English accented eloquence that I actually liked despite being for no reason or making any sense or ever happening again. The green house painting thing was retarded however. As was the way they then instantly solved the case easily with a quick google.
There's a difference between prioritizing character closure over narrative closure - which the show was obviously going to do from the get go - and setting things up specifically to hook viewers, but having no intention of paying them off, and then including a line of dialogue in the last scenes that says "LIFE DOESN"T ANSWER ALL THE QUESTIONS SO NAR NAR VIEWERS. WE'RE NOT SLOPPY, WE'RE PROFOUND!!" ..I mean, LOST did that.
The "change" in Cohle wasn't really a hugely epic and profound one either, as it didn't depend on the specific journey this story exposed his character to, as much as something he could've gotten from being hit by a tree, or eating some dodgy chicken. Also his daughter hadn't been mentioned for about 7 episodes, so, you know, I wasn't really bowled over with emotion. He acted it brilliantly though. Also it was bollocks.
The Carcosa stuff was great though. And the guy was suitably creepy, with his bonkers bout of English accented eloquence that I actually liked despite being for no reason or making any sense or ever happening again. The green house painting thing was retarded however. As was the way they then instantly solved the case easily with a quick google.
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I loved LOST as well. 
Think this is my favorite season of television ever
Think this is my favorite season of television ever
Overall, I give the series 8/10