We have become a mid-table team. When the expectations drop to the level of our players and manager ( we are slowly getting there ). I think we can start enjoying the football again.
Things that have improved
- Thread starter SER19
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Still give up plenty of big chances:
Fulham - 0
Brighton - 2
Liverpool - 6
Southampton - 3
Palace - 3
Twente - 2
Spurs - 9
Porto - 5
Villa - 0
That's only 2 games out of 9 that we didn't allow the opposition to have multiple good chances.
Our xGA is 13.63 in The PL and 2.67 in Europe. Onana has saved us a few times. He's probably the only positive this season.
We're 12th in terms of xG.
We're producing 10-14th place metrics. We can no complaints.
We continue to set new club records
The League season is already over for us and in record time - no need to stress about results now.
Results like 0-0 away to Villa are now signs of progress and should be celebrated like Arsenal securing 4th place.
We BACK our managers.
But should we make a change, the club is heavily linked with Gareth Southgate - the second most successful England manager ever.
We have new league rivals to measure ourselves against - like Bournemouth, West Ham and Leicester.
Recently, we have been the most successful domestic team, apart from Man City.
We now have proper footballing people making the important decisions at our club. At some point, somewhere, somehow, this will start making a difference.
The League season is already over for us and in record time - no need to stress about results now.
Results like 0-0 away to Villa are now signs of progress and should be celebrated like Arsenal securing 4th place.
We BACK our managers.
But should we make a change, the club is heavily linked with Gareth Southgate - the second most successful England manager ever.
We have new league rivals to measure ourselves against - like Bournemouth, West Ham and Leicester.
Recently, we have been the most successful domestic team, apart from Man City.
We now have proper footballing people making the important decisions at our club. At some point, somewhere, somehow, this will start making a difference.
The worst thing SAF ever did was that last speech of his. "Now you stand behind your manager".. its so sad.
I'm in the same boat. 10Hag ball numbs the body. I used to get angry at the telly. Nowadays I just shrug and take a swig of some strong stuff.
One of the main roles a manager has, is to create a balance on his team, as such that they will score enough goals while conceding as little as possible.
What we have seen from ETHs United is that this teams are somewhat on either of the extremes. Either we are extremely open, create plenty of chances, while conceding many chances, or, we are extremely rigid, don't create much, and concede less chances.
Most of the games we basicly need to enter on an 'autodestruct' mode to score goals which is not sustainable, as evidenced from last season.
Leave for a second a distinguishable playing style, not creating basic balance on his team, is unforgivable and an absolutely sackable offence from our coach.
Big mistake in the opening post. Coming in am hour after a draw away to Aston Villa, you should know that a third og the forum will be in emotional turmoil and not able to talk about nuances or even reading plain English. Even if they beat Bayern München three days ago, doesn’t mean drawing away to them isn’t so bad it should be outlawed talking about if there are some things that work better than last season.
For me, I think Ten Hag is done at United now, but that is not the question of the thread.
It’s a simple question. I think the simolest nswer is that our chances and goal attempts ratio vs the opponents are clearly better this season.
Our control of midfield is obviously better than last season, I think you need to be severely mentally impeded if you argue against that.
Defensively we have been more solid for 90% of the playing time. The collapses vs Liverpool, Tottenham and Porto account for most of the things we’ve let through.
Onana is better. We have twice as many playing full backs and strikers. Rashford has scored.
I think that’s about it.
For me, I think Ten Hag is done at United now, but that is not the question of the thread.
It’s a simple question. I think the simolest nswer is that our chances and goal attempts ratio vs the opponents are clearly better this season.
Our control of midfield is obviously better than last season, I think you need to be severely mentally impeded if you argue against that.
Defensively we have been more solid for 90% of the playing time. The collapses vs Liverpool, Tottenham and Porto account for most of the things we’ve let through.
Onana is better. We have twice as many playing full backs and strikers. Rashford has scored.
I think that’s about it.
Seeing or even searching for any improvement is just self-deception, nothing else I'm afraid. Numbers never lie.
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The positive i get this season is not in the footballing sense but the business end of things. Proper wage structure, recruitment and looking into infrastructure for future success.
The football hasn't really improve much. It will take time. However, will it improve with ETH? I think he has ran out of time unless he can pull a string of consecutive wins in the next 3 to 5 games.
The football hasn't really improve much. It will take time. However, will it improve with ETH? I think he has ran out of time unless he can pull a string of consecutive wins in the next 3 to 5 games.
Proper recruitment? Debatable, sorry. 1. They paid a LOT of money for Zirkzee to solve the scoring drought which was ridiculous knowing that the guy scored only 14 goals in 58 matches for Bologna. I have no idea who thought at the club that a guy with such poor statistics in the Serie A will be a prolific scorer in the PL which is a lot stronger competiton. 2. They paid 60 million for an 18 years old teenager who had only a year left of his contract and who claimed that he'd rather play for Real Madrid but Perez offered only 17 million for Lille which is a rather more realistic price. 3. De Ligt. Could be good but if you see his numbers, value, performance all of these keep declining since the age of 20, literally. Let's see how he performs. So the recruitment wasn't that proper in my opinion. Not to mention that despite all these signings we're worse than ever, as for instance Zirkzee is totally unable to find the back of the net.
Dont be so angry. He meant being 14th is a positivity in and of itself.
You are not going to get all of them right. Was the same with Man City in the initial stages. Perhaps the wrong players were bought, but the process of purchase i feel, has improved.
We're skint.
So not sure how much we can do that has not been done already. There really is only one solution.
So not sure how much we can do that has not been done already. There really is only one solution.
I think its what the professionals call "making incremental gains."
I'd question this.
Explain in what way the squad has improved, and what have we done to show that it has, if anything, going by recent perfomances the squad as a football playing unit is worse.
Fitness? I would question that too, some of these players are struggling, they look really leggy after 60mins.
We do not look solid defensivley, most times the ball comes into our penalty area its panic stations, and treated like a hot potato.
Our distribution from the back is poor to say the least, never mind trying to play it out from the back.
All in all, at times we look like a Championship side at best, we lack leadership and direction, against Villa on Evan was showing any real drive and leadership, as well as passion, could that be because he is the sole suriving remnant of the Ferguson ethics?
FFS Welbeck scored the winner against Spurs yesterday and De Gea saved two penalties !
The things that have improved imo is that we are a little closer to doing the basics of football right. Just little.
If we were seeing a marked improvement from week to week and game to game I would be in total agreement, however we are not seeing that, or any glimmer of it.
The team Ten Hag picked to play Villa was a last ditch attempt to save his job, he didn't pick a team to win, he picked a team and tactics that wouldn't lose, thats not good enough for United, it's not right for the players, and it certainly isn't right for the fans.
Seven games in, the trnd is down, we don't have a single player on two goals, yet we have spent £200m in the summer bringing in players that ETH wanted.
This is not top six form, it's not even mid-table form, it's relegation area form, and it needs to change before the players attitude and mental state is so low they are unable to play their way out of it. Rashford is a perfect example, to rash tackles, he should have been sent off yesterday, the best thing ETH did was cub him to save him a red card.
You have to worry, even last season's 8th place finish was not exactly plain sailing, there was plenty of games United played awful and deserved nothing! But somehow managed to grab victory via McTom scoring 2 goals in a minute for example.
I think so far this season United have gotten what they deserve, you could only argue CP was 2 dropped points. Which would move United from 14th to 12th in the table.
Tbh I don't really see any difference from 23/24 only that McTom is not around to nick a goal at the death. Other than that, having a few more fit CB's has helped in defence. The rest are performing as we have come to expect...badly.
I think so far this season United have gotten what they deserve, you could only argue CP was 2 dropped points. Which would move United from 14th to 12th in the table.
Tbh I don't really see any difference from 23/24 only that McTom is not around to nick a goal at the death. Other than that, having a few more fit CB's has helped in defence. The rest are performing as we have come to expect...badly.
This years third kit is way better than last years.
The squad has improved on paper, has 2 players per position and is younger where we don't have the urgent need to fill a gaping hole. That hasn't been in the case in a long time. It's not a bad squad to take over and get playing to a decent level.
Fitness has improved because we don't have as many injuries.
Don't confuse things that are the fault of Ten Hag with things like players looking tired early or looking a mess on the football pitch.
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Also technically these are improvements:
- Last season we were 15th in xPts. Currently 10th
- Last season 12th in xG, same this season (consistency!)
- Last season 15th in xG against, this season 14th in xG against
The oppositions goal difference?
We don't play on paper.
Overall fitness hasn't improved, as for injuries, once again they are starting to mount (no pun intended) up.
Players looking tired early are the fault of he coaching staff, not enough time on stamina.
As has been mentioned on countless other posts, most fans that watch/have watched utd regularly will say that we have a good squad, perhaps not good enough to challenge City but certainly good enough to challenge for top 4.
The issues are (mostly) tactical and structural that ETH is ill-equipped or too stubborn to change, therefore we expect to see an uplift in performance/results if a new manager can use the squad better.
The issues are (mostly) tactical and structural that ETH is ill-equipped or too stubborn to change, therefore we expect to see an uplift in performance/results if a new manager can use the squad better.
Yeah I dont disagree with your assessment, and as I said, this thread is not a defence of ten hag or an argument against criticism. Although it feels as if this is never ending, I really do believe that the next 6 league games will decide his fate. We have Brentford, Chelsea, Leicester and Everton at home, and Ipswich and west ham away. Those are also amidst cup ties we really should be winning.
Whatever about us having a tough start to the season (i do think our opening 7 games were tough, and only tottenham had as tough an opening), there is absolutely no hiding in those games and the cup games around them.
This thread is simply about what things, if any, might be built upon to see progress between now and december 3rd when we face arsenal. Should we for example pick up 14/15 points from 18 and look tight and concede few, it will be based on things we didnt see at all last season. We have no real reason to think we can do that, and we almost certainly wont, but like I said, there are thousands of threads for the grim appraisals.
My personal opinion is we lack leadeership in the dressing room, and not just from Fernanades, but from senior players like Rashford who came through the United system.
Paart of our tenacity against Villa was Evans a 35yr old from the Fergie way of thinking, I gave him MOTM not just because of how he played, but because of how he was ranting and raving at people, giving them a job well done or a bollocking when needed, that was a real positive to see that passion again.
It now needs other senior players to take up that mantle and carry it forward.
I agree. I do wonder that when this team is up against it, if you put yourself in the position of any player and look around, who are the teammates that give you the feeling of confidence that you're still in the game, that you can go win it. We have very talented young players but they need these types around them. I think De Ligt, Martinez, Evans, Dalot and possibly in time Ugarte, are guys who you can probably look to and know theyll give their all, but leadership and inspiration is missing.
I think people underestimate the importance of players who can quite literally organise a defence, and captain their part of the pitch. No surprise that evans can. But the same applies up top and of course in midfield. Casemiro is massively experienced but his body doesnt seem to keep pace anymore. People think attacking is just a free for all but it takes just as much teamwork and know how as defence, and these young attackers really lack it. Ive said elsewhere but pretend first-season Zlatan is the player they're in and around. There is just a totally different feel for that front line in terms of the group battle versus defenders.
I do wonder about future signings, not in terms of stupid marquee signings, but is there anybody out there who could fit that bill and be a sort of talisman like cantona, van persie, zlatan.
-All of our kits are better this season
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I think if we stay with ETH we will get close to be relegated. We are that bad right now.
The shorts look stupid
We do look more compact if only because we stopped playing the footballer formerly known as Casemiro. Our keeper has been our best player as well. But like you say we're still poor and the manager is clearly out of his depth. Once we get a new manager in, that will be the time to really be optimistic.
I've read that our team collected a ridiculous 23 points in the last 19 league matches. That's 46 points for a whole season, which is usually enough for a 15th place finish. Absolutely awful. On top of that, according to the statistics it happened only once in the history of Manchester United when the team scored less than 5 goals in the first 7 league matches. Four, in the 1973-74 season. The team finished that season in 21st place and got relegated. And despite the squad worth of 870 million euros, we're currently 14th. And someone created a thread about "improvements". Really, i don't know if i should laugh or cry.
I’m sure the roof leaks are slightly better
Spot on, the bar was so low last season, thanks to Onana's poor start to his life at UTD. If OP wants to compare progress then they must compare it to Ten Hags first season.
We're not in the bottom three 
Theyve improved the concourse area in Stretford end lower. lovely new open plan!
as for the actual football. no
as for the actual football. no
Posts like your OP are idiotic.
Looking for anything positive when we're 14th, we play terrible football, we can't score goals and 99% of the fanbase want the manager out is stupid.
False. This whole tear it down and rebuild idea is a nonsense and any progress we make in the coming years with a new manager or otherwise will have to be built on something. Ie what the players any manager gets are doing well or decently.
Plenty of threads to go doom posting in