Toby Alderweireld

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If there are question marks around his injury, is it really wise to take the chance and sign another question mark of a centre back? I still believe the money would be better spent elsewhere. Even giving 40 mill extra to DDG to make him stay would be more beneficial imo.
 
devilish said:
He's 29, he's a bit of an injury prone player and he's got just 1 year left in his contract. Add 10m to that 40m and you'll end up with Koulibaly whose younger, stronger and better. Anything beyond the 30m mark for Toby would be crazy. Alternatively we can have a backroom deal with him and have him sign a pre-contract next January

United aren't the type who like signing 29 year olds especially considering the solid youth talent coming through (Lindelof, Tuanzebe and Bailly). If this deal comes through than its a big vote of no confidence to the experienced heads (Smalling, Rojo and Jones) who should have stepped up and lead the defence themselves. I can see at least 1 of them leave tbh.....probably 2.
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Agreed, I'd rather not get a 29yo, don't know why Mourinho chooses older players, probably explains why he only lasts 3 seasons everywhere. But I'd rather have him than Smalling or Jones, who both have made too many mistakes this season. He'd be a good replacement for the time being until Lindelof finds his full potential.
 
devilish said:
United aren't the type who like signing 29 year olds especially considering the solid youth talent coming through (Lindelof, Tuanzebe and Bailly). If this deal comes through than its a big vote of no confidence to the experienced heads (Smalling, Rojo and Jones) who should have stepped up and lead the defence themselves. I can see at least 1 of them leave tbh.....probably 2.
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I think this is right and perhaps we shouldn't have too much confidence in them; Smalling has been ever-present this season but I'm not convinced at all with him, defensively he can have some very solid games but equally he can be prone to errors, his lack of leadership and organisation have always been a concern. I'd be surprised if we did end up getting rid, he's been the most reliable injury-wise.

Rojo's barely kicked a ball this season and is probably the most expendable, he was good for a few months last season but his time here generally hasn't been brilliant (I concede there have been times he's been played out position).

Jones is the most disappointing for me, I think he's a very good player and I actually think he's our best defender when he's fit but his issue is that he never is. The amount of time Jones has spent on the table is almost comical, it's a shame because his talent and desire are always very apparent. I think this season we may end up getting rid sadly.
 
I may be in the minority but I see Alderweireld as a vastly superior defender to Smalling, Jones or Rojo.

I don't think he is being targetted to replace Bailly or any of our young prospects, but as the experienced leader of our defence. A position that Smalling, Jones or Rojo are either not good enough, too inconsistent or too injury prone to fullfil.

I'd agree with concerns about his injury profile over the last two years, but in terms of quality Alderweireld has been several steps better than any of our defenders at his last 3 clubs.
 
edcunited1878 said:
Is Koulibaly as experienced, battle tested and mentally the better player than Toby? I say no. Mourinho is continuing to look for warriors and for professional, mentally mature players will to do what it takes to win.

One or two senior CBs will have to go one would think, so let's see.
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He is the best CB in the serie A a cross between Rio and Vidic. He will do good in the EPL.

However i get that Mou wants an experienced EPl cb. He Doesn't trust his cbs to lead the back and that was pretty evident when he went for Fonte. However similarly to Fonte I cant see mou paying over the odds to get toby. He will either get his man at the right price or he will switch target to someone else.
 
RepardReece said:
Agreed, I'd rather not get a 29yo, don't know why Mourinho chooses older players, probably explains why he only lasts 3 seasons everywhere. But I'd rather have him than Smalling or Jones, who both have made too many mistakes this season. He'd be a good replacement for the time being until Lindelof finds his full potential.
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I don't think we need a 29 year old to offer leadership at the back. Rio and Stam lead the back at age 25 something. However there is no denying that we lack leadership there and that Smalling, Jones and co aren't providing it. If mou wants toby then let him get his man as long as the price is right. Else we switch to another target as we did with fonte
 
devilish said:
He's 29, he's a bit of an injury prone player and he's got just 1 year left in his contract. Add 10m to that 40m and you'll end up with Koulibaly whose younger, stronger and better. Anything beyond the 30m mark for Toby would be crazy. Alternatively we can have a backroom deal with him and have him sign a pre-contract next January

United aren't the type who like signing 29 year olds especially considering the solid youth talent coming through (Lindelof, Tuanzebe and Bailly). If this deal comes through than its a big vote of no confidence to the experienced heads (Smalling, Rojo and Jones) who should have stepped up and lead the defence themselves. I can see at least 1 of them leave tbh.....probably 2.
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Koulibaly won’t go for less than 60m IMO. The fans would go absolutely batshit if they sell him for nothing but an absolute monster fee. He’s pretty much their only CB, but one of the best players at the club.

I mean, do you have any confidence in them to lead the defence? I still don’t rate Smalling as consistent enough and the other two can’t even muster a 3/4 of a season injury free.
 
Lash said:
Koulibaly won’t go for less than 60m IMO. The fans would go absolutely batshit if they sell him for nothing but an absolute monster fee. He’s pretty much their only CB, but one of the best players at the club.

I mean, do you have any confidence in them to lead the defence? I still don’t rate Smalling as consistent enough and the other two can’t even muster a 3/4 of a season injury free.
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50m-60m would be enough to get him. Napoli don't need the money but they can hardly force players to stay against their will either
 
devilish said:
50m-60m would be enough to get him. Napoli don't need the money but they can hardly force players to stay against their will either
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I’m not so sure, he’s contracted until 2021 and is their main defender. They’ll be selling Mertens and Jorginho this summer, I can’t see him going as well. If Sarri goes as well, it would be ridiculous to sell him.
 
dove said:
What's up with this obsession with age? He just turned 29, we can't buy only 20-21 year olds. £40M is a bit too much IMO knowing that he is on the last year of contract and is being frozen out of Spurs squad as he wants to leave but no doubt he would be a quality signing.
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He actually has two more years on his contract. As per his current contract, he can be sold for 25 mil in the summer of 2019, if there is no contract renewal before that. I don't think 40 mil is too much for a top defender like him when VVD went for 75 mil (he is only 2 years younger)
 
devilish said:
50m-60m would be enough to get him. Napoli don't need the money but they can hardly force players to stay against their will either
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This was two years ago, before the prices went absolutely crazy and when Koulibaly wasn't as established as he is now :

Chelsea offered up to £58m for Kalidou Koulibaly, says Napoli's Aurelio De Laurentiis

https://www.google.co.in/amp/www.sk...-koulibaly-says-napolis-aurelio-de-laurentiis

As @Lash says, they won't be selling 3 of their main players in one window especially after coming so close to a title.
Also, my friend who watches a lot a Napoli says he is a bit meh in the air although he is a giant. Not sure that's exactly what we need
 
diarm said:
I may be in the minority but I see Alderweireld as a vastly superior defender to Smalling, Jones or Rojo.

I don't think he is being targetted to replace Bailly or any of our young prospects, but as the experienced leader of our defence. A position that Smalling, Jones or Rojo are either not good enough, too inconsistent or too injury prone to fullfil.

I'd agree with concerns about his injury profile over the last two years, but in terms of quality Alderweireld has been several steps better than any of our defenders at his last 3 clubs.
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I can guarantee that if we get Alder or whoever, he will end up partnering Smalling; not with Bailly or Lindelof. Those later two are far away from ready, imho.

And I don't think he is 'several steps' better than Smalling, because that would make him a world class CB. He wouldn't play for Spurs at his peak for years if that's the case. Unless you mean, ant steps?
 
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If there is any chance we should be all over him. He is the best CB in the league and he isn't injury prone either, he played 68 league games in last 2 seasons.
 
Sanche7 said:
This was two years ago, before the prices went absolutely crazy and when Koulibaly wasn't as established as he is now :

Chelsea offered up to £58m for Kalidou Koulibaly, says Napoli's Aurelio De Laurentiis

https://www.google.co.in/amp/www.sk...-koulibaly-says-napolis-aurelio-de-laurentiis

As @Lash says, they won't be selling 3 of their main players in one window especially after coming so close to a title.
Also, my friend who watches a lot a Napoli says he is a bit meh in the air although he is a giant. Not sure that's exactly what we need
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De Laurentiis is the Italian version of Levy. However, there's one key difference between Levy and him. Levy is obsessed with business. De Laurentiis is the same but he also absolutely hate Juventus.

Now Napoli are at impasse. They did very well but they can't go further then that. Many key figures want to go from Maertens to Jorginho. Sarri is also toying at the idea of moving to greener pastures and Raiola is circling around Insigne like a hungry vulture. A trickle can easily become a flood.

De Laurentiis would not want to get rid of Koulibaly, however he knows that an unhappy player is a dangerous one. Juventus has quite a reputation of courting players to then steal them on the cheap simply because the player wouldn't want to go elsewhere. They did it with our Pogba,they nearly worked their magic with Angel Gomes and they did it with Roberto Baggio and Bernandeschi. Ah they also did it with Higuian, something that pissed off De Laurentiis big time. So if Koulibaly wants out and United stepped in with a good offer then he'd rather sell him to us then let him rot and plot.
 
I think his contractual situation provides a great opportunity for us to sign him and upgrade in that position where we are in a dire need for a right and stable partner for Eric Bailly. Yes, injury proneness is a concern for us but we are well-covered in centre back position and can manage him well and keeping him fit for the most important games in the season, which will also give chances for others to get game time in his absence.

We are in a very strong position to do this deal as we have Luke Shaw to offer in return to Tottenham who thrived under Pochetino and a less pressure environment with Tottenham needing a young Left back which will be a win-win situation for both the clubs just like the deal we cut with Arsenal for Sanchez- Mkh swap. I think Luke Shaw plus 10-15 m should be enough to close this deal and it will be a brilliant bit of business for all the parties involved, where we get a decent Ball playing defender as our build up from the back is very poor and one of the main reasons for our poor attacking build up and moreover we get to sell Phil jones who I think will easily fetch 15-20m in this market from any Lesser Epl club Depending on who's buying. It will also clear the path for us getting Tottenham out of Ryan Sennegnesson's competition who'll no longer need him with Luke Shaw going the other way. We no longer can carry passengers like Jones in the team when you are looking for a Title hunt with a Steep task we have next season.

The only competition I see in his signature is from the likes of Real Madrid who surely will be looking to improve in that area and Psg who will offer him higher wages. If he wants to remain in the league we have got to pounce on this deal.
 
Patrick08 said:
I think his contractual situation provides a great opportunity for us to sign him and upgrade in that position where we are in a dire need for a right and stable partner for Eric Bailly. Yes, injury proneness is a concern for us but we are well-covered in centre back position and can manage him well and keeping him fit for the most important games in the season, which will also give chances for others to get game time in his absence.

We are in a very strong position to do this deal as we have Luke Shaw to offer in return to Tottenham who thrived under Pochetino and a less pressure environment with Tottenham needing a young Left back which will be a win-win situation for both the clubs just like the deal we cut with Arsenal for Sanchez- Mkh swap. I think Luke Shaw plus 10-15 m should be enough to close this deal and it will be a brilliant bit of business for all the parties involved, where we get a decent Ball playing defender as our build up from the back is very poor and one of the main reasons for our poor attacking build up and moreover we get to sell Phil jones who I think will easily fetch 15-20m in this market from any Lesser Epl club Depending on who's buying. It will also clear the path for us getting Tottenham out of Ryan Sennegnesson's competition who'll no longer need him with Luke Shaw going the other way. We no longer can carry passengers like Jones in the team when you are looking for a Title hunt with a Steep task we have next season.

The only competition I see in his signature is from the likes of Real Madrid who surely will be looking to improve in that area and Psg who will offer him higher wages. If he wants to remain in the league we have got to pounce on this deal.
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Bailly is hardly a first choice defender. Too many mistakes, too many injuries and doesn't have a stable head.
 
After watching Vermaelen and Mina the other day i wouldn’t be surprised if Barcelona were after him. If they are i suspect both Levy and Toby would prefer that option. Unless we offer some really silly money i guess.
 
Isotope said:
I can guarantee that if we get Alder or whoever, he will end up partnering Smalling; not with Bailly or Lindelof. Those later two are far away from ready, imho.

And I don't think he is 'several steps' better than Smalling, because that would make him a world class CB. He wouldn't play for Spurs at his peak for years if that's the case. Unless you mean, ant steps?
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He is a world class defender. £40 million is a bargain.
 
RepardReece said:
But I'd rather have him than Smalling or Jones, who both have made too many mistakes this season. He'd be a good replacement for the time being until Lindelof finds his full potential.
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I am not a big fan of Smalling but I have to disagree with you. United were second team in the league and I would say Smalling was one of the best players this season. After DDG, he was the best man in the defence imo. He could be much better on the ball, but so could most CBs in the Premier League.
 
balaks said:
He is a world class defender. £40 million is a bargain.
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Luke Shaw plus 10-15 m will be a win win situation for all parties I think. I am sure Tottenham and Pochh would like Shaw in return with their Rose situation who's looking to leave.
 
rampo said:
He actually has two more years on his contract. As per his current contract, he can be sold for 25 mil in the summer of 2019, if there is no contract renewal before that. I don't think 40 mil is too much for a top defender like him when VVD went for 75 mil (he is only 2 years younger)
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Ah I thought it's until 2019. £40m is about right then.
 
£40m for Alderweireld when Laporte and VVD have gone for £65m and £75m is a bargain. He's better than both by a comfortable margin.
 
1. He's 29, not 34.
2. He's the best CB in the PL since joining Spurs.
3. He's not injury prone ffs. Before this season he last injured his hamstring in 2015 and never before that.
4. Get over the price, it's the post-Neymar market.
 
Trizy said:
1. He's 29, not 34.
2. He's the best CB in the PL since joining Spurs.
3. He's not injury prone ffs. Before this season he last injured his hamstring in 2015 and never before that.
4. Get over the price, it's the post-Neymar market.
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2. Injury prone. You can’t say he is not. You can say that looking at his history, you don’t know. But you can’t say he isn’t injury prone. After a second hammy injury, you simply don’t know. He might have become injury prone as some hammy injuries haunt players forever.
4. Agree the price is low if he is so good like everybody says. But where does that price come from? He is not even for sale.
 
Isotope said:
And I don't think he is 'several steps' better than Smalling, because that would make him a world class CB.
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Again, I may be in the minority but I think Smalling is more than several steps below world class. In fact I think that while he can have a few good games here and there, across a season he is a very average defender at best.

I also think Alderweireld is world class. Maybe not compared to the great defenders of ten or twenty years ago, but certainly by today's standards.
 
devilish said:
He's 29, he's a bit of an injury prone player and he's got just 1 year left in his contract. Add 10m to that 40m and you'll end up with Koulibaly whose younger, stronger and better. Anything beyond the 30m mark for Toby would be crazy. Alternatively we can have a backroom deal with him and have him sign a pre-contract next January

United aren't the type who like signing 29 year olds especially considering the solid youth talent coming through (Lindelof, Tuanzebe and Bailly). If this deal comes through than its a big vote of no confidence to the experienced heads (Smalling, Rojo and Jones) who should have stepped up and lead the defence themselves. I can see at least 1 of them leave tbh.....probably 2.
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This is his first major injury. Been ever present for his clubs before this season.
 
A-man said:
2. Injury prone. You can’t say he is not. You can say that looking at his history, you don’t know. But you can’t say he isn’t injury prone. After a second hammy injury, you simply don’t know. He might have become injury prone as some hammy injuries haunt players forever.
4. Agree the price is low if he is so good like everybody says. But where does that price come from? He is not even for sale.
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If you go by that logic, every single player who's ever gotten a hamstring injury could be considered injury prone. What insanely stupid logic.
 
diarm said:
I may be in the minority but I see Alderweireld as a vastly superior defender to Smalling, Jones or Rojo.

I don't think he is being targetted to replace Bailly or any of our young prospects, but as the experienced leader of our defence. A position that Smalling, Jones or Rojo are either not good enough, too inconsistent or too injury prone to fullfil.

I'd agree with concerns about his injury profile over the last two years, but in terms of quality Alderweireld has been several steps better than any of our defenders at his last 3 clubs.
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You're not in the minority. He's a lot better than Smalling and Jones.
I do agree that it doesn't reflect well on Jose, spending another fortune on a CB. He's aleeaal spent £60m and hasn't solved our issues .
 
Adisa said:
You're not in the minority. He's a lot better than Smalling and Jones.
I do agree that it doesn't reflect well on Jose, spending another fortune on a CB. He's aleeaal spent £60m and hasn't solved our issues .
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Are you posting from 2007?
60m is a quality RB these days
 
cyberman said:
Are you posting from 2007?
60m is a quality RB these days
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That's true. I'm all for this signing. I am sick if CBs that hoof at every opportunity. That's why I'm so desperate for Lindelof to come through.
The way I look at it, Umtiti valued at £60m, LaPorte went for £57m and we all know what VVD went for. I'd gladly pay £40m for Alderweireld.
 
£40m is a decent price for Alderwiereld, only thing I'd say as a negative when buying a player at the end of their peak is you're going to have to replace 3 or 4 core players at the same time in 3 years or so, Matic, Sanchez and Alderwiereld, also the squad (to me) is starting to look a bit on the old side similar to what ours was a City 2 season ago. Really need to get rid of the squad fillers who are 28+ Young, Fellaini, Mata, Herrera etc with younger players to not have the same issues we had.
 
Thunderhead said:
£40m is a decent price for Alderwiereld, only thing I'd say as a negative when buying a player at the end of their peak is you're going to have to replace 3 or 4 core players at the same time in 3 years or so, Matic, Sanchez and Alderwiereld, also the squad (to me) is starting to look a bit on the old side similar to what ours was a City 2 season ago. Really need to get rid of the squad fillers who are 28+ Young, Fellaini, Mata, Herrera etc with younger players to not have the same issues we had.
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Thats 3 players though.
Silva / Fernandinho / Kompany are all older! Even Aguero is up there.
Our squad isn't old at all, the deadwood will drastically lower our average age when they're sold as well.
 
Thunderhead said:
£40m is a decent price for Alderwiereld, only thing I'd say as a negative when buying a player at the end of their peak is you're going to have to replace 3 or 4 core players at the same time in 3 years or so, Matic, Sanchez and Alderwiereld, also the squad (to me) is starting to look a bit on the old side similar to what ours was a City 2 season ago. Really need to get rid of the squad fillers who are 28+ Young, Fellaini, Mata, Herrera etc with younger players to not have the same issues we had.
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This. Post Sir Alex we spent so much replacing Rio, Vidic, Giggsy, Scholes and Evra at once. It can get expensive to try to replace the backbone of a squad at one go
 
cyberman said:
Thats 3 players though.
Silva / Fernandinho / Kompany are all older! Even Aguero is up there.
Our squad isn't old at all, the deadwood will drastically lower our average age when they're sold as well.
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no it's not at the moment but you have a fair few players who are 28 so in the next season or so they'll all be hitting 30 at the same time, it's really time to get rid of those squad fillers who won't play when 30+ and look to replace them in the next 3 windows, Smalling, Rojo, Blind, Mata, Herrera, then you can add in Young, Valencia, Fellaini etc, it's not an old squad yet but in 3 transfer windows it will be.
 
A-man said:
2. Injury prone. You can’t say he is not. You can say that looking at his history, you don’t know. But you can’t say he isn’t injury prone. After a second hammy injury, you simply don’t know. He might have become injury prone as some hammy injuries haunt players forever.
4. Agree the price is low if he is so good like everybody says. But where does that price come from? He is not even for sale.
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Yep, he is 292 day out in the last 7 seasons.
 
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